quote:

ORIGINAL: CerVeza

I admit I am constantly amazed at the new ways leftists show how stupid they are!

quote:

ORIGINAL: Charles6682

Thats how slavery ended and how Women had the right to vote. 

I hate to be infamatory but the level of peoples ignorance out here is nothing short of fucking amazing.

Slavery never ended in america.

When you write bonds against the children and indenture them to debt that is slavery.

YOu are thinking baout "INVOLUNTARY SERVITUDE that the black slaves were subjected too.

If slavery were illegal we would not have a 13 trilion dolar debt.

you people need to wake up and smell the roses you are SLAVES of your own chosing and you continue to be SLAVES because you dont know what the fuck you are doing.

When they wrote the consitution,AK-47's were around.Their idea of guns was a rifle.Clearly,times have changed.However,the right to bear arms is still in the constitution.I do believe in much stricter gun control laws.One that actually make a real impact.Clearly,no violent offenders should ever be near a gun.People are clearly have mental issues should not be near gun.Kids should not be near guns.Only legal,law abiding,private citizens whos only purpose is for self protection and hunting.I dont believe certain guns should be legal.Grandma Rosie down the street dosent need a AK-47 to protect herself.Neither does the hunter.Armed Forces and Law Enforcement,different situation.I mean seriously,how many guns does someone need?Thats how I feel about guns.I am for strict gun control measures.However,an complete ban on all guns,thats a hard one.I mean,the right to bear arms is in the second amendment.

You use the words arms and guns indiscriminately interchangeably as if they are the same thing and they are NOT. 

You and most americans are fucking illiterate and you think you should have the ability to control the law of this country when you dont even know what the fuck you are talking about.

Arms and guns are not the same.   Arms is literally anytthing that can be used as a weapon to kill.

guns are a subset of arms arms are not a subset of guns.

Like free speech,these things are basically in grained into our constitution and into American society.Like Freedom of Speech,the Consitution is what gives most Americans the quality of life we have.

Another fantasy.

In the nicer parts of America,this country is great.I wont live near the violent areas of

what part is that?  living with the bears?

America.Again,anything can and does happen to people all over the world.Sometimes,sadly,its just a matter of being in the wrong place at the wrond time.Perhaps people all over should become more alert about the world around you.

quote:

ORIGINAL: InvisibleBlack

If all you want to do is score some talking points any time someone dies tragically, you're definitely not part of the solution - you're part of the problem.

quote:

ORIGINAL: InvisibleBlack

- FR -

Some days, I'm appalled. Reading this thread is almost brain damaging. This poor woman is in the hospital, others are dead and it's an endless tirade of people looking to score points on the political forum of a BDSM board for their own specific point of view. You are walking examples of the very things you claim to despise.

As far as I'm aware, there is no evidence providing any motive for this shooting. Anything you are claiming as a cause reveals far more about yourself than it does about Jared L. Loughner. All I can determine from his semi-coherent postings is that he had issues about literacy and the currency.  I, as with many others, suspect that he was, quite simply, crazy. As trite and awful as this sounds - it happens. On August1, 1966 Charles Whitman got on top of the Clock Tower in Austin and shot over 40 people, more than a dozen died. On March 13, 1996 Thomas Hamilton walked into a school in Dunblane, Scotland and open fire on a Primary One class, killing sixteen five- and six- year olds and their teacher. On April 19, 1995 Timothy McVeigh detonated a fertilizer bomb outside an FBI office in Oklahoma City and killed 168 people. On June 27, 1994 the Aum Shinrikyo detonated a sarin gas bomb in the subways in Tokyo killing 7 and hospitalizing over 500 in an attempt to install the group's founder as emperor of Japan. I could go on and on for hours.

If the kernel of your argument is that you can prevent all senseless tragedies caused by dysfunctional individuals if only your set of laws gets enacted - I think you should be locked up. You can't. If your first thought on seeing this awful occurence is that some other group you disagree with is to blame for it - the problem is not with them, it's with you.

I would say that the level of violence is rising - not just in American culture but universally. A valid discussion would be what the cause of this increase in the level of visceral anger people are feeling and their need to lash out with it and what can be done to reverse or prevent it - not at the level of "let's ban guns" or "let's make everyone register to buy fertilizer" - that's treating the symptoms - more at the level of "what is making people feel either so frustrated or so oppressed or so whatever they believe their only recourse is psychotic acts of violence".

I would also say that there is a simple reason why the level of angry rhetoric has been steadily increasing. It's because it works. Fear-mongering is a hugely successful tactic. The ranting demagogue defeats the calm intelligent debator. You might not want it that way, but that's the way it is. Joe McCarthy's anti-communist screed is looked down upon now but it was hugely successful. He won office. He got re-elected. You don't think the big political thinkers noticed this? 

When Jack Kennedy ran for the Senate and later for the Presidency in 1960 he hammered on the "missile gap" - that the Soviets were way ahead of us in stockpiling nuclear weapons. That Nixon, who was part of the previous administration, was weak on defense for allowing the Russians to pull head of us. This was fear-mongering, plain and simple. Kennedy later admitted he was well-aware that there was no missile gap. When Lyndon Johnson ran against Barry Goldwater in 1964 he used the famous "Daisy Girl" ad showing a young girl atomized by an atomic bomb to demonize his opponent. I could go on and on with this, too. It's not unique to any political party or group.

They do it because it works. You don't like it - stop voting for them. Stop repeating their vitriol. Stop running their attack ads for them.

This isn't unique to politics. It's pandemic. Movies are more violent. Television is more violent. Talk shows are more violent. Jerry Springer drove the calm rational talk shows off of prime-time. The entire culture has shifted. A better line of inquiry would be why, is there any benefit to it at all and if not, what can be done about it?

If all you want to do is score some talking points any time someone dies tragically, you're definitely not part of the solution - you're part of the problem.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

quote:

ORIGINAL: InvisibleBlack

Reading this thread is almost brain damaging... If all you want to do is score some talking points any time someone dies tragically, you're definitely not part of the solution - you're part of the problem.

quote:

ORIGINAL: RapierFugue

You have, as a nation, a simple choice; either do something meaningful about gun ownership, rather than tinkering at the edges, or else accept these kind of events as the price of having a gun culture.

quote:

not any liberal Ive ever met carnally...

quote:

ORIGINAL: liks2plzlf

When you accuse some men of just laying there and not puttling much effort into pleasing the woman, your referrilng to liberals, right!!

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife
What I despise are people who won't take a stand on anything.  People who want to sit back, hold hands, and pretend that the solutions are oh so simple.

You sit there and complain about it, then accuse others of not offering any solutions while offering absolutely nothing except your self-righteous ranting.

quote:

ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda

quote:

ORIGINAL: RapierFugue

You have, as a nation, a simple choice; either do something meaningful about gun ownership, rather than tinkering at the edges, or else accept these kind of events as the price of having a gun culture.

Rapier, I don't understand why you don't seem to grasp that we have made our choice. Thank you for your concern, but we're content with our decision.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lockit

This country needs to get serious about the treatment of mental health issues. In the course of my work and in my own family life, I have seen people that needed to be committed, needed mental health services and we did all we could to get them that help, but the system fails to adequately serve the mentally ill.

My son is one of them. We begged them to commit him twice in ten months. The last time he had tried to kill himself three times in two weeks and jumped in front of a man on a bike and he nearly dumped it. We got him put in emergency care, but they released him no matter what we said. Six hours later he changed a whole lot of lives, people that had to see what happened and give assistance until medical help could be found... lives changed because my son was ill and no one would help.

When the kids were young, we were walking down the street and a man coming the other direction stopped, hugged a wall and tried to stay away from my children. Within that month he was shooting at children from his upstairs window. He was committed for less than a year and a half and released as crazy as he was when convicted and placed.

I saw a woman with many personalities that came into the shelter. The police brought her in and I stated that we were not the place for her and that we had families there. They had no other place to take her. She was a total mess and needed to be committed, but they couldn't commit her until she had done something to hurt other people and even then it wouldn't have lasted, as she had been committed before and released.

Mass murderer William Bonin, killed as many as 23 young boys, for which my brother was the only living survivor. Had they kept him, 23 boys would be living their lives today.