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RE: Great Guy, But Vanilla - 5/2/2011 8:28:31 PM   
Whiplashsmile4


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quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveAsObject
quote:

ORIGINAL: RedMagic1
You need to deal with the real problem. His unwillingness to tell you how to dress isn't it.

LMAO! Dress? Huh? Micromanaging is not the issue.

And yes, as I posted, there must be another underlying issue.


This might be a worth wild expedition to take inside of yourself. I myself know exactly what I do or don't get out of BDSM itself including D/s. There are other things outside of kink and D/s that matter to me in a partner.

I will express this much, if I found an amazing Vanilla girl and it truly was amazing, they would indulge my kinky side and know how to deal with my Dominant sides of my personality without having a mental melt down over it.

Have you ever thought that you might give him a good reason to explore this madness? That you could provide the safety and reassurance that his soul ain't going to implode...nor that he's going to explode via spontaneousness combustion and go straight to hell?

Don't sell opportunity short with a crap load of excuses.

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RE: Great Guy, But Vanilla - 5/2/2011 10:23:54 PM   
Awareness


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quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveAsObject I found myself in love with an amazing, vanilla guy. A very rare and perfect match,
  Oh really.  What exactly made him a perfect match?

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RE: Great Guy, But Vanilla - 5/2/2011 11:18:38 PM   
juliaoceania


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Whiplashsmile4

Sweety.... If I by chance found and fell in Love with the Perfect Vanilla girl, and found it amazing. To the point there was no personality conflicts and such. I'd be tossing in my BDSM membership card at the local branch office.

Do you have any idea, how hard it is to find somebody (vanilla or otherwise) that is a good match? If you don't, you'll find out how easy it to be in the company of cats and how easy it can become spending hours alone.

Rethink and Re-evaulate who you are and what matters the most to you in the long terms verses what you think you might need in the short run.



Amen!


_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

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RE: Great Guy, But Vanilla - 5/2/2011 11:33:04 PM   
juliaoceania


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quote:

I don't think I'd get to a point of truly loving someone who wasn't dominant by nature, so it's almost impossible for me to answer that question. It's purely hypothetical and I don't know the answer to it.  But I believe yes, I would reevaluate my needs, as that's a practice I normally do today.


That was what I was trying to get at... if I were in the situation as the OP I would reevaluate things....

I suppose I am in an evaluation period. I can very well imagine myself in a vanilla relationship. I can imagine being treated as an equal in all things and having an equal voice. This is new to me.... I am thankful that I am readily able to see that about myself. Perhaps I have been posting here too long, but I have seen many people over the years that seemed to find it threatening that they may come to a place where they feel the need to reevaluate.... this board hasn't always been friendly to people who were in the process of redefining their needs....



_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

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RE: Great Guy, But Vanilla - 5/3/2011 6:20:28 AM   
NuevaVida


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I can completely understand being in an evaluation period. For the longest time I had stuffed myself into a box I didn't fit in, because I thought that was where I needed to be. After that I went through quite an intense evaluation period, so I could figure out who I am and what makes me tick. Since then, I am always weighing life situations against who I know myself to be, and keeping myself in check, to be sure if I'm on the right path or not.  Because of that, I'm honed in pretty good as to what works for me and what doesn't.

I agree that people don't seem to support when others re-evaluate.  By the same token, people don't seem to like when you've figured out and are comfortable with who you are, either.  I went to a discussion group dinner recently and I dared to say I'm really comfortable in my own skin and know I'm exactly where I need to be.  That suddenly became an invitation for everyone to challenge me, because I can't possibly know and like myself, can I?   It was very enlightening.

Re-evaluating is great, and I'm supportive of anyone who does that.  I learned a lot about myself in the process, and now it's somewhat of a continual process.  As far as relationships go, while I don't believe I'd be fulfilled in a "vanilla" relationship, I realized I am happiest submitting to someone who is a lot more lax and laid back about things.

May we all find our bliss.


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RE: Great Guy, But Vanilla - 5/3/2011 6:37:06 AM   
DesFIP


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quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania
My question was, if you fell in love with someone, truly loved them, and they did not identify as dominant, would that cause you to reevaluate your needs?


This line caused a response in me. I wouldn't need for him to identify as dominant, as long as I responded to it in him. If he didn't like to think of himself as dominant, having bad associations with the word, that wouldn't bother me. As long as he did take the lead in the relationship.

I'd miss some play of course, but at my age play is necessarily lighter than it used to be due to thinning of skin, less elasticity, longer recovery times and so on. But it wouldn't matter to me if he called himself dominant or just a traditional man as long as he naturally took the lead. And as long as he didn't think less of me for allowing him to take the lead, which is the problem I have found with men who do not use the label dominant.


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RE: Great Guy, But Vanilla - 5/3/2011 7:00:33 AM   
Asherscorp1


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In a way I can relate to your problem. I spent years trying to put vanilla men into a D/s relationship and it never, ever worked out. If it's something you NEED from a relationship then this guy is not for you. You can love him till the cows come home but if he cannot give you the one thing you need to be really fulfilled it simply won't work. That's like saying, I love this gay man and he loves me but we can't ever have sex. Yes, it's only one aspect of the relationship but intrinsically you can't fulfill each other and I doubt anyone would say you are wrong to not settle for a relationship like that. If you feel so compelled by the things you do love about this person that you want to date him, try it. Feel it out, work your way through your initial impression and see where it takes you. Nothing is lost if you casually date for awhile and it may either change what you think you know about him or yourself or confirm that you need something else and motivate you to find it.

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RE: Great Guy, But Vanilla - 5/3/2011 7:11:30 AM   
NuevaVida


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Des you make a great point. I dont much care what label he puts on himself, it is his state of being that I find important. I need him to have a need to lead the relationship.

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RE: Great Guy, But Vanilla - 5/3/2011 7:57:27 AM   
LafayetteLady


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Whiplashsmile4

Sweety.... If I by chance found and fell in Love with the Perfect Vanilla girl, and found it amazing. To the point there was no personality conflicts and such. I'd be tossing in my BDSM membership card at the local branch office.

Do you have any idea, how hard it is to find somebody (vanilla or otherwise) that is a good match? If you don't, you'll find out how easy it to be in the company of cats and how easy it can become spending hours alone.

Rethink and Re-evaulate who you are and what matters the most to you in the long terms verses what you think you might need in the short run.



This and what Juliaoceana said. You are 45 years old. Ok. You still didn't mention how long you and this man have been involved. As others have said, you have to be spending significant time with him to "fall in love."

While JO using the term "brainwashed" seems offensive to some, and maybe isn't the best word, her point is dead on. Many of us get so caught up in our "ideal mate," that when someone comes along who doesn't fit that, we pass them by. It is rare to find true love, and even more rare to find someone who is "perfect" in every way.

Honestly, if identifying as "slave" was most important to you, you wouldn't have "fallen in love" with anyone who wasn't master to your slave. Think of it this way, if you are heterosexual, you aren't going to "fall in love" and have an intimate relationship with someone of your own gender. Why? Because you aren't likely going to put yourself in that situation.

Many people who say, "I've fallen in love with this person, but I don't think the relationship can work because they lack 'X,' are trying to find a way to sabatage the relationship. By that I mean, the problem is not with the person they are "in love with" but with themselves. For whatever reason, they are not ready for a relationship and will find something wrong with anyone they get involved with.

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RE: Great Guy, But Vanilla - 5/3/2011 8:51:51 AM   
slaveAsObject


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LafayetteLady
Many people who say, "I've fallen in love with this person, but I don't think the relationship can work because they lack 'X,' are trying to find a way to sabatage the relationship. By that I mean, the problem is not with the person they are "in love with" but with themselves. For whatever reason, they are not ready for a relationship and will find something wrong with anyone they get involved with.


Thank you, and this is what I mentioned last night. That after making the original post, there must be more to this than meets the eye.

I deliberately left out details because I just wanted to blurt out what I did in the OP. Just venting and thinking out loud, well, as far as 'out loud' can get in writing.

I do thank you and the others for your thoughts.

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RE: Great Guy, But Vanilla - 5/3/2011 1:29:36 PM   
agirl


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quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveAsObject


quote:

ORIGINAL: LafayetteLady
Many people who say, "I've fallen in love with this person, but I don't think the relationship can work because they lack 'X,' are trying to find a way to sabatage the relationship. By that I mean, the problem is not with the person they are "in love with" but with themselves. For whatever reason, they are not ready for a relationship and will find something wrong with anyone they get involved with.


Thank you, and this is what I mentioned last night. That after making the original post, there must be more to this than meets the eye.

I deliberately left out details because I just wanted to blurt out what I did in the OP. Just venting and thinking out loud, well, as far as 'out loud' can get in writing.

I do thank you and the others for your thoughts.


I loved my last partner and he was as far removed from dominant as was possible.  He was, and still is, a good and charismatic person and I still enjoy being with him.

I don't see myself as anything other than a person, and whether or not I find myself *loving*, (whatever that means) doesn't mean I think I'm in something that'll last.

I'll never be *ready* for a relationship, M/s or otherwise...........I've never prepared myself for one........My time and energy is spent rather like my children's........... exploring whatever I like and love, taking care of the things I have to, and trundling along with whatever comes along. I'm always ready to explore a person, though.

I've never been *in love* with M, though I do *love* him. Not so long ago I couldn't have asserted that, even though we've been together for years.

I can't say for sure what things I could or could not live without, so I don't. I'm clearly capable of living in various types of relationships, so I wouldn't assert that *being owned* was the be all and end all for me. It just happens to be the most suitable to date .......with M.

agirl

 











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RE: Great Guy, But Vanilla - 5/3/2011 2:32:24 PM   
leadership527


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeffff
You should go for it. If you don't you will wonder forever. If it ends up in flames, at least you gave it a shot.

I agree.... so long as she's up front with the guy that he isn't what she's looking for. Personally, if she said that to me I'd be saying "Goodbye".

I'm one of those "dominant personalities that didn't identify as dom" so I'm rooting for the guy... but not under false pretenses. He needs to know he's currently ranked as "inadequate" and playing a catchup game. For me, that message would be the end of the relationship.

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

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RE: Great Guy, But Vanilla - 5/3/2011 3:38:50 PM   
sheisreeds


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However, if the shoe doesn't fit, it doesn't fit.

Speaking of re-evaluation, sometimes that goes in the opposite direction. I was married, had comes to terms w/ kinky as being a late teens phase. My ex-husband I started off even as very playful, though his heart wasn't really in it. Then I got depressed, started to really dislike my life, and wake up in the middle the night in cold sweats from dreams of having nails in my back to the point of drawing blood.

In some respects we are what we are, and we love what complements who we are.

Not saying that a lack of kink ended my marriage, but it was definitely a big fat nail in the coffin. There is just some amazing emotional fulfillment I get when someone I love can do mean things to me out of love. I love my current partner of two years more than I ever loved my ex. I feel so much more openly affectionate, I feel understood, and I absolutely adore him and our relationship.

Looking back on my marriage, when we got together I made a lot of compromises. I thought if I loved someone and wanted to commit it was worth it. In the end those choices caused me to love myself less, and as a direct result be able to feel less love for my partner.

What raises a red flag for me in the OPs description of the relationship is her partner's complete lack of interest in BDSM. It's important to her, and ignoring it is ignoring a huge part of who she is whether or not she's actively engaged in it. A relationship to me, is not on solid ground if partners don't accept and get to know all parts of one another.

_____________________________

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Oh my darling, give me reason
give me something to believe in



You need a spankin' baby!

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RE: Great Guy, But Vanilla - 5/3/2011 4:08:27 PM   
LafayetteLady


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quote:

ORIGINAL: sheisreeds

What raises a red flag for me in the OPs description of the relationship is her partner's complete lack of interest in BDSM. It's important to her, and ignoring it is ignoring a huge part of who she is whether or not she's actively engaged in it. A relationship to me, is not on solid ground if partners don't accept and get to know all parts of one another.


The OP is not a young girl, she is in her 40s. Also, unlike what you described for yourself, she doesn't indicate that her kink desires are a "new" discovery about herself. If that were the case, I would have a different opinion, but given what the OP has described, she got into a relationship with this man already being aware of her desires. To me, it seems as though one of two things are most likely; she was desperate to be in a relationship, but he really isn't what she wants and now is faced with making a choice between him and the kink, or she suffers commitment issues and is looking for reasons that the relationship can't work.

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RE: Great Guy, But Vanilla - 5/3/2011 4:31:16 PM   
lovelyesme


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i was in the relationship i am in now for 8 years when i first came to terms with my kinky desires.  Leaving didn't seem like a fair thing-i loved him.  He was the sweetest guy on earth-for one thing he wanted to minimize the fact he was 6'8" and i sure couldn't see him as MASTER. I gave him some stuff to read.  He said "let's go down to the basement and fuck like bunnies" and later: "do you have any more of this stuff to read?"  A week later he took me out to dinner and spoke very firmly-while politely- to the hostess-she deserved it-and it was my turn to ask for the basement.  Its been ten years- we've both evolved SLOWLY.  Each of us had years of acculturation to peel off to become comfortable with this aspect of ourselves.  Sometimes, I'm ahead of him. Sometimes, he's ahead of me.  I love him.  i love to serve Him.  Time-it's a beautiful thing. The bdsm has been our cement.  We feel incredibly lucky.  We had to rebuild the stairs to the basement.  That's my story, don't know if it can help you.
esme

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RE: Great Guy, But Vanilla - 5/3/2011 4:52:09 PM   
sheisreeds


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The comment you quoted has nothing to do with being young, and also kink was not new to me at that time, my entire sexual life (16-22) up until meeting my now ex-husband did not qualify as new.

The red flag I mentioned is still a red flag for me today.

If my 40 year old friend who was really into poetry met a guy, and he was perfect except for the fact that he didn't like poetry, ignored her work, didn't support her efforts, didn't attend her readings, and didn't want to hear any of it, I'd have the same comment.

I don't care what it is, parts of us deserve respect, the woman he loves identifies/identified as a slave, it is a part of who she is.

My ex didn't like poetry, interrupted me while I was reading all the time, thought the whole thing was silly.

My current partner isn't a fan, but loves to read what I write because it is mine.

Big difference.

_____________________________

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Oh my darling, give me reason
give me something to believe in



You need a spankin' baby!

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RE: Great Guy, But Vanilla - 5/3/2011 4:58:56 PM   
juliaoceania


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quote:

ORIGINAL: sheisreeds

The comment you quoted has nothing to do with being young, and also kink was not new to me at that time, my entire sexual life (16-22) up until meeting my now ex-husband did not qualify as new.

The red flag I mentioned is still a red flag for me today.

If my 40 year old friend who was really into poetry met a guy, and he was perfect except for the fact that he didn't like poetry, ignored her work, didn't support her efforts, didn't attend her readings, and didn't want to hear any of it, I'd have the same comment.

I don't care what it is, parts of us deserve respect, the woman he loves identifies/identified as a slave, it is a part of who she is.

My ex didn't like poetry, interrupted me while I was reading all the time, thought the whole thing was silly.

My current partner isn't a fan, but loves to read what I write because it is mine.

Big difference.



The OP never said the man she has feelings for wasn't interested in her ideas about BDSM. He has discussed this with her. She never said he dismissed her feelings, she just said that was not the way HE identified...

In your poetry analogy, the person takes no interest and will not support his partner's interests.... that does not seem to be the problem here.

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

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RE: Great Guy, But Vanilla - 5/3/2011 5:42:27 PM   
LafayetteLady


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From: Northern New Jersey
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quote:

ORIGINAL: sheisreeds

The comment you quoted has nothing to do with being young, and also kink was not new to me at that time, my entire sexual life (16-22) up until meeting my now ex-husband did not qualify as new.
The red flag I mentioned is still a red flag for me today.

If my 40 year old friend who was really into poetry met a guy, and he was perfect except for the fact that he didn't like poetry, ignored her work, didn't support her efforts, didn't attend her readings, and didn't want to hear any of it, I'd have the same comment.

I don't care what it is, parts of us deserve respect, the woman he loves identifies/identified as a slave, it is a part of who she is.

My ex didn't like poetry, interrupted me while I was reading all the time, thought the whole thing was silly.

My current partner isn't a fan, but loves to read what I write because it is mine.

Big difference.


Like it or not, being young has much to do with it, and it WAS new. The most interesting thing about the age from 16-22 is that you THINK you know everything while biologically and psychologically you are still developing and learning who you are in many ways. That isn't meant as an insult, simply as a fact.

As far as the analogy, that is another mistake of youth. Granted, it sounds like your ex completely lacked respect for you, but many couples have separate interests that they don't share and it doesn't destroy the relationship. In fact, these separate interests can strengthen their love for each other. The difference between what I am saying and what you describe is that the individuals RESPECT each other's interests. If your partner was really into camping and you weren't, that doesn't mean you should go camping and be miserable just because it is what he loves. You should, however, have enough respect for him to allow him to enjoy his hobby while you take that time to enjoy yours (and yes, unless you are getting paid to write poetry, it is a hobby).

Identifying as dom/master/sub/slave is NOT simply an interest for many. Now, obviously, your poetry means a great deal to you. After the disrespectful way your ex responded to your interest, which is very dear to you, when you met someone and were in the "getting to know you" stage, if he showed disinterest, your interest in him would have diminished and you would have discontinued the relationship LONG before it reached a point of being "in love." That's how it works as we mature, which you obviously have, no longer believing that you have to sacrifice who you are or change to be in a relationship.

When YOU are in your 40s' you will look back on this time in your life and go "wow, look how much I've learned about myself and life since then." Of course, for those who are only discovering their BDSM desires in their 40s or after already being in a loving, committed relationship, it is a bit different. Hence my point with the OP. She says nothing to indicate that identifying as slave is something she just discovered, after already being in a relationship with this man and now wondering what to do. The fact that she admits she intentionally left out pertinent information in her original post tells me that she is looking for people to give her reasons to dump him. THAT is the red flag to me.

Think about it this way, if your current partner, who I am assuming you are very much in love with, suddenly lost interest in your poetry, would you dump him? I don't mean he started demeaning you about it as you say your ex did. I mean he simply wasn't as interested as he is now. Is being with someone who wants to read your poetry more important than the love you feel for him?

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RE: Great Guy, But Vanilla - 5/3/2011 9:19:02 PM   
Zinok


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Despite a lot of people here. I understand completely how you feel. I am also in love with a vanilla man. Aside from him not sharing my kinks and being unwilling to hurt me, we match in every other field. So, I can relate to being incredibly companionable with someone despite sexual urges.
My best advice to you is to be completely open and communicative with your interest. Educate him on BDSM and try to explain to him why you feel you need it in life. I know that once I did that with my boyfriend, it was a long path but we finally got to a point where he is alright with me submitting to another woman. (Hence I'm on here searching!)
My point is that with communication and education, you may be able to come to a conclusion where you do not feel stifled by him and where he can be comfortable with you engaging in BDSM with out him.

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Profile   Post #: 59
RE: Great Guy, But Vanilla - 5/3/2011 10:02:41 PM   
IrishMist


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quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveAsObject

I found myself in love with an amazing, vanilla guy. A very rare and perfect match, except he does not have a Dom aspect to his personality, never mind Master! Not even an inkling.

For me, being slave is WHO I am and I have been searching for someone who is Dom and see themselves as Master. Where it is not a fetish but WHO they are, intrinsic to their personality.

hmmm, I can bet what 99.9% of you would think, and I am posting this to read feedback. And who knows, give me the kick in the ass that I need and not settle till I find the perfect Master.

What a pain in the ass! Finding someone rare, is well, rare.

UGH!!!

After reading this, I would have to ask what exactly you see being a slave as, and what you see being a Master as?

A great guy who trips your wires , so to speak. And yet, you are going to pass him by because in your eyes, he does not measure up to what you consider 'being a Master to your slave'?

I say give him a shot. You just may find yourself surprised.

_____________________________

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