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RE: 2010 The Hottest year On Record - 1/14/2011 8:41:27 AM

Phoenixpower

Posts: 8098
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

This thread is not about global warming, its about climate change.

~FR~

Actually...even without global warming and climate change....my personal experience also was that it was the hottest year ever in my life...I had so many moments last year where I considered a heart attack would actually be a relief for me...

So yes...2010 was uncomfortable hot for me

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(in reply to mnottertail)

Post #: 21

RE: 2010 The Hottest year On Record - 1/14/2011 8:48:51 AM

RacerJim

Posts: 1583
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: AnimusRex

Seems sad we have to keep pointing this stuff out...

Also seems sad that we have to keep pointing out that that the stuff you keep pointing out is due to the Earth's natural cyclic cooling and warming. For crying out loud it was only 30 years ago that the scientific community was predicting a new ice age unless humankind drastically changed it's way of life.

(in reply to AnimusRex)

Post #: 22

RE: 2010 The Hottest year On Record - 1/14/2011 9:01:59 AM

DomYngBlk

Posts: 3316
Joined: 3/27/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DCWoody

That graph shouldn't be anywhere. It's a graph of the temperature differences that's labelled as a graph of temperature changes. That's just a slightly significant fuck up. The article is shitty too. 'worsening' 'fever'.

Should also note that this is just according to the new data source, the old (as in, the standard used by IPCC until 2007) is still showing 1998 as the warmest year.

Would also ask who the 'we' is in the OP. Americanisation of another subject? Us vs them?

Think you can assume we are those that understand global warming vs. them that don't

(in reply to DCWoody)

Post #: 23

RE: 2010 The Hottest year On Record - 1/14/2011 10:09:16 AM

DomKen

Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DCWoody

That graph shouldn't be anywhere. It's a graph of the temperature differences that's labelled as a graph of temperature changes. That's just a slightly significant fuck up. The article is shitty too. 'worsening' 'fever'.

Should also note that this is just according to the new data source, the old (as in, the standard used by IPCC until 2007) is still showing 1998 as the warmest year.

Would also ask who the 'we' is in the OP. Americanisation of another subject? Us vs them?

Actually it is a graph of the yearly average temp graphed against the centuries average temp. It is an excellent visual representation of an upward trend that we should not be seeing. If it was a natural change the slope of the graph should be more or less linear and this has the unmistakable hallmark of a positive feedback situation.

(in reply to DCWoody)

Post #: 24

RE: 2010 The Hottest year On Record - 1/14/2011 10:21:59 AM

Hippiekinkster

Posts: 5512
Joined: 11/20/2007
From: Liechtenstein
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda

quote:

ORIGINAL: AnimusRex

Seems sad we have to keep pointing this stuff out...

It snowed in Atlanta last week, so obviously that's completely impossible.

What a mess. I made it down my driveway this morning but ain't makin' it back up. Ice. Car's on the street. And I had a hell of a time going up the front yard to my upper front yard (my yards terraced, w/ a small set of 4 steps going up the the upper yard brick patio/walkway, thence to my front foor steps. Have a rose arch with Madison Jasmine at the lower steps. Smells amazing when in bloom. Have one at the front foor, too, on an arbor I built.); even with my cane, and walking on snow, it was still very hazardous. I'm hoping it will melt of enough for me to go to a friends place in the same subdivision to watch the Falcons beat Green Bay.

There's still some ice on the main roads, and wrecks aplenty.

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(in reply to ThatDamnedPanda)

Post #: 25

RE: 2010 The Hottest year On Record - 1/14/2011 10:35:06 AM

Hippiekinkster

Posts: 5512
Joined: 11/20/2007
From: Liechtenstein
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: RacerJim

quote:

ORIGINAL: AnimusRex

Seems sad we have to keep pointing this stuff out...

Also seems sad that we have to keep pointing out that that the stuff you keep pointing out is due to the Earth's natural cyclic cooling and warming. For crying out loud it was only 30 years ago that the scientific community was predicting a new ice age unless humankind drastically changed it's way of life.

"Did scientists predict an impending ice age in the 1970s?

The skeptic argument...Ice age predicted in the 70s
"The media had been spreading warnings of a cooling period since the 1950s, but those alarms grew louder in the 1970s. In 1975, cooling went from 'one of the most important problems' to a first-place tie for 'death and misery'. The claims of global catastrophe were remarkably similar to what the media deliver now about global warming." (Fire and Ice).

What the science says...
Select a level... Basic Intermediate
The vast majority of climate papers in the 1970s predicted warming.

In the thirty years leading up to the 1970s, available temperature recordings suggested that there was a cooling trend. As a result some scientists suggested that the current inter-glacial period could rapidly draw to a close, which might result in the Earth plunging into a new ice age over the next few centuries. This idea could have been reinforced by the knowledge that the smog that climatologists call ‘aerosols’ – emitted by human activities into the atmosphere – also caused cooling. In fact, as temperature recording has improved in coverage, it’s become apparent that the cooling trend was most pronounced in northern land areas and that global temperature trends were in fact relatively steady during the period prior to 1970.

At the same time as some scientists were suggesting we might be facing another ice age, a greater number published contradicting studies. Their papers showed that the growing amount of greenhouse gasses that humans were putting into the atmosphere would cause much greater warming – warming that would a much greater influence on global temperature than any possible natural or human-caused cooling effects.

By 1980 the predictions about ice ages had ceased, due to the overwhelming evidence contained in an increasing number of reports that warned of global warming. Unfortunately, the small number of predictions of an ice age appeared to be much more interesting than those of global warming, so it was those sensational 'Ice Age' stories in the press that so many people tend to remember.

The fact is that around 1970 there were 6 times as many scientists predicting a warming rather than a cooling planet. Today, with 30+years more data to analyse, we've reached a clear scientific consensus:"
http://www.skepticalscience.com/ice-age-predictions-in-1970s.htm

It was primarily Newsweek that spread the "global cooling" bullshit. Now that you know the truth, will you stop repeating the Newsweek BS?

_____________________________

"We are convinced that freedom w/o Socialism is privilege and injustice, and that Socialism w/o freedom is slavery and brutality." Bakunin

“Nothing we do, however virtuous, can be accomplished alone; therefore we are saved by love.” Reinhold Ne

(in reply to RacerJim)

Post #: 26

RE: 2010 The Hottest year On Record - 1/14/2011 10:40:57 AM

Charles6682

Posts: 1820
Joined: 10/1/2007
From: Saint Pete,FL
Status: offline

Whether Global Warming is real or not,I cant say.If it is,is it man-made or just a natural cycle the Earth is going through?I will say,I would still prefer a cleaner Earth either way.I support clean energy solutions.Recycling is a great thing.I was taught as well to try and care for this Earth.Thats really the main point.Humans need the Earth but the Earth doesnt need Humans to survive.

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(in reply to mnottertail)

Post #: 27

RE: 2010 The Hottest year On Record - 1/14/2011 10:58:46 AM

popeye1250

Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline

Not in S. Carolina it isn't!
I was comparing my elec/heating bill for dec of '09 and '10 and 2010 is 7% higher than 2009.
No "variables" either, I live alone and keep the thermostat at 69. I've been here for six years and this has been the coldest winter here by far!
Watch, the next mass murderer will be a "global warmer."

Charles, I agree, I recycle all plastics, newsprint, cardboard and especially aluminum cans.
Aluminum factories are always built near power plants as it takes a tremendous amount of energy to produce aluminum.

< Message edited by popeye1250 -- 1/14/2011 11:02:04 AM >

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"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to AnimusRex)

Post #: 28

RE: 2010 The Hottest year On Record - 1/14/2011 11:36:30 AM

mnottertail

Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline

what was cpkwh in 09 and in 10 and any detail on the monthly static charges?

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(in reply to popeye1250)

Post #: 29

RE: 2010 The Hottest year On Record - 1/14/2011 1:42:01 PM

peacefulplace

Posts: 157
Joined: 8/22/2010
Status: offline

~FR~

Isn't it funny how our weather systems are becoming more extreme (witness--as only my one local example, mind you--the three major snowstorms in DC that left us with higher winter snow totals than Fargo, ND last winter followed by the hottest hell of a summer I've ever had the displeasure of living through), just as scientists predicted the intial effects of climate change would happen?

Here's what I don't get: Who in the hell, as a layman, has the hubris to say global warming/climate change doesn't exist when hundreds of scientists, trained in their discipline, have been sounding this alarm for years now? You'd believe it is a political ideology that is driving this? Keep on fidling, folks...Rome's going to burn.

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(in reply to mnottertail)

Post #: 30

RE: 2010 The Hottest year On Record - 1/14/2011 2:00:59 PM

DCWoody

Posts: 1401
Joined: 10/27/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: DCWoody

That graph shouldn't be anywhere. It's a graph of the temperature differences that's labelled as a graph of temperature changes. That's just a slightly significant fuck up. The article is shitty too. 'worsening' 'fever'.

Should also note that this is just according to the new data source, the old (as in, the standard used by IPCC until 2007) is still showing 1998 as the warmest year.

Would also ask who the 'we' is in the OP. Americanisation of another subject? Us vs them?

Actually it is a graph of the yearly average temp graphed against the centuries average temp. It is an excellent visual representation of an upward trend that we should not be seeing. If it was a natural change the slope of the graph should be more or less linear and this has the unmistakable hallmark of a positive feedback situation.

I meant that labelling it as 'changes' implied global temperatures increased by 0.4C one year, then a further .4 increase the next, and the next....etc.

(in reply to DomKen)

Post #: 31

RE: 2010 The Hottest year On Record - 1/14/2011 3:15:07 PM

FirmhandKY

Posts: 8948
Joined: 9/21/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY

Combination proselytizing and self-reinforcing echo effect.

Let's not forget confirmation bias to reinforce your self-confirming views Firm.

rule, do you mean to tell me that you do not believe that confirmation bias exists, or that you are the only human being on the planet who is immune?

Firm

_____________________________

Some people are just idiots.

(in reply to rulemylife)

Post #: 32

RE: 2010 The Hottest year On Record - 1/14/2011 3:16:26 PM

Charles6682

Posts: 1820
Joined: 10/1/2007
From: Saint Pete,FL
Status: offline

Let me see if I have this right.Here in the Tampa Bay area.The winter of 2010 was the coldest winter on record.Then,summer of 2010 was the hottest year on record.THEN,just last month in December,was the coldest December on record!!I give up,the weather cant make its mind up!!

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(in reply to DCWoody)

Post #: 33

RE: 2010 The Hottest year On Record - 1/14/2011 3:17:43 PM

rulemylife

Posts: 14614
Joined: 8/23/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY

Combination proselytizing and self-reinforcing echo effect.

Let's not forget confirmation bias to reinforce your self-confirming views Firm.

rule, do you mean to tell me that you do not believe that confirmation bias exists, or that you are the only human being on the planet who is immune?

Firm

No, what I mean to tell you is that thing about the pot and kettle.

(in reply to FirmhandKY)

Post #: 34

RE: 2010 The Hottest year On Record - 1/14/2011 3:42:17 PM

FirmhandKY

Posts: 8948
Joined: 9/21/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY

Combination proselytizing and self-reinforcing echo effect.

Let's not forget confirmation bias to reinforce your self-confirming views Firm.

rule, do you mean to tell me that you do not believe that confirmation bias exists, or that you are the only human being on the planet who is immune?

No, what I mean to tell you is that thing about the pot and kettle.

Then you need to read my shit closer, because your confirmation bias is as big as a fucking planet.

Firm

_____________________________

Some people are just idiots.

(in reply to rulemylife)

Post #: 35

RE: 2010 The Hottest year On Record - 1/15/2011 10:53:47 AM

popeye1250

Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: peacefulplace

~FR~

Isn't it funny how our weather systems are becoming more extreme (witness--as only my one local example, mind you--the three major snowstorms in DC that left us with higher winter snow totals than Fargo, ND last winter followed by the hottest hell of a summer I've ever had the displeasure of living through), just as scientists predicted the intial effects of climate change would happen?

Here's what I don't get: Who in the hell, as a layman, has the hubris to say global warming/climate change doesn't exist when hundreds of scientists, trained in their discipline, have been sounding this alarm for years now? You'd believe it is a political ideology that is driving this? Keep on fidling, folks...Rome's going to burn.

Peacefulplace, and thousands of scientists disagree with it. Wouldn't it be "hubristic" for "laymen" to say that "global warming" *does* exist? Look at Al Gore, he's made hundred$ of millions from it and he has a "degree" in "Theology" or whatever the hell it is!
Do you think he had any "special" knowledge leftover from his days as V.P.? You know, something that "the rest of us" wouldn't have? He's a "Layman" too, only one who capitalised on it.

You'd get the same result trying to argue with a "9-11 truther" a UFO "Believer" or an Obama "birther" as you would with a "global warmer" or whatever they're calling themselves this week, ***endless, circuitous arguments!***

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to peacefulplace)

Post #: 36

RE: 2010 The Hottest year On Record - 1/15/2011 10:58:52 AM

DomKen

Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline

As near as anyone can tell Gore has made nothing off AGW. He donates all proceeds from speeches and the like to charity.

And there are not thousands of scientists with expertise in climate science who disagree that AGW is happening. The number is more like a couple of dozen and they all have close ties to the fossil fuel industry.

(in reply to popeye1250)

Post #: 37

RE: 2010 The Hottest year On Record - 1/15/2011 11:03:50 AM

popeye1250

Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

As near as anyone can tell Gore has made nothing off AGW. He donates all proceeds from speeches and the like to charity.

And there are not thousands of scientists with expertise in climate science who disagree that AGW is happening. The number is more like a couple of dozen and they all have close ties to the fossil fuel industry.

Yeah, and those e-mails were ....."stolen" which I guess makes them,..."not true?" "True?"
I rest my case.

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to DomKen)

Post #: 38

RE: 2010 The Hottest year On Record - 1/15/2011 11:33:07 AM

anthrosub

Posts: 843
Joined: 6/2/2004
Status: offline

Anyone here ever read, "The Truth about Money"? There's a nice little analogy about the stock market and its behavior. Think of a little boy walking up a hill playing with a yo-yo. The advice is to watch the boy and not the yo-yo. I think with the climate change debate there's a bit of that going on. People are judging the yo-yo and not the boy to reach their conclusions on the matter. Just the other day I read someone criticizing climate change by pointing out how cold it is in the northeastern United States with below than normal temperatures. But while this is happening, what's happening in the rest of the world needs to be considered.

I agree that the earth is fine and it's people who are in danger...regardless of whether we are talking about global warming or something entirely unrelated. The planet is not infinite and we are all here having an impact on it by our very presence. Resources are being put under a lot of pressure and when it comes to skating close to the earth's carrying capacity...I think it would be wise to scale things back a bit to avoid going past the point of no return. The naysayers apparently aren't concerned about this being a real possibility but it could happen with or without climate change.

_____________________________

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(in reply to popeye1250)

Post #: 39

RE: 2010 The Hottest year On Record - 1/15/2011 11:55:26 AM

popeye1250

Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: anthrosub

Anyone here ever read, "The Truth about Money"? There's a nice little analogy about the stock market and its behavior. Think of a little boy walking up a hill playing with a yo-yo. The advice is to watch the boy and not the yo-yo. I think with the climate change debate there's a bit of that going on. People are judging the yo-yo and not the boy to reach their conclusions on the matter. Just the other day I read someone criticizing climate change by pointing out how cold it is in the northeastern United States with below than normal temperatures. But while this is happening, what's happening in the rest of the world needs to be considered.

I agree that the earth is fine and it's people who are in danger...regardless of whether we are talking about global warming or something entirely unrelated. The planet is not infinite and we are all here having an impact on it by our very presence. Resources are being put under a lot of pressure and when it comes to skating close to the earth's carrying capacity...I think it would be wise to scale things back a bit to avoid going past the point of no return. The naysayers apparently aren't concerned about this being a real possibility but it could happen with or without climate change.

Anthro, if people want to "help the Earth" they should get involved in population control!

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to anthrosub)

Post #: 40

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