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RE: Physics..Paradigm shift coming..Next 5 miles - 2/26/2011 8:53:34 PM   
Termyn8or


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Is this the same cold fusion argument that happened 30 years ago ?

T^T

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RE: Physics..Paradigm shift coming..Next 5 miles - 2/26/2011 9:12:32 PM   
Icarys


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or

Is this the same cold fusion argument that happened 30 years ago ?

T^T

There are a number of avenues here but this is mainly for me an argument on the existence of Hydrinos which as far as most of the scientific community believes, doesn't exist. Dr. mills believes this may explain the source of this new power source. FFS most didn't believe in the existence of Black holes nor Quarks either.

Here's a couple of links submitted I believe to Cambridge and AIP by Dr. Mills and Colleagues.
http://journals.cambridge.org/action/displayAbstract?fromPage=online&aid=151123
http://journals.cambridge.org/action/displayAbstract?fromPage=online&aid=355891
http://jap.aip.org/resource/1/japiau/v92/i12/p7008_s1?isAuthorized=no

< Message edited by Icarys -- 2/26/2011 9:20:22 PM >


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RE: Physics..Paradigm shift coming..Next 5 miles - 2/26/2011 9:51:44 PM   
Termyn8or


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I don't believe in anything or the existence thereof. Ever been to a black hole ? Oh but they say because of this and that it must exist. So does the bogeyman if you got the right (wrong) perspective. In the shadows of night, there are more optical illusions than could ever be concieved by Man. Most don't even know that the sky is not blue.

Einstein started this light bends around gravity so time must this and that and bla bla bla. I don't believe this shit for a minute. He was good for awhile but when he got older I think he lost it. But that's just me. Bring your backpack space pod over and let's take it apart to see how it works. All these great discovweries and we don't even know how to tell food from not food. Buncha shit.

Now these cold fusionists, OK, they observed a change in the spectrograph reading. Try to power your house with that.

We went from stone age, bronze age, iron age, whatever. Now we live in the mechanical age. Maybe in a few decades this age will start to end, but cold fusion is not what's going to do it. They say a discharge occurs, it indicates a certain voltage, well charge some batteries off it then. Get the point ? We are not in a position to rule the stars yet, we are in a certain stage of development. Even if this technology were to exist, will the commoner ever see it ?

Even if cold fusion is reality, it is not much more than a small afterburner for a laser.

The paradigm includes economic factors.

T^T

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RE: Physics..Paradigm shift coming..Next 5 miles - 2/27/2011 7:50:21 AM   
DomKen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Icarys

Those of you who hold the laws of physics so near and dear may need to fasten your mental seat-belts or is it loosen them a bit?

John Christie's Magnet Motor that touts up to 5 times the power consumed.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xnsYUYfMtXk


Perpetual motion is impossible. Anyone who belives otherwise is a liar or a fool.

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RE: Physics..Paradigm shift coming..Next 5 miles - 2/27/2011 7:58:27 AM   
Icarys


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quote:

Perpetual motion is impossible. Anyone who belives otherwise is a liar or a fool.


I'm surely neither but you may believe what you want. I've seen with my own eyes what others would technically consider perpetual motion. Not more than two feet from me in a classroom.

Care to comment in an average way about the Blacklight power issue or would you rather just skip over that for various reason?

(I bet I can guess what your answer will be )


< Message edited by Icarys -- 2/27/2011 8:28:20 AM >


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RE: Physics..Paradigm shift coming..Next 5 miles - 2/27/2011 8:33:43 AM   
Icarys


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If you'll notice..the University of NC-Ashville, University of Wisconsin, Rowan University, GEN3 and CfA have all done independent studies on BLP. I'm sure there's more to come.

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Alaska Bound-The Official Countdown Has Started!
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RE: Physics..Paradigm shift coming..Next 5 miles - 2/27/2011 9:30:36 AM   
Icarys


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The thing is..Even if his theories are wrong..Rather than trying to prove or disprove a theory in this case first..Why not repeat the experiment all across the US and THEN work out why it works if it does. Which has been shown to work so far BTW....Just maybe on his way, trying to discover hydrino's based on his theory, he has in-turn discovered something else entirely or maybe it works completely on a different yet unknown set of mechanics.

To dismiss it outright is the true foolishness here.


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submission - the feeling of patient, submissive humbleness - the state of being submissive or compliant; meekness.

Alaska Bound-The Official Countdown Has Started!
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RE: Physics..Paradigm shift coming..Next 5 miles - 2/27/2011 9:42:47 AM   
tyrasia


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Icarys

If you'll notice..the University of NC-Ashville, University of Wisconsin, Rowan University, GEN3 and CfA have all done independent studies on BLP. I'm sure there's more to come.


*starts jotting schools down in the back of her thesis book*

Thank You Icarys :)


tyr

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RE: Physics..Paradigm shift coming..Next 5 miles - 2/27/2011 9:49:57 AM   
Icarys


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tyrasia


quote:

ORIGINAL: Icarys

If you'll notice..the University of NC-Ashville, University of Wisconsin, Rowan University, GEN3 and CfA have all done independent studies on BLP. I'm sure there's more to come.


*starts jotting schools down in the back of her thesis book*

Thank You Icarys :)


tyr

(Grins) Off to help them are you?

Come to think of it..jokes aside..I'd love to see the results of that..If you weren't joking yourself that is. :>


< Message edited by Icarys -- 2/27/2011 10:00:13 AM >


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submission - the feeling of patient, submissive humbleness - the state of being submissive or compliant; meekness.

Alaska Bound-The Official Countdown Has Started!
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RE: Physics..Paradigm shift coming..Next 5 miles - 2/27/2011 2:08:47 PM   
Termyn8or


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I'll assume this is the comment section.......

About 35 years ago if I told you that a simple series electronic circuit could have more current flowing at one end than the other, if you were familiar with the technology you would've said that I am absolutely crazy. It was considered totally impossible until the advent of the switching regulator. Take for example the operation of a solid state light dimmer. It does not actually regulate, it switches. It switches on and off so fast you can't see it.

That simple device was made possible by what's called a four quadrant triac. It switches at the line rate - 60 Hz. The idea is that power is wasted by resistance, which is what transisors do - they are electronically controlled resistors in a sense. When they are between full on and full off they dissipate power. This is why there is a big piece of aluminum in your stereo, to dissipate the wasted energy in the form of heat.

Well in most equipment many sources are needed at different voltages. For example your PC needs + and - 5 volts, 12 volts etc. You have 120 volts AC. This is changed to DC in the power supply and goes through a transformer after a transistor, which switches on and off very fast, thus producing the AC which drives the transformer.

But in certain applications the transformer is not needed, just a coil will suffice. Fo example, to supply the processor in your PC, it takes a hell of alot of current. The voltage is lower and lower as the technology advances but let's say the processor needs 1.5 volts at 40 amps. A switching regulator takes the 5 volt supply at about 13 amps, and steps it down to what is required. This is proof of the impossible because without a transformer, it is (actually was) impossible. But the math bears it out.

Because the active device is always either full on or full off, it dissipates no appreciable power. If it is turned on for 50 % of the time you would expect half of the input voltage at the output after filtering. It's not quite that simple but close enough for illustriative purpose. So it puts out 2.5 but takes in 5. Where did the other volts go ? In the old days they went into a big piece of aluminum called a heat sink. Now it goes nowhere.

Literally, the part that suppies the power to the microprocessor in your computer right now defies the laws of physics as they were thought and taught decades ago. THE FACT IS, THE LAWS OF PHYSICS DID NOT CHANGE, we just learned more about them.

We are liars and fools. We have very smart fools and honest liars. People who can adapt to new discoveries, and believe me not everyone can. They know who they are. They claim that a perpetual motion machine is impossible despite the fact that we all live in one, in a way. Thee original energy that propelled the motion of celestial bodies in the universe is not wasted. Even if it does not strictly qualify as perpetual motion, it's close enough.

This budding motor/generator technology does not violate the laws of physics, it just uses them in a new way. Supposed fools and liars make up a good portion of the innovators of the last century or so. It's not magic. It's not slight of hand. When I heard about these generator things I was just as skeptical as anyone. Again, the laws of physics did not change, my understanding of them did.

The technology used is older than you think actually. For lack of a better term I would call it effective modulation of force produced by permanent magnets. More simply, they use this force to cause motion, which is the scientific definition of work.

Some people seem to think that all innovation comes from major universities and research labs, and that is simply not true. Sure they have a function. Specially controlled environmnets in which to test theories, special tools and measuring equipment, things like that. But very few true innovations were discovered that way. I put it that way because if you really think about it, invention really is nothing more than discovery.

Major research centers operate within a certain paradigm. Independent innovators operate outside that venue, but are of course subject to the same laws of physics. If you take it that way, you can see that very little is impossible. It may be impossible for us, but only the dumbest geniuses think they know everything. Take Henry Ford as case in point. It's not as technical, but serves to illustrate - consider the scenario ;

Ford : I'm gonna put up this big building and steel and other raw materials will go in one end and cars will drive out the other
??? : You're full of shit, you can't do that, you know what that would take ?
Ford : Yes
??? : Then you are either a fool or a liar
Ford : Good fucking bye.

Sure Ford went to school, but how could he have been taught at school how to do something that had never been done ? Riddle me that. Have you driven a Ford lately ? That is my point about having an open mind. Of course I dismissed the idea about these solar cells that came up recently. Know why ? Because I have an idea how they work, and when they started talking about polarized light it didn't fit with extant facts in my mind. Of course neither did the hummingbird motor which is based on the same technology as the "perpetual" generator. Look up hummingbird motor and see when it came out. You may be surprised at just how old the technology is.

It has not been brought to market, but they can get a new drug passed so fast it'll make your head spin. The status quo depends on the status quo. This is why technology is so fucked up. This is why alot of things are so fucked up.

One Man with the means can change history. He will be a loner, without support from the establishment. Really, if you're making millions on petrofutures, would you fund a project that would put you out of business if successful ? You tell me.

This is long enough, I could write a book on the subject. I have seen the advancements in technology in my lifetime. I have literally seen the impossible, so it seems. But it isn't what it seems. You have to look at the roots of the tree, the teeth of the gift horse and the ball joints on a used car. You must remain skepical yet openminded. This is a paradox for those who were educated primarily in a structired system. And what I mean by that is that many people have gone to school. It gives you the basics, but not the mental tools to innovate.

Go figure, because innovation is an anaethma to the status quo. Before Ford, car chassis' were built, and then bodies were selected, much as the top end of a stagecoach. And that's really what it was, it just didn't require a horse. Cars were very expensive and Ford's goal was to simplt make them affordable for the average Joe. If Ford were alive today, in light of these new technologies I think he would be in the thick of it. He was that type. No I didn't know him personally of course, but he saw an untaken opportunity. It takes more than a sheepskin to do what he did.

Who will be the one to actually change the world this time ?

T^T

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RE: Physics..Paradigm shift coming..Next 5 miles - 2/27/2011 5:12:55 PM   
DomKen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Icarys

The thing is..Even if his theories are wrong..Rather than trying to prove or disprove a theory in this case first..Why not repeat the experiment all across the US and THEN work out why it works if it does. Which has been shown to work so far BTW....Just maybe on his way, trying to discover hydrino's based on his theory, he has in-turn discovered something else entirely or maybe it works completely on a different yet unknown set of mechanics.

To dismiss it outright is the true foolishness here.


Ok, lets start with the hydrino lie.

The distance of the electron shell from the nucleus is governed by the electromagnetic force. bringing the electron shell closer to the nucleus is possible but would require ridiulous amounts of input energy and would be useless for storage as the hydrogen atoms would tend to return to normal radiating heat which would make storage essentially impossible without constant input energy.

All the journal articles published by the inventor is in Physics Essays which has a terrible reputation in the physics community and is the publisher of last resort for all sorts of crackpots and frauds.
http://www.natscience.com/Uwe/Forum.aspx/physics-research/746/Physics-Essays

But that wasn't what I was commenting on, although it is also clearly a fruad. I was pointing out that your claimed 5X output to input magnet motor was physically impossible. Just consider what happens if you feed the output into the input. That should result in infinite output energy which is of course impossible. You must always get less energy out of a system than the amount you put in.

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RE: Physics..Paradigm shift coming..Next 5 miles - 2/27/2011 5:32:42 PM   
Icarys


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quote:

Ok, lets start with the hydrino lie.

The distance of the electron shell from the nucleus is governed by the electromagnetic force. bringing the electron shell closer to the nucleus is possible but would require ridiulous amounts of input energy and would be useless for storage as the hydrogen atoms would tend to return to normal radiating heat which would make storage essentially impossible without constant input energy.

All the journal articles published by the inventor is in Physics Essays which has a terrible reputation in the physics community and is the publisher of last resort for all sorts of crackpots and frauds.
http://www.natscience.com/Uwe/Forum.aspx/physics-research/746/Physics-Essays

But that wasn't what I was commenting on, although it is also clearly a fruad. I was pointing out that your claimed 5X output to input magnet motor was physically impossible. Just consider what happens if you feed the output into the input. That should result in infinite output energy which is of course impossible. You must always get less energy out of a system than the amount you put in.

As I've stated...His theories maybe be incorrect..Calling him a liar is a bit idiotic when you're not most likely as smart as the man...If you were you'd be working in the field..Which I don't think you do.

As for the other links...well time will tell on all of those won't they. The motor does seem fishy..I think we're highly inefficient when it comes to how we produce, use and store energy so I'm trying to keep an open mind to possibilities.

John Kanzius's discovery as far as I know doesn't break any laws so maybe he's onto something.

ElectroChemical Science may wind up surprising a number of people in exotic ways..We'll have to wait and see there as well. This stuff isn't worked out overnight...if it's never attempted, we'll never know the actual answers and I think that does more harm than good.

So it's much easier to call a person a crackpot, liar and scammer than it is to pry open our own minds at times.. Like I've said..just because we take a peek at something doesn't mean we are nuts ourselves. unless people fear their own grips on reality, I'm not sure what the problem is. I'm sure though there are those out there that will find something bad with it.


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RE: Physics..Paradigm shift coming..Next 5 miles - 2/27/2011 5:55:12 PM   
Termyn8or


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"You must always get less energy out of a system than the amount you put in. "

I'm going to say this ONCE.

The energy is put in by the fields of permanent magnets. Manipulating those fields is not creating energy it is USING it.

Let me know if any of those words are too big.

T^T

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RE: Physics..Paradigm shift coming..Next 5 miles - 2/27/2011 6:21:19 PM   
Icarys


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One string to rule them all on the science channel if anyone is interested...Hosted by Morgan Freeman! Just kidding..They are talking about a new unified theory..very interesting.

BBL :>



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RE: Physics..Paradigm shift coming..Next 5 miles - 2/28/2011 7:09:03 AM   
tyrasia


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...alas there IS a drawback to only having netflix piped to the Wii....

maybe You would be so nice as to fill a girl in later :)

May i cmail You please Icarys Sir?

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'Life isn't about how to survive the storm, but how to dance in the rain.'

'If i can laugh at something 3 times i can deal with it to it's completion' ~tyrasia~

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RE: Physics..Paradigm shift coming..Next 5 miles - 2/28/2011 8:16:50 AM   
Icarys


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tyrasia

...alas there IS a drawback to only having netflix piped to the Wii....

maybe You would be so nice as to fill a girl in later :)

May i cmail You please Icarys Sir?

You have mail.


< Message edited by Icarys -- 2/28/2011 8:38:13 AM >


_____________________________

submission - the feeling of patient, submissive humbleness - the state of being submissive or compliant; meekness.

Alaska Bound-The Official Countdown Has Started!
http://tinyurl.com/872mcu3
http://alturl.com/mog7m

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RE: Physics..Paradigm shift coming..Next 5 miles - 2/28/2011 9:52:54 AM   
DomKen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or

"You must always get less energy out of a system than the amount you put in. "

I'm going to say this ONCE.

The energy is put in by the fields of permanent magnets. Manipulating those fields is not creating energy it is USING it.

Let me know if any of those words are too big.

T^T

No, it isn't. The only way to get energy out of a magnetic field is to change, oscillate, the field. That requires moving the magnet(s) or moving the conductor coil. You always get less energy out of the system than you put in to rotate whatever you choose to rotate.

This is a basic fact of the Second Law of Thermodynamics and anyone who claims they can break it is a liar or a fool.

< Message edited by DomKen -- 2/28/2011 9:53:40 AM >

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RE: Physics..Paradigm shift coming..Next 5 miles - 2/28/2011 11:42:52 AM   
Icarys


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quote:

This is a basic fact of the Second Law of Thermodynamics and anyone who claims they can break it is a liar or a fool.


If you think that's relative to what he's talking about you're far removed from his curve of thought.

There is such a thing as repulsion and in itself it does produce force..No laws broke as far as I know.


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RE: Physics..Paradigm shift coming..Next 5 miles - 2/28/2011 1:13:51 PM   
DomKen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Icarys

quote:

This is a basic fact of the Second Law of Thermodynamics and anyone who claims they can break it is a liar or a fool.


If you think that's relative to what he's talking about you're far removed from his curve of thought.

There is such a thing as repulsion and in itself it does produce force..No laws broke as far as I know.


How do you get the two magnets close enough for repulsion to move them apart? You have to add energy and if you then use that repulsion to generate energy you will get less out than you put in. That is always true.

< Message edited by DomKen -- 2/28/2011 1:14:06 PM >

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RE: Physics..Paradigm shift coming..Next 5 miles - 2/28/2011 1:56:54 PM   
Icarys


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quote:

How do you get the two magnets close enough for repulsion to move them apart? You have to add energy and if you then use that repulsion to generate energy you will get less out than you put in. That is always true.


I've bought less than stellar supplies from wally but hopefully I'll have a crude model built in a day or so.

The magnet field of the pieces aren't the most powerful and that's what I really need to make this work but I'll do what I can..If it doesn't work it doesn't work.. Worst case scenario, you get a good chuckle from it. :>

I've never built one but I've had this design since I was young so why not try it out... I have seen one working model before but there's more to it than just sticking magnets to a merry-go-round and expecting it to work.

This particular design works on a pendulum..It may not work because each magnet is placed at a particular position which in turn would eventually allow the shaft of the pendulum to come to rest..It'll be fun to tinker regardless..

The design I saw went on to do this...Opposing magnets repel once, yes, initially set in motion and magnets are put in place. In this case it was immediately repelled. The design I saw rotated the magnets and somehow shielded the attracting forces..now they say that's not possible..Well actually that depends on who you talk to. Maybe my science teacher was pulling a prank on us..If he was he never let us know. He's also the one who built the AC powered "closed" loop electric systems that I saw as well. Reworked generator along with leverage and pulleys in place to extract the tiniest amount of power..Enough to run a light-bulb..

If I hadn't seen it for myself..I might not have believed it either.

< Message edited by Icarys -- 2/28/2011 2:17:52 PM >


_____________________________

submission - the feeling of patient, submissive humbleness - the state of being submissive or compliant; meekness.

Alaska Bound-The Official Countdown Has Started!
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http://alturl.com/mog7m

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