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RE: Chivalry is not dead - 4/27/2006 6:49:14 PM

Cloudz

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To put it quite simply...manners are a huge turn on for me!

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RE: Chivalry is not dead - 4/27/2006 6:50:07 PM

losttreasure

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Level

quote:

ORIGINAL: losttreasure

There are still graceful women in Texas who appreciate gallantry. ;)

Yes there are. And has anyone told you that you resemble a young Kay Bailey Hutchinson? (Regardless of your politics, I mean that as a compliment, lol)

*laughs* Stashed away somewhere, I do have a photo of myself and Kay... standing side by side, the resemblance fades. But thank you. ;) Usually I'm likened to those who I truly have no resemblance to... Julia Roberts, Carrie Fisher, Margot Kidder... *shrugs* go figure.

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RE: Chivalry is not dead - 4/27/2006 6:51:09 PM

MHOO314

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quote:

Not being afraid to stand up to your critics and say to them "This is what I am... deal with it, or ignore it... but NEVER try to subjugate me because I do not want to be like you"

How wonderfully said, and interesting way to phrase it---but what happens when that feeling could ruin a relationship?

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RE: Chivalry is not dead - 4/27/2006 7:11:25 PM

hidemyeyes

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Chivalry isnt dead, but as far as i can see it's rather lacking in the youngest generations of males over here (Australia, that is), and i dont think it enters the head of a lot of young lesbians over here either. The older men over here have quite lovely manners, especially the tradesmen i get to meet at work. i myself am quite chivalrous when courting a lady: giving her flowers, opening doors for her, and i HATE seeing a woman carry anything other than her personal bag, it makes me cringe.

However, at the moment, i'm the femme. What a headspin when the door gets opened for me.

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RE: Chivalry is not dead - 4/27/2006 7:42:27 PM

thetammyjo

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Remember that a knight also serves his king.

I find knightly virtues and attitude to be very attractive in submissive men.

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RE: Chivalry is not dead - 4/27/2006 7:54:00 PM

KnightofMists

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I agree that chivalry is indeed a code of conduct to be admired and even aspired to. I believe the code you express is the European version. The samurai's code, who are every bit a Knight of their culture is some what different. In fact, one can find different codes of conduct amoung all sorts of cultures and groups. I do believe that all of them have value and one disgards them is reckless.

A couple individuals of scientific note have done alot of research on the character strengths and virtues that are most acknowledged thru the course of time and across cultures. Christopher Perterson & Martin E.P. Seligman's book Character Strengths and Virtues has much of what you express in the code of chivilry and more. By no means is it a complete and only book... but it is one worth beginning ones quest on building ones character.

This is all leads me to my personal opinion that codes of conduct like the chivilry code, the samurai's code and many like them are an important aspect to consider.when getting to know someone. I find it particularly important that a person can Communicate their specific code.. and they can Demonstrate actions that reflect positively the code they live by. Action speaks louder than words as they say... but the words set the standard to which the actions shall be measured.

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RE: Chivalry is not dead - 4/27/2006 8:02:48 PM

bandit25

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Good manners are good manners, no matter who displays them. I love when a man opens a door for me or pulls out my chair.

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RE: Chivalry is not dead - 4/27/2006 8:21:13 PM

gooddogbenji

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I was raised in a very conservative way, and had the chance to be schooled in Switzerland on the rules of chivalry, or generally how to behave. Who walks where and why, who stands when who enters, who is introduced to whom. Most of it is kinda frivolous, but fun to know.

Some women appreciate it, some don't. Any Mistress I am with would have to enjoy being the lady - doors opened, 9 course dinners, checks paid by me and the like. Don't like it? Find some rude bastard. lol

Yours,

benji

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RE: Chivalry is not dead - 4/27/2006 8:45:06 PM

EbonyFtshGoddess

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quote:

he problem with chivalry is too many men use it as an excuse to shower women with unwanted attention. I say that living in the land of PC...California, there are plenty of women who enjoy genuine chivalry, it is just rather rare.

no. i respect a man that can respect me

see. my thing that is difference.. i was raise by a woman that was born in 1920

she told me this:

if a man doesnt walk on the outside of the street.. DUMP HIM

if he doesnt stand when you leave the table. IGNORE HIM

if he uses a salad fork instead of another fork. once again. not worthy of you.

if he doesn't stand when you leave the table.. he has no manners.

she told me several things.. and i've adhered to that since then.

i trust my Nana from everything. she is also the woman that told me.. don't take a man that is less than 10 years older than you.. unless he's exceptional.

once again.. that's me

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RE: Chivalry is not dead - 4/28/2006 2:21:19 AM

Kedikat

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Chivalry in it's definition from olden times is only defined in old times. It was the realm of the wealthy in a time when they were insulated entirely from the realities of life.
Even amongst them, chivalry was bought and sold and practiced in the concept of station amongst your peers in privilage and wealth.
It is in the everyday drudge that chivalry is truly expressed.
The Knight in shining armour, trampled the poor woman with her child. His chivalry was reserved for pompous mannerism with his peers.

The junky who picks the beaten whore from the gutter and shares his meager shelter to care to her wounds is a knight. People who give more than they know they have. Who give at cost to themselves.

They are chivalrous, they are knights.
No shining armour.
Naked but for their honour.

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RE: Chivalry is not dead - 4/28/2006 6:15:39 AM

LuckyAlbatross

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I'm all about good manners and social awareness.

Not so much on sexism or kinky orientationism- if it's the nice thing to do, it's the nice thing to do.

And while I like the universal human values- no I don't want to go back to that actual time.

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RE: Chivalry is not dead - 4/28/2006 6:42:33 AM

MsIncognito

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Chivalry is the most delicate form of contempt.
~Albert Guerard

.....just a thought...

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RE: Chivalry is not dead - 4/28/2006 6:42:48 AM

Moloch

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kedikat

Chivalry in it's definition from olden times is only defined in old times. It was the realm of the wealthy in a time when they were insulated entirely from the realities of life.
Even amongst them, chivalry was bought and sold and practiced in the concept of station amongst your peers in privilage and wealth.
It is in the everyday drudge that chivalry is truly expressed.
The Knight in shining armour, trampled the poor woman with her child. His chivalry was reserved for pompous mannerism with his peers.

The junky who picks the beaten whore from the gutter and shares his meager shelter to care to her wounds is a knight. People who give more than they know they have. Who give at cost to themselves.

They are chivalrous, they are knights.
No shining armour.
Naked but for their honour.

Wow that was very well said, I agree.

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RE: Chivalry is not dead - 4/28/2006 7:00:11 AM

rapture2778

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i honestly don't know if i could seriously consider a relationship if they didn't have manners. Perhaps this is because i have always lived in the south, but when in public i conduct myself as a lady and would hope that my partner would be a gentleman. Opening doors, pulling my chair out at a nice dinner, table manners, etc...i believe that whether we like it or not we are judged by our actions, and if "chivarly" is going out of style i guess i am too!

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RE: Chivalry is not dead - 4/28/2006 7:00:54 AM

Dustyn

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*knowing I will be on the run for life, but still posting*

Feminism destroyed most of what transmorphed from chivalry into just good manners. That and a generation of mothers telling their daughters that they don't need a man to feel complete and whole. For some it's the truth. For some, it's damned them to an existence of pure misery.

Not everyone thinks it's dead, but the life support is slowly and utterly starting to fail.

- Dustyn

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RE: Chivalry is not dead - 4/28/2006 7:33:57 AM

EbonyFtshGoddess

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masterdeltafire

quote:

One of these days in houston, look me up girl. I'll have the candles and light music ready :) just make it before sunset :) They are pretty sitting on the shores of Galveston. *purrs at the thought

i was going to go to texas for the texas latex party.. but i wanted to go to the San Francisco fetish ball instead. next year i'll check out the Texas Latex Party..

i do like sunsets, but i live in a canyon area so the hills sorta hide the good sunsets.. i usually go to the beach to enjoy a sunset. we do get killer sunrises though.. maybe i'll look you up next year i go to TLP.

CrappyDom

quote:

The problem with chivalry is too many men use it as an excuse to shower women with unwanted attention. I say that living in the land of PC...California, there are plenty of women who enjoy genuine chivalry, it is just rather rare.

that door incident i saw was in CA. i live in the los feliz area.. by the hollywood sign and women in the hollywood hills are typically very stuck up (myself included sometimes).. and sometimes when a man is just being respectful they take it as he wants to club her over the head and drag her back to the cave.

the only time i've ever been annoyed with a man being chivalrous was once in NYC i went to light a cigarette and before i could even reach for my lighter a guy had a flame like RIGHT in my face. it honestly scared the shit outta me. and it almost caught my bangs on fire. but i know he meant well. just warn a lady before you go to light her cigarette. thank god i use a holder when i smoke otherwise it would have been like 5 inches closer to my face.

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RE: Chivalry is not dead - 4/28/2006 7:41:39 AM

thetammyjo

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dustyn

*knowing I will be on the run for life, but still posting*

Feminism destroyed most of what transmorphed from chivalry into just good manners. That and a generation of mothers telling their daughters that they don't need a man to feel complete and whole. For some it's the truth. For some, it's damned them to an existence of pure misery.

Not everyone thinks it's dead, but the life support is slowly and utterly starting to fail.

- Dustyn

I can't speak for other feminists but for me it spread out who should display good manners.

If I see someone trying to open a door when their hands are full, I open the door, I don't wait around for some man to do it or chide the nearest man into doing it.

By the same token I am quite capable of offering my bus seat to an older person, a handicapped person, or a person juggling several children. I don't sit around waiting for some man to do it because that, in my opinion, shows me to be the rude one unwilling to do kindnesses but expecting others to do them.

To expect only kindness and manners and assistance from one sex seems to me to be arrogancy at worse and lazyiness at best.

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RE: Chivalry is not dead - 4/28/2006 7:43:08 AM

meatcleaver

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Chivalry was as much about keeping people in their place as a code of conduct, as for chivalry of medieval knights, it barely existed in practice, assasination being a far more effective way of deciding disputes. What we think of as medieval chivalry is largely a Victorian invention anyway and their yearning for idylic myth in the chaos of the industrial revolution.

When it came to the crunch, in battle the serfs would slug it out and kill each other while the knights had a bit of sport trying to capture each other. A dead knight was worthless but a captured one you could hold for ransome money. Unfortunately at the Battle of Agincourt the French boo-booed with their tactics and with a mixture of picking a bad terrain to fight on, bad weather and the deadly humble English Longbowman, their knights were slaughtered. Probably because they were in such a rush at wanting to capture Henry V for ransome, that they never considered they might get killed.

If King Arthur did exist, he certainly wouldn't have had the chivalric code we hear in stories, that was Victorian invention. However, the saying 'Heroes die once, cowards die twice.' comes from the Anglo-Saxons which would have been Arthur's foe. The Anglo-Saxons in their warrior code had the idea of a good death, which was about keeping their good name because their name was all they could leave in the world. Their ancestors would have poets write poems about the great deeds of the family heroes from which they descended. Life was short and brutal, as one Anglo-Saxon king was renowned to have said.'Life is a bird that flies into the beer hall, circles the fire and returns to the knight. Christianity pretty much destroyed the Anglo-Saxon warrior code so we know little of it.

Chivalry is dead? It barely existed in the first place.

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RE: Chivalry is not dead - 4/28/2006 7:51:02 AM

KindredAngelus

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Chivalry is dead, but the idea of it is not. What was done by the Knights In Shining Armour is no longer applicable in todays society. The Idea of Chivalry is what is now called Manners. What I have seen, though, is that all ideas change with the times. Ideas, like Language are organic. when they stop changing, they die (see the Latin language). What was seen as good manners in the 50's sometimes seem archaic today while what is manners today may seem barbarous to those from the 50's

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RE: Chivalry is not dead - 4/28/2006 8:02:35 AM

KindredAngelus

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The quote, I believe, is, "Heroes die but once while a coward dies a thousand deaths."
But in the main you are right. The Victorian closet prudes made the ideal of "Romantic Love" and rewrote history to suit their own fetishes

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