RE: Pro-ana and pro-mia as kinks (Full Version)

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leadership527 -> RE: Pro-ana and pro-mia as kinks (6/18/2010 8:40:56 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth
well, to be fair, not everyone who continues to smoke dies from their smoking activity...however, unless the anorexic/bulimic stops their anorexic/bulimic activities, they WILL die from it.

so, in your example, smoking cigarettes is more like playing russian roulette...taking a chance on suicide...anorexia/bulimia puts a load in every chamber and verrrrrrrrry slowwwwwwwwly pulls the trigger with a guaranteed result.

and let's not forget obesity which by all accounts is significantly worse than smoking. Let's face it, there are lots of activities that we allow within our society that are contra-indicated for health reasons.... rock climbing and back country skiing come to mind. Alchohol has the nifty effect of not simply killing the imbiber but also causing a significant death toll to nearby strangers.

I guess as I've thought over my "I don't want to pay for your kink" stance, I've decided that the number of such cases is not worth the paperwork required to write exclusions for them. Not only that, but as I noted above, I don't want to foster a totally risk averse culture which -- a thing which would have significant repercussions for the viability of the US as a nation. So, I suppose the answer is that some people are prone to doing things which are not going to promote a long & healthy life and so long as the numbers of such people don't rise to the levels required to create a financial problem, then so be it.



CallaFirestormBW -> RE: Pro-ana and pro-mia as kinks (6/18/2010 8:50:00 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

well, to be fair, not everyone who continues to smoke dies from their smoking activity...however, unless the anorexic/bulimic stops their anorexic/bulimic activities, they WILL die from it.

so, in your example, smoking cigarettes is more like playing russian roulette...taking a chance on suicide...anorexia/bulimia puts a load in every chamber and verrrrrrrrry slowwwwwwwwly pulls the trigger with a guaranteed result.


Actually, ana/mia are pretty sustainable for decades. We've got a couple of ana/mias in the local groups here who have been actively ana/mia for 20+ years. The biggest risk for ana/mia is underlying issues (particularly cardiac issues) that cause heart damage/failure and/or kidney damage/failure. If an ana/mia makes it into the long-term risk pool, ana/mia is sustainable for decades.

One other thing I want to mention on this subject is that there are cultures that follow similar patterns which are honored within the context of the culture. Aescetics are religious/spiritual practitioners who choose to follow intense physical activity and minimal food (sometimes no more than 1 cup of rice over the course of a week, and 1-2 oz of tofu or beans every couple of weeks) for 20-30 years or more, and somehow manage to live through the process, despite the appearance of starvation. In fact, there is some research that indicates that intense calorie restriction over an extended period of time actually extends the lifespan for human beings.

I think that the idea of a person "starving hirself" or being starved by someone else triggers our collective 'squick' factor, as a function of human survival. Regardless of the individual's preferences, we feel compelled to "fix" people who make these choices so that they don't make us uncomfortable. I fully admit that I am an extremist in this area -- it isn't that I am not compassionate to the discomfort that such choices place on the general public... I just think that the more important philosophical standpoint is the protection of the individual right to determine how one will exist in one's own skin, whether or not I personally would make the same choices. In the same way, I think that freedom of speech requires that someone who disagrees with me have the same rights to speak out and say what xhe thinks -- however, where the desire to control others' behavior conflicts with individual self-determination for one's own body, I am firmly in the camp that says that the individual's right to determine the outcome for hir own life/body trumps anything else -- even society's "comfort" with those choices.

As I said in an earlier post, if I had my 'druthers', I'd have everyone involved go through an evaluation with an ana/mia/authority-dynamic-aware psychotherapist, and if, at the end, it was determined that everyone was capable of making informed choices regarding their own lives, then it's time to let go and let them live their own lives. In the absence of that possibility, I would err on the side of personal autonomy for decisions regarding one's own body and life... meaning that if a person wants to stay in this kind of relationship and is satisfied with the potentials... xhe should be welcome to do so without external intrusion. Part of that, IMO, is the fact that family members, etc, are going to b*tch... and that is just one of the risks that has to be dealt with -- there probably won't be a way to get them to "understand"... and it would be just as wrong to try to force them to "accept" such decisions as it would be to try to force her to change her decisions because of their discomfort.

Calla



porcelaine -> RE: Pro-ana and pro-mia as kinks (6/18/2010 8:51:09 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: CallaFirestormBW

I would also concur with porcelaine in that the mindset that allows this kind of behavior to become active has to be in existence in some form up front. Ana/mia is REALLY difficult -- it requires a rigidity of control and persistence in the face of discomfort that can't be done casually... one really does have to become nearly obsessive to be able to manage ana/mia long-term... and it isn't something that someone can -force- on another person unless xhe has the mindset to already be able/willing to go there. It's just too easy, in our world, to find ways to "cheat" if one isn't really fully committed, internally, to the process.


In my opinion pro-ana/mia is more difficult to treat. Especially when the sufferer was of normal weight before it ensued. This isn't a diet gone wrong. It's a sleeping giant that never goes away. And I'm certain she's heard it speak on numerous occasions and was aware of her desire to go down this path. You reject it because it's wrong and you realize the ultimate price that will be paid. But that doesn't mean the desire abates. Fear kept things in check. Once that leaves the spiral is inevitable. It's an addiction of the worse kind.

I don't believe the treatment methods utilized for anorexia and bulimia are effective. Nor do I advocate group sessions either. The sharing and support is not conducive for improvement, but clandestine encouragement for furtherance. I don't believe the sufferers to be a completely lost cause, but I do think the families need immense resources, time, patience, and a big dollop of hope steeped in reality to see this through. In their mind emaciation is beautiful. Until you're able to alter that line of thought, you're merely containing the issue. The solution is much harder to secure.

~porcelaine



crazyml -> RE: Pro-ana and pro-mia as kinks (6/18/2010 8:55:34 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: CallaFirestormBW
I fully admit that I am an extremist in this area -- it isn't that I am not compassionate to the discomfort that such choices place on the general public... I just think that the more important philosophical standpoint is the protection of the individual right to determine how one will exist in one's own skin, whether or not I personally would make the same choices. In the same way, I think that freedom of speech requires that someone who disagrees with me have the same rights to speak out and say what xhe thinks -- however, where the desire to control others' behavior conflicts with individual self-determination for one's own body, I am firmly in the camp that says that the individual's right to determine the outcome for hir own life/body trumps anything else -- even society's "comfort" with those choices.

Calla




Brilliant response, Calla.

You and I don't disagree all that much - I believe that people should have the right to determine how they exist with their own skin (to steal your elegant phrase). Where we differ is the point at which I feel society has a duty to step in - People like me need people with your more intense views on liberty (I've avoided "extreme" because of it's implications of krankiness, which isn't something I'd ascribe to you) to keep us from wrapping everyone in cotton wool.



porcelaine -> RE: Pro-ana and pro-mia as kinks (6/18/2010 8:56:09 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: CallaFirestormBW

Actually, ana/mia are pretty sustainable for decades. We've got a couple of ana/mias in the local groups here who have been actively ana/mia for 20+ years. The biggest risk for ana/mia is underlying issues (particularly cardiac issues) that cause heart damage/failure and/or kidney damage/failure. If an ana/mia makes it into the long-term risk pool, ana/mia is sustainable for decades.


You're correct. That's why I mentioned their nutritional knowledge earlier. They have specific counts that they follow to make certain that the body is getting enough without severe ramifications. They eat. This is where they differ sharply from anorexics or bulimics for that matter. I view it a two-fold system of maintenance and loss.

~porcelaine



CallaFirestormBW -> RE: Pro-ana and pro-mia as kinks (6/18/2010 9:09:38 AM)

quote:

In their mind emaciation is beautiful. Until you're able to alter that line of thought, you're merely containing the issue. The solution is much harder to secure.


This is a crucial point. See, I'm not sure that we -should- try to alter that line of thought, any more than I think that people should have to alter their preferences to find me attractive because I'm fat. The sticking point for many people is that it bothers them that another person would make choices that might cause them to die early... which makes the issue of our own mortality come too close for comfort, and makes people skittish--compelling people to interfere in people's freedom of choice about their own bodies.

As you've noted, most of the treatment programs out there only serve to provide a support network for continuing the behavior among individuals who have made that choice. My relative managed, through her inpatient stays, to connect with a network that talks daily about their ana/mia behavior and supports one another in the choice -- to the point where she finally decided not to have kids, because she can't see herself giving up her genuine love for herself with as skin and bones. She is an artist, and her aesthetic reflects in both directions -- and did so LONG before she entered on this path.

I'd also like to say that I disagree with the public sentiment that ana/mia behavior is "caused" by the fashion industry, etc. While the fashion industry has been an outlet for exposure of ana/mia, I think that that is symptomatic, rather than causative. Frankly, it's fun to dress fashion dolls. It's something that most fashion designers are accustomed to -- so having bodies that are like mannequins, without a lot of stray 'flesh' around to take into consideration is really conducive to the fashion industry. It also provides a place for young people who are already on the ana/mia track to go where they won't be judged harshly for their appearance -- and the more our culture tries to force these individuals to accept an aesthetic that they find gross, the more these individuals will shape a sub-culture to allow them their free expression. The fact that there are so many ana/mia practitioners in fashion is, at least in part (IMO), a function of that ideosyncracy -- and our obsession, as a culture, with the fashion industry, makes it appear as if the outlet is the cause.

I'd like to say that it's been my experience, in working with some really amazing professionals, that these individuals are typically not "victims" of their choices, but active participants. It may scare us or disgust us, but it is their choice, and they have the right to make it.

Calla



leadership527 -> RE: Pro-ana and pro-mia as kinks (6/18/2010 9:16:14 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: CallaFirestormBW
This is a crucial point. See, I'm not sure that we -should- try to alter that line of thought, any more than I think that people should have to alter their preferences to find me attractive because I'm fat. The sticking point for many people is that it bothers them that another person would make choices that might cause them to die early... which makes the issue of our own mortality come too close for comfort, and makes people skittish--compelling people to interfere in people's freedom of choice about their own bodies.

Heh, I totally agree and I am, in fact, enough of a cold-hearted bastard to not particularly care whether other people harm themselves. My big concern is strictly financial. I'm sure on the entire laundry list of human behaviors there'd be at least a few that I would not want to allow my neighbors to do... I'd have to think long and hard about consensual cannibalism for instance... but overall I'm pretty good with "If you want to hurt yourself and you're not asking me to pay for it, then go for it." as a policy.



wandersalone -> RE: Pro-ana and pro-mia as kinks (6/18/2010 9:32:01 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: CallaFirestormBW

I'd like to say that it's been my experience, in working with some really amazing professionals, that these individuals are typically not "victims" of their choices, but active participants. It may scare us or disgust us, but it is their choice, and they have the right to make it.

Calla



And for therapists working with people who have these incredibly firm beliefs about the rightness and logicality of what they are doing it would be naive to think that we could try and alter their beliefs and often the best we can do is to take a harm minimisation approach (much the same as I would with chronic self harm in some instances)



kiwisub12 -> RE: Pro-ana and pro-mia as kinks (6/18/2010 9:51:15 AM)

I'm thinking that the dom that instigated/supported this life choice would actually be held liable if one of the women dies.

There was a case of a woman who sat on her boyfriends toilet until her butt grew into the seat. After she was finally removed, the boyfriend was charged with (i think) mistreatment of an adult incompetent.   Just because the woman refused to come out didn't make him any less responsible for reporting her condition.

I see the same situation here - if the women are starving themselves, for whatever reason, then he is responsible for reporting it.   Anyway, depending on the law of the land, his responsibility may come back to bite him on the butt.



Ishtarr -> RE: Pro-ana and pro-mia as kinks (6/18/2010 10:29:35 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

It might.

But what about hunger strikes? Who are we to decide what another person can and cannot put their lives in danger for? What motives are acceptable and what are not?

Do we believe in "informed consent" and ownership of our bodies so long as it doesn't unwillingly harm another or don't we?

I see unhealthy shit happen at munches and parties all the time- newbies playing with three new tops at their first party and not one of them warning about possible drop, lying about being monogamous and cheating, leaping into collars with barely a second glance. Do I have the right to prevent them from making THEIR choices about THEIR lives?

Anorexia is just an easy target because it's so physically obvious and directly harmful.


LA, I'm going to quote something my Ethics prof told me a while ago, just because I like your posts so much...

"You're too much of a libertarian to have a reasonable discussion with" [:D]



porcelaine -> RE: Pro-ana and pro-mia as kinks (6/18/2010 11:34:27 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: CallaFirestormBW

The sticking point for many people is that it bothers them that another person would make choices that might cause them to die early...


An obsession with ones appearance would already be present. Sometimes it doesn't manifest as anorexia or bulimia. The ideas behind both disorders may be disquieting on some level, but they aren't completely repulsive either. Pro-ana/mia provides the answer that was lacking. It's a theoretical question of sorts. I know I'm not "a" but "b" isn't off base. Perhaps it's more acceptable to be the latter than the first. At least in the practitioners mind.

quote:

As you've noted, most of the treatment programs out there only serve to provide a support network for continuing the behavior among individuals who have made that choice. My relative managed, through her inpatient stays, to connect with a network that talks daily about their ana/mia behavior and supports one another in the choice -- to the point where she finally decided not to have kids, because she can't see herself giving up her genuine love for herself with as skin and bones. She is an artist, and her aesthetic reflects in both directions -- and did so LONG before she entered on this path.


It's a cesspool of tidbits and other pieces of advice to promote the lifestyle. In all truth talking to them only pushes her deeper down the rabbit hole. It's akin to a murderer taking advice from one of his own. They're both speaking the same language. The group removes the isolation and gives them camaraderie. They're not alone anymore.

quote:

The fact that there are so many ana/mia practitioners in fashion is, at least in part (IMO), a function of that ideosyncracy -- and our obsession, as a culture, with the fashion industry, makes it appear as if the outlet is the cause.


Gemma Atkinson is the celebrated poster child for pro-ana/mia adherents. She's an ideal that many seek to emulate. I don't know if she's a sufferer, but it's clear her body type is one many wish to have. I can't blame that on the fashion industry. That's a defect taking place in someone's head. I think she's an acceptable beginning, but rarely where it ends. That's merely the jumping off point so to speak. A prominent rib cage with jutting pelvic bones isn't being showcased on the runaway, and that's the standard that many are working towards.

quote:

I'd like to say that it's been my experience, in working with some really amazing professionals, that these individuals are typically not "victims" of their choices, but active participants. It may scare us or disgust us, but it is their choice, and they have the right to make it.


I've noticed that many of them have a peculiar relationship with food. It's almost a love/hate of sorts. It isn't often articulated because it skews the line of socially accepted behaviors. Finding one another through ana and mia is an unlikely homecoming. It allows them to express all the things that have gone unsaid. The traits involved in this disorder are more prevalent than most realize. The difference is the individual's unwillingness to go the distance. Or perhaps the activating triggers have never been pressed. In the end it is a choice. You can't be pro-ana or mia without making the decision to do so.

~porcelaine



Mercnbeth -> RE: Pro-ana and pro-mia as kinks (6/18/2010 11:49:55 AM)

~ Fast Snack ~


quote:

Actually, ana/mia are pretty sustainable for decades. We've got a couple of ana/mias in the local groups here who have been actively ana/mia for 20+ years. The biggest risk for ana/mia is underlying issues (particularly cardiac issues) that cause heart damage/failure and/or kidney damage/failure. If an ana/mia makes it into the long-term risk pool, ana/mia is sustainable for decades.


I've been ana/mia for 54 years - with sustained fasting for periods as long as 10-12 hours, of course I was sleeping for most of those long periods. I consider myself a recovering, functional anorexic. I'm currently in the middle of a 3 hour fast and anticipate continuing it at least until lunch, if not all day until 5:30 when my slave better have my usual Friday evening martini and appetizers waiting. I may be anorexic but I still require having my basic needs met. Being completely disclosing, I also actively engage in 'purging'. Some may be fooled and think it genetic, however my head 'hair purge' is deliberate and ongoing. Focusing 'on topic' to similar internal digestion considerations; I actively 'purged' this morning. I plan, and hope to do so again tomorrow morning and regularly every day until I too die from the abuse I've subjected myself to sustain my personal, albeit perhaps similarly delusional, 'perfect' body image. There is nothing anyone can do to stop me either!

Attention seekers come in all forms - Adopting a ana/mia identity is a particularly good, and fashionable it seems, method. The four pages of discussion so far point to how much attention you can get and may serve to rationalize continuing to live in such a manner. To know someone active for 20+ years serves as an example of how well that works. Gandhi used the attention for political reasons, (ummm considering resent posts; was it 'altruistic' or self serving? Would we know the name Gandhi if he espoused the same views but looked like Orson Wells did in his later years?) using it for visibility and exposure is no less valid. "Hey - we need another for our party. Why not invite over that anorexic you know? But not the bulimic - that's just a waste of food."

According to a 'Western-centric', 'Judeo/Christian' view of world history; only two people have gotten off the planet without dying. (Name them for bonus points!) We are ALL dying, and I guarantee there is nobody living any form of life or 'style' that someone else can't point out how self destructive that dietary or life choice is. Therefor talk to the right 'expert' and we are ALL committing suicide. The bottom line is suicide, natural causes, accident, or ending up in an convenient empty lot by pissing off the wrong person or 'family' - you die. How you get there it up to you. Personally, I'm taking the hedonistic, bacchanal, over-indulgent, approach. I know I'm killing myself - but I'm having a FUN in the process!

Therefor, I'm taking the position that Pro-ana and Pro-mia, and those who love, create, nurture, and enable them, deserve to have their 'fun' too!

And hey - if anyone has an interest in finding the ana/mia of your dreams - some wear these 'insider bracelets'. Who knows - someday having one may define you as the ana/mia 'old guard'.



LuckyAlbatross -> RE: Pro-ana and pro-mia as kinks (6/18/2010 11:54:56 AM)

quote:

"You're too much of a libertarian to have a reasonable discussion with"


LOL ideally I'm an anarchist (self-rule), but we haven't evolved nearly to the point of that being feasible in terms of global society yet.



Tantriqu -> RE: Pro-ana and pro-mia as kinks (6/18/2010 12:23:56 PM)

Easy: To the OP: if this is true, call the cops.
And to the pro-anorexia and pro-bulimia posters: you KNOW if someone did this to their dog, you'd be breaking down their door and threatening the dom with a fire hatchet.
Cowards.
the so-called dom is medically and dangerously ignorant and a sociopath, the women are mentally incapable and in the midst of Stockholm Syndrome, and the sooner the cops are called, the better. Every day, the likelihood of beriberi and other starvation disorders being reversible plummets. The women are in a Japanese concentration camp in the midst of plenty instead of an Indonesian jungle.
If that's their kink, let him restrict a menstruating women to a well-balanced 2200 kcal/day with a vitamin and mineral supplement under a registered dietitian plus 30 minutes/day cardio.
Anything more is bestial.



CallaFirestormBW -> RE: Pro-ana and pro-mia as kinks (6/18/2010 1:27:03 PM)

quote:

And to the pro-anorexia and pro-bulimia posters: you KNOW if someone did this to their dog, you'd be breaking down their door and threatening the dom with a fire hatchet.


The difference is, a dog can't give consent and choose to live this way. A human being -can-, and has the ultimate sovereignty over hir own body.

quote:

Cowards.

Frankly, it is much more courageous to abide by one's own firm beliefs, even when that means taking a stand that results in such overtly hostile commentary than to knuckle under to pressure from the masses. It would be easy (and weak, IMO) to just nod and say "Oh, yeah, this is absolutely bad because everyone else says it's just awful" without considering all of the circumstances in play and considering the free will of the participants.

Calla



January -> RE: Pro-ana and pro-mia as kinks (6/18/2010 3:17:19 PM)

quote:

And to the pro-anorexia and pro-bulimia posters:


Your statement is kind of provocative, no?

Just because some of us might regard starvation as a form of BDSM, doesn't mean we approve. I personally think it's awful. But not everybody practicing kink is mentally sound.

Speaking of mental: A little open-mindedness would do you some good, Tanrumqu. Calling people cowards and writing with conviction and emotion doesn't automatically make you ethically superior.

January






DarkSteven -> RE: Pro-ana and pro-mia as kinks (6/18/2010 5:19:50 PM)

I have tried to cure eating disorders with a discipline regimen.  Got nowhere.  That's one nasty, sick habit.

If I ever met some idiot who actually fostered this in a sub, I'd haul off and sock him.

quote:

ORIGINAL: sunshinemiss

Helping someone *overcome* a disorder would be impressive.


Yeah.  Been there, tried that, failed.



sunshinemiss -> RE: Pro-ana and pro-mia as kinks (6/18/2010 5:26:51 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Tantriqu

Easy: To the OP: if this is true, call the cops.

There is little the police can do. There is little that even psychiatric institutions can do unless the person is at death's door.

And to the pro-anorexia and pro-bulimia posters: you KNOW if someone did this to their dog, you'd be breaking down their door and threatening the dom with a fire hatchet.

Agreed. Or at least there would be outrage.

Cowards.
the so-called dom is medically and dangerously ignorant and a sociopath, the women are mentally incapable and in the midst of Stockholm Syndrome, and the sooner the cops are called, the better. Every day, the likelihood of beriberi and other starvation disorders being reversible plummets. The women are in a Japanese concentration camp in the midst of plenty instead of an Indonesian jungle.

While I don't cotton to name calling and such, from a psych standpoint I agree - there is serious mental illness on both sides.

If that's their kink, let him restrict a menstruating women to a well-balanced 2200 kcal/day with a vitamin and mineral supplement under a registered dietitian plus 30 minutes/day cardio.
Anything more is bestial.


I'd add a visit to the M.D. here and follow those guidelines, but yup. I'm with the spirit of your post.


Feeding (pardon the word) someone's psychiatric disorder is not "mastering" them. "Ordering" a compulsive person to continue being compulsive is like "ordering" your car to drive when you have your foot on the gas peddle.

Helping someone *overcome* a disorder would be impressive.

best,
sunshine



LafayetteLady -> RE: Pro-ana and pro-mia as kinks (6/18/2010 5:36:50 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: EclipseAbove

That is a slippery slope. Many people would say that anyone who agrees to being flogged or beaten or <insert your favorite kink> is also not making rational decisions. I know many people who would love to have everyone kinky declared unable to make rational decisions and locked up until they "recover". Makes me think of the homosexual re-education camps that some churches run to "cure" people of homosexuality.


So to avoid what you perceive as a "slippery slope" you feel it is much better to sit back and see someone die, all because they "consented." Believe it or not, the court would not view flogging and this situation equally.

quote:


As to the original topic, while it may be difficult to read about the results of this person's choices, I haven't heard anything that indicates non-consent or even her unhappiness with the situation. Maybe I missed something. It sounds like the only issue she has is with her family's dislike and attempt to be involved. This is one of those extreme cases that really tests the idea that consenting adults can do whatever they want as long as it doesn't infringe on others. So far, I don't see it infringing on anyone more than any other activity does (every activity has an impact on others, it is just a matter of degrees).


There is no disputing that anorexia and bulimia are ILLNESSES. By your comment above, someone who was into "cutting" (and not in the kinky aspect) who felt good about what they were doing, or a schizophrenic who felt it was right to listen to the voices in their head should all be left to make their own decisions.

The reality is that far too many "kinksters" take the concept of "choices" and "tolerance" way too far. It's become like an excuse to ignore the world around you. I can't help but wonder how people like you feel when you hear that the person you didn't try to help because you couldn't see any "unhappiness" or indication of "non-consent" turns up dead or injured for life. I guess y'all then take the attitude of thinking that they learned their lesson, and sleep like a baby.

Personally, I am extremely happy that I don't choose to be that way. I would rather have a bunch of people who shun responsibility under the umbrella of ignorantly not wanting to save someone from themself call me judgemental, then to ignore even ONE person that, in my view, was not making rational decisions and was headed towards seriously hurting themselves or worse, losing their life.

You probably sleep better at night, but then so do the blissfully ignorant. No that isn't a nice statement. But you know what? While it is very sad that this woman has put herself in this situation and seems to be lacking the capacity to see the danger, it is the absolute lack of ethics, morals and social consciousness that this "blanket" of "tolerance" for other people's decision, regardless of the danger that make people think that all kinksters are amoral and deviant. That type of person is not simply giving BDSM a bad reputation, you make the whole human race look bad. Thankfully, there are more people like me than you.

OP, I understand that you don't know where this woman is or anything like that and you want to help. Should you be able to continue speaking with her, and can find out, I would call the police in her area and send them to the house to remove the woman. They are obligated to check on her if you tell them that she told you she was being purposely starved to death. The fact that she also claims to have consented means nothing. One look at her and the police would remove her and the other woman and arrest the man. Yes it is a drastic act, but perhaps would save her life. At this point, she needs deprogramming.



sunshinemiss -> RE: Pro-ana and pro-mia as kinks (6/18/2010 5:43:22 PM)

quote:

The reality is that far too many "kinksters" take the concept of "choices" and "tolerance" way too far. It's become like an excuse to ignore the world around you. I can't help but wonder how people like you feel when you hear that the person you didn't try to help because you couldn't see any "unhappiness" or indication of "non-consent" turns up dead or injured for life. I guess y'all then take the attitude of thinking that they learned their lesson, and sleep like a baby.
...
You probably sleep better at night, but then so do the blissfully ignorant. No that isn't a nice statement. But you know what? While it is very sad that this woman has put herself in this situation and seems to be lacking the capacity to see the danger, it is the absolute lack of ethics, morals and social consciousness that this "blanket" of "tolerance" for other people's decision, regardless of the danger that make people think that all kinksters are amoral and deviant. That type of person is not simply giving BDSM a bad reputation, you make the whole human race look bad. Thankfully, there are more people like me than you.


Thank you Lafayette. I agree that tolerance is one thing. Willfully ignoring danger is another.

Best,
sunshine




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