Being true to yourself (Full Version)

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PainObjectForUse -> Being true to yourself (7/11/2011 7:18:02 PM)

I just want to share something I have been thinking for a while. I believe that people who are into certain life styles, and not just here, but people who are in touch with their nature, their urges (wathever they may be), their personal needs, are more mature, more fulfiilled, accomplished. Not just that, but they seem to have an overall higher self-confidance, strenght of character and dependability.

As opposed to being in denial and repression, bound by SOME cultural spiritual and religious nonsensical rules and beliefs. Not to mention anachronic. Which in itself can lead to  psychosomatic disturbancies.

I wonder if anyone else feels the same .



LadyPact -> RE: Being true to yourself (7/11/2011 7:59:33 PM)

No, I really don't. I don't think kinky people are any different than any other cross section of society.  We aren't special, smarter, more enlightened or anything else.  We're just regular folks with kink splashed in.



Palliata -> RE: Being true to yourself (7/11/2011 8:04:20 PM)

Kink is simply a microcosm of society. Some are highly enlightened, some are petty dictators with delusions with grandeur. We are different, but not substantively.



LadyHibiscus -> RE: Being true to yourself (7/11/2011 8:04:34 PM)

Nope. Not in the slightest. Folks are folks, regardless of their proclivities.



DecadentDesire -> RE: Being true to yourself (7/11/2011 8:05:04 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: PainObjectForUse

I just want to share something I have been thinking for a while. I believe that people who are into certain life styles, and not just here, but people who are in touch with their nature, their urges (wathever they may be), their personal needs, are more mature, more fulfiilled, accomplished. Not just that, but they seem to have an overall higher self-confidance, strenght of character and dependability.

As opposed to being in denial and repression, bound by SOME cultural spiritual and religious nonsensical rules and beliefs. Not to mention anachronic. Which in itself can lead to  psychosomatic disturbancies.

I wonder if anyone else feels the same .


No, I don't. In fact, I think people in alternative lifestyles try to sell this notion of being more enlightened, mature, "in touch", and evolved, because they lack self-confidence and strength of character.



Missokyst -> RE: Being true to yourself (7/11/2011 8:13:35 PM)

Some people are quite happy in their repression and may view others who are hanging all out there as crass.

The only generality about human nature is that it is diverse.



PainObjectForUse -> RE: Being true to yourself (7/11/2011 8:35:17 PM)

It is refreshing to know such straightforward and diametral opinions from mine. I  feel I am proven right to some extent by these posts. But also learned something,which is preparing myself  to be met with strong healthy opposition.

What I am trying to point out is that psychosomatic disorders are caused by senseless repression created by absurd moral codes, that, in my humble opininion are an aberration and not part of human nature at all. 

SO, being in touch with our true desires is a healthier and more sensible thing to do.



Kaliko -> RE: Being true to yourself (7/11/2011 8:48:09 PM)

I took your post to mean not only people in alternative sexual type lifestyles, but any type of lifestyle that speaks to them....religious, veganism, artistic, whatever. So if that was the case, then yes, I do agree with you. There is a certain something to following your own desires and I do believe it provides one with a confidence and a willingness to shrug off the criticism and doubts of others.

That being said, I'm not one of those people. I can feel it in my heart and gut every night when I go to sleep that I am not practicing what I most fervently believe. So this isn't me saying that I am so enlightened. But people who manage to do it? Yes, I think they have a certain something that others who are still in the dark or denial about themselves haven't yet achieved.

And yes, I think that a repression, subconscious or otherwise, of what we truly desire can result in depression, anxiety, physical health issues, etc.



crazyml -> RE: Being true to yourself (7/11/2011 11:45:04 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: PainObjectForUse
I  feel I am proven right to some extent by these posts.


Boggles.



sunshinemiss -> RE: Being true to yourself (7/11/2011 11:51:53 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: PainObjectForUse

I just want to share something I have been thinking for a while. I believe that people who are into certain life styles, and not just here, but people who are in touch with their nature, their urges (wathever they may be), their personal needs, are more mature, more fulfiilled, accomplished. Not just that, but they seem to have an overall higher self-confidance, strenght of character and dependability.

As opposed to being in denial and repression, bound by SOME cultural spiritual and religious nonsensical rules and beliefs. Not to mention anachronic. Which in itself can lead to  psychosomatic disturbancies.

I wonder if anyone else feels the same .


You are talking about self-actualization - the highest point on Maslow's hierarchy of needs.  A very well respected and oft-quoted theory.  And in my estimation, it is true.  You are correct.  People who live their lives - WHEN THEY HAVE FACED THE REALITY - are more self-aware.  It takes a lot of personal autonomy and strength of character to go against the flow.  This is not about certain lifestyles so much as it is about being true to oneself (so aptly noted in your thread name).  In being more self-aware, one is healthier. 

I think where you lost people was the word "lifestyle" which I think you are using in this way - a self aware / self-examining way - versus the way the word is often bandied about in these parts - a "we're kinky and therefore better than the vanillas" manner.  If you had chosen a different word, I daresay the answers would have been very different. 

This is how I read what you wrote:

I've been thinking about how hiding and lying about one's nature can sometimes be harmful to oneself.  I've been thinking that maybe if I'm more honest with myself, I will be healthier.  I wonder if this is true for other folks as well.  For example, I"m thinking about people like - the gay person who comes out of the closet or the transgender person who bravely changes their body or the cancer survivor who refuses to hide that there is a scar on her neck where she had radiation.  I think that being honest about who and what we are, what is true for us - even if it goes against the flow - can make someone a healthier and happier person. 

As an aside, people with psychosomatic disorders get something out of them.  People who are repressed are sometimes that way for reasons other than unhealthy reasons, though.  Repression is very useful in the case of trauma so as not to debilitate someone for example.

I think you have had a couple of psych classes and are therefore mulling things over.  Good on you. 

You might want to rethink that absurd name, though.  It gives the suggestion that you are nothing EXCEPT your kink.  Hopefully you have more depth than that - from your post it would seem you do.

best,
sunshine




crazyml -> RE: Being true to yourself (7/12/2011 12:52:09 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: PainObjectForUse

I just want to share something I have been thinking for a while. I believe that people who are into certain life styles, and not just here, but people who are in touch with their nature, their urges (wathever they may be), their personal needs, are more mature, more fulfiilled, accomplished. Not just that, but they seem to have an overall higher self-confidance, strenght of character and dependability.

As opposed to being in denial and repression, bound by SOME cultural spiritual and religious nonsensical rules and beliefs. Not to mention anachronic. Which in itself can lead to  psychosomatic disturbancies.

I wonder if anyone else feels the same .


Why does someone have to be into a "certain lifestyle" in order to be fulfilled? I know plenty of vanilla bank clerks who are wonderfully fulfilled in their utterly mundane and conventional lives.

When you say "in touch" do you mean "willing to act on them" or could "in touch" also mean "reconciled to them"?

Where would you draw the line? Is someone who is fulfilled by maiming domestic pets allowed to be "in touch" with their "thang"? What about the person who gets of on murdering people, or fiddling with minors?

When you talk about "SOME" cultural, spiritual and religious nonsensical rules and beliefs, it's clear that you don't mean "ALL" - Which ones do you mean, and how are you qualified to determine which ones fall into which category? (I'd hasten to add that I make no claim whatsoever to be better qualified).

As soon as you invoke "culture", you're invoking "society", and this is where it gets tough. Very few cultural rules/taboos are "nonsensical", most of the taboos can be explained one way or another. Most western morality is derived from the Old and new testaments, and these books (the old testament in particular) defined a set of rules aimed at ensuring the success of a particular tribe in an arid, desert-like environment. I'm not defending them, or their applicability today, but there are explanations for most of these rules, so it's simply not fair to describe them as "nonsensical". They may be wrong of course, but that doesn't imply nonsense.

I don't think Maslow had BDSM in mind when he talked about "self actualisation", nor did I think he was expecting people to become renegades against social/cultural norms. I think he was talking about contentment, the ability to strive and thrive intellectually and spiritually.

Of course, there are many social "norms" that have to be challenged. Sexuality and Gender equality are the two that spring immediately to mind. In the context of BDSM, yes we should be content and grounded in our kinks - but even this is fraught. There are some kinks that I (subjectively) think are simply wrong, that others would argue are perfectly ok... who is right?

So you do make an interesting point, but your second post kind of did for your argument.

quote:

ORIGINAL: PainObjectForUse

It is refreshing to know such straightforward and diametral opinions from mine. I  feel I am proven right to some extent by these posts. But also learned something,which is preparing myself  to be met with strong healthy opposition.


My initial reaction was that the "i feel I'm proven right to some extent" riff was a little absurd. Perhaps yes, to some extent, provided that extent is pretty fucking small.

quote:




What I am trying to point out is that psychosomatic disorders are caused by senseless repression created by absurd moral codes, that, in my humble opininion are an aberration and not part of human nature at all. 


Now you're jumping the shark. Psychosomatic disorders have a whole range of causes, and "absurd moral codes" may play a part in some, but I doubt this gross generalisation is anywhere near being safe.

You need to qualify these "absurd moral codes" you refer to. I'll bet they're not "absurd", I mean, do you really think our predecessors were that stupid to cling to "absurd" rules? Again, that isn't to say that they're necessarily right, in any sense, but challenging taboos and moral "rules" by simply saying "Oh that's absurd" is a hide into nothing.

And taboos absolutely have a part in human nature, how the hell do you think these taboos came to pass and how do you think they came to endure - they're very very much part of human nature.

quote:



SO, being in touch with our true desires is a healthier and more sensible thing to do.



Fair enough, it's a little bit on the "fucking obvious" side of enlightenment, but fair dos, I agree with this one.



PainObjectForUse -> RE: Being true to yourself (7/12/2011 2:48:53 AM)

TO: crazyml

quote:


Why does someone have to be into a "certain lifestyle" in order to be fulfilled?


Yes, I need  to choose my words more carefully like people pointed out.

quote:


When you talk about "SOME" cultural, spiritual and religious nonsensical rules and beliefs, it's clear that you don't mean "ALL" - Which ones do you mean, and how are you qualified to determine which ones fall into which category? (I'd hasten to add that I make no claim whatsoever to be better qualified)


Yes. I need to be more specific and stop making generalizations.And I never said I was qualified. That would be overly presumptuous. I merely meant I don't agree with fundamentalist attitudes.

quote:


My initial reaction was that the "i feel I'm proven right to some extent" riff was a little absurd. Perhaps yes, to some extent, provided that extent is pretty fucking small.


Not at all absurd. Proven right in the sense that you are strong and confident in your posts and the defense of your views, helping me to evolve by making me understand the flaws in my thought process and that life is complex and not  black and white, And by making me understand I have a lot to work on myself.

quote:


Fair enough, it's a little bit on the "fucking obvious" side of enlightenment, but fair dos, I agree with this one.


Yeah, It's an annoying tendency of mine in order to try and fit in forums.

TO: sunshinemiss


quote:


I think you have had a couple of psych classes and are therefore mulling things over.  Good on you. 

You might want to rethink that absurd name, though.  It gives the suggestion that you are nothing EXCEPT your kink.  Hopefully you have more depth than that - from your post it would seem you do.


Psych class was over a longtime ago when I was 15. I am in self learning mode pretty much now.

Yes, I have a sort of bad taste when it comes to choosing user names. How about " diamond in the rough" sounds ?

And thank you for your wonderful post.

TO: HannahLynHeather
quote:


what the fucking fuck?

what you just wrote is one of the most insanely idiotic things i've ever fucking read. everyone on this forum is now dumber for having read it. may god have mercy on your soul.


THank you for that colourful post. Drop by any fucking time. [;)] I believe in a lot of things, I believe in Elvis, but I don't believe in god. And they were both dead the last time I checked.

TO: Kaliko

quote:


That being said, I'm not one of those people. I can feel it in my heart and gut every night when I go to sleep that I am not practicing what I most fervently believe. So this isn't me saying that I am so enlightened. But people who manage to do it? Yes, I think they have a certain something that others who are still in the dark or denial about themselves haven't yet achieved.



What keeps you from finding out and practidcing what you fervently "believe"?



HannahLynHeather -> RE: Being true to yourself (7/12/2011 2:51:21 AM)

quote:

THank you for that colourful post. Drop by any fucking time. I believe in a lot of things, I believe in Elvis, but I don't believe in god. And they were both dead the last time I checked.
good retort. but your initial premise is still fucking moronic.



PainObjectForUse -> RE: Being true to yourself (7/12/2011 3:15:03 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: HannahLynHeather

quote:

THank you for that colourful post. Drop by any fucking time. I believe in a lot of things, I believe in Elvis, but I don't believe in god. And they were both dead the last time I checked.
good retort. but your initial premise is still fucking moronic.


Live and learn. I believe in a direct approach and no fear of confrontation. Life would be pretty dull without and we wouldn't learn a fucking thing. An I wouldn't have met you. ON to my next moronic post.

Hmm, I think I will enjoy myself here.

P.S. - see you in our next match. Rocky has nothing on you.



HannahLynHeather -> RE: Being true to yourself (7/12/2011 4:43:05 AM)

god loves you. and i don't think you're to fucking bad myself.



Buzzzz -> RE: Being true to yourself (7/12/2011 6:20:57 AM)

It is fucking great to see all that fucking stuff going on on that fucking site. welcome to the fucking internet..... Now I feel better.



kalikshama -> RE: Being true to yourself (7/12/2011 6:37:30 AM)

quote:

I've been thinking about how hiding and lying about one's nature can sometimes be harmful to oneself. I've been thinking that maybe if I'm more honest with myself, I will be healthier. I wonder if this is true for other folks as well. For example, I"m thinking about people like - the gay person who comes out of the closet or the transgender person who bravely changes their body or the cancer survivor who refuses to hide that there is a scar on her neck where she had radiation. I think that being honest about who and what we are, what is true for us - even if it goes against the flow - can make someone a healthier and happier person.


This is how I read it, too. I think self-aware people are more self-aware, but not necessarily happier.

[image]http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2007/02/imsorrydave.jpg[/image]





sunshinemiss -> RE: Being true to yourself (7/12/2011 6:45:24 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: HannahLynHeather

god loves you. and i don't think you're to fucking bad myself.


Sure G*d loves you, but I'm his favorite.  :)



leadership527 -> RE: Being true to yourself (7/12/2011 7:22:40 AM)

Well, I think you got it sort of right in a garbled way.

I believe that people who are into certain life styles, and not just here, but people who are in touch with their nature, their urges (wathever they may be), their personal needs, are more mature, more fulfiilled, accomplished.
Sort of. What they are is more self-aware. I'm not sure which lifestyles might support an enhanced self-awareness but I'm going to guess that the answer is, "The right lifestyle for each individual." But yes, people who are more aware of themselves also tend to live happier and more successful lives.

As opposed to being in denial and repression, bound by SOME cultural spiritual and religious nonsensical rules and beliefs. Not to mention anachronic. Which in itself can lead to psychosomatic disturbancies.
Yes... but.... the way you've got this wrong is that you're assuming anyone else in the world is anything like you? As I noted above, the "right" lifestyle is going to be whichever one MOST fits the actual non-repressed person. So for some people, the "religious nonsense" lifestyle is going to be EXACTLY the thing which fits them.

Subjectivity's a bitch dude, but you need to police your own thoughts when thinking about humans in general. You need to always check and make sure that what you're thinking is about humans and not just about you.



Wolf2Bear -> RE: Being true to yourself (7/12/2011 8:56:53 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: PainObjectForUse

What I am trying to point out is that psychosomatic disorders are caused by senseless repression created by absurd moral codes, that, in my humble opinion are an aberration and not part of human nature at all. 



You seem to overlook one factor in all this: there are too many variables to human nature to accurately classify or pigeonhole what defines mortal code. Obviously there is a general agreement to most people's moral codes about murder, suicide, etc. Where it diverges is each one of us defines our own moral code to what we personally feel is right and what is wrong. A good example is the stance people take on abortion or assisted suicide or even same sex marriage. It is human nature to push boundaries and often the boundaries we push and expand are our own, thus the morality may not be acceptable yet that is subjective to the outsiders who are judging my morality against there own. Problem is what I determine what is moral or immoral is solely from my concept and it is not to be used to judge another.




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