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RE: Marriage and D/s - 9/22/2011 9:07:22 PM   
Iamsemisweet


Posts: 3651
Joined: 4/9/2011
From: The Great Northwest, USA
Status: offline 		Yes, that is the usual boring argument one hears against prenups. Except at least 50% of marriages end in divorce. Then people wish they had a prenuptial. Why not discuss this shit beforehand? It certainly goes a long way to determining if you are really compatible. Otherwise, if the relationship fails, the state gets to decide who gets what and how things go.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Amygdalin


quote:

ORIGINAL: Iamsemisweet

My advice is the same advice I give to everyone getting married - do a prenup.


I never did understand that. Kind of like setting yourself up for failure. If your mentality is skewered before you set out to do something, good luck seeing it through to completion.


_____________________________

Alice: But I don't want to go among mad people.
The Cat: Oh, you can't help that. We're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.
Alice: How do you know I'm mad?
The Cat: You must be. Or you wouldn't have come here.

(in reply to Amygdalin)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: Marriage and D/s - 9/22/2011 9:27:40 PM   
Amygdalin


Posts: 69
Joined: 6/28/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Iamsemisweet
Yes, that is the usual boring argument one hears against prenups.


Ah, I see. Because it is my opinion, which differs from yours, it is boring. I never said I was 100% right. Read my other comments to see that. I sympathize with those taken advantage of.

quote:

Except at least 50% of marriages end in divorce.


Again you are starting from "a glass half empty" perspective. Sorry if you have gone through this, but not everybody does. So in the case of Sophia and so many others, don't be a wet blanket of sorts. Marriage is a good thing. A wonderful thing. It may end in tragedy, but so can a strictly dating relationship. What is the sense of pissing on it? Everyone knows nothing in life is certain. We all deal with it.

quote:

Why not discuss this shit beforehand? It certainly goes a long way to determining if you are really compatible.


To me, talking about "insurance," this has nothing to do with compatibility. If a girl brought this up, it would be an insult to me. It would show she didn't trust me and didn't truly know me. And I would expect any girl to feel the same if I brought it up to her.

(in reply to Iamsemisweet)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: Marriage and D/s - 9/22/2011 9:59:07 PM   
Iamsemisweet


Posts: 3651
Joined: 4/9/2011
From: The Great Northwest, USA
Status: offline 		Sweetie, I am a divorce attorney. So don't get a prenuptial. I make most of my money off people who don't. Works for me.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Amygdalin


quote:

ORIGINAL: Iamsemisweet
Yes, that is the usual boring argument one hears against prenups.


Ah, I see. Because it is my opinion, which differs from yours, it is boring. I never said I was 100% right. Read my other comments to see that. I sympathize with those taken advantage of.

quote:

Except at least 50% of marriages end in divorce.


Again you are starting from "a glass half empty" perspective. Sorry if you have gone through this, but not everybody does. So in the case of Sophia and so many others, don't be a wet blanket of sorts. Marriage is a good thing. A wonderful thing. It may end in tragedy, but so can a strictly dating relationship. What is the sense of pissing on it? Everyone knows nothing in life is certain. We all deal with it.

quote:

Why not discuss this shit beforehand? It certainly goes a long way to determining if you are really compatible.


To me, talking about "insurance," this has nothing to do with compatibility. If a girl brought this up, it would be an insult to me. It would show she didn't trust me and didn't truly know me. And I would expect any girl to feel the same if I brought it up to her.


_____________________________

Alice: But I don't want to go among mad people.
The Cat: Oh, you can't help that. We're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.
Alice: How do you know I'm mad?
The Cat: You must be. Or you wouldn't have come here.

(in reply to Amygdalin)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: Marriage and D/s - 9/22/2011 10:06:58 PM   
Amygdalin


Posts: 69
Joined: 6/28/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Iamsemisweet

Sweetie, I am a divorce attorney. So don't get a prenuptial. I make most of my money off people who don't. Works for me.


Sure thing. I am not most people though, so I think I'll do okay. I have found that most people that tell me not to do something or that it's "really hard" to succeed at something mostly just are terrible at the given subject or don't care enough to try their best. Just because the majority agrees on something doesn't make it the right way.

(in reply to Iamsemisweet)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: Marriage and D/s - 9/22/2011 10:22:46 PM   
Iamsemisweet


Posts: 3651
Joined: 4/9/2011
From: The Great Northwest, USA
Status: offline 		I don't believe I ever told you to do or not to do anything. I was responding to the OP.
OP, good luck on your marriage. A good marriage is a beautiful thing.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Amygdalin


quote:

ORIGINAL: Iamsemisweet



Sure thing. I am not most people though, so I think I'll do okay. I have found that most people that tell me not to do something or that it's "really hard" to succeed at something mostly just are terrible at the given subject or don't care enough to try their best. Just because the majority agrees on something doesn't make it the right way.


_____________________________

Alice: But I don't want to go among mad people.
The Cat: Oh, you can't help that. We're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.
Alice: How do you know I'm mad?
The Cat: You must be. Or you wouldn't have come here.

(in reply to Amygdalin)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: Marriage and D/s - 9/22/2011 10:26:59 PM   
Amygdalin


Posts: 69
Joined: 6/28/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Iamsemisweet

I don't believe I ever told you to do or not to do anything. I was responding to the OP.
OP, good luck on your marriage. A good marriage is a beautiful thing.


Ah, am sorry, since you quoted my post in your last one. Figured you were addressing my exact words. My fault.

But I agree. Best wishes, Sophia.

(in reply to Iamsemisweet)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Marriage and D/s - 9/22/2011 11:11:37 PM   
SophiaChan


Posts: 15
Joined: 4/30/2006
Status: offline 		You guys are all very funny with your prenup stuff. While I appreciate all that discussion, it really is beside the point for me. We have agreed to cross that road, legally, when we come to it. For now, I own a piece of junk car that I don't care about and I rent my home. I have tons of student loan debt and hardly any furniture. He owns about the same amount in India (where he is from).

This brings me to my next point. While I appreciate the lengthy post about Islamic countries, he is not Muslim or from one of those countries. I am Catholic, he is Hindu. We both very much love and respect each others religions and enjoy the celebrations and beliefs of both and we would raise our children to be the same.. both Catholic and Hindu. Because we believe that neither spiritual path is more valid than the other and in fact compliment each other beautifully. So, no worries about him stealing my children (IF we have any) and since I made India my home for 4 yrs, I'm pretty sure that I have a good grasp on what marrying into that culture would entail. And I wouldn't say that I am worried about him giving into his family pressure because from what I've seen he is extremely stubborn and just does as he wants. While I do worry about my time with his family, I feel that I can weather that storm. Equally, I don't really see his mother moving to this country and living with us. This topic was another discussion that we had and have hacked to death. As in, I laid out all my possible worries involving his family in front of him and our two best friends (also Indian) and we talked through every logical possibility. It was good and needed.

As for him becoming a citizen, it will not happen. India does not formally recognize dual citizenship and he would give up many of his rights as an Indian citizen if he became an American. While this COULD happen, I find it unlikely and pretty unnecessary all in all. So, I think that pretty much covers all of those worries.

Thanks again for the lovely advice!! Any thoughts on D/s contracts or collaring contracts. Who has used them, for what, and when?

(in reply to Amygdalin)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: Marriage and D/s - 9/23/2011 1:58:42 AM   
DonGiovani


Posts: 129
Joined: 8/28/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: littlewonder

Having been married I can tell you that the most difficult thing to overcome was having to integrate our differences so that we could live cohesively as one unit, taking each other into account instead of being selfish, having to think as a family instead of the self, to compromise. If you're already living together then you've probably already been doing this and you don't have any leaps to make except for the legal aspects of documents and such.




Quote for truth. Even living together well doesn't mean there won't be bumps or bones of contention that come out of left field. People change, and marriage is a huge catalyst for that.

With that being said, best of luck to you!

< Message edited by DonGiovani -- 9/23/2011 1:59:43 AM >

(in reply to littlewonder)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: Marriage and D/s - 9/23/2011 3:26:50 AM   
Mr4sg


Posts: 99
Joined: 9/2/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Amygdalin


quote:

ORIGINAL: Iamsemisweet

My advice is the same advice I give to everyone getting married - do a prenup.


I never did understand that. Kind of like setting yourself up for failure. If your mentality is skewered before you set out to do something, good luck seeing it through to completion.


It is because of outdated laws supporting women. Any Dom worth his stones wont accept a chance of half his possessions ending up with his sub.

Second, its not setting up for failure. Buying health insurance does not set you up to become sick.!

_____________________________

Don't argue with idiots. It lowers you to their level where they beat you with experience.

(in reply to Amygdalin)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: Marriage and D/s - 9/23/2011 3:33:12 AM   
Mr4sg


Posts: 99
Joined: 9/2/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Pteryx777

quote:

As for him becoming a citizen, that will not likely happen as he loves his country.


this is a common misconception. he can get US citizenship and keep dual citizenship.


Not true. Some countries require you hand over your citizenship of your original country once you accept a different citizenship.

Netherlands for one, does not allow its citizens to acquire a second citizenship without giving up their Dutch citizenship.

This is tied to the fact that all Dutch citizens have access to (free) forms of education, healthcare and retirement from the government,
even when living abroad !

_____________________________

Don't argue with idiots. It lowers you to their level where they beat you with experience.

(in reply to Pteryx777)
Profile   Post #: 50
RE: Marriage and D/s - 9/23/2011 8:36:25 AM   
Amygdalin


Posts: 69
Joined: 6/28/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mr4sg
Second, its not setting up for failure. Buying health insurance does not set you up to become sick.!


You are right. Health insurance doesn't set you up to be sick. But it is purchased in case you get sick. It is insurance. A safety net.

Just like a prenup is made in case there is a divorce. It means you have divorce on your mind before you even get married. Which shows me you don't have much faith in your partner.

I'm not going to respond to this anymore because I feel like I am destroying dear Sophia's thread and I don't want that. If you want to debate this, start a new thread on prenups and I'll go back and forth with you until your domly stones turn old and grey.

(in reply to Mr4sg)
Profile   Post #: 51
RE: Marriage and D/s - 9/23/2011 9:02:29 AM   
kalikshama


Posts: 14805
Joined: 8/8/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tj444

quote:

ORIGINAL: kalikshama
My ex husband and I had personality tests done before we got married, and, among other things, learned that I was more extroverted and that it might be a good idea for me to be the social director.

hmmm, find that interesting.
Knowing what you know now and that he is your ex now, do you think those tests should have been more of a red flag to the two of you? If you could do it again, would you still have married him or what would you have done differently? I know hindsight is 20/20 tho..


I would still have married him. We were married 14 years, separated the last 4. I wasn't old enough to drink when I got married - we grew apart over time. We were both in the military when we met, and there were tremendous advantages to getting married, especially overseas as we were. After we got out of the military and time went on, we just got farther and farther apart, especially after I got sick and quite drinking.

Regarding pre-nups, I didn't wish for this afterwards but our middle-class income and lack of children from previous marriages didn't warrant anything other than the court-ordered 50:50 split. (We also agreed that we would each assume our own credit card debt, 401k plans, and vehicles.)

(in reply to tj444)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: Marriage and D/s - 9/23/2011 9:23:22 AM   
Iamsemisweet


Posts: 3651
Joined: 4/9/2011
From: The Great Northwest, USA
Status: offline 		Done. See off topic general discussion
quote:

ORIGINAL: Amygdalin


quote:

ORIGINAL: Mr4sg
!


You are right. Health insurance doesn't set you up to be sick. But it is purchased in case you get sick. It is insurance. A safety net.

Just like a prenup is made in case there is a divorce. It means you have divorce on your mind before you even get married. Which shows me you don't have much faith in your partner.

I'm not going to respond to this anymore because I feel like I am destroying dear Sophia's thread and I don't want that. If you want to debate this, start a new thread on prenups and I'll go back and forth with you until your domly stones turn old and grey.


_____________________________

Alice: But I don't want to go among mad people.
The Cat: Oh, you can't help that. We're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.
Alice: How do you know I'm mad?
The Cat: You must be. Or you wouldn't have come here.

(in reply to Amygdalin)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Marriage and D/s - 9/23/2011 9:58:56 AM   
SophiaChan


Posts: 15
Joined: 4/30/2006
Status: offline 		Kalikshama - I must say that your post and the circumstances of your marriage and divorce are so incredibly similar to my own! I also agree with your sentiments that if I had to do it all over again, would I still do it the same way! hell yes!! I was very happy in my first marriage for many years. For these reasons, I have some strong opinions about getting it annulled.
I take it that you didn't use a prenup for your current relationship then? Based on your adorable picture, it looks to me like you are exactly where you are supposed to be in life, despite its sometimes cruel twists of fate!

(in reply to Iamsemisweet)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: Marriage and D/s - 9/23/2011 10:04:28 AM   
Pteryx777


Posts: 8
Joined: 9/21/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mr4sg


quote:

ORIGINAL: Pteryx777

quote:

As for him becoming a citizen, that will not likely happen as he loves his country.


this is a common misconception. he can get US citizenship and keep dual citizenship.


Not true. Some countries require you hand over your citizenship of your original country once you accept a different citizenship.

Netherlands for one, does not allow its citizens to acquire a second citizenship without giving up their Dutch citizenship.

This is tied to the fact that all Dutch citizens have access to (free) forms of education, healthcare and retirement from the government,
even when living abroad !


I was referring to US naturalization, not foreign. Dutch laws are muddled (see below). the reality is that the Netherlands' laws are unenforceable abroad and rely on an "honor" system of self-reporting. the US is not obligated by treaty to report the status of dutch citizens within the US.

Dual citizenship

Although Dutch law restricts dual citizenship, it is possible for Dutch subjects to legally hold dual citizenship in a number of circumstances, including:
those who acquire another citizenship at the time of birth (for example, a child born to Dutch parents in the United States would hold both U.S. and Dutch citizenship).
persons who acquire Dutch citizenship through the option procedure (including former Dutch citizens resuming citizenship)
persons who become naturalised Dutch subjects, who obtain an exemption from the requirement to renounce their foreign citizenship, such as those married to Dutch subjects.
Dutch subjects who naturalise in another country who are exempted from the loss of nationality rule (such as those married to a citizen/subject of that country).

(in reply to Mr4sg)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: Marriage and D/s - 9/23/2011 10:37:04 AM   
Pteryx777


Posts: 8
Joined: 9/21/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SophiaChan

You guys are all very funny with your prenup stuff. While I appreciate all that discussion, it really is beside the point for me. We have agreed to cross that road, legally, when we come to it. For now, I own a piece of junk car that I don't care about and I rent my home. I have tons of student loan debt and hardly any furniture. He owns about the same amount in India (where he is from).

This brings me to my next point. While I appreciate the lengthy post about Islamic countries, he is not Muslim or from one of those countries. I am Catholic, he is Hindu. We both very much love and respect each others religions and enjoy the celebrations and beliefs of both and we would raise our children to be the same.. both Catholic and Hindu. Because we believe that neither spiritual path is more valid than the other and in fact compliment each other beautifully. So, no worries about him stealing my children (IF we have any) and since I made India my home for 4 yrs, I'm pretty sure that I have a good grasp on what marrying into that culture would entail. And I wouldn't say that I am worried about him giving into his family pressure because from what I've seen he is extremely stubborn and just does as he wants. While I do worry about my time with his family, I feel that I can weather that storm. Equally, I don't really see his mother moving to this country and living with us. This topic was another discussion that we had and have hacked to death. As in, I laid out all my possible worries involving his family in front of him and our two best friends (also Indian) and we talked through every logical possibility. It was good and needed.

As for him becoming a citizen, it will not happen. India does not formally recognize dual citizenship and he would give up many of his rights as an Indian citizen if he became an American. While this COULD happen, I find it unlikely and pretty unnecessary all in all. So, I think that pretty much covers all of those worries.

Thanks again for the lovely advice!! Any thoughts on D/s contracts or collaring contracts. Who has used them, for what, and when?


India and its laws, as I mentioned, is quite okay, at least in theory (sometimes enforceability is an issue). and hinduism is quite okay, at least in theory. the only thing about India is a strong sense of tradition and identity as you have encountered. so hinduism is far less dogmatic than christianity, judaism and islam but the strong cultural identity will more than likely have your man's family insisting on a hindu wedding. I have been to mixed marriages where there is a christian and hindu ceremony performed. I must say that the hindu ceromony was beautiful and awash in flowers and colors and the bride and groom looked wonderful in their traditional dress. actually, the bride looked hot and had henna designs put on that made her hotter. so the in theory part is more about how you fit and that seems to be going well. but remember, it is easier to foster an independence streak far from dehli - when he returns and it is not only family but social pressure that he faces.. well, things may feel different.

you find me not offering advice on the slave contract because I think that if you have the other stuff licked then that part is far easier. it's more about attitude and you seem to have a good one. so, like your American-Indian masala, your mix of spice is going to have its own flavor.

(in reply to SophiaChan)
Profile   Post #: 56
RE: Marriage and D/s - 9/23/2011 4:42:21 PM   
RaspberryLemon


Posts: 422
Joined: 7/18/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SophiaChan
Thanks again for the lovely advice!! Any thoughts on D/s contracts or collaring contracts. Who has used them, for what, and when?

Not everyone uses them, in fact a lot of people look down on it and don't see a use to it. For the people that do have them, everyone's is different and what you include in it will be specific to what you both want/agree to. So if you want to have one, the best way to figure out what to put in it is to talk to your partner about it and see what kinds of things they'd like it to address and include, and give him your input as well. Discuss it and make sure you both agree on everything in it.

Personally, my Master and I do have a contract. To give you an idea of what we did with ours, I'll direct you to my post in a thread on the subject: http://www.collarchat.com/m_3790894/mpage_1/key_/tm.htm#3790946

Hope this helps.

(in reply to SophiaChan)
Profile   Post #: 57
RE: Marriage and D/s - 9/23/2011 4:51:25 PM   
kalikshama


Posts: 14805
Joined: 8/8/2010
Status: offline
quote:

I was very happy in my first marriage for many years. For these reasons, I have some strong opinions about getting it annulled. I take it that you didn't use a prenup for your current relationship then? Based on your adorable picture, it looks to me like you are exactly where you are supposed to be in life, despite its sometimes cruel twists of fate!


Why thank you!

While I wouldn't rule out some sort of BDSM ceremony, I don't see a second marriage happening, so a prenup is not even on my radar.

Have you thought of two ceremonies - one for family and one less conventional? My ex-h and I were in Okinawa at the time and did all the paperwork stuff in November then had a ceremony in February when family could come.

If I understand you correctly, I agree that an annulment after years of happy marriage is kind of a cheat. I am familiar with annulment and Catholicism; but is it necessary when you are marrying a Hindu?






< Message edited by kalikshama -- 9/23/2011 4:53:31 PM >

(in reply to SophiaChan)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: Marriage and D/s - 9/23/2011 6:00:49 PM   
OsideGirl


Posts: 14442
Joined: 7/1/2005
From: United States
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SophiaChan
Any thoughts on D/s contracts or collaring contracts. Who has used them, for what, and when?
We initially used a contract, primarily to make an effort to have everything pertinent discussed before we got too far into things. It was used as a guideline.


_____________________________

Give a girl the right shoes and she will conquer the world. ~ Marilyn Monroe

The Accelerated Velocity of Terminological Inexactitude

(in reply to SophiaChan)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: Marriage and D/s - 9/23/2011 9:54:12 PM   
LookieNoNookie


Posts: 12216
Joined: 8/9/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SophiaChan

Hello All!

My Dom of 3.5 yrs and myself are getting married. We would love some advice.... any and all kinds!

The facts are that we are from extremely different cultures, religions, races. He is six years younger and this is my second marriage. We've had lots of uphill battles, but have weathered the storm to arrive at this beautiful place.

As part of the preparation for this upcoming marriage, we wish to incorporate the lifestyle BDSM aspect into our discussions. So, to get to my point,
1. Have you experienced lifestyle BDSM and marriage? What are some difficulties and joys we should expect?
2. Even if you haven't been or aren't married, but just in the lifestyle with the same partner long time, what long term / committed struggles have you undergone that have shaped you?

I know this is a bit general, but 'big' is the perfect place to start. I'll come up with more detailed questions as we float along.

Thanks!


Marriage.

That ultimately means lawyers at some point.

I don't like it, and having reviewed your photo, I recommend a 6 month stint at my place (just to be sure....this is all {entirely} because of my incredible giving nature).

And by the way....don't EVEN think that just because I'm lonely, single, short, fat, bald and broke....that I'm going to be easy. 

I don't "give it up" just on a whim!

< Message edited by LookieNoNookie -- 9/23/2011 9:55:47 PM >

(in reply to SophiaChan)
Profile   Post #: 60
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