RE: The path to Dem victory in 2012...circumvent the Constitution

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willbeurdaddy -> RE: The path to Dem victory in 2012...circumvent the Constitution (7/21/2010 3:09:12 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: flcouple2009 Archer, They can allocate the electoral votes however they wish. I don't believe they can just opt out which is what they are voting for. No, that isnt what they are voting for. They are voting to pledge their electors to vote with the popular vote. That isnt opting out.

Jeffff -> RE: The path to Dem victory in 2012...circumvent the Constitution (7/21/2010 3:09:37 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy I agree, except that it is circumventing the intent of the electoral system, albeit not the language. But that is where an attorney make their money.

willbeurdaddy -> RE: The path to Dem victory in 2012...circumvent the Constitution (7/21/2010 3:11:02 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Jeffff In this age pressing the flesh is less valuble than it was. Television plays a huge part. Illinois has as of 2000, 12,419,293 people and 24 eletoral votes. Indiana has 6,080,485 and 11 electoral votes. If 5 milion people in IN. vote Republican, it goes Rep. If the same number vote Rep. in Il. it goes Dem. Yes that is an over simplification but it might be possible a popular vote actually carries the wishes of the country better. We have a popular election for govenor in Il. There are 6 million people in the CHicago area. Chicago is a democratic strong hold, yet we have recently elected republican govenors. I am not married to the idea of a popular vote, but I think it is worth exploring. So change "pressign the flesh" to "allocating advertising dollars to markets". Utah will have to go to youtube to even find out who's running.

truckinslave -> RE: The path to Dem victory in 2012...circumvent the Constitution (7/21/2010 3:11:07 PM)
quote: Well, whats needed is federal constitutional changes to amend that electoral college shit outta existence Clearly that's the honest way to do it, just as repeal of the 2nd Amendment would have been the honest way to do "gun control". Clearly, also, the dims have tried/are trying these end runs for two simple reasons: 1. They lack the votes to do it honestly. 2. They lack the integrity to do it honestly.

Archer -> RE: The path to Dem victory in 2012...circumvent the Constitution (7/21/2010 3:15:02 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy Utah will have to go to youtube to even find out who's running. OMFG That's funny I don't care who you are.

Jeffff -> RE: The path to Dem victory in 2012...circumvent the Constitution (7/21/2010 3:16:03 PM)
WHere do you get this shit? How come you never know what you are talking about. You showed GREAT integrity firing employees who did not vote the way you liked. God... you really are an idiot.

DomKen -> RE: The path to Dem victory in 2012...circumvent the Constitution (7/21/2010 4:57:08 PM)
If no one has noticed virtually no Presidential campaigning is being done outside of 2 to 4 "battleground" states every 4 years. In my entire adult life (first Presidential election I voted in was 1988) I have yet to live in one of these battlegrounds despite having cast votes in 4 of the highest population states in the country (CA, FL, NY, IL). Secvondly why should my vote be worth so much less than a voter in Wyoming? Illinois has 21 electoral votes and a population of 12.9M while Wyoming has 3 electoral college votes and a population of 550k. IOW Illinois has 23 times as many people represented by only 7 times as many electors. The system is skewed way too far in favor of the small population states.

willbeurdaddy -> RE: The path to Dem victory in 2012...circumvent the Constitution (7/21/2010 5:00:00 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DomKen If no one has noticed virtually no Presidential campaigning is being done outside of 2 to 4 "battleground" states every 4 years. In my entire adult life (first Presidential election I voted in was 1988) I have yet to live in one of these battlegrounds despite having cast votes in 4 of the highest population states in the country (CA, FL, NY, IL). Secvondly why should my vote be worth so much less than a voter in Wyoming? Illinois has 21 electoral votes and a population of 12.9M while Wyoming has 3 electoral college votes and a population of 550k. IOW Illinois has 23 times as many people represented by only 7 times as many electors. The system is skewed way too far in favor of the small population states. First paragraph is bullshit, second paragraph is exactly the way it was intended to keep populous states from wielding too much power. Change the Constitution if you dont like it, dont do an end run. http://www.newsweek.com/2008/06/14/everywhere-and-beyond.html

DomKen -> RE: The path to Dem victory in 2012...circumvent the Constitution (7/21/2010 5:16:02 PM)
Posting an article about Obama's fifty state strategy doesn't prove anyone campaigned where I live in 2008. I live in Illinois and the state was solid for Obama from the very start. No one campaigned here. Only reason I even saw a campaign ad on TV was I spent the final weekend as a volunteer in Indiana.

willbeurdaddy -> RE: The path to Dem victory in 2012...circumvent the Constitution (7/21/2010 6:07:26 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DomKen Posting an article about Obama's fifty state strategy doesn't prove anyone campaigned where I live in 2008. I live in Illinois and the state was solid for Obama from the very start. No one campaigned here. Only reason I even saw a campaign ad on TV was I spent the final weekend as a volunteer in Indiana. quote: virtually no Presidential campaigning is being done outside of 2 to 4 "battleground" states every 4 years Thats why I was careful to quote you...so you cant get away with lying about what you said. "virtually no Presidential campaigning is being done outside of 2 to 4 "battleground" states every 4 years" not that "no one campaigned here". The 50 state strategy directly addressees that nonsense. As far as Illinois goes...duhhhhh. Its his home state. It doesnt say a goddam thing about campaigns in general. And "no one campaigned here" is a lie to start with. "The city of Springfield still hasn’t been fully repaid for costs associated with hosting then- U.S. Sen. Barack Obama’s presidential campaign stop in the fall of 2008." I guess it was a phantom stop they want to be repaid for. And while it may be the same stop, August is usually considered summer: "Joe and I will appear for the first time as running mates this afternoon in Springfield, Illinois—the same place this campaign began more than 19 months ago." August 23rd. Do I really need to waste more time exposing your lies and ignorance?

DomKen -> RE: The path to Dem victory in 2012...circumvent the Constitution (7/21/2010 6:39:43 PM)
Maybe you're not clear on what "virtually no" means and how it is different from none or maybe you are just clueless.

slvemike4u -> RE: The path to Dem victory in 2012...circumvent the Constitution (7/21/2010 6:44:45 PM)
Ken.....I'm going with clueless.

zenny -> RE: The path to Dem victory in 2012...circumvent the Constitution (7/21/2010 7:03:49 PM)
Yes.. mob rule is the way to go. I only wish the electoral college would do their job. Then again.. the requirements to be a member aren't that high.

mnottertail -> RE: The path to Dem victory in 2012...circumvent the Constitution (7/22/2010 6:46:19 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Archer jeff if I have X hours to spend pressing the flesh and campaigning, am I going to spend it in a city where I might get 2 million votes or in one where I might get 200,000 votes? The electoral college was designed to force candidates to campaign in all parts of the country. It was designed as one of the checks and balances of power. a check against the tyranny of the majority. I know Mel Gibson is out of favor but the quote from hin in The Patriot applies here "why should I trade 1 tyrannt 3000 miles away for 3,000 tyrannts 1 mile away?" the Founding fathers feared too much democracy. Yeah, we were all aflutter when the candidates stopped in Richville. I understand the design Archie, but it really hasn't panned out, the script now reads, do the homey soul food man of the people thing on tv up in new hampshire, then you can get on to the big cities, and big bucks, send your vp candidate out to the sticks while you do a few medium cities, and then when its a really really really slow news day, see if you can hook up a little tough on defense speech in dismal seepage iowa at the local VFW sleepathon hall. The Electoral College pretty much corresponds to the reps et al in your state, such that big cites have a deathgrip in any case. And, in many ways, the issues in big cities (federally) are not that different in tiny towns. Obama cannot hire police for Los Angeles by example......... You get where I am going Archer. Ron

willbeurdaddy -> RE: The path to Dem victory in 2012...circumvent the Constitution (7/22/2010 11:39:25 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DomKen Maybe you're not clear on what "virtually no" means and how it is different from none or maybe you are just clueless. Your "virtually" was attached to your nonsense about campaigning outside of 2-4 battleground states, which was totally disproven by Obama's own strategies. The claim of "virtually no campaigning" is so patently absurd its painful. Your claim about Ill. was "no one campaigned here", no caveats. Again proven wrong, and without even including McCain/Palin. Fail again, Kendoll.

truckinslave -> RE: The path to Dem victory in 2012...circumvent the Constitution (7/22/2010 2:56:47 PM)
quote: The system is skewed way too far in favor of the small population states. Are you sufficiently consistent to call for abolishing the Senate? The Founders wanted States (and regions) to have some small amount of power in their own right.

truckinslave -> RE: The path to Dem victory in 2012...circumvent the Constitution (7/22/2010 3:00:29 PM)
quote: do the homey soul food man of the people thing on tv up in new hampshire, then you can get on to the big cities, and big bucks, The primary schedule is a completely different problem from the electoral college, and is of course the fault not of the Constitution but of the parties.

DomKen -> RE: The path to Dem victory in 2012...circumvent the Constitution (7/22/2010 3:06:22 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy quote: ORIGINAL: DomKen Maybe you're not clear on what "virtually no" means and how it is different from none or maybe you are just clueless. Your "virtually" was attached to your nonsense about campaigning outside of 2-4 battleground states, which was totally disproven by Obama's own strategies. The claim of "virtually no campaigning" is so patently absurd its painful. Your claim about Ill. was "no one campaigned here", no caveats. Again proven wrong, and without even including McCain/Palin. Fail again, Kendoll. Talk to me about failure when you learn to do simple multiplication. I stand by what I wrote and I'm sure everyone who read what I wrote understood the point I was making. Only you seem to have trouble understanding english. That's 2 r's you fail at. How's your handwriting? illegible?

willbeurdaddy -> RE: The path to Dem victory in 2012...circumvent the Constitution (7/22/2010 3:07:50 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DomKen quote: ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy quote: ORIGINAL: DomKen Maybe you're not clear on what "virtually no" means and how it is different from none or maybe you are just clueless. Your "virtually" was attached to your nonsense about campaigning outside of 2-4 battleground states, which was totally disproven by Obama's own strategies. The claim of "virtually no campaigning" is so patently absurd its painful. Your claim about Ill. was "no one campaigned here", no caveats. Again proven wrong, and without even including McCain/Palin. Fail again, Kendoll. Talk to me about failure when you learn to do simple multiplication. I stand by what I wrote and I'm sure everyone who read what I wrote understood the point I was making. Yes, they understood that both of your points were based on falsehoods. Like "all" of your arguments.

DomKen -> RE: The path to Dem victory in 2012...circumvent the Constitution (7/22/2010 3:11:03 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: truckinslave quote: The system is skewed way too far in favor of the small population states. Are you sufficiently consistent to call for abolishing the Senate? The Founders wanted States (and regions) to have some small amount of power in their own right. Got no problem with the Senate. It works as an upper house pretty well. But if you guys are so gung ho for the electoral college then let's repeal the 12th amendment and go back to what the founders actually intended.

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