RE: Oh NOOO!! Another Gay GOP sex scandel brewing (Full Version)

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housesub4you -> RE: Oh NOOO!! Another Gay GOP sex scandel brewing (8/16/2011 5:07:31 PM)

quote:



The right wants the same rights for everyone. Not different rights for the color of your skin, your gender, or your sexual preference.



Have you missed all their speeches about gays in the military, about marriage is only between a man and a woman, have you even see Bachman talk on TV or listend to her BS anti gay crap she spews, or even googled 1 of her husbands or her speeches????  Have you read or watched 1 of Kings hearings he put on last month???  MY GOD,,,how uninformed are you to make that statement

They want equal rights for people who do as they say and follow their beliefs. 




Theon38 -> RE: Oh NOOO!! Another Gay GOP sex scandel brewing (8/16/2011 5:11:39 PM)

quote:

Have you missed all their speeches about gays in the military, about marriage is only between a man and a woman, have you even see Bachman talk on TV or listend to her BS anti gay crap she spews, or even googled 1 of her husbands or her speeches???? Have you read or watched 1 of Kings hearings he put on last month??? MY GOD,,,how uninformed are you to make that statement


Yes, ive paid attention to all of that.

And I stand by my statement. We want everyone to be treated the same. No one should have special preference. Just because you choose to have sex with someone of your same gender shouldn't give you special status in the military (Since you brought that example up). Can you find the same gender attractive and serve in the military? You sure can.

Equal rights. Not special rights.




farglebargle -> RE: Oh NOOO!! Another Gay GOP sex scandel brewing (8/16/2011 5:14:02 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead


quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle


quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead


quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

Aren't CLOSETED politicians a national security risk, since they *can* be blackmailed to keep their "secret"?


There's been a few civil servants over here who've lost their jobs over that, but that was back when it was still possible to keep things like that secret. I suspect they might be less of a security risk these days...


The threat isn't being homosexual. The threat is being closeted, and therefore vulnerable to blackmail.

You miss my point: how many of your politicians have managed to stay in the closet rather than exposing themselves to the voters?


Well, if they're closeted, we wouldn't know that?




Iamsemisweet -> RE: Oh NOOO!! Another Gay GOP sex scandel brewing (8/16/2011 5:23:01 PM)

Depends on what you consider a right, Theon.  I notice you are married.  Do you consider marriage a right?  Because I sure do, and the "Right" is pretty adamant about gays not having that right. 

quote:

ORIGINAL: Theon38

quote:

What I did state was that the only place on the political spectrum that contests gay rights is the Right. Opposition to gay rights is pretty much an exclusively Right wing phenomenon. Opposition to womens' rights is largely a Right wing phenomenon. This is the case throughout the Western world. This is also why arguments asserting equivalence across the spectrum fail completely.


I think you're wrong about this.

The right wants the same rights for everyone. Not different rights for the color of your skin, your gender, or your sexual preference.




tazzygirl -> RE: Oh NOOO!! Another Gay GOP sex scandel brewing (8/16/2011 5:23:45 PM)

quote:

And I stand by my statement. We want everyone to be treated the same. No one should have special preference. Just because you choose to have sex with someone of your same gender shouldn't give you special status in the military (Since you brought that example up). Can you find the same gender attractive and serve in the military? You sure can.


How is that "special" status?




tweakabelle -> RE: Oh NOOO!! Another Gay GOP sex scandel brewing (8/16/2011 5:30:37 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Theon38

quote:

Have you missed all their speeches about gays in the military, about marriage is only between a man and a woman, have you even see Bachman talk on TV or listend to her BS anti gay crap she spews, or even googled 1 of her husbands or her speeches???? Have you read or watched 1 of Kings hearings he put on last month??? MY GOD,,,how uninformed are you to make that statement


Yes, ive paid attention to all of that.

And I stand by my statement. We want everyone to be treated the same. No one should have special preference. Just because you choose to have sex with someone of your same gender shouldn't give you special status in the military (Since you brought that example up). Can you find the same gender attractive and serve in the military? You sure can.

Equal rights. Not special rights.

So please tell me:
- When two men or two women wish to marry each other, where does the opposition come from? The Left? The Centre? The Right?
- Currently laws prohibit gays marring each other but permit hetero marriages. Is that equal rights? Or special rights for some and no rights for others?
- Who opposes changing laws to permit gays marrying? The Left? The Centre? The Right?
- Who opposes reproductive freedom for women? The Left? The Centre? The Right?

No one wants special laws for any one. The current situation is that some people do have special rights especially in relation to marriage. I would like to see every one having the same rights. The Left and many in the Centre of politics advocate legal changes to make the law equal for all - why does the Right (and by and large, only the Right) oppose these measures?




Theon38 -> RE: Oh NOOO!! Another Gay GOP sex scandel brewing (8/16/2011 5:30:41 PM)

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Do you consider marriage a right?


I absolutely, 100%, do not consider marriage to be a right. Other things I do not consider to be rights (So you can see where i'm coming from) are housing, food, water, shelter, etc.

Provide them for yourself, or beg charity from others, but don't expect the government to provide these things.





housesub4you -> RE: Oh NOOO!! Another Gay GOP sex scandel brewing (8/16/2011 5:31:13 PM)

It's the right who does NOT want them treated equally,  

They (the Gays) are not asking for special treatment, they are asking for EQUAL treatment.

Same with marriage, it's the RIGHT pushing for laws forbidding same sex couples the right to marry.

For a group that says they want smaller government they sure want to tell people how they can live, and what they can do in their bedroom  ie Perry and the anti sodomy laws he refused to take off the books

Are you saying the right supports the law of the land when they want Drs arrested for performing legal medical procedures??  I mean hell, the right even wants women who are raped to pay the state for the kit to prove they where raped (NJ last week)  How is that equal????








tazzygirl -> RE: Oh NOOO!! Another Gay GOP sex scandel brewing (8/16/2011 5:35:08 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Theon38

quote:

Do you consider marriage a right?


I absolutely, 100%, do not consider marriage to be a right. Other things I do not consider to be rights (So you can see where i'm coming from) are housing, food, water, shelter, etc.

Provide them for yourself, or beg charity from others, but don't expect the government to provide these things.




Thats not the question I asked you.




willbeurdaddy -> RE: Oh NOOO!! Another Gay GOP sex scandel brewing (8/16/2011 5:38:48 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: housesub4you

Same with marriage, it's the RIGHT pushing for laws forbidding same sex couples the right to marry.



It would be the first time Ive ever heard CA described as right leaning, if you were correct.

The fact is you want to put everyone into neat little buckets. The real world, even in politics, doesnt work that way.




Theon38 -> RE: Oh NOOO!! Another Gay GOP sex scandel brewing (8/16/2011 5:41:41 PM)

quote:

So please tell me:
1) When two men or two women wish to marry each other, where does the opposition come from? The Left? The Centre? The Right?
2) Currently laws prohibit gays marring each other but permit hetero marriages. Is that equal rights? Or special rights for some and no rights for others?
3) Who opposes changing laws to permit gays marrying? The Left? The Centre? The Right?
4) Who opposes reproductive freedom for women? The Left? The Centre? The Right?


1) Too hard to answer. For example, California is a left state. Obama won it pretty handily in 2008. Yet, a new constitutional amendment to keep marriage defined in the State Constitution as between 1 man and 1 woman was passed.

2) Yes, that is equal rights. The law prevents all sorts of marriage contracts. It prevents a person from marrying an animal. A father his daughter. An adult to a child. A living being to an inanimate object. One person from marrying multiple people. This is not an exhaustive list, just all I could think of at the moment. However, everyone has the equal right to marry 1 person of the opposite sex that is of age. Your choice not to do that doesn't take that right away from you.

3) Same as #1.

4) Shouldn't number 4 read, "Who opposes the murder of innocent children?" The answer to that is clearly the right. ;)

See, it's all in how you write a question. If you ask a loaded question, don't expect a straight answer.




Theon38 -> RE: Oh NOOO!! Another Gay GOP sex scandel brewing (8/16/2011 5:44:05 PM)

quote:

They (the Gays) are not asking for special treatment, they are asking for EQUAL treatment.


Ah, but they already have EQUAL treatment. Equal treatment, too.




Theon38 -> RE: Oh NOOO!! Another Gay GOP sex scandel brewing (8/16/2011 5:46:25 PM)

quote:

How is that "special" status?


Any status that is not equal to what everyone else gets is special. What's with the scare quotes?





Theon38 -> RE: Oh NOOO!! Another Gay GOP sex scandel brewing (8/16/2011 5:48:58 PM)

quote:

I mean hell, the right even wants women who are raped to pay the state for the kit to prove they where raped (NJ last week) How is that equal????


This sounds more like a libertarian position than a right position.

Although I don't consider myself libertarian, I do agree with this position. If someone broke my arm, they should pay for it. If they cannot be found and forced to pay, then i'll have to pay for it.

Why should I expect others to pay for me? Sure, it was a horrible thing that happened to me. But I see no reason why men with guns should go to your house and take your money to pay for me because something horrible happened to me.




tazzygirl -> RE: Oh NOOO!! Another Gay GOP sex scandel brewing (8/16/2011 6:01:31 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Theon38

quote:

How is that "special" status?


Any status that is not equal to what everyone else gets is special. What's with the scare quotes?




I didnt post a scare quote.  Nor do I see what the men and women in the military are asking for as special.  If you are a serviceman, and you are caught in bed with a woman... no biggie.  Caught in bed with a man, discharge.

How is that equal?




tazzygirl -> RE: Oh NOOO!! Another Gay GOP sex scandel brewing (8/16/2011 6:04:54 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Theon38

quote:

I mean hell, the right even wants women who are raped to pay the state for the kit to prove they where raped (NJ last week) How is that equal????


This sounds more like a libertarian position than a right position.

Although I don't consider myself libertarian, I do agree with this position. If someone broke my arm, they should pay for it. If they cannot be found and forced to pay, then i'll have to pay for it.

Why should I expect others to pay for me? Sure, it was a horrible thing that happened to me. But I see no reason why men with guns should go to your house and take your money to pay for me because something horrible happened to me.


How do you find the man who raped a woman without a rape kit to 1) prove you were raped and 2) Id with certainty who the rapist was?

If you are a victim of rape you shouldnt have to pay for this.




domiguy -> RE: Oh NOOO!! Another Gay GOP sex scandel brewing (8/16/2011 6:13:00 PM)

theon is not up to these forums.

what does an adult have in common with a child, a relative, an animal or a group of people?

The only comparison to be made is that a heterosexual adult is allowed to marry where a homosexual adult is not.

Stay on point if it is possible.




domiguy -> RE: Oh NOOO!! Another Gay GOP sex scandel brewing (8/16/2011 6:16:57 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Theon38

quote:

Have you missed all their speeches about gays in the military, about marriage is only between a man and a woman, have you even see Bachman talk on TV or listend to her BS anti gay crap she spews, or even googled 1 of her husbands or her speeches???? Have you read or watched 1 of Kings hearings he put on last month??? MY GOD,,,how uninformed are you to make that statement


Yes, ive paid attention to all of that.

And I stand by my statement. We want everyone to be treated the same. No one should have special preference. Just because you choose to have sex with someone of your same gender shouldn't give you special status in the military (Since you brought that example up). Can you find the same gender attractive and serve in the military? You sure can.

Equal rights. Not special rights.



Until recently where have gays received equal treatment in the military. Clinton tried to allow everyone to be allowed to serve in the military but opted for DADT as a compromise, until then if you were gay you were not allowed to serve.

Where is there special status given to gays in the military?

I would expect a direct answer.




kalikshama -> RE: Oh NOOO!! Another Gay GOP sex scandel brewing (8/16/2011 6:18:47 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Theon38

quote:

I mean hell, the right even wants women who are raped to pay the state for the kit to prove they where raped (NJ last week) How is that equal????


This sounds more like a libertarian position than a right position.

Although I don't consider myself libertarian, I do agree with this position. If someone broke my arm, they should pay for it. If they cannot be found and forced to pay, then i'll have to pay for it.

Why should I expect others to pay for me? Sure, it was a horrible thing that happened to me. But I see no reason why men with guns should go to your house and take your money to pay for me because something horrible happened to me.


What about the police sketch artist who makes a picture of the person who broke your arm? Should you pay for that? If someone is murdered, should his family pay for the CSI?

Look, we pay TAXES for these services. I find it offensive that rape victims are singled out to not receive crime investigation services.




tweakabelle -> RE: Oh NOOO!! Another Gay GOP sex scandel brewing (8/16/2011 7:00:23 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Theon38

quote:

So please tell me:
1) When two men or two women wish to marry each other, where does the opposition come from? The Left? The Centre? The Right?
2) Currently laws prohibit gays marring each other but permit hetero marriages. Is that equal rights? Or special rights for some and no rights for others?
3) Who opposes changing laws to permit gays marrying? The Left? The Centre? The Right?
4) Who opposes reproductive freedom for women? The Left? The Centre? The Right?


1) Too hard to answer. For example, California is a left state. Obama won it pretty handily in 2008. Yet, a new constitutional amendment to keep marriage defined in the State Constitution as between 1 man and 1 woman was passed.

2) Yes, that is equal rights. The law prevents all sorts of marriage contracts. It prevents a person from marrying an animal. A father his daughter. An adult to a child. A living being to an inanimate object. One person from marrying multiple people. This is not an exhaustive list, just all I could think of at the moment. However, everyone has the equal right to marry 1 person of the opposite sex that is of age. Your choice not to do that doesn't take that right away from you.

3) Same as #1.

4) Shouldn't number 4 read, "Who opposes the murder of innocent children?" The answer to that is clearly the right. ;)

See, it's all in how you write a question. If you ask a loaded question, don't expect a straight answer.

What a pathetic series of cowardly cop outs.

Anything that doesn't suit your political purpose is ignored as "too hard" to answer. It's not too hard - it's very simple to distinguish where the opposition to gay marriage comes from. All you need to do is open your eyes.

We all know (as you do too) that only the Right opposes gay marriage. Do you really think for a minute that any one is going to persuaded by your childish response? Or the word games you play in response to the second question? Are you seriously suggesting that the marriage of two adults who love each other is comparable to incest or bestiality? Such responses reveal a level of hatred and contempt for gays and other sexual minorities that is seriously offensive on a site like this. An attitude confirmed in your subsequent posts.

Why don't you just come out and say it: You don't think gays are the same as you and don't deserve equal rights? At least that would be honest. Your position is truly that of the Right - equal rights for people who are the same as me and f--k the rest - it's dishonest, narrow minded, bigoted, offensive and (if you are some variety of kinkster) utterly hypocritical.





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