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RE: Ronald Reagan on Debt Ceiling - 7/19/2011 10:06:38 PM   
cloudboy


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quote:

Saint Ronnie raised the debt ceiling 18 times and railed against the congress playing politics with raising the debt ceiling.



Before Reagan the US was the largest creditor nation in the world, afterward it was the largest debtor. RR also set the table for "no sacrifices," aka a culture where spending was NOT accompanied by tax increases to reflect the outflows. The Republicans are ready to send young soldiers off to war, yet can't ask the rich to pay more in taxes. Its just sick.....

History has shown that tax decreases increase the national debt. There has never been an exception to this.

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 7/19/2011 10:10:19 PM >

(in reply to juliaoceania)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: Ronald Reagan on Debt Ceiling - 7/19/2011 10:11:44 PM   
ladyneedshelp


Posts: 78
Joined: 4/18/2011
Status: offline 		Well I thought some liberal was going to rip my first post to shreds......point out all the half truths.....but I am so sorry...U were not fast enough......

My evil rich boss is forcing me to help him out (more hours) and darn his evil hide...he will insist on paying me for them! I have to be up in 5 hours....yawn....I will look forward to seeing it in the morning (if anyone cares to try)

Good night to all....hope U have sweet warm and fuzzy dreams!

Lady Pamela

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RE: Ronald Reagan on Debt Ceiling - 7/19/2011 10:58:09 PM   
rulemylife


Posts: 14614
Joined: 8/23/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: ladyneedshelp


Lenders quit lending when an borrower reaches a set ratio of income to debt.......when we reach that ceiling we should stop right? Or keep soaking the rich....... Ofcourse this ignores the fact that the poor end up paying in higher prices to cover those taxes....it does not matter so long as the evil rich pay dam it!


I see.

So if we cut taxes for the wealthy they will benevolently share their prosperity with us all.


(in reply to ladyneedshelp)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: Ronald Reagan on Debt Ceiling - 7/19/2011 11:11:09 PM   
rulemylife


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ladyneedshelp

Liberals can pick it apart? Really? Ok!


It wouldn't take much work considering the astounding number of inaccuracies.

Unfortunately it's a little too late and I'm a little too tired.

But let's try a few quick ones.

Bush had a Republican Congress for the majority of his time in office.

In the last two years of Clinton's term there was a budget surplus.

A surplus that Bush promptly pissed away with his tax cuts.





(in reply to ladyneedshelp)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: Ronald Reagan on Debt Ceiling - 7/20/2011 12:55:46 PM   
lockedaway


Posts: 1720
Joined: 3/15/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: ladyneedshelp

The report goes on to say that then Sen. Obama voted no to raising the limit. What it did not say was Obama's comments.....that it was irresponsible to heap debt on our children and grandchildren, and it showed profound lack of leadership. (Gotta give him some credit! )

The reporter said Reagan said the same thing Obama and Timmy the tax cheat are saying......what it did not say is he said that to a democrat congress.......hummmmmm

The goverment has been spending like there is no tomorrow....BOTH democrats and republicans! Not just during one or two admin. In each and every presidency the spending has risen. During Reagan's term (w/dems congress)it went up just over 1/2 trillion, during during Clinton's term(w/rep.congress) it went up almost as much. During most of Bush's term (w/dems.congress) it was just a bit higher.......then it exploded at the end.....but all together it was a bit more...up 3/4 trillion.(till2008) then Obama w/dems congress doubled it again with another doubling by 2015...........According to economists....in past reports, when a country passes a GDP/spending ratio, job growth slows dramatically. We are approaching that ratio. No matter what they do we are about to experience inflation.....we are already experiencing increased prices.....add inflation to what's going on and we the people (not the rich in the govt.) are going to be hurting.....and the goverment, in this case the democrats, want to spend MORE!!! That's not going to help!! It will only make it worse.... There comes a time when the free money ends and the intrest on that free money swamps everything. Before anyone says Obama is offering cuts.......anyone seen them in writing? Is he talking one trillion over 10 years? A drop in the bucket? And when Reagan agreed to tax increases it was on the promises of cuts from the democrats....most of which never came......same thing happened to bush..... Should we believe them again?

WTF???


Good post, Lady.  What the idiot libs do not seem to realize that something that perhaps needed to be done during Reagan could be running amok 30 years later.  SlaveMike talks about how you are incapable of depth or reasoning.  But read his posts.  Does he say anything?  SlaveMike is an Obama sycophant.  He is on disability, he gets a hand out and he is going to support the party of handouts because they bought his vote long ago.  Don't banter with him.  He is a leech and an irrelevant one at that.

(in reply to ladyneedshelp)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Ronald Reagan on Debt Ceiling - 7/20/2011 1:01:55 PM   
lockedaway


Posts: 1720
Joined: 3/15/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

quote:

Saint Ronnie raised the debt ceiling 18 times and railed against the congress playing politics with raising the debt ceiling.



Before Reagan the US was the largest creditor nation in the world, afterward it was the largest debtor. RR also set the table for "no sacrifices," aka a culture where spending was NOT accompanied by tax increases to reflect the outflows. The Republicans are ready to send young soldiers off to war, yet can't ask the rich to pay more in taxes. Its just sick.....

History has shown that tax decreases increase the national debt. There has never been an exception to this.


Cloud boy, perhaps you might remember a few other things about Regan's administration.  Just before Regan took office, the United States had already be relegated to a position of second place militarily behind Russia with S.A.L.T. 1.  Carter had agreed to S.A.L.T. 2 but wised up at the last moment.  Even still, out military was at its weakest since the demobilization after WW II.  Russia had invaded Afghanistan.  What was our tepid response?  We boycotted the Olympics.  Carter had absolutely destroyed the economy.  We had hostages in Iran.

Ok.....cloudboy???  That is the shit storm Ronaldus Maxmus took the country in.  At the end of his presidency, he bankrupted and destroyed the Soviet Union without a shot being fired.  No one YOU know was deployed to fight the Soviets, right?  Reagan took them down with competitive military spending, subterfuge and poking the Soviet Union in the eye wherever he could, 24 hours a day.  He was THE LAST PRESIDENT with a pair of balls.

(in reply to cloudboy)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: Ronald Reagan on Debt Ceiling - 7/20/2011 1:08:08 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: ladyneedshelp


Lenders quit lending when an borrower reaches a set ratio of income to debt.......when we reach that ceiling we should stop right? Or keep soaking the rich....... Ofcourse this ignores the fact that the poor end up paying in higher prices to cover those taxes....it does not matter so long as the evil rich pay dam it!


I see.

So if we cut taxes for the wealthy they will benevolently share their prosperity with us all.




We cut taxes for the wealthy for the last ten years and it hasn`t created jobs.

bush`s jobs performance was flat.

How many trillions did the bush tax cuts/stimulus package for millionaires, cost us ?


_____________________________

"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

President Obama

(in reply to rulemylife)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Ronald Reagan on Debt Ceiling - 7/20/2011 1:12:44 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		Carter actually started the funding of guerillas in afghanistan 1979.  St. Wrinklemeat was a johnny come lately.  

He ended Carter's grain embargo of the Soviet Union, which did not help hasten the fall.

The Soviet Union was pretty much unwilling to reform their economy (like the US) which was in serious trouble long before St. Wrinklemeat.

They were short of natural gas and paying thru the nose for it (much like us with oil) and funding what they could with oil exports (much like us borrowing).

They were worn out by a war that they couldnt win and would never end in Afghanistan (much like we are doing in Iraq and Afghanistan)

So, it goes a little beyond St. Wrinklmeat singlehandedly destroying the Soviet Empire, but he was in the right place at the right time, and some of his policies helped. 

Unfortunately most of his policies were very bad for the US in the long term, and that is what the neo-cons got out of it in their wrong as usual fashion, and are still espousing.

< Message edited by mnottertail -- 7/20/2011 1:40:38 PM >

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RE: Ronald Reagan on Debt Ceiling - 7/20/2011 2:26:35 PM   
MrRodgers


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ladyneedshelp

Right....lenders to government ignore all lending common sense.....oh and lenders from government)danny Mae/ferries mac ) ignore all safe lending pracitices.....but I am sure that will soon stop Obama said just a few weeks ago that U should think about renting.....UR own house was not such a good idea I suppose.

Dam thee I go...using that irritating U again...duhhh!

Lenders make their investment in US debt considering all factors, risk, cost, terms (maturity) all of the time. US federal debt continues as we write to be among the cheapest (low interest rates, most secure) i.e., safest debt in the world. If you are writing of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, they are not lenders, they are govt. guaranteed, low interest mortgage 'warehousers. They buy mortgages, package them and resell them until the recent slef-inflicted meltdown.

They buy up private mortgages at their qualifying terms under certain qualifying income/debt ratios. The rationale was to use its govt. (socialist) non free market insurance for low rates to earn profits on a small spread between the two rates. This sent cash back to the mortgage market which did nothing but enrich lenders and home builders.

Where they went wrong was that typically in govt., they were operated by greedy capitalist scum who actually walked away with untold $millions in bonuses. That was accomplished by unlike anytime in their history...borrowed billions more to further leverage their rent-seeking. The existence of those mortgage buyers was and has been bi-partisan since their inception. Was was not bi-partisan was the regulatory regime to which they were subject 2001-2008, which was virtually non-existent.




(in reply to ladyneedshelp)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Ronald Reagan on Debt Ceiling - 7/20/2011 2:29:06 PM   
willbeurdaddy


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Joined: 4/8/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers


. Was was not bi-partisan was the regulatory regime to which they were subject 2001-2008, which was virtually non-existent.






Thanks to Barney and Friends.

_____________________________

Hear the lark
and harken
to the barking of the dogfox,
gone to ground.

(in reply to MrRodgers)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Ronald Reagan on Debt Ceiling - 7/20/2011 2:48:41 PM   
MrRodgers


Posts: 10542
Joined: 7/30/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59


quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: ladyneedshelp


Lenders quit lending when an borrower reaches a set ratio of income to debt.......when we reach that ceiling we should stop right? Or keep soaking the rich....... Ofcourse this ignores the fact that the poor end up paying in higher prices to cover those taxes....it does not matter so long as the evil rich pay dam it!


I see.

So if we cut taxes for the wealthy they will benevolently share their prosperity with us all.




We cut taxes for the wealthy for the last ten years and it hasn`t created jobs.

bush`s jobs performance was flat.

How many trillions did the bush tax cuts/stimulus package for millionaires, cost us ?


Well the facts of the matter are, taxes in the US are at a 60 year low, while spending is at an all time high with only exception proportionally being WWII. The US has the overall 3rd lowest...that's lowest tax regime in the industrial west. Repubs have starting with Reagan, had no problem cutting taxes while increasing spending. In fact, Reagan vetoed the first budget sent to him for having too much pork.

In 2006, after starting two unpaid-for wars and creating an unpaid-for drug benefit, a vertical repub govt. passed the largest transportation bill in history with 15,000 earmarks. (pork)

Cutting taxes only...has never created jobs, only enriched those whose taxes were cut...individual and corporate. Jobs didn't come to the Reagan admin. until after he raised the payroll taxes and raised the capital gains tax and in fact at the calender end of 1983...unemployment was over 10%. Reagan cut taxes 3 times and raised taxes 11 times.

Repubs have raised the debt limit every year as presidents starting with Reagan.





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Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Ronald Reagan on Debt Ceiling - 7/20/2011 5:01:00 PM   
MrRodgers


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Joined: 7/30/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers


. Was was not bi-partisan was the regulatory regime to which they were subject 2001-2008, which was virtually non-existent.



Thanks to Barney and Friends.

Barney & friends had little to nothing to do with 2001-2008 as it was the repubs in power and when the dems tried to fix things...suffered 13 vetoes by Bush.
So...not even a nice try.

In fact, it was Bush who in 2005 when ALL 50 atty's general tried to use state law to get the shit-paper dealers to stop, used an 1863 OCC (office of the controller of the currency) to get the federal courts to rule that [it] and not the states were the regulators of question.

Here

(in reply to willbeurdaddy)
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RE: Ronald Reagan on Debt Ceiling - 7/20/2011 5:10:46 PM   
willbeurdaddy


Posts: 11894
Joined: 4/8/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers


Barney & friends had little to nothing to do with 2001-2008 as it was the repubs in power and when the dems tried to fix things...suffered 13 vetoes by Bush.
So...not even a nice try.


Rewriting history might work with your lib friends. It doesnt fly here.

From that conservative new source, the NYT:

September 11, 2003– The Bush Administration today recommended the most significant regulatory overhaul in the housing finance industry since the savings and loan crisis a decade ago.

Under the plan, disclosed at a Congressional hearing today, a new agency would be created within the Treasury Department to assume supervision of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, the government-sponsored companies that are the two largest players in the mortgage lending industry,

The new agency would have the authority, which now rests with Congress, to set one of the two capital-reserve requirements for the companies. It would exercise authority over any new lines of business. And it would determine whether the two are adequately managing the risks of their ballooning portfolios.

The plan is an acknowledgment by the administration that oversight of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac — which together have issued more than $1.5 trillion in outstanding debt — is broken. A report by outside investigators in July concluded that Freddie Mac manipulated its accounting to mislead investors, and critics have said Fannie Mae does not adequately hedge against rising interest rates.

Among the groups denouncing the proposal today were the National Association of Home Builders and Congressional Democrats who fear that tighter regulation of the companies could sharply reduce their commitment to financing low-income and affordable housing.

Barney and Maxine Waters blocked every attempt to rein in Frank Raines, Fannie, Freddie and the sham lending practices pushed by the Dems.

_____________________________

Hear the lark
and harken
to the barking of the dogfox,
gone to ground.

(in reply to MrRodgers)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Ronald Reagan on Debt Ceiling - 7/20/2011 5:36:35 PM   
lovmuffin


Posts: 3759
Joined: 9/28/2007
Status: offline 		Didn't Raines cook the books to secure an enormous bonus ?   Why has this never been prosecuted ? 

< Message edited by lovmuffin -- 7/20/2011 6:15:19 PM >

_____________________________

"Give a man a gun and he can rob a bank. Give a man a bank and he can rob the world." Unknown

"Long hair, short hair—what's the difference once the head's blowed off." - Farmer Yassir

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Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Ronald Reagan on Debt Ceiling - 7/20/2011 5:51:10 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline 		http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNBUzJX7uiw&feature=related


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bAH-o7oEiyY&feature=related

_____________________________

"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

President Obama

(in reply to lovmuffin)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Ronald Reagan on Debt Ceiling - 7/20/2011 5:52:31 PM   
outhere69


Posts: 1302
Joined: 1/25/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ladyneedshelp

Right....lenders to government ignore all lending common sense.....oh and lenders from government)danny Mae/ferries mac ) ignore all safe lending pracitices.....but I am sure that will soon stop Obama said just a few weeks ago that U should think about renting.....UR own house was not such a good idea I suppose.

Dam thee I go...using that irritating U again...duhhh!

Ummm....that's Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, and over 80% of their loans were good.  It was private subprime firms accumulating all the crap loans, and idiots on Wall Street who packaged them into securities (not even understanding their models).  Go check out "The Magnetar Trade" for a good example of firms that knew exactly what crap they were peddling.

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Profile   Post #: 36
RE: Ronald Reagan on Debt Ceiling - 7/20/2011 6:05:31 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline 		Fannie and freddie were/are the main scapegoats of bushies and neo-cons.

Barney Frank is darth vador in the story of woe and behind everything.

Those are the talking points and miss know-nothing is just repeating them.

The story goes that ALL the bad loans were FORCED on banks by the horrible heavy hands of goverment and given to bums and other poor people.Fannie and Fredie ruined the entire hosing market,and the auto industry and the AIG and Lehman Brothers and Citibank and etc.

Listen to a nutty-con today and they say anyone BUT bush was to blame.

One nutter the other day blamed Jimmy Carter for our current mess.

There`s a whole other group of nutters who seek to blame President Obama for what happened in '08'.


< Message edited by Owner59 -- 7/20/2011 6:06:21 PM >

_____________________________

"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

President Obama

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Profile   Post #: 37
RE: Ronald Reagan on Debt Ceiling - 7/20/2011 6:29:19 PM   
willbeurdaddy


Posts: 11894
Joined: 4/8/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: lovmuffin

Didn't Raines cook the books to secure an enormous bonus ?   Why has this never been prosecuted ? 


He repaid $25 million in bonuses and paid a $2 million dollar fine to get out of it. Ie his buddies in Congress kept him out of jail.

_____________________________

Hear the lark
and harken
to the barking of the dogfox,
gone to ground.

(in reply to lovmuffin)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Ronald Reagan on Debt Ceiling - 7/20/2011 6:37:07 PM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline 		Asshole(yes you locked) my "handout" was secured and guaranteed during Bush's term.....March 2005. I receive no handouts...none at all....what I receive is a WORKERS compensation check and a well earned SSI payment....both of these are forms of insurance ...neither is a hand out, ipso facto no one bought my vote.
I say this not because you are worth the effort...but just to exhibit how big an asshole you truly are

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


(in reply to willbeurdaddy)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Ronald Reagan on Debt Ceiling - 7/20/2011 7:06:58 PM   
lovmuffin


Posts: 3759
Joined: 9/28/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: lovmuffin

Didn't Raines cook the books to secure an enormous bonus ?   Why has this never been prosecuted ? 


He repaid $25 million in bonuses and paid a $2 million dollar fine to get out of it. Ie his buddies in Congress kept him out of jail.


And yet it didn't do much to fix the damage he helped caused.  It's not just the politicians but the looters and moochers that go along with them.


_____________________________

"Give a man a gun and he can rob a bank. Give a man a bank and he can rob the world." Unknown

"Long hair, short hair—what's the difference once the head's blowed off." - Farmer Yassir

(in reply to willbeurdaddy)
Profile   Post #: 40
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