RE: Drug Testing Welfare applicants proven waste of money.... (Full Version)

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DomYngBlk -> RE: Drug Testing Welfare applicants proven waste of money.... (8/22/2011 5:56:05 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: FantasyKisses

I live in a welfare town, quite literally. Social Security, TANF, and General Assistance are responsible for 'paying' the bulk of the income in this area. Far more people receive welfare of some sort than hold jobs. This is not conjecture, this comes from multiple demographic studies by a variety of sources, both government and non.

I am also a disabled American who used to be a tax payer. I had an industrial accident, received nothing from Worker's Comp and was wheelchair-bound for some time before teaching myself how to walk again out of necessity. Now that I can walk unassisted (except in the winter, but hey, it snows here), I am trying to get retrained because I cannot go back into my work sector. I believe in being a tax payer and employed. I believe that welfare, in all forms should be limited (though I think there should be added assistance for those people who have no children and are trying to get back to work). I don't believe that people should be able to make a career out of welfare and that the qualifications for things like mental health should be restricted further because mental health diagnosis and care is out of control in this country. (If you were to look at further demographics, you'd notice that most of the residents in my town are bipolar. Which turns a legitimate mental health condition into a freakin' epidemic.)

Most of the people on welfare -post edit: in my town- are on drugs. That has also been proven by government and independent studies. (While self-answered questionnaires may indeed be skewed, both of the health groups here release information as part of their HIPAA consent forms.) I know first hand that drug use here is common in the mental health districts, and that people go so far as to let their rent slide in order to purchase drugs with welfare money and that a lot of people will sell their prescriptions for illegal drugs. (Btw, I'm also a criminal justice student and politically active.)

That being said, I am enthusiastically all for drug testing and I think there should be a federal law that requires pharmacies to report to PCPs. I think there needs to be more pro-social training courses for people as well, such as cooking classes, comparative shopping lessons, and gardening classes for those on food stamps. --Secondary Post Edit: I also think junk food and energy drinks should be banned from the program because it is not uncommon to go into a convenience store and see an energy drink with a hand written sign below it that proudly proclaims "foodstampable". (Why is that even a word???)-- I think that budgeting classes should be mandatory for people on any form of welfare, and that programs like Section 8 and energy assistance should pay landlords and utility companies directly instead of putting the money in the hands of the recipient. Drug testing results may be dependent on the type of drug used, length of time and tolerance to said drug, the person's body type and biology, however it can work for many cases including non-prescription medication abuse as many medications have a half life and build up in one's system.

Smoking pot may be the least offensive, but I do not think that people on welfare should be able to buy pot. Cigarettes, yes. They are legal for the moment. But I would also like to see alcohol (which is more of an epidemic as far as abused substances go) be put on the same chopping block as tobacco (and I'm a smoker). Then again, I think the manufacturing sector needs to be brought back to the US so we have jobs and can stop this so-called 'Cycle of Poverty' because too many people around the country see welfare as an answer.



Have any idea of how unsympathetic that sounds to people that are basically in the same situation you are?




MusicalBoredom -> RE: Drug Testing Welfare applicants proven waste of money.... (8/22/2011 6:44:29 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or

Yeah, that retroactive money is fucking great when they shut your electricity off and there is an $80 charge to get it turned back on.

Oh yeah, it's fair.

T^T


Find a state that doesnt have shutoff protection for low income households.


I live in two states.  NY has shutoff protection, Louisiana does not. Now using standard collarchat statistics gathering and reporting methods, 50% of the states do have cut off protection.





rulemylife -> RE: Drug Testing Welfare applicants proven waste of money.... (8/22/2011 7:00:53 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: FantasyKisses

I live in a welfare town, quite literally. Social Security, TANF, and General Assistance are responsible for 'paying' the bulk of the income in this area. Far more people receive welfare of some sort than hold jobs. This is not conjecture, this comes from multiple demographic studies by a variety of sources, both government and non.

I am also a disabled American who used to be a tax payer. I had an industrial accident, received nothing from Worker's Comp and was wheelchair-bound for some time before teaching myself how to walk again out of necessity. Now that I can walk unassisted (except in the winter, but hey, it snows here), I am trying to get retrained because I cannot go back into my work sector. I believe in being a tax payer and employed. I believe that welfare, in all forms should be limited (though I think there should be added assistance for those people who have no children and are trying to get back to work). I don't believe that people should be able to make a career out of welfare and that the qualifications for things like mental health should be restricted further because mental health diagnosis and care is out of control in this country. (If you were to look at further demographics, you'd notice that most of the residents in my town are bipolar. Which turns a legitimate mental health condition into a freakin' epidemic.)

Most of the people on welfare -post edit: in my town- are on drugs. That has also been proven by government and independent studies. (While self-answered questionnaires may indeed be skewed, both of the health groups here release information as part of their HIPAA consent forms.) I know first hand that drug use here is common in the mental health districts, and that people go so far as to let their rent slide in order to purchase drugs with welfare money and that a lot of people will sell their prescriptions for illegal drugs. (Btw, I'm also a criminal justice student and politically active.)

That being said, I am enthusiastically all for drug testing and I think there should be a federal law that requires pharmacies to report to PCPs. I think there needs to be more pro-social training courses for people as well, such as cooking classes, comparative shopping lessons, and gardening classes for those on food stamps. --Secondary Post Edit: I also think junk food and energy drinks should be banned from the program because it is not uncommon to go into a convenience store and see an energy drink with a hand written sign below it that proudly proclaims "foodstampable". (Why is that even a word???)-- I think that budgeting classes should be mandatory for people on any form of welfare, and that programs like Section 8 and energy assistance should pay landlords and utility companies directly instead of putting the money in the hands of the recipient. Drug testing results may be dependent on the type of drug used, length of time and tolerance to said drug, the person's body type and biology, however it can work for many cases including non-prescription medication abuse as many medications have a half life and build up in one's system.

Smoking pot may be the least offensive, but I do not think that people on welfare should be able to buy pot. Cigarettes, yes. They are legal for the moment. But I would also like to see alcohol (which is more of an epidemic as far as abused substances go) be put on the same chopping block as tobacco (and I'm a smoker). Then again, I think the manufacturing sector needs to be brought back to the US so we have jobs and can stop this so-called 'Cycle of Poverty' because too many people around the country see welfare as an answer.



So it's OK for you to be given assistance, but everyone else is a bi-polar, drug addicted alcoholic who needs to be cut off?

Conservative hypocrisy at its finest.










tazzygirl -> RE: Drug Testing Welfare applicants proven waste of money.... (8/22/2011 10:05:41 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Take a look back at the welfare threads willbe and refresh your memory.  If you cant be honest, this discussion is over.


Not worth my time. I dont remember seeing any, I do remember you strawmanning about it often.


You often have a selective memory.  and a twisted definition of strawmanning.



wilbur has never said anything negative about anyone at any given time tazzy. You have obviously miscontrued his words.....


Nope.. I am his favorite target.  And he will sniff anyone's asshole to take a swipe at me.




flcouple2009 -> RE: Drug Testing Welfare applicants proven waste of money.... (8/22/2011 11:18:09 AM)

I would take a swipe if you bent over    [:D]




ricken -> RE: Drug Testing Welfare applicants proven waste of money.... (8/22/2011 12:04:06 PM)

As someone that is (once again) unemployed, I found myself back at the food stamp place....3 visites @ about 4 hours each, I get a great big $95.00 a month. Guess there the answer to those extra 30 pounds I got, but thats another subject.

I wouldn't have an issue with taking a drug test, thats the hoop they want me to jump through, fine, I don't do dope anyway. AND....this is going to be bad but....

If your getting money from welfare, it should be a last resort and you shouldn't be able to afford drugs, cigs, or booz.....

But since I'm in Il and a state contractor that did the drug testing just got busted for theft
http://www.suntimes.com/7213768-417/contractor-with-ties-to-blago-pleads-guilty-to-theft.html

But since our government is ran by a bunch of scum sucking assholes all the way from pres on down I know (YES FUCKING KNOW!!!) the crooks will do nothing more than have us piss in the jar, and as soon as we leave, flush the sample, flip a coin, and check off a box that decides if we got caught doing something or not.

So, yeah drug testing is a wast of time and money




kalikshama -> RE: Drug Testing Welfare applicants proven waste of money.... (8/22/2011 12:11:21 PM)

A friend of mine who is a former scumbag who rehabilitated himself says he never gave a dirty urine if he knew about the test in advance. I'm sure the $30 tests are the easiest fooled.

I think this whole welfare recipients using drugs is a big red herring. Companies like GE are the real cheats:

5 Ways GE Plays the Tax Game

April 4, 2011

by Jeff Gerth, ProPublica, and Allan Sloan,
A version of this story was co-published with Fortune.

General Electric’s tax department is famous for inventing ways to pay Uncle Sam less. So it should come as no surprise that its CEO, Jeff Immelt, is in the crosshairs as the new chairman of the President’s Council on Jobs and Competitiveness.

The job puts him in the limelight as Washington debates ways to make the tax system fairer, respond to competition from low tax countries and cut the federal deficit — competing imperatives sure to confound reform efforts. If the debate does get serious, attention is likely to focus on whether to get rid of some of the special tax advantages that benefit GE and other multinational companies.

Still, GE is in a class by itself. Here are five ways the company pares its tax rate well below the top U.S. corporate rate of 35 percent — sometimes into the single digits.

...Strategy No. 4: Move Jobs Overseas, Get a Tax Break

Congress is famous for writing bills with fine print and pleasing titles. Take the American Jobs Creation Act of 2004. It actually led GE to shift some of its aviation leasing operations to Ireland in order to qualify for a tax deferral. The law’s tax provisions also saved GE hundreds of millions of dollars in taxes annually, according to company filings.

...According to Irish public records, GE also set up a new aviation funding corporation in Ireland with about $15 billion in assets — and no employees.




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