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Bankrupt Solar Company A Republican Problem, Not Just O... - 9/13/2011 7:08:20 PM   
Owner59


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http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/09/13/solyndra-bankrupt-solar-republican-problem_n_960287.html

The White House will have some explaining to do Wednesday when the Energy and Commerce Committee demands to know how half a billion taxpayer dollars were squandered.

But the explanation is likely to include a history lesson that goes back to the GOP.

That's because Solyndra first came into the picture during the Bush administration, when it was one of just 16 firms found eligible for several billion dollars available in the Energy Policy Act of 2005's guaranteed loan program.

And more, the Energy Policy Act, which the Bush administration used to promote Solyndra, was passed by the same committee under the leadership of Rep. Joe Barton (R-Texas).

One Democrat noted that while the GOP has been having a field day with the involvement of an Obama bundler, another major investor in a similar position is Madrone Capital Partners, run by Walmart's Walton family -- major GOP donors.

Further, the Bush administration nearly pushed a guaranteed loan through for Solyndra the day before Obama took office, ThinkProgress reported


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RE: Bankrupt Solar Company A Republican Problem, Not Ju... - 9/13/2011 7:44:15 PM   
willbeurdaddy


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Yeah, finances 6 years ago is a major problem compared to the company already being in the shitter when they were given a half a billion, with rumors of there being major contributions to the Obama campaign. Nice try.

< Message edited by willbeurdaddy -- 9/13/2011 7:45:03 PM >


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RE: Bankrupt Solar Company A Republican Problem, Not Ju... - 9/13/2011 8:06:23 PM   
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You're both wrong- it's a US problem. It's not only Solyndra that failed, there have been 3 failures of US firms. The Chinese are sewing up the market- this is no time to be arguing whether it's a Democratic or Republican problem.

Sam

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RE: Bankrupt Solar Company A Republican Problem, Not Ju... - 9/13/2011 8:10:51 PM   
willbeurdaddy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: samboct

You're both wrong- it's a US problem. It's not only Solyndra that failed, there have been 3 failures of US firms. The Chinese are sewing up the market- this is no time to be arguing whether it's a Democratic or Republican problem.

Sam


Yes, its a US problem, you just missed what the problem is. Trying to pick winners and losers in business is a government problem that lies primarily on the left side of the aisle.

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RE: Bankrupt Solar Company A Republican Problem, Not Ju... - 9/13/2011 8:12:07 PM   
Owner59


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Says the party that destroyed our economy.

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RE: Bankrupt Solar Company A Republican Problem, Not Ju... - 9/13/2011 8:28:53 PM   
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quote:

Yes, its a US problem, you just missed what the problem is. Trying to pick winners and losers in business is a government problem that lies primarily on the left side of the aisle.


Yeah, on the right the problem has become finding someone in the party who isn't criminally insane of just plain fucking weird to run as your presidential candidate.
   Better go with Gingrich... he can invoke Bob Dole a lot and it'll at least be funny.



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RE: Bankrupt Solar Company A Republican Problem, Not Ju... - 9/13/2011 8:52:44 PM   
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fr:
This is kinda close to home.
The lady who lives about ten miles from me was involved with these folks. They were suppose to put a "solar farm" on her property and sell the electricity to edison and she was to get a percentage of the proceeds...visions of early retirement...she was over here yesterday calling them everything except nice guys.

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RE: Bankrupt Solar Company A Republican Problem, Not Ju... - 9/14/2011 9:09:58 AM   
samboct


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Check out this article in solar buzz: http://solarbuzz.com/facts-and-figures/market-facts/global-pv-market

One of the interesting points, is that China has a 15% discount for PV cells/modules sold in Japan/West. Isn't this the definition of dumping?


Sam

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RE: Bankrupt Solar Company A Republican Problem, Not Ju... - 9/14/2011 12:03:37 PM   
lovmuffin


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  500 million out of the porkulous package to loan these guys and now the administration says they were duped.  LMAO,  what else have they been duped on.

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RE: Bankrupt Solar Company A Republican Problem, Not Ju... - 9/14/2011 12:06:10 PM   
Sanity


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FR -

quote:

House probing $528M loan to failed solar company
- 28 minutes ago

The Obama administration's eagerness to deliver economic stimulus may have influenced a federal review of a loan to a now bankrupt solar panel manufacturer, a move that may have left taxpayers on ...


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RE: Bankrupt Solar Company A Republican Problem, Not Ju... - 9/14/2011 12:49:08 PM   
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edited to make new post

< Message edited by Lucylastic -- 9/14/2011 1:07:47 PM >


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RE: Bankrupt Solar Company A Republican Problem, Not Ju... - 9/15/2011 10:40:22 AM   
samboct


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Just found this article in the NY Times: http://topics.nytimes.com/top/news/business/energy-environment/solar-energy/index.html

The Chinese are dumping, there's no question. I think they're using Amazon's model- basically get market share no matter what, then worry about profitability when everybody else has no choice. You can argue that Solyndra's technology wasn't ready for prime time, but Evergreen and SpectraWatt looked like they should work.

I think the Chinese are basically targeting First Solar's pricing which is now down to $.76 per watt for a cell. However, since their cells aren't efficient as silicon, the larger modules required eats up some of this cost savings. But I think the Chinese have said we're going to make sure that our stuff is competitive with First Solar come hell or the Great Wall.

The question remains- what are we going to do about it?

Sam

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RE: Bankrupt Solar Company A Republican Problem, Not Ju... - 9/15/2011 10:42:48 AM   
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quote:

ORIGINAL: samboct
The question remains- what are we going to do about it?

Sam



Await the great free market and the cutting edge innovation of capitalism (two things that do not include the US)

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RE: Bankrupt Solar Company A Republican Problem, Not Ju... - 9/15/2011 10:49:35 AM   
slvemike4u


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quote:

ORIGINAL: lovmuffin

  500 million out of the porkulous package to loan these guys and now the administration says they were duped.  LMAO,  what else have they been duped on.
Seems they believed the Republicans had Americas best interests in mind.
Man were they fucking duped!

< Message edited by slvemike4u -- 9/15/2011 10:50:24 AM >


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RE: Bankrupt Solar Company A Republican Problem, Not Ju... - 9/15/2011 11:12:58 AM   
SternSkipper


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quote:

500 million out of the porkulous package to loan these guys and now the administration says they were duped. LMAO, what else have they been duped on.


Ummm ... I am pretty sure you're gonna have a pretty tough time sourcing a statement saying "we were duped" to anyone in the administration.
   What you're succumbing to is all the third party claims I think. I've been following this pretty well I think. And while I see PLENTY of claims by El Rushbo (known drug criminal / suspected dealer) and other similarly credible sources, But I have yet to find a credible journalistic source attributing a statement indicating the white house staff claiming to have been duped. At best you'll see them offering the explanation that it is hard to predict winners and losers. Or that they do not feel that anyone acted inappropriately.


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RE: Bankrupt Solar Company A Republican Problem, Not Ju... - 9/15/2011 11:41:29 AM   
samboct


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I don't think anyone in either administration was duped. I think people gambled, and lost- or didn't realize how badly the game was rigged against them. For Solyndra- the technology wasn't ready although clearly folks in Washington wanted it to be- it was an easy solution. The problem is that there's no plan B- what do we do now that Solyndra has failed, as well as a few other US firms?

Its really hard to argue that anyone was duped- that would have entailed an empty factory or a factory making junk. Instead, they got a line producing solar cells- and ones that were innovative with decent performance- but not killer, which is what they needed. Plus they were ugly. Clearly, we did get something for our half a billion- nobody just skated with the money- it just wasn't enough. This is what happens when you get complacent and the competition passes you, all the effort it the world doesn't make up for the lead that the opposition has. Unlike a track sprint-this is an area where we can throw money at it. It's going to cost us more than if we would have been awake in the first place, but it's still a viable option now. It won't be in a few years.

Sam

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RE: Bankrupt Solar Company A Republican Problem, Not Ju... - 9/15/2011 11:57:57 AM   
Arturas


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59





http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/09/13/solyndra-bankrupt-solar-republican-problem_n_960287.html

The White House will have some explaining to do Wednesday when the Energy and Commerce Committee demands to know how half a billion taxpayer dollars were squandered.

But the explanation is likely to include a history lesson that goes back to the GOP.

That's because Solyndra first came into the picture during the Bush administration, when it was one of just 16 firms found eligible for several billion dollars available in the Energy Policy Act of 2005's guaranteed loan program.

And more, the Energy Policy Act, which the Bush administration used to promote Solyndra, was passed by the same committee under the leadership of Rep. Joe Barton (R-Texas).

One Democrat noted that while the GOP has been having a field day with the involvement of an Obama bundler, another major investor in a similar position is Madrone Capital Partners, run by Walmart's Walton family -- major GOP donors.

Further, the Bush administration nearly pushed a guaranteed loan through for Solyndra the day before Obama took office, ThinkProgress reported




AH...NO. This is pure crap and everyone living in reality knows it. Why? A hugh spin using half truths. For example, "Solyndra first came into the picture during the Bush administration, when it was found..."

Not So, here is the truth. The results of the Congressional probe shared Tuesday with ABC News show that less than two weeks before President Bush left office, on January 9, 2009, the Energy Department’s credit committee made a unanimous decision not to offer a loan commitment to Solyndra. Notice the loan commitment was not made until Obama's administration, overriding yet another department tasked to make such decisions.

And, excerpted from "Free Republic", 9/14/11.
quote:

The geniuses in the Obama administration don’t seem to realize just how damaging this is to their case. Put the Bush DOE rejection of Solyndra together with the emails that broke last night:

The August 2009 e-mails, released to The Washington Post, show White House (my note: OBAMA White House) officials repeatedly asking OMB reviewers when they would be able to decide on the federal loan and noting a looming press event at which they planned to announce the deal. In response, OMB officials expressed concern that they were being rushed to approve the company’s project without adequate time to assess the risk to taxpayers, according to the e-mails, which were provided by Republican congressional investigators…

And you have a true scandal that reaches directly into the Obama White House, and which clearly fits into the overall Obama “green” agenda. The main question demanding an answer now is, What did the president know and when did he know it?


Almost forgot this gem:
quote:

And more, the Energy Policy Act, which the Bush administration used to promote Solyndra, was passed by the same committee under the leadership of Rep. Joe Barton (R-Texas).


Oh great, here we see the word "promote" used to somehow imply Bush ran round pushing this company for a loan and then when he "nearly" gave them the loan but somehow never got to it, he must have sent Obama a letter "promoting" the company for a loan and since we know Obama always does what Bush wants, then it must be Bush's fault. Okay, you win. I see the infallible logic in this. Oh, and I get the fact that a republican got the very much needed Energy Policy Act passed, but what has that got to do with this? OH, I see, it implies the Energy Policy Act, if never enacted by republicans, would not have gotten Obama in trouble here and so it's Bushes fault.


Let's take this final great point offered up as a good reason to blame Bush:


quote:

Further, the Bush administration nearly pushed a guaranteed loan through for Solyndra the day before Obama took office, ThinkProgress reported



The word "nearly" is meaningless here. Bush did not push the loan through. If he "nearly" did it this would matter only if he was playing horseshoes. It would be more truthful to say Bush "nearly" did it until he read the recommendation not to do it presented by the DOE.

So, this Clown in Chief has still not gotten it, the "blame Bush" strategy, while being the only available strategy left to the Community Organizer some idiots voted into the White House, has gotten transparent even to progressives it being this far into his administration, such as it is.



< Message edited by Arturas -- 9/15/2011 12:06:28 PM >


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RE: Bankrupt Solar Company A Republican Problem, Not Ju... - 9/15/2011 12:08:44 PM   
mnottertail


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I am not quite sure what the asswipe you are blowholing is about, but yeah, it is alot of money, and frankly, among the many concerns is the Chinese dropping their prices for conventional panels by 30%, it didn't help the value proposition, nor the company.

Of course we are in the Wal-Mart mindset here. The longer payoff, for the efficiency and quality just ain't working.

Buy cheap consumable junk, toss it and go again.



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RE: Bankrupt Solar Company A Republican Problem, Not Ju... - 9/15/2011 12:19:33 PM   
Arturas


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Then vote for somebody to repeal NAFTA, withdrawal China's most favored trading partner status, reinstate tariffs on Chinese goods that equalize their price. Move production back into the U.S. and return us to a first world country status with a AAA credit rating because we cannot keep selling each other life insurance and fast food, we have to make things again. In short, start winning the trade war already in progress. There's a republican from Texas talking about this.

< Message edited by Arturas -- 9/15/2011 12:21:19 PM >


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RE: Bankrupt Solar Company A Republican Problem, Not Ju... - 9/15/2011 12:43:02 PM   
mnottertail


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Yeah, well a republican from Texas can go fuck himself. Its undoable, we should have not let Nixon walk in that motherfucker, we should start working our own value proposition, and we should quit with the shoddy goods and build shit like we mean it.

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