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RE: Can a submissive be trained to be dominant? - 1/8/2011 1:43:44 PM   
Aynne88


Posts: 3873
Joined: 8/29/2008
Status: offline 		I can, have, and will again service top and or dominate people. No issues whatsoever with topping anyone, I am far more dominant in nature than I am submissive.

That said.....that entire above statement seriously excludes MY dominant. Holy fucking turnoff to even thinking about topping, dominating, or any other metaphor because for me that is the sexual the death knell. I love him because of his dominance over me, and if it makes me "limited" to not be able to wrap my head around being able to top him, yeah, I am way okay with that.


< Message edited by Aynne88 -- 1/8/2011 2:14:56 PM >

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As long as people will shed the blood of innocent creatures there can be no peace, no liberty, no harmony between people. Slaughter and justice cannot dwell together.
—Isaac Bashevis Singer, writer and Nobel laureate (1902–1991)



(in reply to RCdc)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: Can a submissive be trained to be dominant? - 1/8/2011 2:12:47 PM   
LillyBoPeep


Posts: 6873
Joined: 12/29/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RCdc

quote:

ORIGINAL: phoenixmoonn13

i couldnt do it i couldnt even top. i showed master this and he laughed. he said to someone the other day that i dont have a dom gene in my body. he would have to script the whole thing for me


Like I said, I feel for anyone who has a partner who doesn't and won't inspire a person to be anything they put their mind into being.

A Master limiting their s-type because their s-type doesn't like it or thinks that are unable to achieve, is poor management.


how is that necessarily poor management? maybe they are simply being honest? =p not every s-type does have the ability to top. if they are honest and admit that, rather than being dishonest and trying to force it, i see nothing wrong there. =p slaves have limitations, and simply having a Master doesn't get rid of them. =p poor management is shoving someone to do something that s/he really can't do. good management is realizing strengths and weaknesses -- capitalizing on the strengths and seeing what weaknesses can be overcome. not every weakness can.

then following that, someone who DOES top and doesn't enjoy it but smiles anyway, you tell them they are lying by omission. =p so do they do it even if they don't enjoy it, but at least try to make it seem like they do, or do they just not do it? can't have it both ways. =p haha

(in reply to RCdc)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: Can a submissive be trained to be dominant? - 1/8/2011 2:40:36 PM   
RCdc


Posts: 8674
Status: offline
quote:

how is that necessarily poor management? maybe they are simply being honest? =p not every s-type does have the ability to top. if they are honest and admit that, rather than being dishonest and trying to force it, i see nothing wrong there. =p slaves have limitations, and simply having a Master doesn't get rid of them. =p poor management is shoving someone to do something that s/he really can't do. good management is realizing strengths and weaknesses -- capitalizing on the strengths and seeing what weaknesses can be overcome. not every weakness can.

Because they haven't tried, not because they aren't honest.

I'm talking about the dominants who don't have the ability to inspire their charge into at least trying, and automatically dismiss it because 'they don't have the gene'.
If everything was genetic, we wouldn't have a gorgeous photograph of you in those fabulous lashes, ya dig?

Denying anyone the chance based purely on the fact that they couldn't possibly have the gene without even letting them try it once, is poor management.  I'm not suggesting force, but inspiration.

Of course, a dominant might just not want a sub that can work a flogger, and that's different

quote:

then following that, someone who DOES top and doesn't enjoy it but smiles anyway, you tell them they are lying by omission. =p so do they do it even if they don't enjoy it, but at least try to make it seem like they do, or do they just not do it? can't have it both ways. =p haha


Or the third option.  Be honest with the fact that you hate it, don't hide the fact (like trying to make it seem like they do) and instead suffer and do it.
Obeying isn't about doing what you want, but what you signed up for.

Geeze, everyone wants stuff easy... joking aside, that is why there is such a high fail rate in relationships and divorce/seperation is on the up.

_____________________________
RC&dc


love isnt gazing into each others eyes - it's looking forward in the same direction

(in reply to LillyBoPeep)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: Can a submissive be trained to be dominant? - 1/8/2011 2:47:40 PM   
AquaticSub


Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
Status: offline 		~Fast Reply~

A submissive can be trained to top. A submissive can be trained to act in a dominant manner. Depending on their acting abilities, the situation and what is motivating them, they might even be able to able to carry on the facade for some time, similar to a homosexual who got married to give the appearance of being heterosexual.

I don't believe, for a second, that a desire to control and the things that I consider to be required to qualify as a dominant can be instilled through trained. Through the training, the genuine desire might be discovered but not created.

That is, of course, my humble opinion and your mileage may vary.

< Message edited by AquaticSub -- 1/8/2011 3:18:33 PM >

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to RCdc)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: Can a submissive be trained to be dominant? - 1/8/2011 3:14:58 PM   
OsideGirl


Posts: 14441
Joined: 7/1/2005
From: United States
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SlaveRMneeded

It depends on if she is a true submissive
There's no such thing as a true submissive.

quote:

ORIGINAL: SlaveRMneeded
you'll probably shatter her poor little nerves.
Yes, we're all delicate little princesses without a lick of sense in our heads and can't handle doing anything that might possibly be outside of a submissive role. <eyeroll>

Yes, a submissive can be taught to top. They may or may not enjoy it, it depends on the person.

< Message edited by OsideGirl -- 1/8/2011 3:15:23 PM >

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(in reply to SlaveRMneeded)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Can a submissive be trained to be dominant? - 1/8/2011 7:00:36 PM   
Aynne88


Posts: 3873
Joined: 8/29/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: AquaticSub

~Fast Reply~

A submissive can be trained to top. A submissive can be trained to act in a dominant manner. Depending on their acting abilities, the situation and what is motivating them, they might even be able to able to carry on the facade for some time, similar to a homosexual who got married to give the appearance of being heterosexual.

I don't believe, for a second, that a desire to control and the things that I consider to be required to qualify as a dominant can be instilled through trained. Through the training, the genuine desire might be discovered but not created.

That is, of course, my humble opinion and your mileage may vary.


That was perfect Aqua.


_____________________________

As long as people will shed the blood of innocent creatures there can be no peace, no liberty, no harmony between people. Slaughter and justice cannot dwell together.
—Isaac Bashevis Singer, writer and Nobel laureate (1902–1991)



(in reply to AquaticSub)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: Can a submissive be trained to be dominant? - 1/8/2011 10:53:42 PM   
phoenixmoonn13


Posts: 398
Joined: 6/11/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RCdc

quote:

ORIGINAL: phoenixmoonn13

i couldnt do it i couldnt even top. i showed master this and he laughed. he said to someone the other day that i dont have a dom gene in my body. he would have to script the whole thing for me


Like I said, I feel for anyone who has a partner who doesn't and won't inspire a person to be anything they put their mind into being.

A Master limiting their s-type because their s-type doesn't like it or thinks that are unable to achieve, is poor management.


hes not limiting me he jsut knows for me this isnt the way to go, he inspires in so many ways and he doesnt limit things because i dont like them he jsut knows this isnt going to do any good for either of us. if he asked i would do it and he knows it, he knows my limits and which to push.

(in reply to RCdc)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Can a submissive be trained to be dominant? - 1/9/2011 6:08:17 AM   
DesFIP


Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RCdc
because obeying is what it's all about, when it comes to submission.


Except for those who aren't obedience wired but get turned on by service. Or those who are driven by emotional transparency instead.

Not all subs are into obedience. Universalizing your experience is a good way to make mistakes. As you've just done.


_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!


(in reply to RCdc)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Can a submissive be trained to be dominant? - 1/9/2011 6:14:11 AM   
xssve


Posts: 3589
Joined: 10/10/2009
Status: offline 		Sure, anyone can go through the motions - whether they internalize and warm to it or not is whole different issue.

(in reply to DesFIP)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Can a submissive be trained to be dominant? - 1/9/2011 6:14:33 AM   
CherryNeko


Posts: 330
Joined: 12/29/2010
From: Mexico City
Status: offline 		No.

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Before this night ends?
I'm dying surrounded by white flowers
Which scatter in the sky...

(in reply to spankeree)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Can a submissive be trained to be dominant? - 1/9/2011 1:23:16 PM   
defiantbadgirl


Posts: 2988
Joined: 11/14/2005
Status: offline 		Some submissives can become dominant with or without training. My Sir was a sub before I met him. Now he's a switch. Some may need training, others have learned through their own experiences being dominated what to do.

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(in reply to spankeree)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Can a submissive be trained to be dominant? - 1/9/2011 1:35:43 PM   
LadyConstanze


Posts: 9722
Joined: 2/18/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl

Some submissives can become dominant with or without training. My Sir was a sub before I met him. Now he's a switch. Some may need training, others have learned through their own experiences being dominated what to do.


I always thought subs would make great dominants, simply because they know what makes them tick, though it doesn't mean that they are dominants, just that they can pretend to be. Some people go through changes and can be submissive or dominant...

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Those who do and those who don't!

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(in reply to defiantbadgirl)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: Can a submissive be trained to be dominant? - 1/9/2011 7:32:42 PM   
AnnaOfAramis


Posts: 523
Joined: 7/30/2008
Status: offline
quote:

Except for those who aren't obedience wired but get turned on by service. Or those who are driven by emotional transparency instead.

Not all subs are into obedience.


Thanks for saying this. I was thinking something along the same lines. For me slavery is not about making myself obey, because to me that would be mastering myself. For me it is about my Master causing me to want to do exactly what he wants me to do. For me it isn't at all about obedience, but about being mastered... obedience is only how the result looks, if that makes sense.

well wishes,

anna

edited to add: oh, and regarding the OP, no I don't think someone can be trained to be dominant. You either are or you aren't. But you can train someone to top I guess.

< Message edited by AnnaOfAramis -- 1/9/2011 7:36:24 PM >

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in obsequium hominis

(in reply to DesFIP)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Can a submissive be trained to be dominant? - 1/9/2011 11:51:33 PM   
phoenixmoonn13


Posts: 398
Joined: 6/11/2010
Status: offline 		when we were online in secondlife he said oneday he was going to get me a pet. it was when i said what do i do with her and how do i do it and i panicked big time and we both realised it may be a limit . so he treid to get me to lead with one of his subs jsut a shopping trip we came back with her being the top and we had been in message he was tryign to tell me what to do.

i only put this in because of someones comment. if i couldnt cope online he wouldnt expect me to in rl

(in reply to AnnaOfAramis)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Can a submissive be trained to be dominant? - 1/10/2011 12:34:00 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

How insulting to many submissive's. You seem to think that submissive must mean fragile emotionally, limited to this or that and unbalanced. I've seen more submissive's that could shatter someone's nerves (no comment on those they could shatter if they were of a mind to) than those that would be shattered because their dominant wanted a little play action typically associated with a submissive, which isn't always the case.

One does not need to be a dominant personality to be good or great top.

I find it sad and disturbing when people promote the idea that submissive means lacking in some manner, less than, weaker, substandard... and lady, you do it all the time.


Rock On!

I find inspiration simply in pleasing. When he is pleased, it excites me to no end to know I am the one who pleased him. Instilling within me the desire to try harder to please him more.

After all... I am the one who reaps the rewards.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Can a submissive be trained to be dominant? - 1/10/2011 12:36:44 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

Yes, we're all delicate little princesses without a lick of sense in our heads and can't handle doing anything that might possibly be outside of a submissive role.<eyeroll>


Dammit, quit giving away our secrets or we will revoke your subbie-princess tiara!

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to OsideGirl)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: Can a submissive be trained to be dominant? - 1/10/2011 1:44:07 AM   
RCdc


Posts: 8674
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

quote:

ORIGINAL: RCdc
because obeying is what it's all about, when it comes to submission.


Except for those who aren't obedience wired but get turned on by service. Or those who are driven by emotional transparency instead.

Not all subs are into obedience. Universalizing your experience is a good way to make mistakes. As you've just done.



Except that I didn't make a mistake because I wasn't talking about service submissives because that isn't what the OP asked about.

< Message edited by RCdc -- 1/10/2011 1:46:12 AM >

_____________________________
RC&dc


love isnt gazing into each others eyes - it's looking forward in the same direction

(in reply to DesFIP)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: Can a submissive be trained to be dominant? - 1/10/2011 2:25:09 AM   
AquaticSub


Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
Status: offline 		The OP just said submissive. Didn't include or exclude any particular type.

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to RCdc)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Can a submissive be trained to be dominant? - 1/10/2011 3:53:10 AM   
RCdc


Posts: 8674
Status: offline 		But didn't imply service and does imply mastery/dominance, and not as Des mentioned.

quote:

Except for those who aren't obedience wired but get turned on by service.


If you are turned on by service, and one of the services you give is bottoming... then that's irrelevant to the OPs question because then the answer is just 'Find one who already bottoms'.

Of course the OP probably articulated that way because they are fairly new and do not know the difference.  However blinding him with every kind of s-type there is and every possibility and getting him confused with switching won't help and seeing as they haven't been back yet, I am pretty sure it's already got them skeered off.

_____________________________
RC&dc


love isnt gazing into each others eyes - it's looking forward in the same direction

(in reply to AquaticSub)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Can a submissive be trained to be dominant? - 1/10/2011 4:56:04 AM   
DesFIP


Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RCdc
Like I said, I feel for anyone who has a partner who doesn't and won't inspire a person to be anything they put their mind into being.

A Master limiting their s-type because their s-type doesn't like it or thinks that are unable to achieve, is poor management.


And I pity anyone who has a partner who is unable to recognize and respect someone's authentic self. But instead demands they become imitations of someone else.


_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!


(in reply to RCdc)
Profile   Post #: 40
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