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RE: The Cleansing of Huckleberry Finn - 1/6/2011 8:16:00 AM

GreedyTop

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oh.. so THATS what he was saying.. no wonder..

*leaves it cryptic*

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RE: The Cleansing of Huckleberry Finn - 1/6/2011 8:18:55 AM

LadyPact

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quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

FR

Wog

ETA: Just an experiment. - that's a near equivalent to the 'N' word in UK slang.

Good thing you explained it. I was a little clueless there for a second.

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RE: The Cleansing of Huckleberry Finn - 1/6/2011 8:27:43 AM

AlwaysLisa

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Hi Greedy,

Uncle Toms Cabin and Roots came to my mind as well. Hell, why not just pretend we were all hatched from eggs in the 21st century and ignore our past all together.

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RE: The Cleansing of Huckleberry Finn - 1/6/2011 8:33:27 AM

DomKen

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Huckleberry Finn is one of my favorite novels, I like most things Clemens wrote. I have to ask though how much harm is done to the book by this change? Instead of N***** Jim it now says Slave Jim. That word has such terrible connotations now that it keeps teachers from using Finn in classes and this changes that single word, without greatly changing the meaning of the book.

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RE: The Cleansing of Huckleberry Finn - 1/6/2011 8:40:09 AM

AlwaysLisa

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Dom Ken,

Would you rewrite American History as well? Or perhaps anything on WW1, if it was found to be far too violent? These things happened, people wrote about them, changing a word in a literary piece of work won't alter that fact.

There are many words found offensive to people in all nationalities, while I don't condone the use of N*****, to pretend that particular time in history didn't exist, isn't the correct way to make a change.

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RE: The Cleansing of Huckleberry Finn - 1/6/2011 8:44:11 AM

GreedyTop

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I am totally for the idea that special "childrens editions" be issued, for the terminally PC folks to give to their kids.. but leave the original version alone for those of us that think Farenheit 451 was a cautionary tale... (or , in my case.. a nightmare!!0

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RE: The Cleansing of Huckleberry Finn - 1/6/2011 8:49:51 AM

kdsub

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I do understand your train of thought but do you say demeaning words around your children? I would hope not anyway. What is so wrong with editing books to make them appropriate for children?

If the book is clearly marked as abridged for children I see no harm. Now if some governing agency was demanding that the original be changed and all previous versions destroyed then I would be up in arms with you.

Butch

< Message edited by kdsub -- 1/6/2011 8:51:38 AM >

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RE: The Cleansing of Huckleberry Finn - 1/6/2011 9:07:03 AM

Marc2b

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quote:

Huckleberry Finn is one of my favorite novels, I like most things Clemens wrote. I have to ask though how much harm is done to the book by this change? Instead of N***** Jim it now says Slave Jim. That word has such terrible connotations now that it keeps teachers from using Finn in classes and this changes that single word, without greatly changing the meaning of the book.

The use of euphemisms to cover up facts that some regard as unpleasnt (eg "differently abled" for "crippled") serves only to condescend. Children are tougher that we usually give them credit for. Why can't we simply explain to children the meaning, context in the story and historical uses of "nigger," and explain to them why it would be considered offensive in most cases today? If they are too young to understand these things then they are too young for Huckleberry Finn anyway. I see this nonsense in the same league as putting coverings on nude statues.

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RE: The Cleansing of Huckleberry Finn - 1/6/2011 9:07:58 AM

WestBaySlave

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Huckleberry Finn isn't just fiction, it's a piece of history in that it's a product of its time. Editing out what makes modern people uncomfortable in no way erases what was bad then or alleviates racism now, it's just white-washing the past to try make it assume our current moral aesthetics. Bowdlerization at work, I'm sorry to say, and one that's ultimately self-defeating if it aims to solve racial tensions.

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RE: The Cleansing of Huckleberry Finn - 1/6/2011 9:11:03 AM

AlwaysLisa

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quote:

I do understand your train of thought but do you say demeaning words around your children? I would hope not anyway. What is so wrong with editing books to make them appropriate for children?

For those of us old enough to remember growing up hearing those words, speaking for myself, it was common knowledge that certain words were offensive and we simply didn't use them. No one had to rewrite books for that message to come across.

I don't agree with altering the world to make it kid friendly, nor do I think "time outs" are the way to go with spoiled brats. Books are an expressive way to maintain history, why not let youngsters read about the way it actually was, rather then a sunshine and lollipop version?

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RE: The Cleansing of Huckleberry Finn - 1/6/2011 9:13:15 AM

Hillwilliam

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Those who forget the past (or rewrite it) are doomed to repeat it.

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RE: The Cleansing of Huckleberry Finn - 1/6/2011 9:26:04 AM

GreedyTop

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quote:

ORIGINAL: AlwaysLisa

quote:

I do understand your train of thought but do you say demeaning words around your children? I would hope not anyway. What is so wrong with editing books to make them appropriate for children?

For those of us old enough to remember growing up hearing those words, speaking for myself, it was common knowledge that certain words were offensive and we simply didn't use them. No one had to rewrite books for that message to come across.

I don't agree with altering the world to make it kid friendly, nor do I think "time outs" are the way to go with spoiled brats. Books are an expressive way to maintain history, why not let youngsters read about the way it actually was, rather then a sunshine and lollipop version?

*rethink of my last post*

Good point, Lisa.

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RE: The Cleansing of Huckleberry Finn - 1/6/2011 9:49:47 AM

kdsub

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quote:

ORIGINAL: AlwaysLisa

For those of us old enough to remember growing up hearing those words, speaking for myself, it was common knowledge that certain words were offensive and we simply didn't use them. No one had to rewrite books for that message to come across.

I don't agree with altering the world to make it kid friendly, nor do I think "time outs" are the way to go with spoiled brats. Books are an expressive way to maintain history, why not let youngsters read about the way it actually was, rather then a sunshine and lollipop version?

But you see I am most likely older than you...lol and I remember children calling other children niggers. I also remember the devastation and hurt this caused.

I talk one way around my male friends and another around children and I can express the same ideas. So can a book. As with anything you have the choice to allow your child to read any book you please but it would be nice to have a choice.

Butch

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RE: The Cleansing of Huckleberry Finn - 1/6/2011 10:18:17 AM

PeonForHer

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

FR

Wog

ETA: Just an experiment. - that's a near equivalent to the 'N' word in UK slang.

Good thing you explained it. I was a little clueless there for a second.

Hmmm. On reflection, 'wog' here isn't really that close to the 'N' word as it's been used in the USA. 'Wog' doesn't have so brutal and bitter a history behind it.

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RE: The Cleansing of Huckleberry Finn - 1/6/2011 10:30:29 AM

popeye1250

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This book has been around for what, 130-140 years now and now those anal-retentive goose-stepping political correctors think it should be changed? Number one, who cares what they think?
Number two, people who act like that trying to tell everyone else how to think or act are mentally ill.
If a known sociopath told you to do something would you do it?

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RE: The Cleansing of Huckleberry Finn - 1/6/2011 10:40:48 AM

AlwaysLisa

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quote:

So can a book. As with anything you have the choice to allow your child to read any book you please but it would be nice to have a choice

There are already choices, if you don't like the way Twain penned the book, let your kids watch the Disney version.

People were up in arms over a popular series, The Little Rascals, they felt it stereotyped certain races. At the time of filming, it was acceptable, but due to the delicate nature of some, the series was pulled from the air. You can't change history, and by putting blinders on kids you are robbing them of the chance to see it as things really were. As the parent, it's your job to teach your children what is acceptable and what is not, don't shrug that job off on everyone else by demanding the world comform to what you feel is appropriate to your kids.

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RE: The Cleansing of Huckleberry Finn - 1/6/2011 11:05:28 AM

popeye1250

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quote:

ORIGINAL: AlwaysLisa

quote:

So can a book. As with anything you have the choice to allow your child to read any book you please but it would be nice to have a choice

There are already choices, if you don't like the way Twain penned the book, let your kids watch the Disney version.

People were up in arms over a popular series, The Little Rascals, they felt it stereotyped certain races. At the time of filming, it was acceptable, but due to the delicate nature of some, the series was pulled from the air. You can't change history, and by putting blinders on kids you are robbing them of the chance to see it as things really were. As the parent, it's your job to teach your children what is acceptable and what is not, don't shrug that job off on everyone else by demanding the world comform to what you feel is appropriate to your kids.

I can remember watching "Amos and Andy" as a kid during the 1950's because it was funny.
If something "offends" you then don't watch it or read it, it's that simple.
There's always a small group of people who can't stand it when other people are having fun.

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RE: The Cleansing of Huckleberry Finn - 1/6/2011 11:11:53 AM

PeonForHer

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

That word has such terrible connotations now that it keeps teachers from using Finn in classes . . .

Yep, that's true, from what I've been reading today. It was once banned because of its 'common and vulgar vernacular', now it's being effectively banned because of the N word (plus a couple of others). I can imagine publishers being at their wits' ends by now.

I don't think Prof Gribben, the editor of this new edition, is the guilty party here. I can entirely understand his view that changing a few offensive words is a lesser evil by far than that of many kids not being taught about the book precisely because of those offensive words.

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RE: The Cleansing of Huckleberry Finn - 1/6/2011 11:26:04 AM

servantforuse

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The 'N' word is used every day on the north side of Milwaukee, and it's not white folks using it. Kids call other kids the 'N' word and parents call their own kids the 'N' word.

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RE: The Cleansing of Huckleberry Finn - 1/6/2011 1:00:56 PM

Aylee

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

It seems to me that if we are going to have fits over a word, we ought to at least have the stones to look it in the eye.

This article does that

I hope this edition finds it's way into the dumpbins, straight from the presses.

I would call them ball-less eunuchs, but that would be insulting to eunuchs.

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