Collarspace Discussion Forums


Home  Login  Search 

RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme?


View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
 
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Ask a Mistress >> RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? Page: <<   < prev  11 12 [13] 14 15   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 11:21:39 AM   
LadyNTrainer


Posts: 1584
Joined: 5/20/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DMFParadox
Sadly, I am suggesting exactly this.


Maybe my viewpoint is skewed here, as a long term successful poly dominant.  In order for any relationships to be satisfying and stable in the long run, especially complex ones like either D/s or poly, let alone both at the same time, everyone in the equation pretty much has to have a figurative Master's degree is honesty, communication, self-knowledge and personal transparency.  Fail in any of these things, and you're going to run into problems sooner rather than later.  So for me and my personal relationships, these values are the highest ones we set for ourselves and for each other, of sheer necessity. 

Because I think it's a factually descriptive term for what a computer programmer might describe as a WYSIWYG interface, I term these qualities "integrity".  If something comes out of my mouth, you can generally trust that it is an honest, accurate and self-aware reflection of what I am actually feeling and experiencing.  In short, if I say it is the truth, then it is the truth.  I may qualify what I say with disclaimers that I may not know what the truth is for you, or that I do not know if I have my objective facts absolutely correct.  I may refuse to disclose some of the truth if I feel it is not the business of the person asking, or if I am not ready to discuss it, or if there is some other reason I think it would not be constructive.  But I almost never consciously tell an actual untruth, regardless of the situation.  In general, I see this behavior as beneath me, unworthy of me, cowardly, and a corruption of true data, which is about the closest thing to blasphemy that my un-religious mind can understand.  Knowingly telling an untruth makes me exceedingly uncomfortable and unhappy.  I am capable of the act should I decide for some reason that it is the right thing to do, but petty personal gain is an insufficient motive to lose self-respect over.  I prefer being around people whose definition of personal integrity is at least reasonably congruent.


quote:

'Integrity' is a value much like every other: it is in large part dictated by the surrounding culture. Some cultures would state you violate your honor by not killing someone who insulted you; others, by having any kind of sex with someone outside of wedlock. Women have been stoned for less. So have men.


Honor is a different concept than integrity, and depends on the external views of others more than it does on your internal state.  But to avoid confusion, I will set the relatively simple definition of personal integrity as I use the term to encompass self respect that is contingent on the truth and reliability of your given word and your presentation of yourself.

quote:

But the fundamental traits that encourage survival and fecundity don't change as quickly; and one of them -- you'll hate this -- is to be a good liar. Convincing people that the right hand is empty and they shouldn't bother looking at the left one successfully is a huge advantage in a lot of situations.


Primate behavioral strategies for long term genetic survival are highly polymorphic; there is no single design that works in a complex environment.  The ability to deceive begins at the chimpanzee level, is seen well developed in gorillas, and broadens into much greater complexity in Homo sapiens.  Deception is an excellent tool for maximizing short term gains, but how does it stack up as a long term strategy for maintaining valuable social alliances?  Research suggests it does poorly; any species with a capacity for learning can and does learn when an individual's exhortations are not an accurate reflection of reality, and in short order he will find himself crying wolf to an unsympathetic crowd.  He may still deceive some individuals for short term gain, especially if they are not already familiar with his tactics, so the behavior may well persist due to the effectiveness of these rewards.  What this behavior won't do very effectively is build long term social alliances.


quote:

Women select for it. Now ask yourself: what kind of test would suffice to see if a man is a successful and skilled liar?


The evolutionary counterpressures here are significant.  Keep in mind that the test is for the reproductive fitness and long term survivability of offspring, not for a single strategy among many possible strategies that can maximize economic gains.  Homo sapiens is a complex species with polymorphic behavioral strategies, so selecting only for the "good liar" strategy is unlikely to make sense.  It's the end result that matters - actual success of the strategy selected in maximizing resources. 


quote:

Somehow, men must balance both being good, reliable providers on the one hand (better for kids), good liars and manipulators on the other hand (better traits to have in kids), and be both faithful enough to a woman so that her children have less competition (better for kids), while also being the kind of man that would successfully attract many women should he be given the chance (Better trait for male children; genetically speaking, a philandering son with good fertility is a jackpot.)


This is an example of evolutionary counterpressures, and the determining factor in mate selection is typically simpler than this: has this individual's strategies actually worked to maximize his economic resources in a manner advantageous to the female doing the selecting, and to her future offspring?  Male and female long term reproductive success strategies do differ to the point that it becomes something of a perpetual arms race of trait selection; see the Red Queen hypothesis work by W. D. Hamilton for a good treatment of this notion.

quote:

Let's say that you're designing a woman that can test for all of these traits, time and time again. You win only if she produces more grandchildren (not children, grandchildren; it takes two generations to measure the results) than the woman next to her. How would you do it?


Because there is no single good answer, typically this will tend to default to the most immediately obvious and predictable traits of physical fitness for childbearing, eg, waist to hip ratio.  Nurturing traits tend to be selected for as well.  Beyond that, it's arguable that mate selection for any single strategy that conflicts with other strategies (eg, the ability to deceive versus the ability to form lasting social alliances) is utterly ineffective at the level of that many coefficients removed. 


_____________________________

Your dominant Personal Trainer for fitness and body shaping in the lifestyle. Let my fetish be your motivation.

(in reply to DMFParadox)
Profile   Post #: 241
RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 11:31:24 AM   
Twoshoes


Posts: 1218
Joined: 7/27/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus
quote:

ORIGINAL: Twoshoes
The underlying assumption is that we, men need to 'convince' women to sleep with us.

You have to convince us to choose YOU from all the available stock :)

LH, I think this simply means we're incompatible.

People have different preferences for how they want to be acknowledged. Treating me like 'Another Brick in the Wall', is a sure-fire way to immediately lose all my interest and send me off looking for Pink Floyd instead.

(E: A reference that transcends generational differences.)

< Message edited by Twoshoes -- 10/26/2010 11:37:26 AM >

(in reply to LadyHibiscus)
Profile   Post #: 242
RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 11:44:03 AM   
LadyHibiscus


Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline
We're not incompatible, Twoshoes, you're just younger than my normal target audience! :)

_____________________________

[page 23 girl]



(in reply to Twoshoes)
Profile   Post #: 243
RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 11:47:19 AM   
LadyNTrainer


Posts: 1584
Joined: 5/20/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Lockit
I will say this... any man that reads this shit and agrees... don't email me... We are not friends if you can agree that women are irrational...


Humans are irrational.  We're an irrational species, for the most part.  It's not about men or women, it's about Homo sapiens being a slightly less hairy primate that is still fundamentally a monkey when it comes to ingrained social reflexes and behaviors.  I don't think DF has his science quite right however; it's more complicated than that.


_____________________________

Your dominant Personal Trainer for fitness and body shaping in the lifestyle. Let my fetish be your motivation.

(in reply to Lockit)
Profile   Post #: 244
RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 12:03:06 PM   
LadyNTrainer


Posts: 1584
Joined: 5/20/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: naughtynick81
The average woman who thinks most men are not good enough, let's hear her debate on it


I think that most men are *not a good match for me*.   As for my views on what constitutes "not good enough", this song by Leslie Fish pretty much encapsulates it.

Better than who? (better than who)
The scores aren't in. (the scores aren't in)
Let the gods of evolution say who'll win.
Better at what? (better at what)
In what way? (in what way)
Let the gods of evolution have their say.

I'm better than you at shooting,
You're better than me with a knife.
Who's to say which tool works better when the punks come for your life?
You're better than me at karate,
I'm better than you with a stick.
Do you really want to walk through the slums tonight, let the old gods take their pick?

I'm better at breathing pollution,
You're better at avoiding colds.
Which of us will last the longer in the worst the future holds?
You're better at surviving bug bites,
I'm better at eating junk.
If civilization sinks tomorrow, which of us would be sunk?

I'm better at training horses,
You're better at fixing cars.
Which will be in more demand at the next turn of the stars?
You're better at hunting rabbits,
I'm better at making fire.
Which of those skills can better fulfill what tomorrow might require?

I'm better at growing gardens,
You're better at counting cash.
Which will serve us best tomorrow, the money or the stash?
You're better at working computers,
I'm better at making a song.
Which will put more food on the table if the world goes right or wrong?

(musical interlude)
You're better at playing dominance,
I'm better at making friends.
What works better, whether or not civilization ends?
Nobody knows the future,
Or what skill betters the odds.
So it's best to say we're all born equal and leave the rest to the gods.

Let the gods of evolution have their say.

_____________________________

Your dominant Personal Trainer for fitness and body shaping in the lifestyle. Let my fetish be your motivation.

(in reply to naughtynick81)
Profile   Post #: 245
RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 1:22:42 PM   
Nineveh


Posts: 1299
Joined: 2/5/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: daintydimples

As a switch I have to reply to this. When I was still looking, I went out on dates with both dominant and submissive males. 99.9  % of the time, the male offered to pay. This is dating.....it has nothing to do with BDSM, or fem dommes, or anything else.

Well brought up men in our culture are taught they should pay, and so they do. Now realize, I was prepared to pay if they did not want to, but was in all cases was pleased they did. This is not b/c I am a cheap money grubbing whore (well i don't THINK so) but b/c it told me the male in question viewed the experience as a real date, not some BDSM porn fantasy.

I have a real time relationship with a male submissive, he often pays, sometimes I do, sometimes I cook for him. I cook for him to show him how much he is loved and appreciated. It has nothing to do with money or all these other issues that have been brought into this conversation. I have to think has to do with a macho male sub who would love a femdomme who could make him pay and make him like it. Alas, with his current attitude, he will never experience that.




In my BDSM porn fantasies I always pay, because I am a wealthy man in my fantasies and the fact I paid means the woman is indebted to me.  In real life meanwhile I am poor and more often than not I don't end up paying. 

I was raised to believe that chivalry is a tool of the patriarchy and assuming that I will be paying for a woman is condescending and an assumption that she cannot properly support herself.  Now mind you if I am out with a friend I make sure I have enough to pay for me and the friend both, that covers male, female, on a date or casual.  However I tend to assume we are each paying for ourselves unless it is discussed beforehand.

If I am aware that I am paying I am going to assume a certain level of control over what she orders.  I'm a Dom so that isn't entirely out of line but it seems, to me, that a Femdom would not be ok with the sub man she is out with assuming any level of control over what she can and cannot order.

(in reply to daintydimples)
Profile   Post #: 246
RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 1:29:21 PM   
Nineveh


Posts: 1299
Joined: 2/5/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

This thread and ones that we've had in the past like it on this subject seriously does make Me feel for those of you who date.  Please understand that I'm not saying that to be condescending.  It just comes across to Me as being so damn complicated.  Isn't the point of the date to go out, have fun, and get to know the person better?  The way it comes across on threads like this, that idea seems to get lost.    (Which I guess is ok, since this whole thing started on an entirely different topic.  It seems rather simple that clients should pay if we were talking about pro domination.)

It seems to Me that, if you invite someone to dinner, that means you are asking them to be your guest, just the same as if you were inviting them to your home.  Nobody opens their door for their dinner guest and says, "your portion of the dinner party is thirty bucks" before they come in.  (Though I do agree with what has been mentioned in this thread about a guest bringing wine, dessert, or a gift for the host.)  Why is it any different because of where you have dinner?  The host is the person paying for the meal either way, whether they are buying the food and making it at home or if it's by paying the check at the restaurant.

If you do want to go dutch, I do think that is something that you should tell someone up front.  That way, the person can make their decision before the scheduled time about whether or not they can afford to go.  It would put a person in a terrible position if they didn't have the funds with them when they left the house and were put on the spot with no money in their wallet.



That depends on what kind of dinner party it is.  IN the group I grew up in most dinner parties were potlucks, this meant that the host was responsible for providing dishes, silverware, and so forth, but that the food was mostly provided by the guests.  This is not uncommon among lower income people across the country.  The expense of throwing a proper dinner party, even with relatively inexpensive food, can be more than a family can take on all at one time so by having the guests contribute gatherings are made possible that would not be otherwise.

It really is more of a class issue than many people posting in the thread realize.  I don't think it is for Nick, he's rather obviously bitter, but it is for others.

(in reply to LadyPact)
Profile   Post #: 247
RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 2:07:07 PM   
PeonForHer


Posts: 19612
Joined: 9/27/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Lockit

We are not friends if you can agree that women are irrational...


Lockit, I'm not sure that anyone here has said that women are irrational but that men aren't.  I know I haven't. 

But why is being irrational so bad, anyway?  



_____________________________

http://www.domme-chronicles.com


(in reply to Lockit)
Profile   Post #: 248
RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 2:09:30 PM   
Nineveh


Posts: 1299
Joined: 2/5/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Arpig

Pretty much the same thing it takes to be any kind of prostitute


Different sorts of prostitutes require different skillsets.  Prostitution is not a one size fits all profession like plumber or HVAC technician.  It's more like Actor, or Policeman, different sorts require very different skillsets.  A pro Domme needs to be able to project a feeling of authority while still making it clear that she is open to hearing the desires of her clients.  She needs to be able to attract a very different sort of clientele than a street walker or a brothel worker.  Although her clientele overlap, to a large degree, with that of an escort the skillset that she needs is different.

(in reply to Arpig)
Profile   Post #: 249
RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 2:30:59 PM   
Lockit


Posts: 11292
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lockit

We are not friends if you can agree that women are irrational...


Lockit, I'm not sure that anyone here has said that women are irrational but that men aren't.  I know I haven't. 

But why is being irrational so bad, anyway?  




While it may seem I am irrational in saying something like this, I am basing it on rational and reasonable. Take the content in this thread alone and you will see men putting women into little boxes they based on their interpretation. Neurotic-money-grabbers. Take a lifetime of men acting this way from the slum lord fat guy to the highly educated physician, all while they want their cock tended and it gets a little old.

Of course there are those that are confused about themselves and women. They wish to submit and yet that submission or their view of it creates in them a situation that often stems from bad experiences, concepts and a very unhappy place. The passive aggressive manner in which they conduct themselves isn't a problem for me any longer, but I have seen enough of it on this thread alone to know that they are unhealthy individuals that are finding fault with another to justify their experience. All good when there is a balance, but I see no balance in most men complaining around here.

I do not agree that mankind is irrational. Some are, true enough. I see irrational in the way most are using it. Like those men who claim women make mountains out of mole hills, negate how they feel simply because they don't in the matter or are excusing themselves in some manner.

I call a spade a spade... and I am getting tired of saying that. lol A man coming in to take a dump on women is a man coming in to take a dump. It is what it is.


_____________________________

No matter how old a woman gets, some men will think she was born yesterday! ROFL... I love this place!


(in reply to PeonForHer)
Profile   Post #: 250
RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 2:36:16 PM   
sexyred1


Posts: 8998
Joined: 8/9/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lockit

We are not friends if you can agree that women are irrational...


Lockit, I'm not sure that anyone here has said that women are irrational but that men aren't.  I know I haven't. 

But why is being irrational so bad, anyway?  




Why is being irrational so bad? Hmmmm....well....because it propagates a myth that women cannot think clearly, don't know themselves, don't know what attracts them to someone, that we are hormonal, angry, bitches, etc. etc. It carries a negative connotation. Irrational=not being calm and thoughtful, not thinking clearly, thinking only with emotions ruling you.

And there are enough men out there who already believe all that nonsense, so it perpetuates a vicious cycle where men and women continue to not understand each other.

As for men being irrational, again, I would not want to paint everyone with the same brush or my post would then be hypocritical.

(in reply to PeonForHer)
Profile   Post #: 251
RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 3:05:04 PM   
naughtynick81


Posts: 890
Joined: 3/23/2007
Status: offline
Lockit

quote:

If that is how you men think and you can agree on one point and don't notice the others... then you will never know me or the women I know and respect and we have no need to speak.


LOL I wouldn’t be one bit surprised if the women who you respect believe most men are not decent or most men are evil until proven otherwise. That mentality is pretty much the norm amongst today’s women.

Ladypact

In regards to your response towards me, fair enough.


(in reply to LadyPact)
Profile   Post #: 252
RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 3:07:12 PM   
PeonForHer


Posts: 19612
Joined: 9/27/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: sexyred1

Why is being irrational so bad? Hmmmm....well....because it propagates a myth that women cannot think clearly, don't know themselves, don't know what attracts them to someone, that we are hormonal, angry, bitches, etc. etc. It carries a negative connotation. Irrational=not being calm and thoughtful, not thinking clearly, thinking only with emotions ruling you.


I know where you're coming from - and I agree, insofar as we're talking about that debate about gender politics, sexist attitudes in society, and so forth.  Women are wittering creatures who can't reason and never need to be taken seriously.  Yes, I'm familiar with all that horsepoo.

I can't speak for the other men who've been writing here, but it's not the angle I was coming from.  Me, I have a background (of sorts) in psychoanalysis.  I take it for granted that people have desires, motivations, thoughts, that conflict and that are primitive drives that we share with non-thinking beasts.

Actually, I take a lot of solace from that because I'm a submale and that, for me, is an inherently unreasonable thing to be.  Almost every bit of theorising I've read on politics, sociology, anthropology, etc, etc, etc - is premised on the assumption that people want more power, not to give away whatever power they've got.  Hell, even biology - my 'selfish genes' are doing a very bad job indeed.  They should be making me want to do things to women; instead, they've cocked it up and make me want to do things for them.

I also have a background in philosophy.  Go on to that wavelength, and try to put together a logical argument as to why it's better for life to exist than not.  I dare you!  I mean - you start off not being alive, then you struggle for seventy years to stay alive, all for it to fail in the end, anyway.  So what was the point of the struggle?  

< Message edited by PeonForHer -- 10/26/2010 3:21:34 PM >


_____________________________

http://www.domme-chronicles.com


(in reply to sexyred1)
Profile   Post #: 253
RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 3:10:07 PM   
sexyred1


Posts: 8998
Joined: 8/9/2007
Status: offline
Peon, I totally get what you are saying and that is a whole other area for discussion. I am all for being irrational in love, lust, passion and all the primal forces.

But for the purposes of this thread's discussion, the word irrational was thrown around to indicate what I said above.

But your take on it would make for a far move intellectual and compelling thread, on the psychology and philosophy of rational thought.

(in reply to PeonForHer)
Profile   Post #: 254
RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 3:13:07 PM   
GreedyTop


Posts: 52100
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Savannah, GA
Status: offline
~FR~

Peon.. LH and I spoke earlier today.  

*evil grin*

_____________________________

polysnortatious
Supreme Goddess of Snark
CHARTER MEMBER: Lance's Fag Hags!
Waiting for my madman in a Blue Box.

(in reply to sexyred1)
Profile   Post #: 255
RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 3:17:33 PM   
PeonForHer


Posts: 19612
Joined: 9/27/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: naughtynick81

LOL I wouldn’t be one bit surprised if the women who you respect believe most men are not decent or most men are evil until proven otherwise. That mentality is pretty much the norm amongst today’s women.


Oh, FFS, that is complete bollocks.  It's most especially unfair on Lockit because she'll defend men where many, if not all, other women are slagging them off in one of their 'aren't men awful?' parties. 

Nick, look - struggling to get out in what you've been writing are some things that I've thought could do with being said.  However, you keep on making a pig's ear of conveying those points because you go over the top.  People might actually listen to you if you inject a bit of balance - hell, isn't it worth a try?

_____________________________

http://www.domme-chronicles.com


(in reply to naughtynick81)
Profile   Post #: 256
RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 3:20:59 PM   
naughtynick81


Posts: 890
Joined: 3/23/2007
Status: offline
Sorry that I make you cranky, peon 

(in reply to PeonForHer)
Profile   Post #: 257
RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 3:26:22 PM   
PeonForHer


Posts: 19612
Joined: 9/27/2008
Status: offline
Nick, don't get into a who-can-needle-who-the-first with me.  You'd lose. 

Anyway, I started life cranky - I will probably finish it that way, too.

_____________________________

http://www.domme-chronicles.com


(in reply to naughtynick81)
Profile   Post #: 258
RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 3:28:45 PM   
PeonForHer


Posts: 19612
Joined: 9/27/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: sexyred1But your take on it would make for a far move intellectual and compelling thread, on the psychology and philosophy of rational thought.


SexyR, I don't know why, but it really makes me laugh that you put a smiley icon on the end of that sentence. 

_____________________________

http://www.domme-chronicles.com


(in reply to sexyred1)
Profile   Post #: 259
RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? - 10/26/2010 3:31:50 PM   
naughtynick81


Posts: 890
Joined: 3/23/2007
Status: offline
I am sure I would lose, macho man

Look, I have no personal grudge against lockit. I don't towards anyone on the internet. Anyway, I looked up her profile in fetlife and checked out her friends list. I won't name names but I see that she's friends with a very extreme feminist. This person has expressed some seriously fucked up views about men. So I really don't have any doubts in regards to what I said earlier in this thread.

(in reply to PeonForHer)
Profile   Post #: 260
Page:   <<   < prev  11 12 [13] 14 15   next >   >>
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Ask a Mistress >> RE: What do it takes to become a pro domme? Page: <<   < prev  11 12 [13] 14 15   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts




Collarchat.com © 2025
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy

0.094