Testing, being broken, regular punishment, etc., etc.......

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Testing, being broken, regular punishment, etc., etc...... - 5/16/2006 7:12:05 AM

mistoferin

Posts: 8284
Joined: 10/27/2004
Status: offline

Training, brainwashing, mind control, molding, hypnosis to make one submissive....the list goes on and on.......

Does anyone just approach this from the perspective of a Dominant personality building an existance together with a submissive personality because that is who you are as people and you have a sincere desire to find a counterpart in life that you can expand upon those qualities in yourself with?

Two ADULTS who know who they are and can function within their Dominant and submissive personalities without having to resort to a multitude of mindgames to reinforce or prove their predisposition to their nature....

When you meet someone, do you meet them and think "This is going to be the perfect match for me....as soon as I transform them into somebody else?". Or do you say, "This is a human being who possesses the qualities that I desire in a partner and who I feel that I can communicate with as an adult and share our expectations of each other, make our compromises and have a fulfilling relationship where we both honor and respect the other"?

Am I the odd man out here? Is it the majority who believes that you can not live this lifestyle unless you are constantly incorporating headgames?

_____________________________

Peace and light,
~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

When you make a habit of playing on the tracks, you thereby forfeit the right to bitch when you get hit by a train.

"I did it! I admit it and I'm gonna do it again!"

Post #: 1

RE: Testing, being broken, regular punishment, etc., et... - 5/16/2006 7:21:44 AM

LuckyAlbatross

Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin
Does anyone just approach this from the perspective of a Dominant personality building an existance together with a submissive personality because that is who you are as people and you have a sincere desire to find a counterpart in life that you can expand upon those qualities in yourself with?

Me me me! Can I get a cookie?

quote:

Am I the odd man out here? Is it the majority who believes that you can not live this lifestyle unless you are constantly incorporating headgames?

No, you just aren't taken seriously.

The ones who make it in the long term realize that it's about the connection and living life together- the Ms and Ds simply is there or it isn't. No amount of games and tests and ritual will create something if it's not there. And, games and tests get really tiring after a few years. We still play and have fun, but we recognize that simply being who we are is why we're together- not what we do.

I think it's just a normal part of the process of incorporating this into one's life. And how else am I gonna use my nifty internet sorceress abilities?

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to mistoferin)

Post #: 2

RE: Testing, being broken, regular punishment, etc., et... - 5/16/2006 7:23:02 AM

Wulfchyld

Posts: 2618
Joined: 12/7/2005
Status: offline

I wouldn’t ever use hypnosis as means to make one submissive. To improve them, yes. Only in ways they want to be improved. I think all the brainwash stuff is a very bad ting. The world is a mighty big place and I am confident that there is more than one person that shares my kink without needing to be reprogrammed.

Good thread erin.

_____________________________

Loki, forum god of Mischief

Submission is not a gift... it is plunder!
Where there is a whip, there is a way!
Dom/mes of a feather, beat the f*ck out of slaves together

(in reply to mistoferin)

Post #: 3

RE: Testing, being broken, regular punishment, etc., et... - 5/16/2006 7:42:15 AM

mixielicous

Posts: 1283
Joined: 4/6/2006
From: Boston area, Massachusetts
Status: offline

my Master and i began Nilla. we based our relationship based o the fact that i was drawn to his outgoing, powerful personality.

what came from that was a natural evolution, and has been in no way a mind game for either party.

_____________________________

"lets just say he's a few prawns short of a galaxy"

(in reply to Wulfchyld)

Post #: 4

RE: Testing, being broken, regular punishment, etc., et... - 5/16/2006 7:44:03 AM

Mercnbeth

Posts: 11766
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin

Training, brainwashing, mind control, molding, hypnosis to make one submissive....the list goes on and on.......

Does anyone just approach this from the perspective of a Dominant personality building an existance together with a submissive personality because that is who you are as people and you have a sincere desire to find a counterpart in life that you can expand upon those qualities in yourself with?

Two ADULTS who know who they are and can function within their Dominant and submissive personalities without having to resort to a multitude of mindgames to reinforce or prove their predisposition to their nature....

When you meet someone, do you meet them and think "This is going to be the perfect match for me....as soon as I transform them into somebody else?". Or do you say, "This is a human being who possesses the qualities that I desire in a partner and who I feel that I can communicate with as an adult and share our expectations of each other, make our compromises and have a fulfilling relationship where we both honor and respect the other"?

Am I the odd man out here? Is it the majority who believes that you can not live this lifestyle unless you are constantly incorporating headgames?

erin,
If only...

There is nothing about beth that has changed. I only provided guidance and gave her the "freedom" to be and to act upon all of what she was when we met. I think I surprised beth with that attitude. she didn't understand the concept when I told her that's what her "training" would entail. she just was grateful that somehow, as strict as I was in other matters, she appreciated that I hated her cigarette smoking, but I wouldn't change her and require her to quit as part of the Master/slave relationship we were contemplating at the time.

Requiring change is a sure way to set yourself up for failure. Discounting all that occurred in a person's life prior to meeting them will force you to walk through a field of emotional "land minds" without a map. Leave the "breaking" and "testing" and non-play "mind-games" to fictional literature.

Training is guidance and pointing out ways where the subject of the training feels GREAT about who they are and what they are doing. They should be as proud of themselves as you are of them. You can't manipulate a person and be successful in the long term. You can't change the species of the flower you find as a bud, you can only help it blossom and bloom.

(in reply to mistoferin)

Post #: 5

RE: Testing, being broken, regular punishment, etc., et... - 5/16/2006 7:52:21 AM

angelface183

Posts: 688
Joined: 4/12/2006
Status: offline

Erin, you are awesome! Great profile and nice tat, by the way.

Thank you for starting this thread. The first few people I met on this site took great offense to me saying that we were not well matched. One was persistent enough to create multiple profiles after I had repeatedly blocked him. Luckily though others recognized that fundamental differences can be an issue (kids, religion, differing sexual appetites and interests).

You cannot make someone submit to you anymore that you can force someone to fall in love. If the chemistry and desire are not there, it cannot be commanded, in my opinion. I actually had one guy tell me, "You will think of me more often now. I will become an important part of your life." How? He just came across as an insecure weinie! If he were a true Dom, I would not be able to get him off of my mind!

You know what I am talking about...they just excude that certain something, that je ne sais quoi, ...that...

OH CRAP!

I think I just released an egg!

angelface

(in reply to mistoferin)

Post #: 6

RE: Testing, being broken, regular punishment, etc., et... - 5/16/2006 7:55:37 AM

angelface183

Posts: 688
Joined: 4/12/2006
Status: offline

quote:

Training is guidance and pointing out ways where the subject of the training feels GREAT about who they are and what they are doing. They should be as proud of themselves as you are of them. You can't manipulate a person and be successful in the long term. You can't change the species of the flower you find as a bud, you can only help it blossom and bloom.

beth,

you are a very lucky woman to have found so wise a Man

angelface

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

Post #: 7

RE: Testing, being broken, regular punishment, etc., et... - 5/16/2006 8:10:33 AM

bandit25

Posts: 3029
Joined: 6/18/2005
Status: offline

I agree with merc. No one can make you change or force those changes upon you. You change because you want to...because it's the natural course for you.

(in reply to angelface183)

Post #: 8

RE: Testing, being broken, regular punishment, etc., et... - 5/16/2006 8:19:45 AM

akisha

Posts: 2071
Joined: 6/25/2005
Status: offline

Just me but I've always felt all relationships should equal. They might just be equal in a different dynamic. If you have to hypnotize or manipulate someone then it's not a happy healthy relationship is it?

I can understand using different methods to over come fears, but that's about it. Trust, love and commitment should be able to do the same thing in time.

A couple or family works together because each person fulfills a role with in the unit or group. It takes all the pieces fitting together to function as a whole. No one person is less or more then the other, they just have different roles. The dominant has control because the submissive hands it over to them. The submissive has the freedom of another taking charge because the Dominant agrees to accept that responsibility. No one is less the the other. One of the other could choose at anytime to relinquish the role they have and the unit would crack.

If you go into a relationship with only the goal to change a person then you're going to fail. To change a persons base personality is next to impossible (imo) You can enhance certain aspects of them that are already there and try and lessen others but those things will always be part of the person.

_____________________________

I'm confused.... No wait!!! Maybe I'm not

It's not a blonde moment! It's momentary peroxide posioning. ;)

Your pain makes me smile ~ Happy Bunny

532-095-649

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

Post #: 9

RE: Testing, being broken, regular punishment, etc., et... - 5/16/2006 8:23:35 AM

Mercnbeth

Posts: 11766
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: angelface183

quote:

Training is guidance and pointing out ways where the subject of the training feels GREAT about who they are and what they are doing. They should be as proud of themselves as you are of them. You can't manipulate a person and be successful in the long term. You can't change the species of the flower you find as a bud, you can only help it blossom and bloom.

beth,

you are a very lucky woman to have found so wise a Man

angelface

thank you for the compliment, angelface. this slave has been blessed tremendously and is deeply grateful!!!

(in reply to angelface183)

Post #: 10

RE: Testing, being broken, regular punishment, etc., et... - 5/16/2006 8:29:34 AM

juliaoceania

Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline

As to your questions....

Yes I think it is possible for people to be suited to their roles and not needing the other tools you mentioned to incorporate into their dynamic, But there are no "perfect" couples either. All relationships take work eventually, after the "new" wears off.

As for the rest, one person's kink is another person's abuse. I like the idea of doing hypnosis with my dom ... at least if he wants to and we have a well established dynamic. I wish to be melded into his life if we are living together. I want to be dominated all the time.

As for tests, one person's "test" is another person's interrogation scene...LOL. It really is an individual thing now isnt it?

I do not like the term "breaking" either, but I really do not understand it. I guess I was involved with a dom that attempted to break me in some ways the first time I went down this road, it didnt work... Im just stronger than I was before I met him. But then again... thats just me. Someone else may feel the need to be broken in reality, and I can't judge that they do not know what they are doing, but my kink is ok... see what I mean?

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to mistoferin)

Post #: 11

RE: Testing, being broken, regular punishment, etc., et... - 5/16/2006 8:51:02 AM

truesub4u

Posts: 2949
Joined: 11/17/2005
Status: offline

I dunno Erin... guess that's why i'm still free.... I refuse to play these games. When I meet someone interesting enough to talk to ... on line and or off.... and from the get go I see they are trying to test me... break me... even remotely punish me.. they find themselves talking to themselves. If and when there's an agreement to move forward.... we move forward with what we already know...of each other.... not what we want of each other that isn't there as of yet. I don't believe in brain washing...hypnosis.. so those are a waste of time with me. More so than the rest... I see attempts of this to be games. Falling right along with testing. It's been argued that when one is in sub space it's easier to brain wash... make one go further.. do things they normally wouldn't do. I find fault with this. I can fall deep into sub space. But no matter how far I go... I'm still not going to fuck a dog or mess with scat. So there for I find fault with this argument that's been thrown my way.

I've been fortunate to meet here on CM a dominant gentleman. Even while going through that Bull back in Feb with asshole.. lol... this gentleman has been there for me. Waiting patiently for me to get my shit together. And providing God doesn't punish me before the weekend... I'll get to meet him this coming Friday. We are going to meet as stranger that met on the internet and became friendly. We have joked about other things. But we also know I have my out.... as does he... It's a mutual safe ground for each of us. I know he's a dominant... as he knows i'm a submissive. But we're not meeting under those terms. We're meeting as two adults that have found we share the same interest. What happens from there.... no one knows... and we're not going to anticipate more than that. To do so... would ruin what we've already established as possible friends. Yes conversation has come up in the past about our personal roles as we live them. We both have voiced our thoughts on different subjects of dominant roles and submissive roles.

Before this Wolf showed himself to me Erin.. I had same thoughts on this as you. That all because one lives the life that we do. MOST.. not all... seem to think the best way to meet and get what it is they seek.... is to be aggressive right from the start.... or give all right away in fear of not being left behind..... Demmanding of one just as soon as they think they have them with in their reach. Like I said.. not all are like this.. but i've seen this.. on line and off line as well. But I never give up my thoughts, beliefs, morals, stop being who I am... for someone else. Not saying I won't do a little changing after the fact... but not just to attract someones attention. I would feel too much like a fake... misleading someone from the get go leads to disaster... and just not in the mood nor have time for games.. so i'll just keep being me...that's what attracted this Wolf to me.... so he says... lol... we'll see this weekend...

< Message edited by truesub4u -- 5/16/2006 8:52:48 AM >

_____________________________

Wisdom is knowing what to do next, Skill is knowing how to do it, and Virtue is doing it.

(in reply to bandit25)

Post #: 12

RE: Testing, being broken, regular punishment, etc., et... - 5/16/2006 8:53:40 AM

thetammyjo

Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline

I prefer consistant and steady control, rules, and rituals to any of this "breaking" "hypnosis" or "mind-control" stuff.

I will influence my slave but I do it by showing him that my way is the better way and the best way to serve me. If he desires to serve, he learns; if not, he's not here very long.

You show by repeated practice, clear statements and consistancy, and using self-reflection techniques in my household. It is hard work for both people and will only work if desired by both people.

_____________________________

Love, Peace, Hugs, Kisses, Whips & Chains,

TammyJo

Check out my website at http://www.thetammyjo.com Or www.tammyjoeckhart.com

And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

(in reply to mistoferin)

Post #: 13

RE: Testing, being broken, regular punishment, etc., et... - 5/16/2006 8:55:29 AM

angelface183

Posts: 688
Joined: 4/12/2006
Status: offline

good luck to you true...may you find what you seek

(in reply to truesub4u)

Post #: 14

RE: Testing, being broken, regular punishment, etc., et... - 5/16/2006 9:01:01 AM

Kendra

Posts: 92
Joined: 5/17/2005
Status: offline

has her fingers x good luck
has been reading your posts for some time now.,
wishes you only the best
and i hope that maybe the magic happens...
even though you're only meeting as two people with similar interests !!

_____________________________

kendra... freedom through submission......

(in reply to angelface183)

Post #: 15

RE: Testing, being broken, regular punishment, etc., et... - 5/16/2006 9:06:43 AM

Kirei

Posts: 146
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

I don't believe in brain washing, hypnosis, and mind control stuff. I really question the dominants that do this stuff, because I feel they just do not want to spend the time necessary it takes to train a sub/slave to not need that kind of thing. I see those dominants as instant gratification people. The only things I can see maybe using hypnosis for would be like a drug, driking, or smoking problem the sub/slave wants fixed. I feel that when you do things naturally without aids like these you become much stronger and a better person.
I know this because I did it myself with panik attacks. I used to get them very bad, every pych I went too it seemed wanted me on drugs, and I wouldn't do it. I would conquer it myself...took me a lot of years and finding the right pych but I did over come them.
The other problem with all this stuff is what happens when you get a sub/salve that has had this done to them. You can spend double the amount of time de-programming bad things out of them.

Koneko

(in reply to angelface183)

Post #: 16

RE: Testing, being broken, regular punishment, etc., et... - 5/16/2006 9:17:28 AM

SweetSarijane

Posts: 3788
Joined: 10/7/2005
From: KC area Missouri
Status: offline

Great topic!

I see all the game playing, mind games, etc. and it's not for me. The relationship I'm working on is at this point friends and a man and woman interested in each other as a man and woman seeing how things develop. There is no dynamic set. No push for me to submit and obey him. He is Dominant. I am submissive. Right now we're seeing how we fit together as 2 people.

That's what I want and need. To build a relationship based on 2 people being attracted to each other, loving each other, having common interests, fitting together, and then putting the dynamic into place if the rest works. Can't spend 24/7 being flogged, bound, and on your knees. There has to be more.

This doesn't necessarily apply to everyone, it just does to me. It's what I want and need to be happy and fulfilled. Different people have different needs. To me....if your relationship is based soley on the fantasy, it's going to fall apart when reality hits and it will.

_____________________________

Sarah2
Deviant Mind
Wild Side Readers KCSass

(in reply to angelface183)

Post #: 17

RE: Testing, being broken, regular punishment, etc., et... - 5/16/2006 9:25:12 AM

truesub4u

Posts: 2949
Joined: 11/17/2005
Status: offline

sarijane... i'll with you luck as well... I think this is where it should start to begin with... but then that's just me too..

_____________________________

Wisdom is knowing what to do next, Skill is knowing how to do it, and Virtue is doing it.

(in reply to SweetSarijane)

Post #: 18

RE: Testing, being broken, regular punishment, etc., et... - 5/16/2006 9:44:20 AM

elsie

Posts: 28
Joined: 10/21/2004
Status: offline

Personally i enjoy being hypnotized, it helps to lower some of my inhibitions so that i can relax and it also helps me to better implement "mental" bondage when needed. i have used hypnosis for weight loss and for quitting smoking also.

i know that if Mistress wished to use hypnosis as a tool to help me become a better person, thus a better slave to serve her, i would have no problem with it. i know she would never do anything to overtly change my personality or go against my general morality. Besides, it's impossible to MAKE someone do something under hypnosis that they subconsciencely are opposed to. (i.e. i could not be made to eat grapefruit, in fact i woke up at the suggestion).

Training is supposed to be teaching the submissive how to better serve the Dom, it is not meant to "break" them but to enhance their abilities and teach them new skills. What good is a broken toy? *smile*

respectfully,
nara, deeply devoted to and owned by Mistress Jacqui

(in reply to mistoferin)

Post #: 19

RE: Testing, being broken, regular punishment, etc., et... - 5/16/2006 11:33:09 AM

Ceyx

Posts: 89
Joined: 8/23/2005
Status: offline

Hmm. I suppose that on some level I am both training and molding my miss. I wouldn't call it brainwashing, mind control or hypnosis; that implies that I'm making her into something she's not, and that isn't what I'm doing.

For me, 'training' involves developing or bringing to the fore those traits that I find most delightful in Halcyone. Importantly, these are also the things that most please her about herself; I often say that I allow her to live as the woman she is in her heart. We're right for one another because we share the same vision of her.

I liken this sort of 'training' to training a rose (I'm an adequate gardener, so the analogy falls naturally to mind.) A rose will take its distinctive shape (climber, hybrid tea, etc.) as a result of its inner principle of growth-- what it is by nature. You can't make a rose bush into a pretzel. But it will grow better, it will flourish, with patient care and control: sometimes watering, sometimes pruning, so that the rose is as healthy and beautiful as its nature permits. This kind of loving attention doesn't make the rose bush anything other than what it is.

I should point out that I'm speaking here of a committed M/s relationship. I would never dream of exercising that kind of control casually, before time was invested and there was a meeting of the minds.

(in reply to mistoferin)

Post #: 20

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