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Intelligence levels in S/M & BDSM - 4/17/2006 9:54:47 AM

ScooterTrash

Posts: 1407
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From: Indiana
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It's interesting to me to read the posts on the forum boards and just marvel at the amount of folks we have with obviously high IQs and amazing amounts of knowledge. Sure, we disagree often, probably due to it (nature of the beast), but I am just wondering if anyone else is seeing a correlation between being intelligent and being in the lifestyle? I'm almost thinking that we, as a group, may have inadvertently got bored with the "nilla" world not only because of particular kinks and such, but perhaps also because on an intellectual level we didn't fit in. Yes, I know there are some flyers, but the vast majority seems to fit this classification.

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RE: Intelligence levels in S/M & BDSM - 4/17/2006 10:03:40 AM

BrutalAntipathy

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Mensa members used to have a D/s subgroup called Brains & Chains, but I think it is now defunct. The message board had a running thread concerning the correlation between intelligence and D/s. As best as could be told, D/s was the second favorite kink for intellectuals, the first being anthropomorphs.

(in reply to ScooterTrash)

Post #: 2

RE: Intelligence levels in S/M & BDSM - 4/17/2006 10:03:41 AM

heartfeltsub

Posts: 1641
Joined: 11/5/2004
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Having first learned about this lifestyle while living in South Carolina, i can vouch for the fact that not everyone in this lifestyle has an above average IQ. (little joke) That being said, it does seem to be the case that a great many lifestylers are above average intelligence.

(in reply to ScooterTrash)

Post #: 3

RE: Intelligence levels in S/M & BDSM - 4/17/2006 10:06:00 AM

gooddogbenji

Posts: 5094
Joined: 11/15/2005
From: Toronto
Status: offline

Scooter,

I have to say, I have come across all sorts. On the other side I have read profile after profile of both Dom and sub where I shake my head and wonder...

One example, if we take a leap of faith, is the infamous Jessyka that we saw a while ago. The leap of faith I'm taking is saying this person was actually a girl who thought this was serious. She was online a long time before she hit the message boards. I would not have considered her smart.

Many new posters we see are, in my opinion, not presenting themselves in an intelligent way. Rants, whining etc.. Many get shouted down, probably discouraged, and leave, but they are no doubt in "the lifestyle"

I think that in order to survive on these message boards, a reasonable amount of intelligence is needed, or a really thick skin.

To me, these message boards have a LOT of very experienced, intelligent people, but that is not necessarily reflective of the lifestyle population on the whole.

Yours,

benji

< Message edited by gooddogbenji -- 4/17/2006 10:08:32 AM >

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RE: Intelligence levels in S/M & BDSM - 4/17/2006 11:04:24 AM

MasterFireMaam

Posts: 5587
Joined: 3/1/2006
From: Charleston, WV
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I had a submissive for a number of years (we are still friends) who is a social psychologist. It's his professional opinion that more intelligent people are more apt to be open-minded and thus will more readily experiment with and embrace alternate sexualities and relationship dynamics. This isn't saying that all intelligent people are kiny or all kinky people are intelligent, just that there seems to be a decent overlap. I've tried to convince him on a number of occassions to study the BDSM/Leather society, but he seems to think his current area is interesting enough. Geeze! "Come on!" I'd say, "Think of it. Funding to go to any and every Leather event there is!" Nope, he won't budge. Silly man (tongue in cheek). Oh, and yes, he has a Mensa IQ.

Fire

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(in reply to ScooterTrash)

Post #: 5

RE: Intelligence levels in S/M & BDSM - 4/17/2006 2:10:49 PM

puella

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I am not certain that I would lay a great vastness of intelligence at the doorstep of BDSM. I think rather, that is is that you are more likely to get a bunch of people, willing and comfortable in engaging their minds enough to formulate a written thought in this or any other sort of forum. I would think that this makes possible the 'phenomena' within the forums of a spectrum of intelligence, both on display with the written posts, and more illusively with those who just read.

So really I think it might well be more that the sort of people who would frequent a discussion channel in general (of any sort, really) are going to (though not exclusively, of course) be of a certain predisposition which allows for, if not an actualized intelligence, at least the desire to seek out new thoughts, which of course, brings education.

< Message edited by puella -- 4/17/2006 2:15:09 PM >

(in reply to MasterFireMaam)

Post #: 6

RE: Intelligence levels in S/M & BDSM - 4/17/2006 2:25:11 PM

BitaTruble

Posts: 9779
Joined: 1/12/2006
From: Texas
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quote:

ORIGINAL: ScooterTrash

It's interesting to me to read the posts on the forum boards and just marvel at the amount of folks we have with obviously high IQs and amazing amounts of knowledge. Sure, we disagree often, probably due to it (nature of the beast), but I am just wondering if anyone else is seeing a correlation between being intelligent and being in the lifestyle? I'm almost thinking that we, as a group, may have inadvertently got bored with the "nilla" world not only because of particular kinks and such, but perhaps also because on an intellectual level we didn't fit in. Yes, I know there are some flyers, but the vast majority seems to fit this classification.

I wouldn't use this forum as a gauge. The majority of regular posters probably like to write and people who like to do something, practice at it often enough, tend to do it well or at least better than the average Joe Schmoe who doesn't have the opportunity to hone their writing skill. Then there are those (like me) who are opinionated and like to write ::grins:: and that's what I glean from the posters on collarme. In the offline world though, it's the same as anything else with diverse groups of people. You get both rotten and golden eggs ending up in the same basket. The bell curve for forums is skewed so while it may appear one way, it's probably not.

Celeste

_____________________________

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Rock, paper, scissors."

He laughed. "You are the wisest woman I know."

(in reply to ScooterTrash)

Post #: 7

RE: Intelligence levels in S/M & BDSM - 4/17/2006 2:36:11 PM

SusanofO

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Joined: 12/19/2005
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''Whips and Brains'' is not defunct Brutal Antipathy. I just never joined that SIG because I am not sure my local group knows I am interested in "alternative life-styles" (or who may have an extra big mouth if I did). I don't care anyway. I know a few Mensans who are intellectually smart (but not Wise or kind - although I do know a lot of nice ones, too). As I do people who could maybe be in Mensa and just aren't interested (I would bet that Many in Collarme would qualify, including the ones who posted here).

Heart is more important than brains, bottom line (to me) in a partner - and in friendships if there is some quality I admire, while being intelligent is great and I like seeing it (a lot). I see it displayed arounf these boards on a pretty consistent basis. Heart is going to trump brains for me almost every time, though, if I have to make a choice. Even though I still run a local SIG group in my local group (monthly dinners), I barely "quailfied" for Whips and Brains and am not a member (but could be). They also have a SIG (special interest group) called SMart (capital S & M in the word Smart stands for S/M). having "heart' is not incompatible with the concept of sadism (to me anyway) - at all (I've worked that one through for myself and know it can be debated ad infinitum by some also).

Heart is what matters more (to me) if there were going to be a 'coin toss'. It's going to sound way too "basic" - but - to me anyway; whether someone is nice. Life's too short and nobody does anything (although it could, I suppose be debated until the cows came home I tend to still believe it) but inherit "braininess".

But - someone has to actually Work at things like displaying good judgment and knowing when to be kind (and if they are operating in the realm of bdsm particularly, when it might pay to be cruel, and how to try to manage other people's "foibles" - as well as their own.

I think you can be a 'genius' (acc. to an arbitratry intelligence test that measures mostly verbal and logic skills - and no other kinds of skills - like "emotional intelligence skills, for instance) - and an IQ test that was constucted by a foible human to boot) - and use your "intellligence" to destroy other people, or use it to uplift them in any case - so for me - the whole issue of "is it important" gets down to what one ultimately values, bottom line.

It's similar to a "debate" over if one religon (or lacxk thereof) or "life philosophy' is more valid (Atheism, Nihilism, Catholicism, Bhuddism) than another. No. Not unless I was God ( or the Supreme Being, or whatever force created this world) would I even be able to venture a guess as to whether that is the "right" out-look/ religion or if it's the question itself that maybe doesn't matters as much as some seem to think it does.

But - I am (supposedly)a "feeler" type of personality, aso that's where my perspective is coming from. That, plus my "value system" (and he we go w/all the designations that are so subjective again)... - Susan of O

< Message edited by SusanofO -- 4/17/2006 3:19:14 PM >

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And never stops at all". - Emily Dickinson

(in reply to BrutalAntipathy)

Post #: 8

RE: Intelligence levels in S/M & BDSM - 4/17/2006 3:08:41 PM

slavejali

Posts: 2918
Status: offline

You could think of it this way, participation on forums has to indicate some form of intelligence. The fact that any person posting knows how to turn a computer on, how to open a program, how to submit a picture, how to write a profile, how to post to a topic are all indicators of some form of knowledge and intelligence.

quote:

Original Quote: MasterFireMaam
It's his professional opinion that more intelligent people are more apt to be open-minded and thus will more readily experiment with and embrace alternate sexualities and relationship dynamics.

I was going to go into something like that, but as its already been said.

I agree, often intelligence and open mindedness go hand in hand.

< Message edited by slavejali -- 4/17/2006 3:09:11 PM >

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RE: Intelligence levels in S/M & BDSM - 4/17/2006 3:33:52 PM

cillydom

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Joined: 3/3/2006
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I make posts and many think I’m a complete idiot, so that’s not always true.

(in reply to ScooterTrash)

Post #: 10

RE: Intelligence levels in S/M & BDSM - 4/17/2006 3:52:41 PM

Vancouver_cinful

Posts: 1911
Joined: 2/3/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: slavejali

You could think of it this way, participation on forums has to indicate some form of intelligence. The fact that any person posting knows how to turn a computer on, how to open a program, how to submit a picture, how to write a profile, how to post to a topic are all indicators of some form of knowledge and intelligence.

You're much kinder than I am, today, Jali. I'm inclined to say that the internet really attracts those who think they can but haven't really got a clue! LOL

On a serious note: I did read an online study that claimed that a sampling of people into BDSM showed them to be higher than the national average in intelligence, education, and more inclined to be middle-class or upper-middle-class.

Of course, it was an online study, and you'd have to take it with a grain of salt.

Personally, I'm of the opinion that people in the lifestyle are generally of higher intelligence simply because the process of learning about BDSM, and taking the steps to making it a reality in your life, weeds out those who have no patience for learning, self-introspection, and personal growth.

Walking a road less travelled often takes a whole lot of smarts and some serious "book-lerning". (spelling intentional)

Cin

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(in reply to slavejali)

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RE: Intelligence levels in S/M & BDSM - 4/17/2006 3:57:59 PM

Takethiswaltz

Posts: 199
Joined: 3/13/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: puella

I am not certain that I would lay a great vastness of intelligence at the doorstep of BDSM. I think rather, that is is that you are more likely to get a bunch of people, willing and comfortable in engaging their minds enough to formulate a written thought in this or any other sort of forum. I would think that this makes possible the 'phenomena' within the forums of a spectrum of intelligence, both on display with the written posts, and more illusively with those who just read.

So really I think it might well be more that the sort of people who would frequent a discussion channel in general (of any sort, really) are going to (though not exclusively, of course) be of a certain predisposition which allows for, if not an actualized intelligence, at least the desire to seek out new thoughts, which of course, brings education.

I agree. Wonderfully put.

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(in reply to puella)

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RE: Intelligence levels in S/M & BDSM - 4/17/2006 3:59:24 PM

Lordandmaster

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I've found that people in the life tend to be more intelligent than the average dumass vanillas in the world, but most people in the life are intelligent enough to object to this kind of comparison whenever someone brings it up.

I don't think it's a coincidence, however. I wouldn't say that being dominant or submissive is correlated in any meaningful way with intelligence, but SUCCEEDING at being dominant or submissive is difficult and inherently requires a good dose of introspection and intelligence. Most people who can't hack it just drop out and pursue kinky sex--or whatever the fuck they're doing with their time.

(in reply to ScooterTrash)

Post #: 13

RE: Intelligence levels in S/M & BDSM - 4/17/2006 4:02:23 PM

LuckyAlbatross

Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
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I see a correllation to being intelligent and having the time/interest/money/leisure to post on the internet and go to public events to be active as part of the community and thus "known."

I think there are more intelligent people in my Firefly group than at a regular bdsm munch.

More intelligence/education (not the same) usually equates to better job/more pay/more time to find stuff/more access to DO stuff.

People in sub-culture groups go there because their don't fit into the mainstream group that already exists and/or they have a specific interest in that sub-culture.

I don't think "bdsm" correllates to being smarter, I think being active in a sub-culture is correllated to being more intelligent/educated.

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(in reply to ScooterTrash)

Post #: 14

RE: Intelligence levels in S/M & BDSM - 4/17/2006 4:16:55 PM

Vancouver_cinful

Posts: 1911
Joined: 2/3/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster
I don't think it's a coincidence, however. I wouldn't say that being dominant or submissive is correlated in any meaningful way with intelligence, but SUCCEEDING at being dominant or submissive is difficult and inherently requires a good dose of introspection and intelligence. Most people who can't hack it just drop out and pursue kinky sex--or whatever the fuck they're doing with their time.

Thanks for putting it more clearly that I could, LAM.

There are a lot of people out there with dominant or submissive qualities, who have no idea how to get their needs met in a healthy way, because they are lacking in intelligence or education.

These people often end up in relationships where getting hit, or getting to enforce your will, still takes place...just not in a healthy, sane matter. (You could still argue that it's consensual, however, since many choose to stay in these relationships or seek them out...) Of course, then it's called domestic abuse.

Cin

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Cin

quote:

My Karma Account is huge, but I just can't seem to make a withdrawal!!

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(in reply to Lordandmaster)

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RE: Intelligence levels in S/M & BDSM - 4/17/2006 4:36:20 PM

Proprietrix

Posts: 756
Joined: 7/15/2005
From: Ohio/West Virginia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: BitaTruble
I wouldn't use this forum as a gauge. The majority of regular posters probably like to write and people who like to do something, practice at it often enough, tend to do it well or at least better than the average Joe Schmoe who doesn't have the opportunity to hone their writing skill. Then there are those (like me) who are opinionated and like to write ::grins:: and that's what I glean from the posters on collarme. In the offline world though, it's the same as anything else with diverse groups of people. You get both rotten and golden eggs ending up in the same basket. The bell curve for forums is skewed so while it may appear one way, it's probably not.
Celeste

This was my opinion, but since Celeste stated it so well, I don't need to.

On a side note, *most* of my *local* lifestylists fit very well into the Appalachian, 8th grade drop-out, pregnant teenager, excessive beer drinking, stereotype very well. Very nice people and livers of the lifestyle, but not exactly the cream of the crop for intellectual conversation about anything other than deer hunting.

(in reply to BitaTruble)

Post #: 16

RE: Intelligence levels in S/M & BDSM - 4/17/2006 4:54:22 PM

TheShadows

Posts: 403
Joined: 9/16/2004
From: Southern Illinois
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ScooterTrash

...but I am just wondering if anyone else is seeing a correlation between being intelligent and being in the lifestyle?

I have seen a correlation between the two in my own personal relationships and experiences. Of course, this is limited to my own area of my state and the small area of the one next door. Though, I don't think that one necessarily has to do with the other. With as many people who're involved in the lifestyle, throughout the USA, and the world, you're likely to find similar correlations with just about anything else you can think of.

Example...I've also found, from my impromptu discussions with others of like mind in my locality, that a large portion of them are/have been Catholic, have careers in the medical field, or both.

As always, YMMV.

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(in reply to ScooterTrash)

Post #: 17

RE: Intelligence levels in S/M & BDSM - 4/17/2006 5:09:49 PM

KnightofMists

Posts: 7149
Joined: 7/29/2005
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I wouldn't equate intelligence as a parameter for being active in the lifestyle at all. It has been my experience that the intelligence level of the BDSM community is no better or worse than the general poplulation.

I would however, state that it has been my experience that individuals who persist to enhance and grow their own personal lifestyle choices are passionate individuals to this lifestyle.

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Knight of Mists

An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

(in reply to ScooterTrash)

Post #: 18

RE: Intelligence levels in S/M & BDSM - 4/17/2006 5:10:01 PM

JohnWarren

Posts: 3807
Joined: 3/18/2005
From: Delray Beach, FL
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Vancouver_cinful

Personally, I'm of the opinion that people in the lifestyle are generally of higher intelligence simply because the process of learning about BDSM, and taking the steps to making it a reality in your life, weeds out those who have no patience for learning, self-introspection, and personal growth.

To me, this is the salient fact. It's not that BDSM people don't reflect the normal curve of the general population's intelligence; it's that the lower "tail" has been truncated by a general lack of awareness and so doesn't show up among those who are able to discriminate between consensual and nonconsensual.

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(in reply to Vancouver_cinful)

Post #: 19

RE: Intelligence levels in S/M & BDSM - 4/17/2006 5:11:34 PM

CrappyDom

Posts: 1883
Joined: 4/11/2006
From: Sacramento
Status: offline

What a waste it was dropping firefly, fox could have had a real hit.

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

Post #: 20

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