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Carefull what you wish for,... - 7/3/2011 11:10:24 AM

uslayme

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its very sad,...but
http://news.yahoo.com/ny-motorcyclist-dies-ride-protesting-helmet-law-143217859.html

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RE: Carefull what you wish for,... - 7/3/2011 11:13:23 AM

RapierFugue

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quote:

ORIGINAL: uslayme

its very sad,...but
http://news.yahoo.com/ny-motorcyclist-dies-ride-protesting-helmet-law-143217859.html

"Paging Mr Darwin! Mr Darwin to the white courtesy phone!"

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RE: Carefull what you wish for,... - 7/3/2011 12:08:19 PM

slaveluci

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It's "sad" but only in the sense that people can actually function with so little common sense. Your head is like a fragile melon. When putting it in danger - say on a motorcycle - protect it, dipshit. You want the "freedom" to bash your brains out, feel free, but don't expect people to weep and moan when you get just what you asked for. Thin the herd, I say......luci

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RE: Carefull what you wish for,... - 7/3/2011 1:28:58 PM

hlen5

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I'm sorry. I wish he would have survived, but the irony is just toooooooo much.

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RE: Carefull what you wish for,... - 7/3/2011 3:17:15 PM

Termyn8or

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"Troopers say Contos would have likely survived if he had been wearing a helmet."

Yes it is sad but.......

If those choices are taken away from us, many of us would rather die anyway. It's like wearing a seat belt. If Contos would've survived, think about it. Obviously his head hit something, so if wearing a helmet sure he could survive - with a broken neck. Probably a quadrapeligic for life. Some of us choose not to have that happen.

If you don't understand you never will, and really that is not a putdown. It is the way it is and if you can't understand how someone else could possibly do something that you would never do, that is no reason to prevent them from doing it. BC just recently had something similar happen. He had to lock up both wheels on the highway because of an idiot fourwheeler. He is a very experienced rider. If he wasn't he may have bit some asphalt. But it's still his choice. Ask semi drivers about four whelers. They are very brave when faced with 25 tons of steel, what do you think they fear from a motorcycle ?

My cousin (TS) died on a motorcycle. He was an experienced rider, but he fucked up. A long line of traffic, but there is a gravel side on the road. He availed himself of it as a way to get past the congestion, but a truck was coming out of a driveway. He had to dump the bike, which is what you do, but in this case a helmet wouldn't have mattered. His neck was wrapped around the truck's driveshaft.

It cost him his life and I make no pretense - it was his own damn fault. This was my favorite cousin. But that does not change the fact that he fucked up, That truck driver did nothing wrong.

It's hard to be objective about such things, but we must. Rest in peace Contos, and TS. You went out because of your beliefs. I will not have a knee jerk reaction over it.

I refuse to ride. I would on a dirt bike, out in the hills and shit, but not in traffic. People are just too crazy out there. Two seconds of their time is worth more than your life. People get stupid and smash my car, I might get out with a fucking tire iron and teach them how to drive. And believe it or not, without one iota of anger.

Motorcycle riders choose to take a risk. When taking risks is illegal, life is not worth living.

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RE: Carefull what you wish for,... - 7/3/2011 4:41:47 PM

LinnaeaBorealis

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Philosophically I gotta agree with Termy. But the reality is that lots of people who render themselves vegetables from not wearing helmets don't have enough money or insurance to pay for their own medical care & the taxpayers end up paying for it. So for that I don't agree. If they all died, that would be ok, but some end up just gorked for the rest of their lives.

I didn't wear a seat belt in a car until winter of 1982. I was a passenger in a four wheeled vehicle that crashed. All of my injuries could have been prevented had I been wearing a seat belt. But that didn't make me wear a seat belt. My other vehicle was a Suzuki GS550 & I always wore a helmet when I rode, even though there was no law that said I had to. When I first started riding, I didn't wear one but for some reason by the late 70's I decided to always wear one. Well, 9 months after the car crash, the very same thing happened to me while riding the bike. My head hit the pavement twice & my head wasn't injured at all. I had lots of other injuries, but I had avoided flying over the car by laying the bike down & sliding under it, so no quadriplegia for me.

Oddly, it was after flying through the air when I left the bike that I started wearing a seat belt in an enclosed vehicle. I don't like the laws making it illegal to take risks that people choose to take. But I also don't like tax money going to keeping a fool alive. I was raised in an era of people taking personal responsibility for their choices. They weren't allowed to sue others because of their own stupidity. I got hurt in a truck stop one time & it was totally my fault. The suits came running & I told every one of them to stop worrying because in my world, one didn't get to sue for being stupid. So I guess until we get back to that personal responsibility thing, the people want these kinds of laws to protect them from the idiots who would say that it wasn't their own stupidity that got them hurt or killed, it's someone else's fault.

Btw, the headline above the picture taken of me lying on the street read "Helmet saves motorcyclist's life." Probably true. My sister made a gazillion copies of that & showed it to her kids & their friends when they would talk about wanting a bike. LOL So who knows how many other lives that helmet of mine saved.

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RE: Carefull what you wish for,... - 7/3/2011 10:00:37 PM

0ldhen

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MY HEAD MY CHOICE.

While this accident was brake failure, most accidents that occur involving motorcyclists are due to cage drivers who do not see motorcycles.

Do some research, helmets also cause injuries up to and including broken necks.

And, while some bikers lack sufficent insurance to cover long term care due to head trauma, the fact is that more car drivers than bikers are hospitalized yearly requiring such long term care that lack sufficent insurance to cover their expenses.

2% of all motorcycle riders will have an accident, .29% of these will be single vehicle accidents, the rest involve cars/trucks
6.9% of all car drivers will have an accident
Only .0007% of MC riders will suffer a fatal accident,
While.0002% of cars will experience a fatal accident

So, should anybody lacking long term coverage be kept from driving/riding?

I am against seat belt laws as well, except for minor children. I also believe in your right to smoke or not.

I do have long term care coverage, I just think it is the smart thing to do.

But my head, my choice.

And, "thinning the herd" hmm....how bout we just shoot the cage drivers who cause the majority of bike accidents? Now, THAT, would be thinning the herd!

"You want the "freedom" to bash your brains out, feel free, but don't expect people to weep and moan when you get just what you asked for"

Yup, I demand, campaign, march and ride for just that freedom. And, my family, my friends, are aware of my choice. Dipshit or not, guess what, they might miss me, but every fucking one of them will be smiling. They will KNOW that I went out in a manner I CHOSE!

http://www.abateofindiana.org/

< Message edited by 0ldhen -- 7/3/2011 10:07:23 PM >

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RE: Carefull what you wish for,... - 7/3/2011 10:05:51 PM

slaveluci

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Yep, there's lots of ways to thin the herd. Shoot car drivers, motorcycle riders, smokers and anyone else who does anything dangerous. I'm not advocating shooting anyone. I'm advocating protecting one's noggin. The government shouldn't force you to do it. The government shouldn't HAVE TO force you to do it if you have any self-preservation instincts at all. People do stupid things each and every day that the government shouldn't stop you from doing. That doesn't mean they're intelligent things to do. When someone does them and dies from it, it indeed thins the herd and no one can complain much since they chose to do them. You can't argue with that. Though I am apparantly a "cage" driver, I have nothing against those who ride bikes or motorcycles. I don't give two shits if they all splatter their heads like melons if that's what they desire. I'm just not going to act like it's a smart decision...............luci

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RE: Carefull what you wish for,... - 7/3/2011 10:14:06 PM

juliaoceania

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Kinda reminds me of this story

http://articles.latimes.com/1999/oct/23/news/mn-25364

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RE: Carefull what you wish for,... - 7/3/2011 10:16:36 PM

slaveluci

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quote:

ORIGINAL: 0ldhen

MY HEAD MY CHOICE.

While this accident was brake failure, most accidents that occur involving motorcyclists are due to cage drivers who do not see motorcycles.

Do some research, helmets also cause injuries up to and including broken necks.

And, while some bikers lack sufficent insurance to cover long term care due to head trauma, the fact is that more car drivers than bikers are hospitalized yearly requiring such long term care that lack sufficent insurance to cover their expenses.

2% of all motorcycle riders will have an accident, .29% of these will be single vehicle accidents, the rest involve cars/trucks
6.9% of all car drivers will have an accident
Only .0007% of MC riders will suffer a fatal accident,
While.0002% of cars will experience a fatal accident

So, should anybody lacking long term coverage be kept from driving/riding?

I am against seat belt laws as well, except for minor children. I also believe in your right to smoke or not.

I do have long term care coverage, I just think it is the smart thing to do.

But my head, my choice.

And, "thinning the herd" hmm....how bout we just shoot the cage drivers who cause the majority of bike accidents? Now, THAT, would be thinning the herd!

"You want the "freedom" to bash your brains out, feel free, but don't expect people to weep and moan when you get just what you asked for"

Yup, I demand, campaign, march and ride for just that freedom. And, my family, my friends, are aware of my choice. Dipshit or not, guess what, they might miss me, but every fucking one of them will be smiling. They will KNOW that I went out in a manner I CHOSE!

http://www.abateofindiana.org/

And I'm sure that will bring them great comfort as they watch your brains get scooped up into a bucket

I endorse your freedom to do whatever the hell you like as long as it doesn't infringe upon my rights. I want the right to do what I like too as long as I don't hurt you. I really don't think the government should mandate helmets, seat belts, what we should smoke, eat, drink, etc., I really don't. But I also don't think wise people choose to do dangerous things totally unprotected either. Everyone on here pops a stitch when talking about "unprotected" sex. It's very taboo apparently. So....if you fuck someone who may have a disease without protection and you get infected, it's all your fault, you ninny and you won't hear anyone here crying over it. That's how I see the helmet thing. Ride without it all you want. Do 150 on a gravel road lined with tall trees and take yer chances! But, when your head hits one and you're a goner, that's the choice you made, no tears shed by me. Now, if it was a family member or friend, sure I'd be sad. But I'd be sad because they pretty much chose their own terrible fate and chose to ignore a piece of equipment that could've saved their dumb ass from death........luci

< Message edited by slaveluci -- 7/3/2011 10:17:52 PM >

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RE: Carefull what you wish for,... - 7/3/2011 10:20:19 PM

slaveluci

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quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

Kinda reminds me of this story

http://articles.latimes.com/1999/oct/23/news/mn-25364

Yes, but it was her CHOICE and what a brilliant way to protest

luci

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RE: Carefull what you wish for,... - 7/3/2011 10:25:00 PM

juliaoceania

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I am all for the choice to do whatever you like with your life, at the same time, it is unpleasant to clean up the remains of people who splat themselves, and if they do not die they linger on forever and a day in brain injured states with the rest of us taking care of them

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RE: Carefull what you wish for,... - 7/3/2011 10:31:25 PM

LinnaeaBorealis

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quote:

ORIGINAL: 0ldhen

MY HEAD MY CHOICE.

While this accident was brake failure, most accidents that occur involving motorcyclists are due to cage drivers who do not see motorcycles.

Do some research, helmets also cause injuries up to and including broken necks.

And, while some bikers lack sufficent insurance to cover long term care due to head trauma, the fact is that more car drivers than bikers are hospitalized yearly requiring such long term care that lack sufficent insurance to cover their expenses.

2% of all motorcycle riders will have an accident, .29% of these will be single vehicle accidents, the rest involve cars/trucks
6.9% of all car drivers will have an accident
Only .0007% of MC riders will suffer a fatal accident,
While.0002% of cars will experience a fatal accident

So, should anybody lacking long term coverage be kept from driving/riding?

I am against seat belt laws as well, except for minor children. I also believe in your right to smoke or not.

I do have long term care coverage, I just think it is the smart thing to do.

But my head, my choice.

And, "thinning the herd" hmm....how bout we just shoot the cage drivers who cause the majority of bike accidents? Now, THAT, would be thinning the herd!

"You want the "freedom" to bash your brains out, feel free, but don't expect people to weep and moan when you get just what you asked for"

Yup, I demand, campaign, march and ride for just that freedom. And, my family, my friends, are aware of my choice. Dipshit or not, guess what, they might miss me, but every fucking one of them will be smiling. They will KNOW that I went out in a manner I CHOSE!

http://www.abateofindiana.org/

If you're against laws about seat belt usage, why do you believe that minor children should have to wear them? Shouldn't that decision be left up to the parents? After all, there were no seat belts in cars when my children were growing up nor when I was growing up & we survived just fine.

As for whether people smoke or not, of course that's up to them, but I shouldn't have to breathe their smoke if I don't choose to smoke, should I?

It always blows me away when I see families out riding bicycles with only the children wearing helmets. So that means that they could possibly be witness to the parent(s) sustaining a brain injury during a fall.

Your head, your choice. I really have no problem with that. I think that what people are saying here is that it was his choice to not wear a helmet & to die that way, so they don't feel sad that he died because he made that choice.

Here in Chicagoland, I've yet to see a biker wearing a helmet, since there is no helmet law within the city limits, or something like that. I guess if I was still riding, I'd be the only one. Because I don't get on a bike motor or not without a helmet. There are times when I'm out walking or riding in a car when I wish I could wear a helmet! LOL

Btw, a close friend of mine was involved in a car accident the same month as my bike accident. He wasn't wearing a seatbelt & he was thrown through the windshield & landed on his head. When I saw him next, he was a hemiplegic & I helped him to rehab. I survived with few residuals. I'm good with that. My head, my choice.

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Ring the bells that still can ring
Forget your perfect offering
There is a crack in everything
That's how the light gets in
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RE: Carefull what you wish for,... - 7/3/2011 10:39:58 PM

Termyn8or

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"If they all died, that would be ok, but some end up just gorked for the rest of their lives. "

So again money trumps choice. How about this, you see me get flipped off a motorcycle or expelled from a car in a crash, just let me lay there and die. That is the way I want it. Keep your money. (in fact shoot me like a lame horse)

I told you all before that very few people want real freedom. Very few does not include me. Or wait is does, or no..... DAMMIT, what I mean is let me die. My next score I will get one of those med bracelets that says "GIVE NO BLOOD. DO NOT RESSUCITATE". You are free of paying for me, and I am free of you paying for me.

But I can only say that in spirit. In my world it could work, but in this world I will fuck the system out of every fucking dime possible. And I will never stop until the day I die. Wish me luck.

T^T

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RE: Carefull what you wish for,... - 7/3/2011 10:49:10 PM

Termyn8or

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"cage drivers who do not see motorcycles. "

I've heard that term before. Can I fall in love with you ? I won't be much trouble, just hide some assets for me and we'll have a nice life, if you know how to cook that's a plus. Just don't ask me to ride on the roads. How do you feel about dirt biking ? I love to crash. I spent half my life trying. That damn self preservation thing keeps getting in the way though.

But not enough to wear a helmet or a seatbelt.

No, honestly, if I took to street riding I probably would wear one. On the highway I know it's better without, usually you are better off dead, but down city streets and shit, things that happen at 25 MPH, it can make the difference. But I don't want a helmet to save my life, because of that broken neck problem. Fuck all that. If I'm doing 80 MPH and fuck up, I would rather be dead.

My choice.

T^T

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RE: Carefull what you wish for,... - 7/3/2011 10:53:12 PM

Termyn8or

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"Do 150 on a gravel road lined with tall trees and take yer chances! But, when your head hits one and you're a goner,"

Beats the alternative.

T^T

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RE: Carefull what you wish for,... - 7/3/2011 10:54:34 PM

Termyn8or

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"Yes, but it was her CHOICE and what a brilliant way to protest"

Yup, it's that damn swimming that should be outlawed !

T^T

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RE: Carefull what you wish for,... - 7/3/2011 10:56:07 PM

LinnaeaBorealis

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or

"If they all died, that would be ok, but some end up just gorked for the rest of their lives. "

So again money trumps choice. How about this, you see me get flipped off a motorcycle or expelled from a car in a crash, just let me lay there and die. That is the way I want it. Keep your money. (in fact shoot me like a lame horse)

I told you all before that very few people want real freedom. Very few does not include me. Or wait is does, or no..... DAMMIT, what I mean is let me die. My next score I will get one of those med bracelets that says "GIVE NO BLOOD. DO NOT RESSUCITATE". You are free of paying for me, and I am free of you paying for me.

But I can only say that in spirit. In my world it could work, but in this world I will fuck the system out of every fucking dime possible. And I will never stop until the day I die. Wish me luck.

T^T

See, I don't wanna be gorked for the rest of my life. In fact I had a deal with my best friend who was a nurse to prevent them from keeping me alive. I believe that she would have taken care of it for me too. So I did what I could to prevent the gorking & so far I've been lucky. Yeah, it was a 4-wheeler who ran over me, she was old & didn't see me & might have continued right on over my head had it not been for the serendipity of my bike hitting the side of her car & her stopping to see what that noise was. She stopped with the driver side tire inches from my head. I don't think that the helmet would have kept me alive had she kept going. But at least I did my part.

I don't think that there should be laws about helmets or seat belts or about 80% of the shit they make laws for. I call them "I R stoopid laws". There's all this fuss about people talking on their cell phones while driving & that it causes accidents. Guess what, folks? There are more accidents caused by drivers being distracted by their passengers. So should we outlaw passengers in cars? They knew they couldn't get away with that so they got people all emotionally overwrought about cell phone usage. And I've done the hands-free thing. I'm not less distracted that way at all. In fact, I still need to put my hand up to the headset because I can't hear unless I push on it.

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There is a crack in everything
That's how the light gets in
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RE: Carefull what you wish for,... - 7/3/2011 10:56:19 PM

Termyn8or

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"and if they do not die they linger on forever and a day in brain injured states with the rest of us taking care of them "

Not me. Kill me.

I understand what you say, but that is not freedom. Almost nobody wants true freedom.

T^T

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RE: Carefull what you wish for,... - 7/3/2011 11:10:35 PM

Termyn8or

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"See, I don't wanna be gorked for the rest of my life. "

Really, riding on city streets I would probably wear a helmet, but I am not an experienced rider. I can work the thing, but I am no expert at it.

Cars and kids ? Well when I was going up they used to make cars out of metal (gasp). It was fucking hard to get hurt in a car, at least for my ilk. If I had pictures.......some of the wrecks I've been in, it would amaze you that anyone survived. Every weekend I would go out and find another place to go 100 MPH or more. I didn't drink at all back then. I never got busted, I would "case" a road and then come back at what I thought was the right time. Any car I had, if the seat belt caused one fucking minor problem, get caught in the door or anything - out came the knife.

But now people ride around in tinfoil. Crumple zones my ass, put some metal in the car. You get bounced around in there because you're stupid that's not my problem. If you need a seatbelt you shouldn't be driving. If you need a helmet you shouldn't be riding. And if you have kids in the car, being responsible entails a bit more than getting a sign that says "BABY ON BOARD". And kids don't seem to be as immortal as they were when I grew up.

I know the odds, and there are different odds for differnt possibilities. It is my choice to die rather than become a vegetable. When someone tries to take that choice away from me, one of us is going to die.

T^T

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