RE: Protesters hit by hail of gunfire in Libya march

RE: Protesters hit by hail of gunfire in Libya march (Full Version)

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Arpig -> RE: Protesters hit by hail of gunfire in Libya march (2/26/2011 4:35:43 PM)
quote: People are being butchered because of policies that were instituted by the Bush administration. So let's all now just hold hands and pretend that never happened and pray for peace. Oh just fuck off

Sanity -> RE: Protesters hit by hail of gunfire in Libya march (2/26/2011 4:36:10 PM)
This reminds me of Bush vs. Saddam. The only difference now is that its Gaddafi who is butchering his own people and its Obama calling for regime change... [;)] quote: Obama says Gadhafi must leave Libya 'now'

Arpig -> RE: Protesters hit by hail of gunfire in Libya march (2/26/2011 4:41:40 PM)
quote: You don't show anything............ever. You just run your mouth with whatever nonsense happens to spill into your previously empty head. Let me know when you want to back any of your bullshit and I'll be happy to take you on. Until then you are just an annoyance. Sorry, but he did indeed provide reasonable proof of both things he claimed,,,why you pretend he didn't is beyond me...I am a more hardcore lefty than most on here but I have no issue with dawg having provided adequate proof of his claims. Hell RML you embarrass me with your idiotic refusal to accept the proof you demanded when it is presented...grow up or go away

jlf1961 -> RE: Protesters hit by hail of gunfire in Libya march (2/26/2011 4:41:50 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: luckydawg RML has a hard time with "because". Jilf, estimated by whom? I have rumours that the ex FM says there is still a stockpile. Has that become credible? That is the estimate by the last group of international inspectors. quote: Gaddafi opened his weapons stockpiles to international inspection and is known to have stockpiles of 9.5 metric tonnes of mustard gas. His government has reportedly destroyed 50 per cent of its chemical weapons cache. In 2003 soon after the toppling of Saddam Hussein in Iraq, Libya agreed to dismantle its nuclear and chemical weapons programmes. source quote: As Muammar Qaddafi continues his violent crackdown on opposition protesters, U.S. officials are worried how far the embattled Libyan leader may go to neutralize the growing threat to his power. According to a Wall Street Journal report ($), Qaddafi still possesses caches of mustard gas and other chemical weapons, as well as a stockpile of Scud B missiles and 1,000 metric tons of uranium yellowcake, leaving Washington skittish. "When you have a guy who's as irrational as Qaddafi with some serious weapons at his disposal, it's always a concern," a U.S. official told the paper. "But we haven't yet seen him move to use any kind of mustard gas or chemical weapon." source

Arpig -> RE: Protesters hit by hail of gunfire in Libya march (2/26/2011 4:45:25 PM)
something is wrong here...I find myself having to back up the right-wingers because they are the ones presenting actual proof to back their position I disagree with them on about 98% of all issues, but in this one they (particularly luckydawg) are apparently correct.

jlf1961 -> RE: Protesters hit by hail of gunfire in Libya march (2/26/2011 4:47:59 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: luckydawg RML has a hard time with "because". Jilf, estimated by whom? I have rumours that the ex FM says there is still a stockpile. Has that become credible? By International inspectors. Here are the two sources I have found. Report: U.S. wary of Libya's chemical weapons World leaders weigh Libya response

rulemylife -> RE: Protesters hit by hail of gunfire in Libya march (2/26/2011 4:59:40 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TheHeretic quote: ORIGINAL: rulemylife People are being gunned down in the streets and you call it "good bipartisan policy". Or, people are being gunned down in the streets and you see a nice opportunity to turn it all into partisan bullshit with the opening words of your thread, RML. Irish Spring doesn't do well on that sort of stink. As for Kuhdaffy, the idea of seeing video of crowds dragging his body through the streets seems less awful all the time. I don't really give a shit about "Kuhdafffy , but I do like the new spelling. Been to Disney lately? I hear Daffy Duck is still very popular. And I also use Aloe Vera moisturizer to give me that fresh tingly sensation.

rulemylife -> RE: Protesters hit by hail of gunfire in Libya march (2/26/2011 5:02:48 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Arpig quote: People are being butchered because of policies that were instituted by the Bush administration. So let's all now just hold hands and pretend that never happened and pray for peace. Oh just fuck off Well that was ..............interesting. Fuck off was the best you could come up with?

Arpig -> RE: Protesters hit by hail of gunfire in Libya march (2/26/2011 5:03:21 PM)
Like I said before RML...fuck off You are being a total dick your reply to Rich had nothing to do with what he posted, but just pseudo-humorous crap...if you have nothing worthwhile to contribute then why don't you shut the fuck up

Arpig -> RE: Protesters hit by hail of gunfire in Libya march (2/26/2011 5:06:19 PM)
was all it deserved...people are being slaughtered because a dictator who was in power LOOOOONG before either Bush was in power is clinging to power, yet somehow its Bush's fault.....Fuck off was the politest thing I could come up with

rulemylife -> RE: Protesters hit by hail of gunfire in Libya march (2/26/2011 5:19:40 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Arpig was all it deserved...people are being slaughtered because a dictator who was in power LOOOOONG before either Bush was in power is clinging to power, yet somehow its Bush's fault.....Fuck off was the politest thing I could come up with Yeah, well it wasn't too polite. Nevertheless, let's try to continue. If you remember it was Reagan who tried to contain him and did that somewhat successfully. If you also remember it was Libya that admitted to the destruction of the Pan Am flight. And if you still remember it was the Bush administration, you know those anti-terrorist folks, that worked out a wonderful deal to forgive the terrorists.

Arpig -> RE: Protesters hit by hail of gunfire in Libya march (2/26/2011 5:36:33 PM)
A deal, which as LD pointed out, involved Libya giving up its WMD programs (however far fetched they were - not too far fetched since they already had a demonstrated chemical weapons capability) and turning over the accused terrorists in its custody...They did all that was asked of them, regardless of whether he is an asshole dictator..the west made demands, he complied so of course we must normalize relations with him...that's how it works when you are the "good guys"...you make a demand, they comply, you accept it..that's how it works. Fair enough, Bush made a deal with Gadaffi, it was a deal that made that section of the world and a whole lot else safer...it was a good deal, it doesn't mean that that deal is responsible for the massacres going on in Libya today. The two are utterly unrelated, Gadaffi would still be in charge and still be clinging to power as murderously without the deal Bush made...the two are unrelated and you fucking well know it. Stop pretending you can't see...or maybe you aren't pretending and you are as dense as dawg thinks you are.

rulemylife -> RE: Protesters hit by hail of gunfire in Libya march (2/26/2011 5:40:23 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Arpig A deal, which as LD pointed out, involved Libya giving up its WMD programs (however far fetched they were - not too far fetched since they already had a demonstrated chemical weapons capability) and turning over the accused terrorists in its custody...They did all that was asked of them, regardless of whether he is an asshole dictator..the west made demands, he complied so of course we must normalize relations with him...that's how it works when you are the "good guys"...you make a demand, they comply, you accept it..that's how it works. Fair enough, Bush made a deal with Gadaffi, it was a deal that made that section of the world and a whole lot else safer...it was a good deal, it doesn't mean that that deal is responsible for the massacres going on in Libya today. The two are utterly unrelated, Gadaffi would still be in charge and still be clinging to power as murderously without the deal Bush made...the two are unrelated and you fucking well know it. Stop pretending you can't see...or maybe you aren't pretending and you are as dense as dawg thinks you are. No, they are absolutely not unrelated. We legitimatized his regime with that deal.

Arpig -> RE: Protesters hit by hail of gunfire in Libya march (2/26/2011 5:46:42 PM)
Bullshit..his regime had been in power for decades...you may have legitimized it in US eyes by that deal, but not to the rest of the world..and like I said...the US made demands, he met them..what choice do you have but to normalize...he did what you asked. Sure hindsight is 20:20 but anybody with 1/10th of a brain would have known he would fight hard to retain power, it has fuck all to do with the Bush deal...he was there before the bush deal, he would still be where he is without the Bush deal. The one is unconnected to the other, except, as LD has stated, it reduced the weapons that Gadaffi has to use. Yes its tragic what is happening, but at least he isn't spraying mustard gas on them.

tweakabelle -> RE: Protesters hit by hail of gunfire in Libya march (2/26/2011 8:09:12 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ashjor911 quote: calamitysandra Hopefully, the signs are being read correctly, and he really is on his last leg. I shudder to think about the pain and suffering he might inflict upon the protesters before he goes down. agreed but i think that his last fight going to be his nasty one of all he still think that he is a revelution leader above all.... Yes. It looks like Ghadaffi is going down fighting, clinging to his delusions to the last minute. With all the squabbling here, aren't we losing sight of the fact that Ghadaffi's downfall will be achieved by the Libyan people alone. Libyans have been so unbelievably brave facing the monster Ghadaffi's planes, tanks, thugs and mercenaries without any arms or protection or outside support. Over the years, there has been lots of foreign co-operation with Ghadaffi but when it came to removing him, no one in the West (which has made so many billions out of co-operating with Ghaddafi) has made any kind of significant contribution. We need to keep this in mind when we begin to deal with the new free Libya. If I was a Libyan it would be at the forefront of my mind.

Arpig -> RE: Protesters hit by hail of gunfire in Libya march (2/26/2011 8:27:27 PM)
You are right tweak..it is the people of Libya who are doing this...and that is how it should be...if it turns into a civil war that lasts some time (as did the American Revolution) then perhaps we can choose to back one side or the other, but at this point the best we can do is tell them we support their efforts, but it is up to them to dump the regime or not

luckydawg -> RE: Protesters hit by hail of gunfire in Libya march (2/27/2011 1:32:06 AM)
JIlf, that may indeed be true, thanks for providing links. Though I still think it is better that he has less at his disposal.

rulemylife -> RE: Protesters hit by hail of gunfire in Libya march (2/27/2011 4:33:47 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Arpig A deal, which as LD pointed out, involved Libya giving up its WMD programs (however far fetched they were - not too far fetched since they already had a demonstrated chemical weapons capability) and turning over the accused terrorists in its custody...They did all that was asked of them, regardless of whether he is an asshole dictator..the west made demands, he complied so of course we must normalize relations with him...that's how it works when you are the "good guys"...you make a demand, they comply, you accept it..that's how it works. Fair enough, Bush made a deal with Gadaffi, it was a deal that made that section of the world and a whole lot else safer...it was a good deal, it doesn't mean that that deal is responsible for the massacres going on in Libya today. The two are utterly unrelated, Gadaffi would still be in charge and still be clinging to power as murderously without the deal Bush made...the two are unrelated and you fucking well know it. Stop pretending you can't see...or maybe you aren't pretending and you are as dense as dawg thinks you are. No, what I think is there was an extreme amount of hypocrisy that went on to "make the world safer". And that hypocrisy has now come back to bite us in the ass.

rulemylife -> RE: Protesters hit by hail of gunfire in Libya march (2/27/2011 4:40:33 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Arpig Bullshit..his regime had been in power for decades...you may have legitimized it in US eyes by that deal, but not to the rest of the world..and like I said...the US made demands, he met them..what choice do you have but to normalize...he did what you asked. Sure hindsight is 20:20 but anybody with 1/10th of a brain would have known he would fight hard to retain power, it has fuck all to do with the Bush deal...he was there before the bush deal, he would still be where he is without the Bush deal. The one is unconnected to the other, except, as LD has stated, it reduced the weapons that Gadaffi has to use. Yes its tragic what is happening, but at least he isn't spraying mustard gas on them. How in the fuck do you justify terrorism by saying we made a deal for no more terror? Does the word capitulation come to mind?

Hillwilliam -> RE: Protesters hit by hail of gunfire in Libya march (2/27/2011 3:57:00 PM)
Observations over the last week: I hope those in Foggy Bottom have thought about this. Early in the conflict, some pilots were flying to Malta to defect. Even though some pilots have been refusing to bomb civilians, there have been no more defections. Why? One GOOD possibility: They aren't issued enough fuel to defect. Just enough for the mission. This Would be a GOOD time to set up and enforce a "no fly zone" You would have unmotivated pilots that are armed for ground attack, not a to a, that dont have enough fuel to "dogfight". Personally, I'm hopeing it's already too late and that SOB is dead by now but it's someting to think about.

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