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RE: BREAKING: Ron Paul to Announce Presidential Candida... - 5/13/2011 7:11:08 AM   
Real0ne


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Joined: 10/25/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

quote:

so does a loan.


No, it doesn't. Farming is vulnerable to a host of weather and pest problems, several of which can cripple a year's crop.

A futures contract allows the farmer a workable price, guaranteed, giving him a reason to take out that loan and plant.



bullshit

I know shit loads of farmers and they dont even know what futures are.   you must be talking about corporate farms and that may as well be guvmint owned and operated farms


_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 61
RE: BREAKING: Ron Paul to Announce Presidential Candida... - 5/13/2011 7:11:37 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		No, a loan doesn't do that at all. You only need to see the price of housing to see that the vast amount of loans at market does not indicate anything about tomorrows market value.

Arbitrage, and that sort of prudent speculation does.  Today, unfortunately, it also allows for unrestrained robbery.  That needs some paring back.

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 62
RE: BREAKING: Ron Paul to Announce Presidential Candida... - 5/13/2011 7:11:37 AM   
MrRodgers


Posts: 10542
Joined: 7/30/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

Not true, there was no response at all to the second post

Its a mistake for me to  even read your posts, if ever on topic you rarely make sense

quote:

ORIGINAL: flcouple2009

A was pointed out to you several times the article made no mention of what you tried to twist it into.


You just can't resist such absolute nonsense. In your 'second post' 2004-06 those 'liberal' lending scum wrote that shit-paper to package them and sell them to wall street who then got a AAA rating on it, peddled them to unsuspecting investors and foreign greed. Had nothing whatever to do with any leftists (in the minority in both houses) and what they did in congress.

Fannie & Freddie had nothing whatever to do with the crash at wall street. They being typical greedy capitalist scum, saw big $$ and started to borrow to gamble [our] money on MBS's. (mortgage backed securities) It was the gambling casino of peddling crap as AAA paper and their outright fraud of wall street banks who are still getting away with financial murder now, that brought them down.

Repubs, the rightists keep holding up via cloture, resisting regulation of wall street and their selling of shit paper now called derivatives as we type now. Who are you going to blame for the next bailout ? Obama of course and even though he trying to regulate the big banks and what they have done has been watered down by the repub rightists. But even that apparently will not stop you.

(in reply to Sanity)
Profile   Post #: 63
RE: BREAKING: Ron Paul to Announce Presidential Candida... - 5/13/2011 7:12:39 AM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Now that part is true. It's why I favor regulation.


there is no reason to speculate on foods or necessities, if these jerks want to place side bets keep it on the side, not affecting the price.






< Message edited by Real0ne -- 5/13/2011 7:13:21 AM >

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 64
RE: BREAKING: Ron Paul to Announce Presidential Candida... - 5/13/2011 7:13:55 AM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

quote:

so does a loan.


No, it doesn't. Farming is vulnerable to a host of weather and pest problems, several of which can cripple a year's crop.

A futures contract allows the farmer a workable price, guaranteed, giving him a reason to take out that loan and plant.



bullshit

I know shit loads of farmers and they dont even know what futures are.   you must be talking about corporate farms and that may as well be guvmint owned and operated farms


Then you need to get out more and get an education.

Who did you think sold the futures?

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 65
RE: BREAKING: Ron Paul to Announce Presidential Candida... - 5/13/2011 7:15:48 AM   
Musicmystery


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Now that part is true. It's why I favor regulation.


there is no reason to speculate on foods or necessities, if these jerks want to place side bets keep it on the side, not affecting the price.


This is just naive. The price is going to fluctuate, responding to shortages and bounty depending on the weather that year.

You want to live in a simplistic world where everything is always stable. It can't happen.

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 66
RE: BREAKING: Ron Paul to Announce Presidential Candida... - 5/13/2011 7:16:42 AM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

No, a loan doesn't do that at all. You only need to see the price of housing to see that the vast amount of loans at market does not indicate anything about tomorrows market value.

Arbitrage, and that sort of prudent speculation does.  Today, unfortunately, it also allows for unrestrained robbery.  That needs some paring back.



the whole fraud is based on interest filtering its way through the system.   technically there is little to no change in the stock market in real price, the only thing driving price in a big way is inflation and the speculation screws us in the process.  long story


_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 67
RE: BREAKING: Ron Paul to Announce Presidential Candida... - 5/13/2011 7:17:09 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		He doesn't know shit loads of farmers who don't know what futures are, first of all.  No more than he knows a shitload of mechanics who don't know what tools are.

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 68
RE: BREAKING: Ron Paul to Announce Presidential Candida... - 5/13/2011 7:18:30 AM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery


quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

quote:

so does a loan.


No, it doesn't. Farming is vulnerable to a host of weather and pest problems, several of which can cripple a year's crop.

A futures contract allows the farmer a workable price, guaranteed, giving him a reason to take out that loan and plant.



bullshit

I know shit loads of farmers and they dont even know what futures are.   you must be talking about corporate farms and that may as well be guvmint owned and operated farms


Then you need to get out more and get an education.

Who did you think sold the futures?


hardly I am saying the whole system is DESIGNED for corruption and you cant get past the system as it is to see any other way.


_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 69
RE: BREAKING: Ron Paul to Announce Presidential Candida... - 5/13/2011 7:18:41 AM   
Musicmystery


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Joined: 3/14/2005
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quote:

technically there is little to no change in the stock market in real price


Again, no. As companies grow, so does their value.

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 70
RE: BREAKING: Ron Paul to Announce Presidential Candida... - 5/13/2011 7:20:05 AM   
Musicmystery


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quote:

I am saying the whole system is DESIGNED for corruption and you cant get past the system as it is to see any other way.

Hence, an argument for regulation.

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 71
RE: BREAKING: Ron Paul to Announce Presidential Candida... - 5/13/2011 7:21:10 AM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery


quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Now that part is true. It's why I favor regulation.


there is no reason to speculate on foods or necessities, if these jerks want to place side bets keep it on the side, not affecting the price.


This is just naive. The price is going to fluctuate, responding to shortages and bounty depending on the weather that year.

You want to live in a simplistic world where everything is always stable. It can't happen.


hardly

you have wall street capitalizing on shortages making the problem worse and unless you ride around with a semi full of money you only hurt yourself sucking up to those theories.


_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 72
RE: BREAKING: Ron Paul to Announce Presidential Candida... - 5/13/2011 7:22:11 AM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

quote:

I am saying the whole system is DESIGNED for corruption and you cant get past the system as it is to see any other way.

Hence, an argument for regulation.


regulate the corruption?



its serves no purpose for the common people, only wall street.  therefore get rid of it.

< Message edited by Real0ne -- 5/13/2011 7:23:28 AM >

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 73
RE: BREAKING: Ron Paul to Announce Presidential Candida... - 5/13/2011 7:23:32 AM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline 		Sorry, but in the real world, prices fluctuate, and when the weather destroys a crop, prices soar.

Really. Think about what you're saying. This is really basic stuff.

Eliminate futures, and you'll have ONLY large corporate farms, because no one else will survive the risks against that competition.

How corrupt and manipulated do you suppose THAT will be?



< Message edited by Musicmystery -- 5/13/2011 7:25:44 AM >

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 74
RE: BREAKING: Ron Paul to Announce Presidential Candida... - 5/13/2011 7:24:06 AM   
MrRodgers


Posts: 10542
Joined: 7/30/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

quote:

so does a loan.

No, it doesn't. Farming is vulnerable to a host of weather and pest problems, several of which can cripple a year's crop.

A futures contract allows the farmer a workable price, guaranteed, giving him a reason to take out that loan and plant.

bullshit

I know shit loads of farmers and they dont even know what futures are.   you must be talking about corporate farms and that may as well be guvmint owned and operated farms

First of all, futures contracts exist only as a means to speculate and trade commodities without needing more than a piece of paper...not the commodity itself. As what capitalism is...turning paper into money, it is a profit vehicle, nothing more. Yes, one can lose and lose big too if you time it wrong.

Because there are billion$ thrown at speculation in commodities, it can and often does move prices. That price for those that are willing to be objective and learn, become the same thing they call it on oil...the benchmark price, i.e., the price at which all sales negotiation begins.

The futures market then forces...yes forces producers to buy in order to hedge their capital for the insuing further speculation. Believe it or not kinkroids, depending on their timing, producers can lose money buying futures, but...they lose as little as possible.

Anybody here actually tell me how producers can lose money investing in (buying) rising futures ?

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 75
RE: BREAKING: Ron Paul to Announce Presidential Candida... - 5/13/2011 7:24:54 AM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		Which brings us back to monetary policy.

Go Ron Paul!

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 76
RE: BREAKING: Ron Paul to Announce Presidential Candida... - 5/13/2011 7:26:16 AM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline 		as MR pointed out there is more than one real world and you are cherry picking.

As far as I am concerned its a cop out to simply sit back and say "well thats th eway it is" 

and presume that is the only "reality"





_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 77
RE: BREAKING: Ron Paul to Announce Presidential Candida... - 5/13/2011 7:27:07 AM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
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quote:

Which brings us back to monetary policy.


No, it doesn't.

(in reply to pahunkboy)
Profile   Post #: 78
RE: BREAKING: Ron Paul to Announce Presidential Candida... - 5/13/2011 7:29:42 AM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

as MR pointed out there is more than one real world and you are cherry picking.

As far as I am concerned its a cop out to simply sit back and say "well thats th eway it is" 

and presume that is the only "reality"

He was responding to YOU. I've already pointed the answer to his question earlier.

I'm not cherry picking at all--I'm pointing out the realities you're ignoring.

Nor am I sitting back and saying "Well that's the way it is." I'm arguing for regulation, remember?

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 79
RE: BREAKING: Ron Paul to Announce Presidential Candida... - 5/13/2011 7:32:03 AM   
MrRodgers


Posts: 10542
Joined: 7/30/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

quote:

I am saying the whole system is DESIGNED for corruption and you cant get past the system as it is to see any other way.

Hence, an argument for regulation.


regulate the corruption?

its serves no purpose for the common people, only wall street.  therefore get rid of it.

The reason regulations haven't worked is supplied by the whole greedy capitalist culture in the US. They'd much rather get $300,000 a year beating the regulators for Goldman, than $90,000 a year to regulate them at the SEC.

Does anybody know how many regulators and especially those that didn't regulate, that have now gone on to work for wall street ? It would be a very interesting however depressing story.

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 80
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