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Hit and Miss - 9/9/2011 2:45:03 PM

amandie

Posts: 31
Joined: 9/21/2010
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So you are lined up on the cross for your Dom/me
first time with your new Dom/me..he/she aims the flogger at you..
and hits your spine..do you think next shot will be better.. he/she manages to hit your ass but also catches your spine...Do you think well maybe it will improve..

and this goes on all night you find that the pain you are feeling sends you to sub space and your Dom/me has told you your safe word...
which at this moment in time you cannot remember what it was and if you could you would not be able to say it anyway....

And your Dom/me is to inexperienced to notice there is anything wrong if you got into trouble..
After the session is finished you cannot move...and need help to be laid down...

After care consists of a blanket and a glass of water and looking in your direction now and again.

Now my question is do you want another session with the same Dom/me because you feel something for them or do you run as fast as you can when you can....because there is a danger that you could have been seriously injured.

Post #: 1

RE: Hit and Miss - 9/9/2011 2:49:55 PM

IrishMist

Posts: 7480
Joined: 11/17/2005
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I would not have been on the cross to begin with.

However, I would never have another session with a person who did not know what they were doing. I would not blame them though. The blame would lie with me for being stupid enough to allow myself to be put in that position with someone who was a novice.

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Post #: 2

RE: Hit and Miss - 9/9/2011 3:01:14 PM

Aileen1968

Posts: 6062
Joined: 12/12/2007
From: I miss Shore, New Jersey
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What's wrong with the fucking sub that they can't open their mouth and tell the person swinging the flogger that the spine hits are tough?
Long before they go into sub space. People need to take responsibility for their own well being.

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Post #: 3

RE: Hit and Miss - 9/9/2011 3:11:47 PM

NuevaVida

Posts: 6707
Joined: 8/5/2008
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Add me to the "take responsibility for yourself" line of thinking. Also, if I did put myself in that position and things went as described in the OP, I would neither get back on the cross, nor run. I'd have a conversation with the person to figure out what went wrong and how to avoid it the future.

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Post #: 4

RE: Hit and Miss - 9/9/2011 3:16:11 PM

SimplyMichael

Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
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OH MY FUCKING GOD, KILL ME NOW!!!!!!!!!

Jay Wiseman is the kink of the safety nazi's according to many, he testifies in court about kink and safety. Guess how many injuries do to idiots with floggers he can report? Not fucking many, in fact the only way to really hurt someone with a flogger is to beat them with the handle!!!

The whole myth about beating kidneys? MYTH...at least with a leather flogger. Same goes for the spine, a piece of engineering designed to protect the nerves from claws and teeth intent on killing you, not some fat slob with a cheap flogger...

Now, I am sure some with know a friend who knows someone who hear that someone died from a flogger but I know that person and she made it up.

(in reply to Aileen1968)

Post #: 5

RE: Hit and Miss - 9/9/2011 3:16:19 PM

UberBrat

Posts: 45
Joined: 5/14/2011
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I don't think, in that position, the Dom/me would actually be to blame. If the sub doesn't make them aware that the flogger is actually hitting their spine (and actually, isn't that okay anyway? I'm sure while playing my back has been struck and I've been absolutely fine), the sub is to blame - they should be able to be responsible for their own safety (and yes, while that may not be possible in subspace, theyre not going to slip into subspace from the first strike).

If that was me, I'd probably run in the opposite direction. But then, I am lucky that I would never be in that situation - my Master would know what he was doing. And, if he wanted to try something with me that he'd never done before, even if it was a little risky, I imagine I'd be more than happy. He would tell me it was a first for him, and we would try it together, but I would take responsibility, and if he made a mistake (such as striking my spine) I'd make him aware of that. I can't really imagine what that could be, though!

< Message edited by UberBrat -- 9/9/2011 3:18:36 PM >

(in reply to Aileen1968)

Post #: 6

RE: Hit and Miss - 9/9/2011 3:18:53 PM

LadyHibiscus

Posts: 27124
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From: Island Of Misfit Toys
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Thank you, Michael.

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Post #: 7

RE: Hit and Miss - 9/9/2011 3:18:58 PM

Aileen1968

Posts: 6062
Joined: 12/12/2007
From: I miss Shore, New Jersey
Status: offline

Heh. I thought it was a bit over exaggerated too. I love when he hits me hard on the spine with the flogger.

But the general idea of a sub having no responsibility for themselves is just ridiculous.

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Post #: 8

RE: Hit and Miss - 9/9/2011 3:21:42 PM

M4S73R

Posts: 232
Joined: 9/5/2011
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THANK YOU MICHEAL

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Post #: 9

RE: Hit and Miss - 9/9/2011 3:24:38 PM

SimplyMichael

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Joined: 1/7/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aileen1968

Heh. I thought it was a bit over exaggerated too. I love when he hits me hard on the spine with the flogger.

But the general idea of a sub having no responsibility for themselves is just ridiculous.

Aileen, while I agree, it is also a problem when people DO do stupid stuff that causes harm. Although the reality is that there are very few real physical injuries, at least not in proportion to the amount of hand wringing one sees online. One sees all the hand wringing because if you talk about safety, newbies and idiots think "wow, you must be really safe to play with"...

Me, I just tell em I haven't killed anyone recently...

(in reply to Aileen1968)

Post #: 10

RE: Hit and Miss - 9/9/2011 3:42:19 PM

Aileen1968

Posts: 6062
Joined: 12/12/2007
From: I miss Shore, New Jersey
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael
Aileen, while I agree, it is also a problem when people DO do stupid stuff that causes harm.

All people involved in the stupid stuff are responsible. It's never one sided. If someone picks a lousy partner because they have poor judgement...then it's their responsibility because they picked them.

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Post #: 11

RE: Hit and Miss - 9/9/2011 3:45:53 PM

kalikshama

Posts: 14805
Joined: 8/8/2010
Status: offline

I don't like to interrupt a scene with feedback in sentence form so will use:

ow
OW
OW!
OW!
OW!
OW!
OW!

with an occasional "wrapping!" or "yellow" or "red."

I covered the spine topic afterwards by pointing out the diagram in "Screw the Roses, Send me the Thorns" that shows what areas can be hit w what intensities.

I also make clear ahead of time that I need lots of aftercare. I need to cuddle, I might get cold so need to have lots of flannel and covers handy. I might need chocolate and liquid.

I think you bear responsibility here for unclear communication, but if the chemistry/connection wasn't good, no need for followup.

I've had scenes with people where it was clear that post-scene communication would not improve matters sufficiently to try again.

(in reply to amandie)

Post #: 12

RE: Hit and Miss - 9/9/2011 3:55:00 PM

SimplyMichael

Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: amandie

So you are lined up on the cross for your Dom/me
first time with your new Dom/me..he/she aims the flogger at you..
and hits your spine..do you think next shot will be better.. he/she manages to hit your ass but also catches your spine...Do you think well maybe it will improve..

and this goes on all night

Two things, as the dominant, I would never play with this person again or at least not till she had learned to stand up for herself because I am fucking good but I am not fucking psychic.

quote:

ORIGINAL: amandie
you are feeling sends you to sub space and your Dom/me has told you your safe word...
which at this moment in time you cannot remember what it was and if you could you would not be able to say it anyway....

Which points out why many are not keen on A. playing with newbies, B. safe words, C, all of the above. In other words, two idiots playing together = problems and why "bad dominant threads" are stupid.

quote:

ORIGINAL: amandie

After care consists of a blanket and a glass of water and looking in your direction now and again.

That would be WAY too much aftercare for some people and not enough for others. If she asked for more and didn't get it, doesn't make the guy evil, just a bit clueless. If she didn't ask for it and wants to bitch afterwards, she just earned the "slowly back away and make no sudden movements" award and would be someone I would keep a wide berth from.

quote:

ORIGINAL: amandie

Now my question is do you want another session with the same Dom/me because you feel something for them or do you run as fast as you can when you can....because there is a danger that you could have been seriously injured.

I pitty the dominant in this situation because this nitwit he is playing with sounds like a drama queen. Not only that, nothing you wrote about is anything that a decent conversation wouldn't cure. Again, people who keep all this shit locked inside are best avoided and this is the exact sort of crap that causes most of the drama in the scene. Idiots fucking up, taking no responsiblity for their actions, and dipshit horndogs desperate for pussy grabbing torches and pitchforks hoping to get a sympathy fuck.

(in reply to amandie)

Post #: 13

RE: Hit and Miss - 9/9/2011 4:18:00 PM

LadyPact

Posts: 32566
Status: offline

First, absolute agreement with IrishMist and NV as well, but I didn't want to have multiple quotes just to applaud their statements.

quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

OH MY FUCKING GOD, KILL ME NOW!!!!!!!!!

Jay Wiseman is the kink of the safety nazi's according to many, he testifies in court about kink and safety. Guess how many injuries do to idiots with floggers he can report? Not fucking many, in fact the only way to really hurt someone with a flogger is to beat them with the handle!!!

The whole myth about beating kidneys? MYTH...at least with a leather flogger. Same goes for the spine, a piece of engineering designed to protect the nerves from claws and teeth intent on killing you, not some fat slob with a cheap flogger...

Now, I am sure some with know a friend who knows someone who hear that someone died from a flogger but I know that person and she made it up.

Thank you for the common sense on some of this. I'm beginning to think some of it is a lost cause.

Frankly, every top out there has had a strike that didn't land exactly where they expected it to. Even those who have been doing it for a long time, practiced before we ever used that flogger on a person, and all that other stuff, mistakes can happen and they don't tend to put a person in the ER.

~~~~~~~

OP,

If you are playing with somebody who has absolutely no accuracy, the only person to blame is YOU! The only out that you get from this responsibility is if YOU told that person that you wanted the scene to stop and they didn't let you off of that cross. The latter of which I can't imagine you even contemplating going for round number two.

Here's an idea. Screen your play partners. Hey, if they don't play in public for you to be able to do so, set up a target (anything a few inches in diameter will do) and see if they can hit it with the toy they want to use on your ass. If they can't do it....... PASS. Find somebody who can. Otherwise, whatever situation you put yourself in is your own responsibility.

_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

(in reply to SimplyMichael)

Post #: 14

RE: Hit and Miss - 9/9/2011 4:20:37 PM

SimplyMichael

Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline

@LadyPact

Being the trouble making asshole I am, I love going to dungeon's with newbie DMs and doing entire scenes while only wrapping the tails, flogging the face, tailbone and the soft spots behind the knees.

Its so funny, so many hand wring over "wrapping" and yet that is exactly what a single tail does in essense and is far more dangerous but those are "okay" while many get their panties in a bunch if you don't flog "right"...

(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 15

RE: Hit and Miss - 9/9/2011 4:49:04 PM

LadyPact

Posts: 32566
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

@LadyPact

Being the trouble making asshole I am, I love going to dungeon's with newbie DMs and doing entire scenes while only wrapping the tails, flogging the face, tailbone and the soft spots behind the knees.

Its so funny, so many hand wring over "wrapping" and yet that is exactly what a single tail does in essense and is far more dangerous but those are "okay" while many get their panties in a bunch if you don't flog "right"...

Well, put yourself in the DM's shoes. More than likely, it would be somebody else at the club bringing their concerns to the DM, so at that point, they really don't have a choice but to go and check out what you're doing. It puts the fears of the other club patron at rest to see that the person on the floor is responding to concerns. I mean, that is what we tell people to do, rather than to try to stop a scene themselves. I'd be surprised if you didn't find that in the dungeon rules of any public club.

I'll probably have to end it at that. I seem to have been hijacking threads a lot lately.

_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

(in reply to SimplyMichael)

Post #: 16

RE: Hit and Miss - 9/9/2011 5:20:30 PM

SimplyMichael

Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

Well, put yourself in the DM's shoes. More than likely, it would be somebody else at the club bringing their concerns to the DM, so at that point, they really don't have a choice but to go and check out what you're doing. It puts the fears of the other club patron at rest to see that the person on the floor is responding to concerns. I mean, that is what we tell people to do, rather than to try to stop a scene themselves. I'd be surprised if you didn't find that in the dungeon rules of any public club.

I'll probably have to end it at that. I seem to have been hijacking threads a lot lately.

And just think how well the lesson will be learned...its all because I care, lol!

(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 17

RE: Hit and Miss - 9/9/2011 6:00:55 PM

LadyHibiscus

Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline

Saw a scene stopped at a big event. Wrapping with a BUNNY FLOGGER.

Made of bunny fur, not an actual bunny.

True story.

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Post #: 18

RE: Hit and Miss - 9/9/2011 6:15:42 PM

Lucylastic

Posts: 40310
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: amandie

So you are lined up on the cross for your Dom/me
first time with your new Dom/me..he/she aims the flogger at you..
and hits your spine..do you think next shot will be better.. he/she manages to hit your ass but also catches your spine...Do you think well maybe it will improve..

and this goes on all night you find that the pain you are feeling sends you to sub space and your Dom/me has told you your safe word...
which at this moment in time you cannot remember what it was and if you could you would not be able to say it anyway....

And your Dom/me is to inexperienced to notice there is anything wrong if you got into trouble..
After the session is finished you cannot move...and need help to be laid down...

After care consists of a blanket and a glass of water and looking in your direction now and again.

Now my question is do you want another session with the same Dom/me because you feel something for them or do you run as fast as you can when you can....because there is a danger that you could have been seriously injured.

If the bottom didnt tell me what the issue was, I would never play with the bottom again.If I cannot trust a bottom to be honest with their "problems" limits or other situations, they are a danger to themselves and I would consider them to be more dangerous than anything I could do to them.
Having said that... I do not ignore what is happening to ANY bottom I play with. But negotiation before hand ...proper negotiation is a must with a new "play partner. Long term people and pain sluts are a slightly different kettle of fish, but hoenstly 99.9999999% of tops are NOT mindreaders, even more so inexperienced ones

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(in reply to amandie)

Post #: 19

RE: Hit and Miss - 9/9/2011 6:23:57 PM

JanahX

Posts: 3443
Joined: 8/21/2010
Status: offline

quote:

Now my question is do you want another session with the same Dom/me because you feel something for them or do you run as fast as you can when you can....because there is a danger that you could have been seriously injured.

I'm sure there are lots of people that are into spinal injuries. That is a fetish I see all over the place, hardly ever a limit. People line up for that sort of thing, Nothing like being paralized/crutches/walker/wheel-chair as a momento of a "kinky-good-time!"

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Post #: 20

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