RE: The Godwining of the American dialogue

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RE: The Godwining of the American dialogue - 1/11/2011 8:43:47 AM

MrRodgers

Posts: 10542
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quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

Why?
Is it because he's done such a great job?

Well, I am not sure I would say he has done a great job. I am conservative after all, but I will say I am happy with some of the things he has done. And I think he has done a better job at it than Sarah would have if she was elected.

Absolutely. He's continued almost all of the important repub, capitalist fascist policies and practices as most reflected in the financial coronation of the 'kings' on wall street and the bankers. He has continued two great wars for profit, he's kept open GITMO, He's maintained the fascist Partroit act. He has continued that great profit center of deficit spending in continuing low tax rates for millionaires and billionaires.

We could go on and on. You do not get change or reform in the US...IF you wish to remain alive.

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RE: The Godwining of the American dialogue - 1/11/2011 10:08:13 AM

willbeurdaddy

Posts: 11894
Joined: 4/8/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: AnimusRex

The unindicted co-conspirators of the Giffords shooting tragedy are Roger Ailes and Sarah Palin.

It isn't that they used strong language to attack their political opponents; I think strong opinions are a good thing, even delivered in harsh terms.

If someone honestly and sincerely believes that Obama is a dictator who wants to kill Granny, I think they should say so, loudly and in the strongest of terms.

But Fox and Palin don't believe this. Instead, their messages about "death panels" and "Government takeover of medicine" were just cynical craven attempts at fanning the flames of fear and rage so as to gain ratings and political advantage.

It the political equivalent of hysterically accusing someone on a message board of being a Nazi- except in this case it had tragic results.

This is also why I don't accept the calls for "toning down" our rhetoric- as if everyone is doing what Fox does.

Saying hateful things is not the same as saying things hatefully.

If I said, politely and civilly, more in sorrow than anger, mind you, that black people were less intelligent than whites, and someone were to respond with obscene suggestions about my mother, which one of us would need to tone down our rhetoric?

It is the Right that is offering succor and comfort to the notion of white supremacy by altering history (such as the Texas textbook commission or Haley Barbour), and it is the Right that is openly proposing we allow people to die for lack of money (As AZ Gov, Jan Brewer is doing at this very moment), it is the Right that openly regards unemployed people as lazy stray animals, and it is the Tea Party that is suggesting that only property owners be allowed to vote.

These things are being said politely, calmly, in measured civil tones.

These are also hateful thoughts and ideas, and we should respond to them with fury and righteous indignation.

Why dont you provide the slightest shred of evidence that Loughner ever watched Fox and had any clue who Sarah Palin is before you name them co-conspirators?

till then [/thread]

_____________________________

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to the barking of the dogfox,
gone to ground.

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Post #: 42

RE: The Godwining of the American dialogue - 1/11/2011 11:10:52 AM

Politesub53

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

quote:

ORIGINAL: AnimusRex

The unindicted co-conspirators of the Giffords shooting tragedy are Roger Ailes and Sarah Palin.

I dont agree with this, if anything the blame lays with the language of American politics. Both main parties have used adds containing crosshairs, both have used inflammatory speech. When disturbed people read such stuff on a constant basis, they probably become more disturbed.

I have not heard or seen from the left anything like you describe and what I have seen from the right.

I saw a news item here in the mainstream media which mentioned the Democrats ad compared to Palins. I also saw a clip of a speech by Obama where he said something like "If they bring knives, we will bring guns" As Rhetoric goes it isnt exactly helpful is it ?

http://www.politicalforum.com/current-events/166887-palins-map-used-surveyors-crosshairs-democrat-map-used-bulls-eyes-11.html

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RE: The Godwining of the American dialogue - 1/11/2011 11:12:17 AM

GotSteel

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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

quote:

ORIGINAL: GotSteel

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250
Rex, you need to look at the big picture. We have a president who doesn't know what he's doing and who nobody likes.

Your data is a little old, Bush isn't in office anymore.

Got Steel, I was referring to Obama.
If he was up for reelection next week do you really think the nutty professor would be reelected?

According to Gallup his approval ratings have been consistently in the mid forties as of late. That's a far cry from nobody likes him.

Also, where are you getting the nutty professor as a nickname?

Furthermore I think he has a decent chance of being reelected, while he hasn't given the democrats the instantaneous sweeping change which they were hoping for, he has been changing things. I've certainly been hearing the republicans screaming about how he's changing things. But I fear that what will actually happen is that he'll win because the tea party will nominate someone who's completely unelectable.

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RE: The Godwining of the American dialogue - 1/11/2011 11:55:54 AM

AnimusRex

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quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

Why dont you provide the slightest shred of evidence that Loughner ever watched Fox and had any clue who Sarah Palin is before you name them co-conspirators?

till then [/thread]

Don't know if he did or didn't; but he was immersed in the culture of fear and rage and paranoia, the same cutlure that has produced other examples of violence from rightwingers- the cutting of the gas line here,
The curbstomping of a MoveOn activist here.

George Packer in the New Yorker says it best:

"Only one side has made the rhetoric of armed revolt against an oppressive tyranny the guiding spirit of its grassroots movement and its midterm campaign.
Only one side routinely invokes the Second Amendment as a form of swagger and intimidation, not-so-coyly conflating rights with threats.
Only one side’s activists bring guns to democratic political gatherings.
Only one side has a popular national TV host who uses his platform to indoctrinate viewers in the conviction that the President is an alien, totalitarian menace to the country.
Only one side fills the AM waves with rage and incendiary falsehoods.
Only one side has an iconic leader, with a devoted grassroots following, who can’t stop using violent imagery and dividing her countrymen into us and them, real and fake.

Any sentient American knows which side that is; to argue otherwise is disingenuous"

Only one side has been Godwining our national dialogue.

Only one.

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RE: The Godwining of the American dialogue - 1/11/2011 12:15:47 PM

rulemylife

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quote:

ORIGINAL: CerVeza

I remember a colleague of mine in 2008 asked if I wasn't concerned about Palin's lack of experience. I spit my coffee out laughing. She had no idea why I reacted the way I did. Unbelieveable, but this is the state of mind of leftists.

You can't be spitting your coffee out when you're preparing food.

That's just nasty.

So who makes the fries, you or your colleague?

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Post #: 46

RE: The Godwining of the American dialogue - 1/11/2011 12:20:54 PM

willbeurdaddy

Posts: 11894
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

quote:

ORIGINAL: AnimusRex

The unindicted co-conspirators of the Giffords shooting tragedy are Roger Ailes and Sarah Palin.

I dont agree with this, if anything the blame lays with the language of American politics. Both main parties have used adds containing crosshairs, both have used inflammatory speech. When disturbed people read such stuff on a constant basis, they probably become more disturbed.

I have not heard or seen from the left anything like you describe and what I have seen from the right.

I saw a news item here in the mainstream media which mentioned the Democrats ad compared to Palins. I also saw a clip of a speech by Obama where he said something like "If they bring knives, we will bring guns" As Rhetoric goes it isnt exactly helpful is it ?

http://www.politicalforum.com/current-events/166887-palins-map-used-surveyors-crosshairs-democrat-map-used-bulls-eyes-11.html

And the Democrat Leadershp Committee put out ads or strategy emails with targets on several states. Anyone who listens to Keith Olblowhard and thinks the media left isnt more venemous than Fox needs a hearing aid.

_____________________________

Hear the lark
and harken
to the barking of the dogfox,
gone to ground.

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RE: The Godwining of the American dialogue - 1/11/2011 12:21:58 PM

willbeurdaddy

Posts: 11894
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quote:

ORIGINAL: GotSteel

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

quote:

ORIGINAL: GotSteel

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250
Rex, you need to look at the big picture. We have a president who doesn't know what he's doing and who nobody likes.

Your data is a little old, Bush isn't in office anymore.

Got Steel, I was referring to Obama.
If he was up for reelection next week do you really think the nutty professor would be reelected?

According to Gallup his approval ratings have been consistently in the mid forties as of late. That's a far cry from nobody likes him.

Also, where are you getting the nutty professor as a nickname?

Furthermore I think he has a decent chance of being reelected, while he hasn't given the democrats the instantaneous sweeping change which they were hoping for, he has been changing things. I've certainly been hearing the republicans screaming about how he's changing things. But I fear that what will actually happen is that he'll win because the tea party will nominate someone who's completely unelectable.

Knock off the portion of the black vote that support him only for that reason and not for his accomplishments and he's in the 30s.

_____________________________

Hear the lark
and harken
to the barking of the dogfox,
gone to ground.

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RE: The Godwining of the American dialogue - 1/11/2011 12:23:58 PM

Hillwilliam

Posts: 19394
Joined: 8/27/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

quote:

ORIGINAL: GotSteel

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

quote:

ORIGINAL: GotSteel

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250
Rex, you need to look at the big picture. We have a president who doesn't know what he's doing and who nobody likes.

Your data is a little old, Bush isn't in office anymore.

Got Steel, I was referring to Obama.
If he was up for reelection next week do you really think the nutty professor would be reelected?

According to Gallup his approval ratings have been consistently in the mid forties as of late. That's a far cry from nobody likes him.

Also, where are you getting the nutty professor as a nickname?

Furthermore I think he has a decent chance of being reelected, while he hasn't given the democrats the instantaneous sweeping change which they were hoping for, he has been changing things. I've certainly been hearing the republicans screaming about how he's changing things. But I fear that what will actually happen is that he'll win because the tea party will nominate someone who's completely unelectable.

Knock off the portion of the black vote that support him only for that reason and not for his accomplishments and he's in the 30s.

Knock off the portion of people who would vote for a flatworm if it had an (R) after his name and he's in the 70's.

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Post #: 49

RE: The Godwining of the American dialogue - 1/12/2011 10:02:33 AM

willbeurdaddy

Posts: 11894
Joined: 4/8/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: AnimusRex

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

Why dont you provide the slightest shred of evidence that Loughner ever watched Fox and had any clue who Sarah Palin is before you name them co-conspirators?

till then [/thread]

Don't know if he did or didn't;

In other words you condemn people as "co-conspirators" with absolutely no basis to do so, yet you dont see that YOU are exactly what you're ranting about.

_____________________________

Hear the lark
and harken
to the barking of the dogfox,
gone to ground.

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RE: The Godwining of the American dialogue - 1/13/2011 9:54:59 AM

DomYngBlk

Posts: 3316
Joined: 3/27/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

quote:

ORIGINAL: GotSteel

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

quote:

ORIGINAL: GotSteel

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250
Rex, you need to look at the big picture. We have a president who doesn't know what he's doing and who nobody likes.

Your data is a little old, Bush isn't in office anymore.

Got Steel, I was referring to Obama.
If he was up for reelection next week do you really think the nutty professor would be reelected?

According to Gallup his approval ratings have been consistently in the mid forties as of late. That's a far cry from nobody likes him.

Also, where are you getting the nutty professor as a nickname?

Furthermore I think he has a decent chance of being reelected, while he hasn't given the democrats the instantaneous sweeping change which they were hoping for, he has been changing things. I've certainly been hearing the republicans screaming about how he's changing things. But I fear that what will actually happen is that he'll win because the tea party will nominate someone who's completely unelectable.

Knock off the portion of the black vote that support him only for that reason and not for his accomplishments and he's in the 30s.

So, by inference, we can knock off anyone of the same race as the politician in the poll? This means Bush's numbers would have been negative......

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RE: The Godwining of the American dialogue - 1/13/2011 12:26:52 PM

Termyn8or

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I think Bush's numbers would have negative exponents. (for those not math inclined, an absolute negative percentage is an imaginary number, but we can dream). But give Obama time. He will race to the bottom of the spectrum and then if he loses that race, he wins the election.

Again the lesser of two evils. Hey, I'm not putting him down, we could've done worse.

T

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Post #: 52