What is the Republican plan? (Full Version)

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EternalHoH -> What is the Republican plan? (10/24/2010 10:45:34 PM)

Okay, so in 2008, a nation angry at bubbles popping and upside down mortgages and big corporate paydays fell in love with Hope and Change. In just 2 years, not much has been done to fix any of that restlessness. The health care bill amounted to nibbling around the edges. The public is now angry with Hope and Change.

Should the republicans re-take control, what exactly is their plan to fix all the ills from 2000 to now?  Unemployment is 9.5%, but really close to 18% if you count the uncounted and all those people underemployed and not earning adequate returns on their education costs (which are steep and real, btw).

Public debt is sky high, so how will any tax cuts be paid for? Tax cuts? You know they don't pay for themselves, right? Like Stimulus, tax cut proceeds really don't create jobs, those funds only migrate to the Wall St casino. Shut down the casino and banish the shortcuts to wealth? Hell, you created them.

Consumers? They are as scared as business owners sweating Obama's restoration of taxes to Clinton levels. Consumers are banking and not spending just as most business owners are banking and not spending. Not much to be gained here.

If government spending is the problem, how do you cut that spending to "take back the country from the socialists blah blah blah" without throwing more people out of work, those who are presently counted as employed, but really are employed largely because of government spending. The biggest growing job sector, the only goose still laying a golden job report egg, is healthcare, and that's because so much of healthcare is funded by the government (those dollars are spent largely on the elderly whose generation caused this mess and siphoned 28 years of false prosperity from future generations since Reagan).  Killing that off is going to go over as well as a fart in church.

Unregulated capitalism has gambled to the tune of $700 trillion in derivatives debt, which is 46 times what the shopaholic government had racked up in spending debt. What is the Republican plan to keep those financial WMD's from going off? The fuse to that bomb was already lit once, and the Democrats stopped it by throwing money from the nation's credit card at it, but so what?  What will be the Republican's play for when that fuse is re-lit? (and it will be). More deregulation? As of right now, deregulation is the cause of the greatest financial threat ever known to the world. This is serious stuff that is way beyond the comprehension of the average teabagger. The average teabagger cannot even define what a derivative is, let alone tackle in a comprehensive way its threat to the economy.

What is the plan to stop foreclosures or ensure that state governments don't go insolvent?  The gambling on foreclosures by the financial elites is how that fuse to the bomb was lit before. That reality doesnt change simply by electing Republicans, you know?  How much gambling over the solvency of companies and state governments has been racked up the financial elites? How many more private firms will have to be taken over by the government to once again keep that bomb from going off under the Republican watch?

The agenda is pretty tall, the natives are still as restless and unemployed, the credit card is still maxed out, and the financial bomb landscape is just as delicate as when the donkey ran things.

Watching the Sunday morning political talk shows, I was struck by all the republican guests complaining about the debt one week, and then demanding budget-busting tax cut extensions the next. Cognitive Dissonance already?  They aren't even elected yet.

Let me say right now, killing off liberal bastions by defunding things like NPR or any other taxpayer funded group that disagrees with the Almighty is not a solution. Its not enough, and besides, we need real solutions, not fantasy solutions. Getting down on our knees just doesn't cut it. We need solutions for the here and now, not solutions based on any sage advice from the spook daddy in the sky.

So what's the plan?

If you were looking at this as an outsider from a distance, you wouldn't want to touch it. And yet, two political parties are spending hundreds of millions of dollars to fuck each other over for control of a country strapped to a bomb. What is more scary, the biggest political activists and loudmouths on both sides don't know the bomb is there.  Ignorance in action. And the ones who do acknowledge it, think that their freshly scrubbed Constitution or their gun collection or their welfare government is going to be an adequate defense against a bomb that size. Silly stupid shit.




Real0ne -> RE: What is the Republican plan? (10/24/2010 10:56:17 PM)



more for them less for you just like the democrat plan!




Charles6682 -> RE: What is the Republican plan? (10/25/2010 12:30:17 AM)

Here's the Republican plan,nothing.That's it.They will do nothing,just like the last 2 year's.Oppose Obama,blow smoke up the Tea Bagger's ass and do nothing.That about sum's up the Republican's plan right there.




Musicmystery -> RE: What is the Republican plan? (10/25/2010 12:48:37 AM)

quote:

What is the Republican plan?

Wait until the economy recovers, then pretend they caused the recovery.




Hillwilliam -> RE: What is the Republican plan? (10/25/2010 5:57:24 AM)

Classic example on a smaller scale. Our state rep is speaker of the house. He was kicked out of the Republican party for not voting the way he was told to on some key legislation (yes they can do that). Instead, he voted for the advantage of the people that elected him (WHAT A CONCEPT!!!).

It is election time. the Republican nominee is running a REALLY negative campaign, including even using photoshopped pictures, dragging the family in, you name it. (I would say typical Repub tactics but both parties do it).

I ran into the guy campaigning the other day and asked him what he had planned to do when he got into office. The dude looked at me like I had just grown a second head. He had absolutely NOTHING to say. The guy served 2 terms previously (we booted him because he was useless) so he knows how things work and you would expect that he at least had some plans. I guess he was planning on just doing as he was told by the state party chairman.

Bottom line is that he has NO plans other than to try to get into office.

From what I have seen, that is typical nationwide.




EternalHoH -> RE: What is the Republican plan? (10/25/2010 6:08:29 AM)

The economy wont recover, tho, at least it won't for the unemployed 18% on Main St. As of right now, it already has 'recovered' for the Wall St. casino-goer, and that hasn't gone over all that well with the folks on Main St.

We are so beyond the normal business cycle up-and-down. Those traditional tonics no longer work.  As Obama and the democrats have discovered, its not about the act of getting control, its the act of retaining control.

Pops? Firm? Heretic? Yurdaddy? Jack? Sanity? Cucky? Lets put our thinking caps on and tackle something a bit more important than Harry Reid's poll numbers.




pahunkboy -> RE: What is the Republican plan? (10/25/2010 6:16:56 AM)

Note the date.


2000.

I agree with that date. 




EternalHoH -> RE: What is the Republican plan? (10/25/2010 6:41:41 AM)

And that date has nothing to do with Bush, by the way, so the Bush-bashing alarmists need not get their panties in a bunch.

If you are a voter and do not know the significance of that date, then YOU are the problem, YOU are the threat to our country.




TheHeretic -> RE: What is the Republican plan? (10/25/2010 6:58:19 AM)

I need to be heading out the door here shortly, Eterna, but a step in the right direction would be to actually try and pass a budget for the country next year.




Musicmystery -> RE: What is the Republican plan? (10/25/2010 8:14:54 AM)

quote:

The economy wont recover, tho

I didn't say it was a good plan...

[;)]




pahunkboy -> RE: What is the Republican plan? (10/25/2010 8:29:09 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: EternalHoH

And that date has nothing to do with Bush, by the way, so the Bush-bashing alarmists need not get their panties in a bunch.

If you are a voter and do not know the significance of that date, then YOU are the problem, YOU are the threat to our country.


Clinton,  Bush, Obama, and Regan, cabinets all had one thing in common.

They had the same Goldman Saches on them!

So you can not tell me the GOP is any better then the DEMs.

You are being used just like the Obama people are.  




kdsub -> RE: What is the Republican plan? (10/25/2010 8:48:46 AM)

I think we make things too damn complicated when we don’t have to. After all an economy is just a balance of trading my work for yours to fill both our wants and needs.

I say stick to that basic principle…work hard…promote local industry…and let the market ebb and flow as necessary.

Industry that fills our needs will flourish and those that don’t should be allowed to fail. I think it was a mistake by both parties to bail out any business. Those assets were not physically going anywhere they were either there or they were not. Another better run company would have bought them up and moved on more competitively .

So I hope the change will be promote fair business practices but other than that keep hands off the economy and let the necessary adjustments and natural balances occur.

Butch




Moonhead -> RE: What is the Republican plan? (10/25/2010 8:56:56 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy
Clinton,  Bush, Obama, and Regan, cabinets all had one thing in common.

The Reagan cabinet you make a big deal of having voted for, you mean?




EternalHoH -> RE: What is the Republican plan? (10/25/2010 9:19:23 AM)

Clinton, Bush, and Reagan also had one other thing in common, and that was Greenspan. Greenspan was an Ayn Rand disciple. He was a Randite deregulator in charge of the most critical regulatory job in the country. Obama and Bernanke, their actions post-Greenspan have simply been constant damage control.

Reagan's defense bubble, Clinton's tech bubble, Clinton's stock bubble, Bush's housing bubble, Bush's Wall St. pay bubble, and the Chinese economy bubble were all enabled by too much cash in the system, by money printing presses running on overtime, by all the free 'money' dropped onto the nation from the Fed's helicopter. All of the bubbles originated from a deregulator in charge of regulation of the money supply. 

When the GOP waxes nostalgic for a revival of the post-Reagan economic expansion, do they really think a revival of the bubble economies is the grand fix to the mess?




Moonhead -> RE: What is the Republican plan? (10/25/2010 9:20:55 AM)

Probably. People stupid enough to still think that trickle down theory works won't have any problem falling for that one, will they?




cuckyman -> RE: What is the Republican plan? (10/25/2010 9:31:07 AM)

With brainwashed liberals...it all begins and ends with 'Government'...that is the biggest mistake they seem unable to ever recover from... Well here goes...the way back to a healthy economy and freedom from the likes of this socialist regime and it's loony followers..

1... What happened to begin the trainwreck was the election of the Democrat controlled congress in 2006, and with George Sorros and the Tides Foundation now pulling the strings, the first goal of this 'third column' was to implode the economy to take that off the table for the GOP to have as an issue for 2008... The talking point mantra became 'HOUSING IS A RIGHT!' if I recall....and Fannie and Freddie were the corrupt insturments utilized to buy any and all subprime paper and have the government guarentee these mortgages all under the 'fairness' bullshit mantra, and allow Wallstreet to play games with all this bad paper so long as the governemnt saftey net was assured.... and the house came down... I will admit that George Bush was asleep at the wheel during all this with his attention focused on the wars... but it all was talking place with the complicity of the Barney Franks and Dodds led congress pushing it thru.... so to blame Bush is just so much hotair as usual when it comes to anything approaching reality... but when has a democrat ever dealt in reality? When the new republican house gets supoena powers back, I bet a whole bunch of these chickens will come home to roost when the dots are finally connected, and a bunch of folks will be heading off to jail where they belong...

2 All through history...when ANY government spends/absorbs greater than 28% of the gross domestic product...the private economy suffers and job growth stops...you can argue till your blue in the face, but that FACT is there and undeniable....our government now is approaching consuming almost 40% of the gross domestic product. Its time to cut government to the bone.... and layoff/fire thousands and thousands of bloodsucking brueacrats (sorry its tough all over)...and cut government by more than half.... whole departments need to be pitched into the dumper.... energy...commerce....education (yep...let local government run their own schools...it can not be any worse than it is now)... HHS....and defense civilian employment as well as retirement... everything that is spent by the federal government should be cut by a large amount.... raise the retirment age on Social Security, and dig into Medicare fraud and abuse big time.... cut cut cut, and then cut some more....

3 Sell government assets...big time! We don't need Fort Deruise in Honolulu on Waikiki Beach.. nor all the lands controlled by the Federal Burea of land managment....military lands... like Oakaloosa/Santa Rosa Island here.... so many valuable properities that do NOT need to be owned by the government.... including mineral rights... and timber rights.... sell it all if necessary to pay off the debt....

4 We have enough oil and gas reserves here to be exploited NOW to cut our imports by 2/3 very quickly.... open all government lands to private energy exploration and drilling....we need that oil to quit selling our souls to the fucking Arabs! Drill baby drill is right!

5 Cut capital gains taxes to less than 15%.... we have to compete in the marketplace and we are competing against economies with capital gains rates below 5%... The Laffer curve works...its a FACT...cut taxes...get more and more jobs.... despite the bloviations and lies of the left....it was PROVEN under Reagan and will be proven again...

Consider legalizing drugs to stop the outflow of money into Mexico...and STOP ALL ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION...even if it takes putting the entire US Marine Corps on the fucking border...and deport illegals ....they have NO rights to be here....and can re-apply thur legal immigration methods....period! ...no exceptons...

6 Give States the power and control of their soverign territories... get the feds out of ruling the country.... The founders wanted government close to the people, and Washington has had its shot and failed...its time to put the power down to the state level...if you don't like what a state does...move to one that you do like....

Get the government out of the mortgage economy...close Freddie and Fannie and sell off their assets.... and de-regulate de-regulate de-regulate.... if you fear Wall Street...invest your money elsewhere....try locally.... Wall Street will clean its own act up as soon as the people turn their backs on it.... the marketplace works FAR better than asshole politicians....

Finally....we have to trust our own people.... not government ...to solve our problems... America is about one thing...FREEDOM....nothing else...no other consideration tops that ONE THING.... either we survive together in Freedom...or we sink into civil conflict.... we have had our last chance if we act quickly to heal our wounds.... and that is the mission of the government that will be coming to power....either Obama realizes that the people are done with government solutions and is willing to comply with what is needed, or we get him out of the way by impeachment, or over-riding his vetos...either way we take him out of the game...he is a socialist and his idiology is about to be tossed on the scrap heap of history just like in the Soviet Union....

All that is just a start....either we take the medicine, or we get out the guns and settle it once and for all.... question is....which way willl it be..... but one thing for certain....the left is DONE... question is how they go about accepting a new reality... either peacefully...or by open armed conflict..... and you can take that to the so-called bank.... America is now fully awake, and the lies of Sorros and the spin machine left wing media won't save the dems from the people... They underestimated the people grossly...and now will pay the price...enjoy next Tuesday...its just the beginning....





cuckyman -> RE: What is the Republican plan? (10/25/2010 9:40:03 AM)

Trickle Down as you call it...is what a modern economy is about.... You might wish to read Dr Milton Freedman's pulitzer prize winning book... "Free to Choose".... it is the work that dispells your little theory that 'all things originate with goverment' ... like most libs.... you are iniformed, and proudly ignorant of what constitutes a real free economy.... you are about to be taught a lesson in just that..... behold...you might just learn something ....




mnottertail -> RE: What is the Republican plan? (10/25/2010 9:46:42 AM)

Yeah, I read milts book, not bad for a grade school primer, and roundly been laughed at by real economists.




kdsub -> RE: What is the Republican plan? (10/25/2010 9:50:55 AM)

I just want to address one of your points… the selling off of government lands. Unless I’m mistaken they make a modest profit for the government but that is not where I want to go with this post.

Say we do sell off public lands for mineral /oil/gas etc… then 100 years from now when these assets are gone we have done nothing but pass our problems on to our great grandchildren and in the mean time destroyed a lot of our natural heritage.

Why not face up to our problems now and save our children from our past mistakes. Why not have us suffer the pains of developing new sources of power and industry and pass this gift on to our descendants rather than an exhausted defiled earth?

I believe it can be done and at the same time promote new local industry that will make us self supporting as a nation.

Butch




EternalHoH -> RE: What is the Republican plan? (10/25/2010 10:16:07 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: cuckyman
5 Cut capital gains taxes to less than 15%.... we have to compete in the marketplace and we are competing against economies with capital gains rates below 5%... The Laffer curve works...its a FACT...cut taxes...get more and more jobs.... despite the bloviations and lies of the left....it was PROVEN under Reagan and will be proven again...



How do you pay for that? Tax cuts used to create jobs, but no longer do.  Not enough for the money being spent, anyway.

Why would anybody own a business, hire a workforce, pay taxes, etc when they can hand the free money that a tax cut windfall represents over to a hedge fund to gamble with?  Are you really that oblivious to recently enacted wealth shortcuts?  Do you really think the job creators in this world are that dumb to willingly take the long path to wealth creation when a shortcut exists?




quote:

ORIGINAL: cuckyman
Get the government out of the mortgage economy...close Freddie and Fannie and sell off their assets.... and de-regulate de-regulate de-regulate....



The FBI said that 80% of mortgage fraud was bank induced. For every 1 weak loan originated by Fannie & Freddie, there were 4 weak loans originated by private sector banks emulating Fannie & Freddie. Why did the private sector chase that rabbit? Because for every bundle of securitized loans originated, they could sell the securities and a new, unregulated insurance product covering those securities. They made, by far, much more money selling the securities and insurance and held none of the risk of the loans. Deregulation took the Fannie & Freddie problem, and turned it into $60 trillion of gambling debt. And remember, $60 trillion in housing derivatives is only 9% of the $700 trillion total. And you think more deregulation is the answer?

Are you just not aware of this very real aspect to the equation?






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