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RE: News of the World - 7/8/2011 9:03:54 AM   
DomKen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead


quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker
Apparently even the food critic from the Times cannot go into a restaurant without being named a villain ("we don't care what kind of review you give us, for nobody will be reading your trash") and asked to leave, and even the butcher takes him to task.

Is it just me, or does anybody else have that scene from Delicattessen running through their head when they think about butchers giving the idiot a hard time?

Actually I thought of the Soup Nazi first.
"No Meat for You!"

(in reply to Moonhead)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: News of the World - 7/8/2011 3:26:23 PM   
tweakabelle


Posts: 7522
Joined: 10/16/2007
From: Sydney Australia
Status: offline 		Any one naive enough to think that News International is co-operating fully with enquiries, is being honest about its role in this whole affair or indeed, credible or trustworthy at all ought to check out this article in today's Guardian.

Among the matters reported are allegations of evidence-tampering, -hiding and -destruction, false and misleading testimony, perjury and reneged agreements with the investigating police by high ranking NI executives.

Yet again the question is posed: Are Murdoch and NI "fit and proper" people to run media outlets? This is not merely a rhetorical question. Whether Murdoch and NI are "fit and proper" people to run media outlets is one of the criteria to be assessed before Murdoch/NI's take over of BSkyB can go ahead.

< Message edited by tweakabelle -- 7/8/2011 3:32:51 PM >

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RE: News of the World - 7/8/2011 3:56:52 PM   
willbeurdaddy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

I think you mean listen to the BLT.


Yes, that first part is where you got into trouble. but thanks for pointing out the moral and ethical similarity you perceive between the black WASP and the individuals Murdoch clan.


WTF are you talking about?


Your admiration of Obama and your favorable comparisons of  those similar qualities you admire among the Murdochs, of course.

"Just read the James Murdoch statement regarding his closure of the NOW, and a finer example of righteous and self-serving hypocrisy as he tosses the lot under the bus and off the sled for the wolves, cannot be imagined."

"Sure it can. Listen to any of Obama's speeches."

Frankly, I don't see it, but readily admire your regular attempts to show the two as equals in what you think are their qualities.



I dont think they are equals. There is no one who has succeeded with so little ability as Obama.

_____________________________

Hear the lark
and harken
to the barking of the dogfox,
gone to ground.

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Profile   Post #: 43
RE: News of the World - 7/8/2011 4:35:53 PM   
Politesub53


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

Perhaps it may have slipped a few non-UK memories that the soon-to-be-arrested Andy Coulson was until quite recently, UK PM Cameron's chief spin doctor. Coulson served an apprenticeship for this position as Editor of the News Of The World rag 2003-7.

A perfect preparation for life as a right wing spin doctor wouldn't you agree? I wonder if he has negotiated the serial rights to his forthcoming jail diary to The Sun yet?


Ed Miliband is trying to use this against Cameron, but he misses two crucial points, as do you. The police told Cameron that the original hacking affair was done and dusted and no other hacking had been done, other than on behalf of Clive Goodman. Goodman went to jail as did his private investigator. Cameron also got a firm to check Coul;sons background and they found no evidence of wrong doing. Coulson also told Cameron, and indeed anyone who asked him, that he didnt know about the hacking. I dont see how one can blame Cameron.

News tonight is Rebekah Brooks has told NOTW staff in a speech, "there is worse to come" If so that will be the end of Murdochs Sky bid ( If it isnt already dead in the water). Finally, the other tabloids will be running for cover. The NOTW was only fifth highest on the information commissioners list of papers using the same private investigators. Thirty four papers and magazines were said to be involved.

(in reply to tweakabelle)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: News of the World - 7/8/2011 5:06:02 PM   
tweakabelle


Posts: 7522
Joined: 10/16/2007
From: Sydney Australia
Status: offline 		Polite, you might be reading too much into my post. I wasn't blaming Cameron - I was reminding people who Coulson was.

Mind you, at this point, I'm not exonerating Cameron either. His appointment of someone with Coulson's past is open to question - being Editor of the NOTW isn't exactly a monument to one's integrity is it? More and more people seem to be getting caught up in this scandal as time goes by. While the points you make in relation to Cameron seem reasonable to me, it would be rash to definitively exclude any one at this point.

The real point of my post (which you seem to have missed) was about right wing spin doctors - the Coulsons and Mark Regevs of this world and how sleazy and untrustworthy they are.

< Message edited by tweakabelle -- 7/8/2011 5:09:08 PM >

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Profile   Post #: 45
RE: News of the World - 7/8/2011 5:12:38 PM   
hardcybermaster


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

Polite, you might be reading too much into my post. I wasn't blaming Cameron - I was reminding people who Coulson was.

Mind you, at this point, I'm not exonerating Cameron either. His appointment of someone with Coulson's past is open to question - being Editor of the NOTW isn't exactly a monument to one's integrity is it? More and more people seem to be getting caught up in this scandal as time goes by. While the points you make in relation to Cameron seem sound to me, it would be rash to definitively exclude any one at this point.

The real point of my post (which you seem to have missed) was about right wing spin doctors - the Coulsons and Mark Regevs of this world and how sleazy and untrustworthy they are.

I have no idea why Cam employed this bloke,it was a really stupid move but it worth pointing out that most of the hacking actually happened quite a while ago when Blair and Brown had their tongues firmly up the tabloids asses

(in reply to tweakabelle)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: News of the World - 7/8/2011 5:14:54 PM   
FirstQuaker


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quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

I dont think they are equals. There is no one who has succeeded with so little ability as Obama.


So how do you see Obama as being involved in this scandal of Murdoch's happening in the UK right now?

He must have had a hard time framing poor Murdoch on his last visit, especially with the minimal skill set you claim  Obama has.

Or do you think the black WASP told the monarch  to "take care of this wiseguy Murdoch" during his visit and thus detailed the British to bringing this champion down?

(in reply to willbeurdaddy)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: News of the World - 7/8/2011 5:17:38 PM   
Politesub53


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Status: offline 		Tweaks......Let me remind you left wing spin doctors are as bad, if not worse. New labour not only released a "sexed up dossier" but then leaked the name of Dr Kelly who went on to commit suicide.

I didnt miss your point, I just went on to correct it. Most of us here in the UK can work out both sides have been as bad as each other when cosying up to Murdoch. Cameron admitted as much today.

We have a TV show called question time, where a chosen panel take questions from the public. One of the Labour shadow cabinet was in full swing when spouting off out cameron and Murdoch being pals. He shut up pdq when asked why he ( Labour politician ) attended Murdochs lavish summer party three weeks back.

Please keep posting though, cause if I ever get to visit the Melbourne Cup, I may want a room for the night.



(in reply to tweakabelle)
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RE: News of the World - 7/8/2011 5:18:17 PM   
hardcybermaster


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quote:

ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

I dont think they are equals. There is no one who has succeeded with so little ability as Obama.


So how do you see Obama as being involved in this scandal of Murdoch's happening in the UK right now?

He must have had a hard time framing poor Murdoch on his last visit, especially with the minimal skill set you claim  Obama has.

Or do you think the black WASP told the monarch  to "take care of this wiseguy Murdoch" during his visit and thus detailed the British to bringing this champion down?


I think if you started a thread about how lovely butterflies are he would tell you that Obama squashes them for fun

(in reply to FirstQuaker)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: News of the World - 7/8/2011 5:41:52 PM   
FirstQuaker


Posts: 787
Joined: 3/19/2011
Status: offline 		Looks like they have Cameron on the Tory hotseat now for hiring Coulson, and also surprisingly Ed Miliband is in front of Labour for hiring a NOW person involved in the scandal .

Spanking the heads  of both Labour and the Tories at the same time. Clegg isn't in trouble yet but at the rate this thing has been going, one never knows . . .

And there now are calls from Cameron  and other Torys for James Murdoch to come explain a few things . . .

Cameron to Murdoch "You can't toss me off the sled, I am the only one of us who can handle the dogs and drive the bloody thing. How about tossing your son next."



< Message edited by FirstQuaker -- 7/8/2011 5:43:20 PM >

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Profile   Post #: 50
RE: News of the World - 7/8/2011 6:05:15 PM   
Politesub53


Posts: 14862
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline 		Here is a list of papers and magazines, said to use the same investigator. The NOTW is only the start, in my view.

The Daily Mail tops the Information Commissioner’s list with 952 transactions positively identified and although the list heavily features tabloid newspapers, certain magazines and broadsheets are also identified. The other publications listed are: Sunday People, Daily Mirror, Mail on Sunday, News of the World, Sunday Mirror, Best Magazine, Evening Standard, The Observer, Daily Sport, Sunday Times, The People, Daily Express, Weekend Magazine (Daily Mail), Sunday Express, The Sun, Closer Magazine, Sunday Sport, Night and Day (Mail on Sunday), Sunday Business News, Daily Record, Saturday (Express), Sunday Mirror Magazine, Real Magazine, Woman’s Own, Daily Mirror Magazine, Mail in Ireland, Daily Star, Marie Claire, Personal Magazine andSunday World.

(in reply to FirstQuaker)
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RE: News of the World - 7/8/2011 6:34:40 PM   
Anaxagoras


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Joined: 5/9/2009
From: Eire
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze
quote:

ORIGINAL: Anaxagoras
eah its pretty sick stuff but then again many (not all) journalists come across as pond life. Wonder is a certain kind of ruthlessness required to be successful in this line of work?

Its causing uproar in the UK so I hope it will have a big impact on ethics/codes of conduct. I think the politicians know the public feels it is too shocking to let it go on.

Please tell me what you do know about "many journalists"? I wonder if you see fit to insult most of them because you are only familiar with tabloid journalism? MOST journalists don't work for the tabloids, MOST of them do not engage in illegal actions because it would cost them their job, they do their research, do interviews, write articles and are busy to document every step of the way to avoid law suits (one of the reasons why they will tape interviews, so the subject being interviewed can't claim they have been misquoted), they also spend hours and hours fact checking, very glamorous and ruthless to be stuck in libraries and archives to make sure your facts are straight - again to avoid law suits or being fired. Is that ruthless for you? Maybe you should take a step away from tabloids and not insult journalists by comparing them with the kind of pond scum working for tabloids.

I have known a reasonable number of journalists from tabloids, broadsheets, music mags etc. Some seemed pretty decent but many others weren't. The tabloid lot were bad, very ugly in their treatment of people at times but the broadsheet types are bad too in part because they get involved with advocacy journalism and are quite willing to bend and distort the news. When a big story comes along many newspapers still run with it even if it is unverified or untrue. The lawsuits aren't always enough financial disincentive to do so. The media at its best performs a real service for society but the truth as I see it is that few of these people are unimpressive. One example is a chap called Vincent Brown who is one of the most famous journalists in the country where I live. He lives around the corner from me. As a person he is grand but as a journalist he is a serious contender for the most blindly opinionated individual I have ever met. Maybe my own experiences just happen to be more negative or perhaps my expectations are unreleastic since this is also a livelyhood.

< Message edited by Anaxagoras -- 7/8/2011 6:35:09 PM >

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RE: News of the World - 7/9/2011 5:24:46 AM   
Moonhead


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Joined: 9/21/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

Here is a list of papers and magazines, said to use the same investigator. The NOTW is only the start, in my view.

The Daily Mail tops the Information Commissioner’s list with 952 transactions positively identified and although the list heavily features tabloid newspapers, certain magazines and broadsheets are also identified. The other publications listed are: Sunday People, Daily Mirror, Mail on Sunday, News of the World, Sunday Mirror, Best Magazine, Evening Standard, The Observer, Daily Sport, Sunday Times, The People, Daily Express, Weekend Magazine (Daily Mail), Sunday Express, The Sun, Closer Magazine, Sunday Sport, Night and Day (Mail on Sunday), Sunday Business News, Daily Record, Saturday (Express), Sunday Mirror Magazine, Real Magazine, Woman’s Own, Daily Mirror Magazine, Mail in Ireland, Daily Star, Marie Claire, Personal Magazine andSunday World.


Might it be worth pointing out for the Americans on the forum that this is actually a shorter list than it appears to be? The Observer is (despite having a separate editorial staff) the Sunday edition of the Grauniad. Several sunday or weekend supplements to papers (which do have the same editorial staff as the parent papers) are also listed.

Something else that does occur looking at that list is the whole NOTW fuss only really blew up after the Sport was relaunched, despite having been lurking in the wings, swelling ominously, long before that happened. Maybe that's the paper they have waiting in the wings to replace the dead as of tomorrow News of the Screws?

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I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

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Profile   Post #: 53
RE: News of the World - 7/9/2011 4:55:32 PM   
Politesub53


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Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline 		Touching on my point to Tweaks about both parties being linked to Murdoch, this could get even worse. Not just for Murdoch but for Ed Miliband and another Murdoch paper, The Times. Tom Baldwin, Milibands spin doctor, has been accussed of hacking into Lord Ashcrofts ( Tory donor) bank accounts. This is said to have taken place back when Baldwin was a Times journalist.

The Times, suprisingly for a Murdoch paper, has said it expects three police officers and nine NOTW assosiated journalists to be jailed for this. You wouldnt expect on of Murdochs own papers to report this, without it being highly likely

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Profile   Post #: 54
RE: News of the World - 7/9/2011 5:23:57 PM   
FirstQuaker


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Joined: 3/19/2011
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

Touching on my point to Tweaks about both parties being linked to Murdoch, this could get even worse. Not just for Murdoch but for Ed Miliband and another Murdoch paper, The Times. Tom Baldwin, Milibands spin doctor, has been accussed of hacking into Lord Ashcrofts ( Tory donor) bank accounts. This is said to have taken place back when Baldwin was a Times journalist.

The Times, for a Murdoch paper, has said it expects three police officers and nine NOTW assosiated journalists to be jailed for this. You wouldnt expect on of Murdochs own papers to report this, without it being highly likely


World wide the Times is regarded well for having integrity and for accurate, but 'stuffy' journalism, with an upperclass lean.

I think the staff of the Times would much rather be owned by someone else at this stage of the game, but has resigned themselves to maintaining that "stiff upper lip," and carrying on as they have.

As an example and regarding their food critics comments, I  picture some guy in 1000 pound suit and a bowler with his school tie on being told off in Cockney by the butcher and the eatery by working men with  Cockney accents in the British equivalent of "we don't allow your kind in here" and him standing in stunned humiliation both for the accusation, and for it being unanswerable, as he is indeed a part of this Murdoch thing by association, much as if his sister was found working in a brothel in Spain.

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Profile   Post #: 55
RE: News of the World - 7/9/2011 5:29:52 PM   
Politesub53


Posts: 14862
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline 		Your view of the Times, is of Times past (Pun intended) Since Murdoch took over it has gone down hill, both in integrity and content. It used to be one of our top and most reliable papers (In my view THE best), then again so did the Daily Mail and the now defunct NOTW.


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RE: News of the World - 7/9/2011 7:13:44 PM   
tweakabelle


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From: Sydney Australia
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

Tweaks......Let me remind you left wing spin doctors are as bad, if not worse. New labour not only released a "sexed up dossier" but then leaked the name of Dr Kelly who went on to commit suicide.

I didnt miss your point, I just went on to correct it. Most of us here in the UK can work out both sides have been as bad as each other when cosying up to Murdoch. Cameron admitted as much today.

We have a TV show called question time, where a chosen panel take questions from the public. One of the Labour shadow cabinet was in full swing when spouting off out cameron and Murdoch being pals. He shut up pdq when asked why he ( Labour politician ) attended Murdochs lavish summer party three weeks back.

Please keep posting though, cause if I ever get to visit the Melbourne Cup, I may want a room for the night.




I'm not sure I'd join you in viewing New Labour as 'left-wing'. 'Insipid' is one of the more polite words that spring to my mind in this instance.

While the left in the UK may well be just as bad, I do note the absence of my preferred UK rag, The Guardian (but not its weekend incarnation) from the list of media that used the dubious services of the PIs in question.

And while you more than welcome to stay if you're ever in Oz, I live in Sydney which is a thousand kms away from the Melbourne Cup venue. We could always watch it on TV I suppose .....

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Profile   Post #: 57
RE: News of the World - 7/10/2011 2:36:00 AM   
Politesub53


Posts: 14862
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline 		Good points Tweaky..... I used to vote Labour but havent done so for some time. First they leant too far left, not listening to what the working class wanted. New Labour just did a complete U-turn despite many having far left credentials. I have to give the Guardian full credit, it has really pushed this issue to get it into the open. My only wish is we had just one paper willing to operate without siding with one party or the other.

My feeling is we are going to hear a lot of things, about a lot of papers, that will come as a shock to many. There is already a seperate police inquiry into police corruption and hacking. Cameron has announced two full public inquiries. One into the criminal aspect and one into the press and its links to government.

(in reply to tweakabelle)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: News of the World - 7/10/2011 4:11:16 AM   
FirstQuaker


Posts: 787
Joined: 3/19/2011
Status: offline 		We haven't had a paper here yet that was impartial in two hundred some years of supposed attempts.

If they were impartial, that itself would make them suspicious, and  they would be accused of a secret agenda sponsored by whatever villain is on the list of the ones suspecting them.

I doubt anyone has the physical or moral courage to run one without some patronage for protection.

It would be nice to watch from a safe distance though while they lasted, much as a rabbit doing a belly dance in front of a pack of dogs would be.

"if you are walking on thin ice, you might as well dance" - Russian proverb

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Profile   Post #: 59
RE: News of the World - 7/10/2011 5:16:34 AM   
Moonhead


Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

Touching on my point to Tweaks about both parties being linked to Murdoch, this could get even worse. Not just for Murdoch but for Ed Miliband and another Murdoch paper, The Times. Tom Baldwin, Milibands spin doctor, has been accussed of hacking into Lord Ashcrofts ( Tory donor) bank accounts. This is said to have taken place back when Baldwin was a Times journalist.

The Times, suprisingly for a Murdoch paper, has said it expects three police officers and nine NOTW assosiated journalists to be jailed for this. You wouldnt expect on of Murdochs own papers to report this, without it being highly likely

Yesterday's Sun front page was quite surprising on that level as well.

Another point about closing the News of the Screws nobody's mentioned: when a paper closes down, it's traditional to wipe all of the computers and trash all of the files. Maybe somebody thinks that damage control is more important than the profits from a successful paper as they're already being prosecuted?

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to Politesub53)
Profile   Post #: 60
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