RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain authority? (Full Version)

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barelynangel -> RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain authority? (10/22/2010 9:57:38 AM)

Shhh. I didn't realize we now had police who determined what should and shouldn't be asked. Thanks for showing your badge. Should everyone run their curious questions by you prior to posting so you can determine was is and isnot an appropriate question?

Learn something new on the boards every day

Or perhaps you simply want to start bs where there wasn't any. Which I don't think is appropriate. Isn't there enough bs on the boards without you trying go bring some where there isn't any?




Twoshoes -> RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain authority? (10/22/2010 10:11:12 AM)

The biggest problem with this thread: the OP deliberately worded it in a way to discourage discussion or even sharing differing opinions.

(Despite the words "Community Discussion" being one of the labels at the very top.)

Imo, there should just be a new thread about 'love'.




VaguelyCurious -> RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain authority? (10/22/2010 10:12:05 AM)

Now you're putting words in my mouth-I didn't say you shouldn't post, I just questioned what you said.

You're being overdramatic.




DMFParadox -> RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain authority? (10/22/2010 11:11:59 AM)

I think it would be awesome to have a button to filter answers based on the poster's sex and orientation.

Because sometimes you just want to have a beer and compare notes with the guys. Or have a girl's night.

Fetlife is kind of better for this sort of question, because groups have their own forums and self-select, so you can have an actual 'ask a master' thread without subbies or mistresses jumping all over it. Really, threads like this get derailed far too often; it's my biggest complaint about Collarchat.com.




NuevaVida -> RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain authority? (10/22/2010 11:24:03 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DMFParadox
Really, threads like this get derailed far too often; it's my biggest complaint about Collarchat.com.



I don't think it's the various perspectives from all types that derail the threads.  It's the squabbling that goes on between posters that derail them.  I've seen dominants squabble just as much. 





LadyPact -> RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain authority? (10/22/2010 11:38:57 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DMFParadox

I think it would be awesome to have a button to filter answers based on the poster's sex and orientation.

Because sometimes you just want to have a beer and compare notes with the guys. Or have a girl's night.

Fetlife is kind of better for this sort of question, because groups have their own forums and self-select, so you can have an actual 'ask a master' thread without subbies or mistresses jumping all over it. Really, threads like this get derailed far too often; it's my biggest complaint about Collarchat.com.


Then, that is exactly what you do.  The idea is to get up, go out, talk with those people that you want to kick back with, or attend a sig.  There are plenty of events out there that are female or male only, Dominant only, submissive only, age range only, so on and so on. 

As for derailing threads, at least most of the people who answered here contributed to the content of the thread.  Not just threw out some random comment to complain.

Speaking of which, since you just posted a similar comment (one that had little to do with the thread content) on the Mistress board, I'm reminded of the old adage of people in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.  Or is it your opinion that people should only "respect" the outlines of the boards when it comes to someone not being born with a penis?

quote:

ORIGINAL: DMFParadox

seriously? this is a thing? what is this thread I don't even

Everyone has been offended in here by someone. OP's work is done.






leadership527 -> RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain authority? (10/22/2010 11:51:02 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: WolfyMontgomery
Added to say, he doesn't say "I love her, she is my slave", and he does not say "She is my slave, I love her".
He says, "I love my slave."

I love how that expresses it. My love for Carol doesn't run contrary to my ownership of her or separate from it. Instead, the two things are all intertwined with each other and they mutually reinforce each other.

I readily acknowledge how I don't like being "the bad guy" with the woman I love. But it IS the job I signed up for and it IS necessary from time to time. Even then, much as it's distasteful, my dominance is STILL an expression of my love for her.... it's just "tough love".

I dunno, but I guess to me loving the woman who has pledged her entire life and self to making me happy seems like an obvious sort of thing. If not her, then who?




TotalDiscipline -> RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain authority? (10/22/2010 11:56:59 AM)

quote:

Added to say, he doesn't say "I love her, she is my slave", and he does not say "She is my slave, I love her".
He says, "I love my slave."


well perhaps we can read very deep into it..in the end..it leads all to the same it seems.
I mean if you talk to a person..and you pick one of the three lines...they well know what you mean.




lovingpet -> RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain authority? (10/22/2010 12:01:12 PM)

~FR~

I skipped everything.  I began to read the OP and realized it was badly stated.  I read a few lines from this page and decided that the poor wording had lead to some degree of drama.  This thing just isn't that complicated to me.  He loves me through his dominance and I love him through my submission.  That is HOW we love each other and how we long to be loved.  Love is a constant.  This M/s thing is the mode of delivering that.  We could desire it be otherwise at any point, though I doubt we ever will.  Our goal is happily ever after.

lovingpet




DMFParadox -> RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain authority? (10/22/2010 1:17:04 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

Speaking of which, since you just posted a similar comment (one that had little to do with the thread content) on the Mistress board, I'm reminded of the old adage of people in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.  Or is it your opinion that people should only "respect" the outlines of the boards when it comes to someone not being born with a penis?




Oh, nice. A direct assault.

I'll tell you one thing... if a person specifically asks for opinions from submissives or women only, I wouldn't fvcking volunteer mine. And I haven't. Since you can't say the same, you completely fail to justify your moral high ground.

I admit to some pettiness with the post you quoted; fact is, I've seen enough threads where the people with penises *did* show respect for 'girl topics' and the participants thereof, whereas the obverse of that respect was and continues to be quite lacking, that I sometimes feel compelled to balance the scales.

For real conversations, I go elsewhere. Because of folks like you, LP. Since you seem to enjoy picking fights, allow me an ad hominem to match your own. You have no real conception of what respect means; you simply like to think you do, and make other people suffer for your self-righteousness. You displayed knee-jerk reactionary nonsense wholly out of context to my original intent, on both posts, and have earned my everlasting scorn. Fortunately, collarchat does provide a button for that.

Since I probably won't be reading your response, I'll stop after saying one more thing. The op originally asked for 'the opinions of masters who have gone before.' Immediately he was not only deluged with posts from submissives and women, but several of them censored him for daring to exclude them. It happens; the OP handled it gracefully, but that does not make the thread any less derailed. If you want to defend that behavior by calling me out, fine; but try to scrape two brain cells together to notice the context. Because I was not suggesting changing people's behavior; I was suggesting a button. A button to click that would be pretty handy, and given the level of coding ability the operators here have displayed, it seems eminently doable.




LadyPact -> RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain authority? (10/22/2010 1:37:01 PM)

Oh cool.  There aren't many who decide the need to post that they are blocking a person just because they don't like their opinions.

Mine on the subject has always been the same.  I'm a leather person.  I was passed down My Master's Cap in 2008.  That means, I qualify, whether I have a penis or not.  Perhaps if some men weren't threatened by such opinions, they would see that a subject such as this one, doesn't change just because the genders are reversed.  Sadly, they chose to see only their own point of view on the title.

I'm seriously not concerned with your scorn.  As for making people suffer, yeah, I'm a sadist, so I'll cop to that.  I seem to do very well in that area and My dynamic is going just fine with that and the authority (to tie it to the original) in place.  I'm sure the person who shares a dynamic with you would say the same.




OrionTheWolf -> RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain authority? (10/22/2010 1:54:45 PM)

Damn LP made her cry. Heh, I love it.




DMFParadox -> RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain authority? (10/22/2010 2:00:00 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: NuevaVida

quote:

ORIGINAL: DMFParadox
Really, threads like this get derailed far too often; it's my biggest complaint about Collarchat.com.


I don't think it's the various perspectives from all types that derail the threads.  It's the squabbling that goes on between posters that derail them.  I've seen dominants squabble just as much. 


If the various perspectives are solicited - if that's the point of the question - sure. But if the point is to find out a specific perspective, and you've got all these other perspectives clogging the arteries, then the situation gets bit less clear.

It's like asking for a dentist to explain what he thinks is most important in dentistry, and getting 10 responses from the dental patients.




DMFParadox -> RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain authority? (10/22/2010 2:04:08 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

Damn LP made her cry. Heh, I love it.


Doubt I made her cry, but she was out of line.




LadyPact -> RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain authority? (10/22/2010 2:09:59 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

Damn LP made her cry. Heh, I love it.

If you liked that, you should have watched the scene I did last weekend.  [8D]
quote:

ORIGINAL: DMFParadox
Doubt I made her cry, but she was out of line.


I think Orion was referring to you.




WolfyMontgomery -> RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain authority? (10/22/2010 3:02:00 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: VaguelyCurious
quote:

ORIGINAL: barelynangel
Wolfy why do you take every concept being explained here that is different from your own as meaning you have to defend your relationship?

I don't see it as defence-more an exploration of the differences between her relationship and others'.


It is as VaguelyCurious said, and also because I personally don't wholly like it when people use blanket statements to say "This is the way of things", and so I point out - "this is the way for you, but not the way for all." It is not defending my relationship so much as just pointing out that there are different views out there than other peoples'. When he spoke that Love first and Mastery second wouldn't work because it would inevitably lead to a breakdown in control, I simply stated that while that may be what happens for him, it isn't what happens for a lot of people, and it doesn't hurt to see how other people work and tick as well.

I understood where he was coming from, that his way didn't apply to me, but I also wanted to know - as I felt by his phrasing - if he felt that that was the only way. Seeing as how he didn't PM me for my Master's email so that Arturas could hear from Master himself, I guess he must have taken my comment as truth - unless he just thought I was lying out my ass.

And I must say, barelynangel, to question what I said, shouldn't you also accept that others will inevitably question what you say as well?

quote:

ORIGINAL: leadership527
I love how that expresses it. My love for Carol doesn't run contrary to my ownership of her or separate from it. Instead, the two things are all intertwined with each other and they mutually reinforce each other.


That is exactly what I mean.

One can look as deeply or as not deeply as they want into the meaning behind that phrase, and while the basic meaning is roughly the same - I've always felt there was a difference. The difference is in what the person is thinking to make them want to say one of the three. It is that mindset that I love so deeply and what makes me so in love with Master - because he doesn't interchange, he doesn't think one is any less important than the other, the love is as much a part of us as my slavery. If not moreso, since we fell in love with each other long before I became his slave.




NuevaVida -> RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain authority? (10/22/2010 7:16:40 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DMFParadox
But if the point is to find out a specific perspective, and you've got all these other perspectives clogging the arteries, then the situation gets bit less clear.

It's like asking for a dentist to explain what he thinks is most important in dentistry, and getting 10 responses from the dental patients.



Unless of course the slaves and submissives replying can add a perspective the OP had not considered before.  Many of us who post, share our masters and dominants perspectives, since they are not here to post, themselves.  I know personally speaking, I prefer to be open to all input and perspectives as it widens my thinking.

My dentist is a cool guy. If he were closed off to input from his patients, he wouldn't see how what he does affects the very group of people who keep him in business. What if by hearing from his patients, he and his fellow dentists learned that what they felt was most important was actually way off base?  If he wanted to limit his interaction to only other dentists, he'd bring the subject up at the next dental convention.  He wouldn't pose the question in a forum open to the world at large.

And, as I mentioned in my original reply, some of the great questions posed on these boards benefit people other than the person posing the question, and a lot of times people reply to the greater audience, not just the OP.  If an OP wants a private group discussion, I'd suggest either going to a group closed off to the world at large (as you suggested Fet), or starting a blog.






Jaybeee -> RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain authority? (10/22/2010 10:40:38 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Zevar

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jaybeee

Hi, this question is ONLY to Masters, not mistresses or slaves, please (although if I've PM'ed you this link, then you're here by prior invitation regardless of status and so I DEFINITELY want your considered opinion). I've "Asked a Slave" a similar question and the results were pretty uninformative, so with that refinement in mind, here goes!

Do you see any conflict between how much love/affection you can lavish on a slave, and your dominance over her? If you are IN love, do you think there's a point at which too much lovey-dovey stuff, if it starts to cut into the 'stern' times, will lead to a loss of authority? This actually hasn't been my experience in the two relationships I've had since I dropped the whole societal bs about me wanting to be in an "equal" partnership; I've led and so far, I'd gotten the mix correct. But I can't say I was IN love either time; I get the feeling all the rules will be tossed out the window when I'm head over heels.

I ask this because, at heart, I'm a kind leader. I'm quite aware that from time to time, obedience MUST be blind without , authority must be stamped without tolerance of delay but on the whole, I wish to lead with transparency and with caring; I'm not a dictator. So - what have your experiences been, striking a balance between being in love with your slave, and being a Master?

I look forward to your thoughts, gentlemen (and a couple of dear ladies too!)

Jaybeee.


Greetings Jaybeee:


Greetings and top of the morning to you, good sir!! Always a pleasure to converse with a good Irishman of learning!

quote:

To begin I can appreciate you wanting input from those who identify as a master.
Nonetheless, it is my understanding that ANYONE can contribute in ANY forum on ANY thread on CM.


Oh I'm not disappointed in the slightest, when one raises the topic of 'love', it's quite the red rag, and one expects hordes of the fairer sex to charge !! And a couple of non-invitees have proven to be very welcome participants indeed. Pearls, they are.

quote:

I will now present my answers’ in regard to the following questions you asked:

1] Question: Do you see any conflict between how much love/affection you can lavish on a slave, and your dominance over her?

1] Answer:

I do not see a conflict so much as I realize that I have no real interest in lavishing love toward slave who I would allow to serve me. My dominance is immutable. Therefore nothing is capable of producing conditions that would bring about conflicting issues in my ability to rule in all instances.

Love is not an affliction that it could cause me to lose control. Instead it allows me to be in control in a deeper way than I thought possible. Thus my self mastery is enhanced by my efforts of mastering my abilities to control my inner most unseen being in a strengthened focused manner.


Intriguing that you link self-mastery with mastery over her. But if I may clarify the above, do you not feel or display love for your slave?

quote:

2] Question:If you are IN love, do you think there's a point at which too much lovey-dovey stuff, if it starts to cut into the 'stern' times, will lead to a loss of authority?

2] Answer:

Love is not a power that weakens my inner strength. I do not lose control over my mental capabilities when I am affectionate. Thus losing authority is not an option as I do not think along the lines of being able to lose what is naturally mine. But then I am 99% of the time intellectual when I master. 1% of the time I am inclined toward the emotional realm, when mastering.


While I don't wish to share your ratios, I do envy your self-control, that is something I aspire to.

quote:

3] Question: So - what have your experiences been, striking a balance between being in love with your slave, and being a Master?

3] Answer:

Again, my ability to master is not weakened nor am I incapacitated in my capacity to master when I choose to love. I strive to balance all I do, regardless of its nature. I am of the thought that if one is a master, there is nothing to remove the internal self mastery within a master, with the exception of self disgrace. But then that would only serve to be for a period of time. Mastery is not something that is bought or acquired from another. Instead mastery is something that comes from within, where the uncompromising standards that contribute to a man reside.

Through self mastery and self examination mastery can only become strengthened, thus increasing the capacity of mastering. Loving a slave has nothing to do whatsoever with the internal realm where self mastery originates and resides. Balancing is natural as is dominance, in the natural order of Life.

Thus to consider that love cancels authority is likened to considering the wave being unrelenting to the shoreline. Regardless how powerful the lashing of the wave, the earth yields in beauty, all awhile balancing into a most perfectly formed shoreline. As though it was untouched yet somehow never the same.

I wish you most well!


Ahhh, there it is, that wonderful Celtic intermingling of passion and logic, so tragically rare in Anglo-Saxon society. This is why I never lose an opportunity to converse with any fellow of learning from the Emerald Isle and you, my good sir, have raised the bar your compatriots had already set quite high! A pint of Guinness, or glass of Jameson's to you tonight, on my tab!!

[:)]




Jaybeee -> RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain authority? (10/22/2010 11:17:50 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DMFParadox

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

Speaking of which, since you just posted a similar comment (one that had little to do with the thread content) on the Mistress board, I'm reminded of the old adage of people in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.  Or is it your opinion that people should only "respect" the outlines of the boards when it comes to someone not being born with a penis?




Oh, nice. A direct assault.

I'll tell you one thing... if a person specifically asks for opinions from submissives or women only, I wouldn't fvcking volunteer mine. And I haven't.


Hi DMF,

Might I ask why? Your profile indicates you are both male and a Dom, and given the
calibre of intellect and nobility displayed throughout the rest of your post below, which is quite brilliantly written, I'd be very grateful for your time and wisdom on the issue. Unless your username is the clue I'd overlooked???!!??

quote:

Since you can't say the same, you completely fail to justify your moral high ground.

I admit to some pettiness with the post you quoted; fact is, I've seen enough threads where the people with penises *did* show respect for 'girl topics' and the participants thereof, whereas the obverse of that respect was and continues to be quite lacking, that I sometimes feel compelled to balance the scales.

For real conversations, I go elsewhere. Because of folks like you, LP. Since you seem to enjoy picking fights, allow me an ad hominem to match your own. You have no real conception of what respect means; you simply like to think you do, and make other people suffer for your self-righteousness. You displayed knee-jerk reactionary nonsense wholly out of context to my original intent, on both posts, and have earned my everlasting scorn. Fortunately, collarchat does provide a button for that.

Since I probably won't be reading your response, I'll stop after saying one more thing. The op originally asked for 'the opinions of masters who have gone before.' Immediately he was not only deluged with posts from submissives and women, but several of them censored him for daring to exclude them. It happens; the OP handled it gracefully, but that does not make the thread any less derailed. If you want to defend that behavior by calling me out, fine; but try to scrape two brain cells together to notice the context.


Why thank you, my good chap!!! I do try. Though I happily will happily indulge in a discussion with a woman, I make it a policy never to argue with them, online or off; it's one of those edicts that our fathers in generations used to hand down, mine sadly didn't, but because only a few choice ones took the time to explain the principles underlying that policy, it was largely lost in our generation. It is certainly not a "politically correct" policy, but nonetheless has served me spectacularly well in this post-millennial world. Do try it out, and see for yourself the effect on your quality of life.




tazzygirl -> RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain authority? (10/23/2010 8:29:22 AM)

~chuckles

always love to watch men protect each other.




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