RE: No College Degree Necessary?

RE: No College Degree Necessary? (Full Version)

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion

Message

defiantbadgirl -> RE: No College Degree Necessary? (3/9/2011 9:49:03 AM)
I'd love to get a job that pays a decent wage without a degree. Everything I've heard about student loans scares the crap out of me, yet I will be signing up for them next month. I have a curved spine. I've been unable to find any careers that don't require being on my feet all day that pay decent wages. There are jobs available for people who don't have degrees as long as they have no physical disabilities. But college seems to be necessary for someone with a bad back.

jack8007 -> RE: No College Degree Necessary? (3/9/2011 11:40:23 AM)
quote: does someone need a master's degree to sit in a govt. office doing paperwork? Ever had a supervisory civil servant tell you he wasn't going to tell you why he turned you down? Ever hear of due process of law? Apart from principle, it also has a lot to do with getting a fair result efficiently. I believe that every office and every civil service manager should have a thorough grounding in administrative due process, whether thru continuing education or in something like an AA in public administration. If you don't know the rules, you can't follow them very well.

DomYngBlk -> RE: No College Degree Necessary? (3/9/2011 12:58:44 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: popeye1250 quote: ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk quote: ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy It highlights Krugmans propensity toward stretching the bounds of logic to make some socialist point. He seems to agree that there is a "hole" in employment, with high wage jobs and low wage jobs expanding, and a gap that no longer needs to be filled by highly educated workers. [Ignoring the fact that its the educated who will be looked at to fill the high wage jobs that do open up, but thats not the biggest problem with his nonsense]. He then argues that we need to restore bargaining power so "superstars and the ordinary can both have good wages"....after already agreeing that good wage jobs dont exist! And on top of it he wants to guarantee benefits. What the fuck does he think benefits are? They are compensation, you moron. If there are no good wage jobs there is also no room to increase compensation in the form of benefits. How an idiot like him survives at Princeton I dont know. He must have pictures of somebody in the locker room of the Baker rink getting sucked off by a Zamboni. Yeah, that whole nobel prize thing in economics....any dumbass can get that........fuck wilbur get your head out of your ass lol.... True, Obama got his right after he became president, for what I don't know. DYB, would you like a Nobel Peace Prize for,.....whatever? We can form a committee in here and nominate you! The "real" money isn't in "having" a college degree it's in "selling" college degrees. And the "tax-free" status that colleges have should have been revoked long ago. They're all "for profit" now, some of them just don't pay taxes. There's nothing "wrong" with having a degree. There's a lot wrong when so many people have degrees. It's called "the law of supply and demand" which so many people think they can simply ignore. Also, the U.S. is headed in the wrong direction with this "global economy" crap! Anyone who touts it stands to make a lot of money from it while it makes most people poor! But,.....you can buy cheap imported plastic junk at Walmart's right? Whenever anyone in govt. or business says they're "doing it for the consumer" the hoi poloi are already going to be in the bent over grab your ankles position! Anyone who says "it's for the consumer" is NOT your friend! Look at NAFTA, it's been a disaster for the last 16 years and right from the start! How many white collar jobs did that kill? "Publish or die." "Manufacture or die." There is your problem pops. you put more stock into what an ex drug addict disc jockey has to say than someone that has a Phd in Economics along with a nice Nobel Prize in thes same subject..just keep on listening to limbaugh, beck and savage..they are going to save you!

hlen5 -> RE: No College Degree Necessary? (3/9/2011 1:15:57 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy quote: ORIGINAL: rulemylife quote: ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy quote: ORIGINAL: rulemylife So if we want a society of broadly shared prosperity, education isn’t the answer — we’ll have to go about building that society directly. ....... ........... You just said they were the main points, not that you agreed or disagreed with them. We've agreed twice today and you actually displayed a sense of humor once. New meds? You two can be such a hoot sometimes!

rulemylife -> RE: No College Degree Necessary? (3/9/2011 1:34:24 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy You just said they were the main points, not that you agreed or disagreed with them. We've agreed twice today and you actually displayed a sense of humor once. New meds? No, I just switched to light beer.

jack8007 -> RE: No College Degree Necessary? (3/9/2011 1:40:29 PM)
quote: Look at NAFTA, it's been a disaster for the last 16 years and right from the start! How do you figure on insulating yourself from international competition? The Soviets tried, and look where it got them. We're a commercial nation, and should be pro-commerce. International competition or not, there will always be changes in resources or technological progress that will disrupt the status quo and leave people bitching. And of course we all benefit from cheaper goods from overseas, but people are never grateful for good stuff, they just bitch about bad stuff. The big winners in globalization have been the multinational corporations because they have benefited from easier transfers among economies, and this in turn has fed concentration of wealth. But of course the Republicans, and other assholes in other countries, can never get enough. They don't understand that what goes around comes around; all they know is they want more, and they can always blame the Mexicans, and sell people on the idea that guns will protect them from Mexicans, when what they need is protection from thieves on Wall Street. I'm seriously impressed by Arabs taking it to the streets. And I will be vastly more impressed if they keep their ayatollahs under control.

popeye1250 -> RE: No College Degree Necessary? (3/9/2011 6:32:24 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk quote: ORIGINAL: popeye1250 quote: ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk quote: ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy It highlights Krugmans propensity toward stretching the bounds of logic to make some socialist point. He seems to agree that there is a "hole" in employment, with high wage jobs and low wage jobs expanding, and a gap that no longer needs to be filled by highly educated workers. [Ignoring the fact that its the educated who will be looked at to fill the high wage jobs that do open up, but thats not the biggest problem with his nonsense]. He then argues that we need to restore bargaining power so "superstars and the ordinary can both have good wages"....after already agreeing that good wage jobs dont exist! And on top of it he wants to guarantee benefits. What the fuck does he think benefits are? They are compensation, you moron. If there are no good wage jobs there is also no room to increase compensation in the form of benefits. How an idiot like him survives at Princeton I dont know. He must have pictures of somebody in the locker room of the Baker rink getting sucked off by a Zamboni. Yeah, that whole nobel prize thing in economics....any dumbass can get that........fuck wilbur get your head out of your ass lol.... True, Obama got his right after he became president, for what I don't know. DYB, would you like a Nobel Peace Prize for,.....whatever? We can form a committee in here and nominate you! The "real" money isn't in "having" a college degree it's in "selling" college degrees. And the "tax-free" status that colleges have should have been revoked long ago. They're all "for profit" now, some of them just don't pay taxes. There's nothing "wrong" with having a degree. There's a lot wrong when so many people have degrees. It's called "the law of supply and demand" which so many people think they can simply ignore. Also, the U.S. is headed in the wrong direction with this "global economy" crap! Anyone who touts it stands to make a lot of money from it while it makes most people poor! But,.....you can buy cheap imported plastic junk at Walmart's right? Whenever anyone in govt. or business says they're "doing it for the consumer" the hoi poloi are already going to be in the bent over grab your ankles position! Anyone who says "it's for the consumer" is NOT your friend! Look at NAFTA, it's been a disaster for the last 16 years and right from the start! How many white collar jobs did that kill? "Publish or die." "Manufacture or die." There is your problem pops. you put more stock into what an ex drug addict disc jockey has to say than someone that has a Phd in Economics along with a nice Nobel Prize in thes same subject..just keep on listening to limbaugh, beck and savage..they are going to save you! DYB, the best case to be made for not needing a degree is "the boss's son, or daughter." Yet, they seem to do alright don't they? Some of them do but most of them don't. Then there's Bill Gates and probably a thousand other people just like him. Ok, that's the second best. You don't need a degree to be President of the United States.

Termyn8or -> RE: No College Degree Necessary? (3/9/2011 10:25:54 PM)
"We're a commercial nation, and should be pro-commerce. " Then we have to accept the fact that labor has been overpaid for decades. China is very pro commerce, for good reason. There is money to be made. They have a billion people, and the ones who live in caves would like to be able to afford one of them fancy grass huts, or matbe they can get an adobe shack, like down in the southwest here. Over here now we had people of suburbia, I guess they were living high off the hog. I'm not being sarcastic, it may be true. But if we were overpaid, that fueled the internal economy, back when you could actually "buy American". People from Europe tell me how different it is. I don't know if they were overpaid in the old country, but the fact is they're here. Now they have to mow the lawn. Over there, people don't generally have the normal US house. These things are viewed as spacious, and I mean houses that I would call a shoebox. Their wages, and the pursuit of the American dream - to own a house, fueled the construction industry, and therefore all the dependent industries. Now we find that even buying a home is not necessarily buying American. (chinese drywall i.e.) There is no vehicle made in this country totally to my knowledge. These are the mass market items, and we lost our own market. How much cheaper does labor have to be to make it economical to ship all the raw materials across the ocean and then the finished product back ? How overpaid were we ? It was already going down the drain I think, with the decline only forestalled by engineering and high tech. But now computers design things. Also, others have caught on, or caught up, whichever you prefer. We lost our edge, and in a global market we might just be forced back into grass huts, adobe shacks or even caves. Is this our destiny ? T^T

jack8007 -> RE: No College Degree Necessary? (3/9/2011 10:47:39 PM)
quote: we have to accept the fact that labor has been overpaid for decades. how do you figure that? Do you see labor and commerce as being a zero-sum issue?

jack8007 -> RE: No College Degree Necessary? (3/9/2011 10:58:26 PM)
quote: Is this our destiny ? I don't think the international community is ever going to stand still, but I think that there's going to be lots of shaking out, and lots of people left behind. What surprises me is how willing many people are to just bend over. Go to a church or school in a moderate size town, and put GW Bush and Obama on a podium together. Now I will grant Obama has a knack for chatting people up that Bush could only wish he had, but when you put them on the stage, who the hell wants to listen to somebody who talks like a con law prof? Anybody like Obama becomes the instant lightning rod for people's resentments of people who know shit they don't. Let's face it, Obama would not be lost in a courtroom, while most people are dumbfounded. But GW, he's like the big idiot that couldn't hurt anybody. When he says, "bring it on, hyuk, hyuk", the crowds roar. But tell me, who is really hurting these people? Bush's buddies the Kochs? Or Obama? Is it the Wall Street ripoffs of the wars and the housing bubbles that are fucking people? Or is it somebody trying to work them a deal for medical care? Yeah, that's a rhetorical question. People just know what they like, and if they say hey, we should let Goldman Sachs rig the market because it makes us feels good, well. maybe they have it coming.

Brain -> RE: No College Degree Necessary? (3/9/2011 11:43:00 PM)
We need to restore bargaining power so people in low-paying jobs have leverage to obtain better wages and benefits. That's very simple to understand for most people. Sometimes I don't understand your convoluted reasoning. quote: ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy It highlights Krugmans propensity toward stretching the bounds of logic to make some socialist point. He seems to agree that there is a "hole" in employment, with high wage jobs and low wage jobs expanding, and a gap that no longer needs to be filled by highly educated workers. [Ignoring the fact that its the educated who will be looked at to fill the high wage jobs that do open up, but thats not the biggest problem with his nonsense]. He then argues that we need to restore bargaining power so "superstars and the ordinary can both have good wages"....after already agreeing that good wage jobs dont exist! And on top of it he wants to guarantee benefits. What the fuck does he think benefits are? They are compensation, you moron. If there are no good wage jobs there is also no room to increase compensation in the form of benefits. How an idiot like him survives at Princeton I dont know. He must have pictures of somebody in the locker room of the Baker rink getting sucked off by a Zamboni.

willbeurdaddy -> RE: No College Degree Necessary? (3/10/2011 12:13:06 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Brain We need to restore bargaining power so people in low-paying jobs have leverage to obtain better wages and benefits. That's very simple to understand for most people. Sometimes I don't understand your convoluted reasoning. quote: ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy It highlights Krugmans propensity toward stretching the bounds of logic to make some socialist point. He seems to agree that there is a "hole" in employment, with high wage jobs and low wage jobs expanding, and a gap that no longer needs to be filled by highly educated workers. [Ignoring the fact that its the educated who will be looked at to fill the high wage jobs that do open up, but thats not the biggest problem with his nonsense]. He then argues that we need to restore bargaining power so "superstars and the ordinary can both have good wages"....after already agreeing that good wage jobs dont exist! And on top of it he wants to guarantee benefits. What the fuck does he think benefits are? They are compensation, you moron. If there are no good wage jobs there is also no room to increase compensation in the form of benefits. How an idiot like him survives at Princeton I dont know. He must have pictures of somebody in the locker room of the Baker rink getting sucked off by a Zamboni. Its Krugmans reasoning that is convoluted, and yours because as always you cant think for yourself and have to parrot what others say. He specifically accepts the premise that there are no good paying jobs...its high paid or low paid...not that there are good paying jobs if you could just bargain for them. THERE IS NOTHING TO BARGAIN FOR in his view, and then he turns around and says bargain for them.

popeye1250 -> RE: No College Degree Necessary? (3/10/2011 12:40:43 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Termyn8or "We're a commercial nation, and should be pro-commerce. " Then we have to accept the fact that labor has been overpaid for decades. China is very pro commerce, for good reason. There is money to be made. They have a billion people, and the ones who live in caves would like to be able to afford one of them fancy grass huts, or matbe they can get an adobe shack, like down in the southwest here. Over here now we had people of suburbia, I guess they were living high off the hog. I'm not being sarcastic, it may be true. But if we were overpaid, that fueled the internal economy, back when you could actually "buy American". People from Europe tell me how different it is. I don't know if they were overpaid in the old country, but the fact is they're here. Now they have to mow the lawn. Over there, people don't generally have the normal US house. These things are viewed as spacious, and I mean houses that I would call a shoebox. Their wages, and the pursuit of the American dream - to own a house, fueled the construction industry, and therefore all the dependent industries. Now we find that even buying a home is not necessarily buying American. (chinese drywall i.e.) There is no vehicle made in this country totally to my knowledge. These are the mass market items, and we lost our own market. How much cheaper does labor have to be to make it economical to ship all the raw materials across the ocean and then the finished product back ? How overpaid were we ? It was already going down the drain I think, with the decline only forestalled by engineering and high tech. But now computers design things. Also, others have caught on, or caught up, whichever you prefer. We lost our edge, and in a global market we might just be forced back into grass huts, adobe shacks or even caves. Is this our destiny ? T^T Term, correct. And they just keep telling us how great this "global-economy" is! It's nice to have cheap consumer goods but not when you're at subsistance level wages of $15 an hour now when ten years ago you were making $30 an hour in manufacturing that's moved to China now. Now the M.D.'s seem to think they're worth $300-$500k per year or more because they went to medical school. My doctor at the V.A. is from India and I was asking her about that country and it's medical schools and doctors over there and she said the schools over there graduate "many many more doctors than in the U.S." I think there's only 770,000 (?) active "physicians" in the U.S. Now the law of supply and demand being what it is why don't we import enough M.D.s from India to double the number we have now and get the salaries lowered so that people can afford to pay for a doctor's visit? We could do it with Dentists, Accountants, Lawyers wouldn't be neccessary as there's so many of them they're falling out of trees now, and any other high-paying profession. I don't think any of those groups should be sheltered from this global economy. With a country like India at close to a billion people they must be graduating M.D.s by the hundreds of thousands! And then there's China! And Maylaisia. It's a simple distribution problem. People who make $15 an hour can't afford doctors, lawyers, accountants, dentists. There's an old black guy a couple miles away from here who pulls teeth for $25 and from what I was told does pretty well for himself. Many people simply can't afford $150-$ 250 for an extraction by a dentist and instead go down to "George's." Now there's an entrepreneur who saw his opportunities in this global economy and took em!" Everytime I hear the terms, "global-economy" or "free-trade" I automatically think of that movie "Mad Max!" lolol It just pops right into my head! It's very obvious that our govt isn't doing what The People want but what big business wants! We used to call that "corruption." "Graft." When this thing comes crashing down and all it takes is one spark, buy stock in guillotine makers. You know, anytime the govt or big business tries to tell us that something is "good" for us why do I think I'm listening to a used car salesman? And why are we in a global economy if noone out here seems to want it? Like you said a few weeks ago, "Do you know one person who is in favor of NAFTA? Me neither." And you're right about that!

Termyn8or -> RE: No College Degree Necessary? (3/10/2011 1:03:41 AM)
"It's nice to have cheap consumer goods but not when you're at subsistance level wages of $15 an hour now when ten years ago you were making $30 an hour in manufacturing that's moved to China now. " Clinton feels our pain LOL. But there is one part of the equation alot of people miss. It really is a law of business no matter how hard it may be to swallow. If someone else can do the exact same job for less pay, like it or not you are overpaid. That means the same quality as well. Used to be a difference way back when .................... So you have autoworkers making $30 an hour. Even then, other were probably making half that. Now this is different than the early days at Ford. People died working there. My Uncle told me about the foundry at Ford, he had worked there. This is the 1960s, imagine many years ago with less than the best ventilation, before mandatory air circulation and all that came into play. Less automation and alot more muscle. That's the way it was and some simply couldn't handle it. Those who could did very well being paid an unprecedented wage. But it was worth it. The work in the physical sense is not as hard now. Working in that industry is a full time job, and I mean that in the uber sense. But abuses did occur. Labor is the highest portion of the cost. It has the most direct effect on the bottom line. We want competition, or don't we ? One of a few things could save us. Companies have to save money. We are not isolated. Either we get the good pay out there and attract the talent, or we sink to the bottom. Conversely, collective agreements could be found that would lower the cost of very attractive benefit packages, which would also attract talent. By attracting the right talent I mean people who can do the job, want to get the job and want to keep the job. Oh, and intend to do that on their own merit. Of course for this to work you would need competent management. I have no fucking idea what to do about that. Maybe I just hit on something here. Rather than outsource the labor, outsource management ! I'll have to give that some thought. T^T

willbeurdaddy -> RE: No College Degree Necessary? (3/10/2011 1:12:07 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Termyn8or Used to be a difference way back when .................... The only difference way back when was NOT that workers were overpaid.

popeye1250 -> RE: No College Degree Necessary? (3/10/2011 1:17:21 AM)
Term, my sentiments exactly! If we can import 2 million M.D.s into the U.S. from India then the M.D.s here have no right to bitch and complain when they're "only" making $100k because there's so many more doctors! "Supply and Demand!" And there's no problem with quality, my doctor at the V.A. is top notch! People, no matter what their station or profession shouldn't be imune from the global economy. The middle class certainly isn't anymore! They thought they would be didn't they? Well we can see how that's working out for them. Dr. Michael Savage has a good book about this, "Trickle Up Poverty." "Think your imune from this global economy? Think again!" If we keep heading in this direction we'll all be making $6 bucks an hour. Everyone.

jack8007 -> RE: No College Degree Necessary? (3/10/2011 6:25:19 AM)
quote: If we can import 2 million M.D.s into the U.S. from India But you won't, will you?

DomYngBlk -> RE: No College Degree Necessary? (3/10/2011 7:20:23 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: popeye1250 quote: ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk quote: ORIGINAL: popeye1250 quote: ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk quote: ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy It highlights Krugmans propensity toward stretching the bounds of logic to make some socialist point. He seems to agree that there is a "hole" in employment, with high wage jobs and low wage jobs expanding, and a gap that no longer needs to be filled by highly educated workers. [Ignoring the fact that its the educated who will be looked at to fill the high wage jobs that do open up, but thats not the biggest problem with his nonsense]. He then argues that we need to restore bargaining power so "superstars and the ordinary can both have good wages"....after already agreeing that good wage jobs dont exist! And on top of it he wants to guarantee benefits. What the fuck does he think benefits are? They are compensation, you moron. If there are no good wage jobs there is also no room to increase compensation in the form of benefits. How an idiot like him survives at Princeton I dont know. He must have pictures of somebody in the locker room of the Baker rink getting sucked off by a Zamboni. Yeah, that whole nobel prize thing in economics....any dumbass can get that........fuck wilbur get your head out of your ass lol.... True, Obama got his right after he became president, for what I don't know. DYB, would you like a Nobel Peace Prize for,.....whatever? We can form a committee in here and nominate you! The "real" money isn't in "having" a college degree it's in "selling" college degrees. And the "tax-free" status that colleges have should have been revoked long ago. They're all "for profit" now, some of them just don't pay taxes. There's nothing "wrong" with having a degree. There's a lot wrong when so many people have degrees. It's called "the law of supply and demand" which so many people think they can simply ignore. Also, the U.S. is headed in the wrong direction with this "global economy" crap! Anyone who touts it stands to make a lot of money from it while it makes most people poor! But,.....you can buy cheap imported plastic junk at Walmart's right? Whenever anyone in govt. or business says they're "doing it for the consumer" the hoi poloi are already going to be in the bent over grab your ankles position! Anyone who says "it's for the consumer" is NOT your friend! Look at NAFTA, it's been a disaster for the last 16 years and right from the start! How many white collar jobs did that kill? "Publish or die." "Manufacture or die." There is your problem pops. you put more stock into what an ex drug addict disc jockey has to say than someone that has a Phd in Economics along with a nice Nobel Prize in thes same subject..just keep on listening to limbaugh, beck and savage..they are going to save you! DYB, the best case to be made for not needing a degree is "the boss's son, or daughter." Yet, they seem to do alright don't they? Some of them do but most of them don't. Then there's Bill Gates and probably a thousand other people just like him. Ok, that's the second best. You don't need a degree to be President of the United States. Not exactly sure where you are going with that...but if you think Bill Gates is some kind of self made man think again pops....Comes from a rich family.

Termyn8or -> RE: No College Degree Necessary? (3/10/2011 10:41:20 AM)
"Comes from a rich family. " Gates only did two things, stole programs and repackaged them, and figured out how to get paid for it. T^T

MrRodgers -> RE: No College Degree Necessary? (3/10/2011 10:51:35 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy It highlights Krugmans propensity toward stretching the bounds of logic to make some socialist point. He seems to agree that there is a "hole" in employment, with high wage jobs and low wage jobs expanding, and a gap that no longer needs to be filled by highly educated workers. [Ignoring the fact that its the educated who will be looked at to fill the high wage jobs that do open up, but thats not the biggest problem with his nonsense]. He then argues that we need to restore bargaining power so "superstars and the ordinary can both have good wages"....after already agreeing that good wage jobs dont exist! And on top of it he wants to guarantee benefits. What the fuck does he think benefits are? They are compensation, you moron. If there are no good wage jobs there is also no room to increase compensation in the form of benefits. How an idiot like him survives at Princeton I dont know. He must have pictures of somebody in the locker room of the Baker rink getting sucked off by a Zamboni. Apparently their is a lot...you don't know. Translation: Everybody already knows that the capitalist wants their slaves back, can't get them, so they always search for the next best form of oppressed labor unless they are forced by govt. not to as it always requires war or revolution...not to be a slave. If you don't like it then you can go ahead and go to jail or...just die.

Page: << < prev 1 [2] 3 4 next > >>

Collarchat.com © 2025

Terms of Service

0.046875