quote:

ORIGINAL: Archer

L&M What a crock, My original statement included that it was a practice that Christians used as well, but in the rush to call "bigot" some folks ignored that point.

Post 72

"The idea that this couldn't be considered a "victory mosque" ignores centuries of history in which mosques have been erected in the locations of Muslim "victories". Not too unlike Christian history of churches and holidays being built on top of pagan holidays and sacred sites."...


Politesub your holding to my exact words versus the idea expressed wins a point and loses one. The distinction between building on top of the physical foundation after destroying a building and converting by extensive remodeling (such as the case in Hagia Sophia) while fair point when holding someone to exact verbage ignores that the church was in fact converted. It was a church but it isn't now.

Today it would be considered a war crime.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Archer

Here is the specific crock I was referring to in your quote.

Archer said "Not too unlike Christian history of churches and holidays being built on top of pagan holidays and sacred sites."

L&M said ..."You guys really think no Christian in human history ever built a victory church?"

The crock is the question above ignores the original point I made specifically saying that Christians had a like practice. So it was a bullshit line based on nothing, designed as a poor excuse for rhetoric. The idea was stipulated to in the original post and AGAIN you ignore that fact when you ask "what crock?"

How about a shred of intellectual honesty here. Your "throw away" spoke to something stipulated to in my own post pages ago that you chose to ignore twice.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

Well, if he doesn't know how to tie a turban, that's close enough.

quote:

ORIGINAL: luckydawg

So some folks like to change the subject instead of honestly debating.

What does a decree from a differnt church centuries later have to do with anything?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Demspotis

Although it's a bit off-topic, in hopes of preventing scapegoating of a type that has cost innocent lives, most Muslims don't wear turbans, and most of the people who wear turbans in the US belong to the different and entirely distinct Sikh religion, which in most respects shares modern American values (from both sides of the aisle)  far more than other religions. Not only are they not Muslim, but they have centuries of history of fighting and beating Muslim extremists, in particular the ancestors and director predecessors of the Taliban. This was after the Muslims tried to genocide the Sikhs.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Demspotis

quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

Well, if he doesn't know how to tie a turban, that's close enough.

Although it's a bit off-topic, in hopes of preventing scapegoating of a type that has cost innocent lives, most Muslims don't wear turbans, and most of the people who wear turbans in the US belong to the different and entirely distinct Sikh religion, which in most respects shares modern American values (from both sides of the aisle)  far more than other religions. Not only are they not Muslim, but they have centuries of history of fighting and beating Muslim extremists, in particular the ancestors and director predecessors of the Taliban. This was after the Muslims tried to genocide the Sikhs.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Steponme73

I think Stranger Than has hit the nail on the head. His anaolgy is very close to reality. No one is debating their rite to have a mosque. The debate is over where it is.
Another thing to remember is the Muslim relegion considers everyone who is not a member, an infidel...and you know what they do to infidel's if they don't convert? Guess...they do it everyday even to their own kind. They kill them...women, men children it makes no difference to them. It is their way or be dead.
If the Muslims were a peace loving relegion, as some try to make them out to be, they would not still be stoning women to death because of hearsay evidence...It still happens. Maybe you think that is no big deal, but I do.
You see, no other religion on the planet is as radical or as ruthless as the Muslims. You may want them in your back yard, I want them back where they came from. Having spent many years in "their" land, I speak from experience.
The people in New York City are the ones that started the protest. Granted alot of people have joined in, but the final decision rests in New York.
Don't be so naive as to think they have good intentions...they don't. Muslims for years, thousands of years, have built mosques on "conquered" territory. This is what they are trying to do in New York.
The United States is a Judeo Christian based country not a Muslim based country. Look how many Mosques are already here... How many Christian churches do you see in the Middle East? Few if any. They will not allow it.
There is more to this debate than just a mosque...Maybe you want to be a Muslim in the future, but I have no desire.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

quote:

ORIGINAL: Steponme73

I think Stranger Than has hit the nail on the head. His anaolgy is very close to reality. No one is debating their rite to have a mosque. The debate is over where it is.
Another thing to remember is the Muslim relegion considers everyone who is not a member, an infidel...and you know what they do to infidel's if they don't convert? Guess...they do it everyday even to their own kind. They kill them...women, men children it makes no difference to them. It is their way or be dead.
If the Muslims were a peace loving relegion, as some try to make them out to be, they would not still be stoning women to death because of hearsay evidence...It still happens. Maybe you think that is no big deal, but I do.
You see, no other religion on the planet is as radical or as ruthless as the Muslims. You may want them in your back yard, I want them back where they came from. Having spent many years in "their" land, I speak from experience.
The people in New York City are the ones that started the protest. Granted alot of people have joined in, but the final decision rests in New York.
Don't be so naive as to think they have good intentions...they don't. Muslims for years, thousands of years, have built mosques on "conquered" territory. This is what they are trying to do in New York.
The United States is a Judeo Christian based country not a Muslim based country. Look how many Mosques are already here... How many Christian churches do you see in the Middle East? Few if any. They will not allow it.
There is more to this debate than just a mosque...Maybe you want to be a Muslim in the future, but I have no desire.

I am wondering which one of "Their lands" you were in, since your whole post is riddled with inaccuracies. Christianity may not be widespread but is still freely practiced in many Islamic countries. You will also be hard pushed to find anywhere where Christians are put to death due to their faith. I sometimes wonder if some of you are even on planet earth as your claims as so far away from reality.

Edited for spelling.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

Certainly, turn-out at church services all over the Arabian peninsular is significant. Numbers in the congregations regularly beat those in congregations in Europe and even in the United States. The majority of the two million expatriate Christians who attend these services are Filipinos, Lebanese and Indians who have come to the Gulf for work.Roman Catholics from all over the Arabian Peninsula - many of them migrant workers - are helping to pay for the $15m building, which is scheduled to open at the end of the year.http://english.aljazeera.net/news/middleeast/2007/03/2008525184821608334.html

Oh and the protestants and the catholics are still fighting over in NI(as in july 2010)
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2010/jul/14/police-belfast-violence-ardoynePolice Service of Northern Ireland (PSNI) assistant chief constable Alistair Finlay earlier singled out Robinson and McGuinness for criticism after the sustained violence surrounding July 12 Orange Order marches left 82 officers injured.