RE: Where is God ?

RE: Where is God ? (Full Version)

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willbeurdaddy -> RE: Where is God ? (12/11/2010 12:06:45 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kirata quote: ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy Infinite and zero are quite precisely defined... Well unh, actually, infinite is "quite precisely defined" as something indefinite: unmeasurable in extent, duration, etc. [:D] K. I was referring to the defintions in mathematics. Infinite is simply not finite, where finite is defined as "countable". Nothing "indefinite" about it Zero is the additive identity and the integer immediately preceeding 1.

SleazeMerchant -> RE: Where is God ? (12/11/2010 12:12:25 PM)
Science does not need to prove that you are wrong, YOU need to prove that you are right. If you make a claim the burden of proof is on you. You can give me some if you want, but I doubt you will. And by mostly atheist I mean ~95%, and no, its not quite telling, because these people could be educated in area's that would not help them make a more informed decision about such things. I think its quite telling that as intelligence and education go up, religious belief goes down. And you keep saying I backpeddled about Einstein, but you still didn't point out where you think I backpeddled, so I'll do it where I think you are talking about... quote: And an appeal to authority is a logical fallacy; smart or not, people can be wrong and people can make mistakes. Huge mistakes. Take the cosmological constant Einstein incorporated into his model of general relativity. He made a huge mistake in doing that, and why? Because he didn't like that his theory said that the universe should be expanding, so he made it so it said that it didn't. Here I am saying that Einstein made a mistake. quote: Einstein was not completely wrong with his cosmological constant. When Hubble found out that the universe was expanding, it turned out there is still a cosmological constant but it is much smaller than what Einstein orginally thought, because the universe was actually expanding, but at the time, observations and calculations suggested it wasn't. Thats what I mean when I say that the theories and models are refined in light of new evidence. Here I am explaining what the mistake was. If you actually had any clue about anything at all, you could go and read about it if you were so inclined, but after this conversation with you, I seriously doubt you could understand it.

Kirata -> RE: Where is God ? (12/11/2010 12:19:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy Nothing "indefinite" about it The only thing definite about it is its definition as something indefinite, i.e., not finite, unmeasurable. K.

tazzygirl -> RE: Where is God ? (12/11/2010 12:21:19 PM)
You made the claim. The proof is upon you. [;)] Good luck in your religious attitude.

SleazeMerchant -> RE: Where is God ? (12/11/2010 12:30:52 PM)
Like I said before, go and work on making you knowledge less limited, and then come back and say less stupid things, ok?

lickenforyou -> RE: Where is God ? (12/11/2010 12:49:22 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: Scrupulously faithful or exact; strict. Thank you for proving my point. How does that prove your point? Please elaborate

SleazeMerchant -> RE: Where is God ? (12/11/2010 12:52:31 PM)
She wont because she can't because it doesn't.

lickenforyou -> RE: Where is God ? (12/11/2010 12:56:41 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kirata quote: ORIGINAL: lickenforyou bold text done by me And here's the part you didn't bold... *which reveals an intelligence of such superiority* that, compared with it, all the systematic thinking and acting of human beings is an utterly insignificant *reflection. K. Seriously? I didn't highlight it because you used that PORTION of the quote already. You are using intelligence of such superiority* to say that he believed in some sort of god. He already stated that he didn't believe in a LIVING god. An ant has intelligence.

RCdc -> RE: Where is God ? (12/11/2010 12:57:35 PM)
slaps forehead

lickenforyou -> RE: Where is God ? (12/11/2010 1:09:42 PM)
Let me point out, even though you have accused me of being a militant atheist, I am not. And, I really appreciate the chance to read some of Einstein's statements that I hadn't read before. It's nice to know that I came up with a similar outlook on religion on my own. I think that religion has been incredibly important in science. I never thought about the religious feeling aiding in art, though. That is quite profound. I also think that religion has been instrumental in the evolution of societies. I don't blame religion for wars or man's inhumanity to man. Man is an aggressive animal, which is why we have so dominated the planet. And, for the record I never used Einstein to prove there was no god. I responded to the post that had him at the top of a list of religious scientist. I don't say that there is no god or gods or creator. I say that there is not one shred of credible evidence to support the existence of it.

lickenforyou -> RE: Where is God ? (12/11/2010 1:12:19 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SleazeMerchant quote: ORIGINAL: lickenforyou I said that scientist don't believe in the supernatural, they don't I wouldn't say that, I would say that they shouldn't believe in it if they are basing their beliefs on science, because science only deals with the natural, not the supernatural. I know a few scientists that are religious. right, I should have said most

Kirata -> RE: Where is God ? (12/11/2010 1:23:25 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: lickenforyou He already stated that he didn't believe in a LIVING god. An ant has intelligence. As opposed to what, a dead God? Do you just make this shit up? [:D] Well nevermind ants, we're talking about you here. And since it should be a simple matter to post a link to a quote from Einstein in which he says, as you claim -- and emphasize in caps, no less -- that he does not believe in a "LIVING" god, I'll be waiting to see it. K.

Enigma108 -> RE: Where is God ? (12/11/2010 1:43:08 PM)
In a larger picture, have you considered that the supernatural IS natural? Quantum mechanics, for instance, can certainly be called supernatural because it is outside of cause and effect Newtonian mechanics, works like magic, and mostly can't be seen except by inference or indirect proofs. Why wouldn't God (as a real energy, not as a religious icon) be at the far end of all matter and energy?

lickenforyou -> RE: Where is God ? (12/11/2010 1:49:30 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Enigma108 In a larger picture, have you considered that the supernatural IS natural? Quantum mechanics, for instance, can certainly be called supernatural because it is outside of cause and effect Newtonian mechanics, works like magic, and mostly can't be seen except by inference or indirect proofs. Why wouldn't God (as a real energy, not as a religious icon) be at the far end of all matter and energy? It's possible, but there is no proof of it.

lickenforyou -> RE: Where is God ? (12/11/2010 1:55:55 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kirata quote: ORIGINAL: lickenforyou He already stated that he didn't believe in a LIVING god. An ant has intelligence. As opposed to what, a dead God? Do you just make this shit up? [:D] Well nevermind ants, we're talking about you here. And since it should be a simple matter to post a link to a quote from Einstein in which he says, as you claim -- and emphasize in caps, no less -- that he does not believe in a "LIVING" god, I'll be waiting to see it. K. I miss quoted, he said personal god. I'm still waiting to see your proof that he believed in anything supernatural. "Well nevermind ants, we're talking about you here" - And how is that an intelligent response to me doubting that his phrase *intelligence of such superiority* meant a being of some sort?

willbeurdaddy -> RE: Where is God ? (12/11/2010 1:57:20 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Enigma108 In a larger picture, have you considered that the supernatural IS natural? Quantum mechanics, for instance, can certainly be called supernatural because it is outside of cause and effect Newtonian mechanics, QM is not "outside cause and effect Newtonian mechanics". Newtons laws can be derived from quantum mechanics.

Enigma108 -> RE: Where is God ? (12/11/2010 2:03:58 PM)
I stand corrected, not because I didn't know that but because of the way I said it. It's harder to discuss that stuff intelligently than it is to understand it, at least for me.

tazzygirl -> RE: Where is God ? (12/11/2010 2:09:16 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: RCdc slaps forehead ~chuckles its ok, let them think they know what they are talking about.

tazzygirl -> RE: Where is God ? (12/11/2010 2:10:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: lickenforyou quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: Scrupulously faithful or exact; strict. Thank you for proving my point. How does that prove your point? Please elaborate It was elaborated upon.

Kirata -> RE: Where is God ? (12/11/2010 2:12:01 PM)
I'm not sure who you have in mind here, because it was posted in reply to a post of your own. But that post was to me, so I'm guessing. However, I never said you were a "militant atheist". Nor did I ever say you were trying to use Einstein to disprove God. It's just that your notion of religion and your ideas about God are both so narrow that you refuse to accept what Einstein himself plainly says. He clearly saw a superior intelligence, beyond our ability to comprehend, expressed and reflected in the order and beauty of the universe. Although adamant in his view that there was no such thing as a petulant kindergarten teacher in the sky, he was equally firm in declaring himself a deeply religious man, and angry with those who say there is no God and quote him in support of those views. To argue that Einstein wasn't ("really") religious, that he didn't ("really") believe in God, is a purely doctrinal claim based on a narrow set of ideas about the ("true") nature of religion and God. K.

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