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RE: Specfic mental health questions in regards to BDSM? - 10/26/2011 10:03:44 AM   
LillyBoPeep


Posts: 6873
Joined: 12/29/2010
Status: offline 		well it's not just confidence -- some of them are impulsive, too -- they don't thnk things through, take on tons of projects they may not finish, spend a ton of money, etc. there is a lot more going on besides confidence but it may feel/look like confidence.

at the end of the day, though, the assumption that confidence or more specifically the lack thereof is somehow the basis for submission is wrong.

< Message edited by LillyBoPeep -- 10/26/2011 10:04:08 AM >

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RE: Specfic mental health questions in regards to BDSM? - 10/26/2011 10:04:45 AM   
LadyHibiscus


Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Contentment


quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

Is your friend a dom or sub? HOW would we know that? Ask your friend! Whatever they identify as, is going to be the correct answer.

Ah...thanks. Figures it would be something that simple.



What were you expecting, exactly? Were you planning on saying "Oh, no you're not!" regardless of what answer you got?

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RE: Specfic mental health questions in regards to BDSM? - 10/26/2011 10:05:51 AM   
LadyHibiscus


Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LillyBoPeep

well it's not just confidence -- some of them are impulsive, too -- they don't thnk things through, take on tons of projects they may not finish, spend a ton of money, etc. there is a lot more going on besides confidence but it may feel/look like confidence.

at the end of the day, though, the assumption that confidence or more specifically the lack thereof is somehow the basis for submission is wrong.



That implies real life knowledge of how submissives behave, though. We know what a shrinking violet you are, Lilly!

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RE: Specfic mental health questions in regards to BDSM? - 10/26/2011 10:08:00 AM   
GreedyTop


Posts: 52100
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Savannah, GA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: twistedom

Another attacking session what a shocker



pull your panties outta yer ass.. the OP has gotten some answers. and unlike YOU he didnt try to backpedal on his clarification.

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RE: Specfic mental health questions in regards to BDSM? - 10/26/2011 10:20:28 AM   
LillyBoPeep


Posts: 6873
Joined: 12/29/2010
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus


quote:

ORIGINAL: LillyBoPeep

well it's not just confidence -- some of them are impulsive, too -- they don't thnk things through, take on tons of projects they may not finish, spend a ton of money, etc. there is a lot more going on besides confidence but it may feel/look like confidence.

at the end of the day, though, the assumption that confidence or more specifically the lack thereof is somehow the basis for submission is wrong.



That implies real life knowledge of how submissives behave, though. We know what a shrinking violet you are, Lilly!


haha =p in reality, i am actually pretty shy, but i also don't believe shyness has anything to do with confidence, either.

real life knowledge is very important when it comes to talking about things like this because speculation gets you nowhere. i gained HEAPS of confidence because of my relationship with my late M. submission was something i went into because i felt confident about the type of person he was, and having thing great connection with another person, and getting to finally be myself helped me feel like there wasn't much to be un-confident about. the important stuff was taken care of.

submission isn't something you enter into because you're so lacking in confidence that all you can do is follow; that also assumes that following is automatically a position of weakness, when it's not. submission, at least to me, is an expression of a natural way of being, in response to someone else's natural way of being. it has nothing to do with lacking confidence. no matter how far down he took me, i was always aware that i had value with him, i was a worthwhile person to him, which only STRENGTHENED my desire to submit to him, instead of making me turn around and become Dominant, as the OP's theory would suggest.


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RE: Specfic mental health questions in regards to BDSM? - 10/26/2011 10:31:47 AM   
Lockit


Posts: 11292
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Contentment

First, I love wikipedia. I get on a topic and just keep learning more and more, very interesting.

Recently I got onto the mental health stuff, in particular bi-polar, sadism and the new ones for DSM-V. Very interesting read.

First fun one, is that sadism isn't considered a mental illness anymore. They determined it was so common in males, that it wasn't viable as a mental illness. Very amusing. But then again, this is mental health, the minds that, at one point, thought PMS and homosexuality were just mental illnesses.

But for an illness like bi-polar, I imagine it would greatly impact the BDSM scene. Your mood switches from high confidence to a very low confidence, or at least a less confident persona - this would impact your ability to be dominant or submissive. A submissive with that much confidence, is probably not too submissive...Don't really know.

I suspect that listing them as a switch is probably not right either, but I wanted to know other people's thoughts on the subject.

PS: Not looking to make fun of the mentally ill. I enjoy my curiosity, and you can enjoy the conversation too, but try to keep it civil and non-discriminatory. Mental illness is super common and that needs to be kept in mind when posting on a public web site.


You say that you aren't making fun of the mentally ill, that mental illness is super common and we need to keep that in mind when posting on a public web site. If you wish to be sensitive to the vulnerabilities or the numbers of those that suffer mental illness on a public web site, then I would like to suggest something.

Try not to belittle the experience of the mentally ill, by summing it up into one word... a word, I might add, that I couldn't find anywhere within the 'research' document you read, not even in implication. Try not to take your own interpretation or summation of a very complicated mental disorder and form a conclusion for its inclusion into some aspect of life that people involve themselves in and further complicate the situation by confusing fact with your interpretation/conclusion and then expect others to evaluate it all using your own conclusion of it all.

On the same note, your inclusion of interpretation into how it would effect another thing (bdsm, submission and dominance) you have summed up to mean something others see no relation to, within something they have actually lived and experienced... is again, faulty interpretation and application.

By devaluing mental illness, bdsm, submission and dominance as you have, you haven't presented anything but your own confusion and have expected the nearly impossible in pleasant conversation on the topics.

Shit.. I need more coffee for this!


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RE: Specfic mental health questions in regards to BDSM? - 10/26/2011 10:33:42 AM   
kalikshama


Posts: 14805
Joined: 8/8/2010
Status: offline
quote:

Confidence is the word they use most to describe it. They are withdrawn in a down swing, and outgoing in an upswing. They try to be outgoing in a downswing, but it just doesn't seem to work, so they withdrawn. In such a downswing, it is very difficult to see them as dominating, sort of a lost puppy. It's there in an upswing, an inspiring presence, dominant and in control. So the question is, is my friend a dom or sub, or a switch, or something else?


I don't see the correlation. If he doesn't feel Dom when down, that doesn't make him sub or switch - he's just uninterested at the moment.

He may not be an effective Dom when down, but does the thought of domming get his dick hard where ever he is in the cycle?

I suppose it would be possible for a bi-polar switch to be attracted to different sides of the kneel depending on where he is in his cycle, but I think your correlation is tenuous.

(Hey, thanks for taking the beating and sticking to the topic! I think your OP could have been framed better, but it's interesting.)

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RE: Specfic mental health questions in regards to BDSM? - 10/26/2011 10:36:26 AM   
OsideGirl


Posts: 14441
Joined: 7/1/2005
From: United States
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Contentment

1, you guys are fucking idiots, and, 2, no one has answered the question,
Well, this fucking idiot has a degree in psychology.....

In answer to your question, bi-polar has no correlation with any particular orientation. Yes, it can make having a D/s relationship difficult, but it can make having ANY relationship difficult. The polarity is extreme happiness and extreme depression, not extreme dominance and extreme submission. I'm not quite sure how you've come to the conclusion that bi-polar equals switch. It's like saying "water is wet, so grass must be purple".

Bi-polar is a many faceted affliction and it's not going to fit into some easy answer like you want.


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RE: Specfic mental health questions in regards to BDSM? - 10/26/2011 10:37:43 AM   
OsideGirl


Posts: 14441
Joined: 7/1/2005
From: United States
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: twistedom

Another attacking session what a shocker


Showing bitterness, what a shocker from the guy that says that only skinny women get raped.

< Message edited by OsideGirl -- 10/26/2011 10:38:35 AM >

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RE: Specfic mental health questions in regards to BDSM? - 10/26/2011 10:38:56 AM   
Contentment


Posts: 63
Joined: 5/27/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LillyBoPeep

well it's not just confidence -- some of them are impulsive, too -- they don't thnk things through, take on tons of projects they may not finish, spend a ton of money, etc. there is a lot more going on besides confidence but it may feel/look like confidence.

As described to me, confidence as they call it, fits pretty well. They start many projects, confident of success. They spend money, confident of a return on the investment. This is them feeling awesome, like they can do anything - it's very inspiring to see and makes for very enjoyable conversations.



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RE: Specfic mental health questions in regards to BDSM? - 10/26/2011 10:46:36 AM   
Contentment


Posts: 63
Joined: 5/27/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kalikshama

(Hey, thanks for taking the beating and sticking to the topic! I think your OP could have been framed better, but it's interesting.)

Yeah, really needed to frame it better. Total fail to that end.

The internet is always a challenge for me, because I don't know who my audience will be.

I do think I've got my question answered. Thanks for the help.

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Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Specfic mental health questions in regards to BDSM? - 10/26/2011 11:36:21 AM   
MistressLilliana


Posts: 84
Joined: 1/7/2011
Status: offline 		My next statement in no way applies to all people with Bipolar. An ex of mine does have bipolar and I will say that he had on and off days, ups and downs, but the fluctuations weren't just in the "happy or sad" realm. Some days his "high" days made him more dominant and the need and want to be in control..on some of his "low" days he'd rather be submissive and give the control over. This was not because he was super happy so he became dominant or super depressed so he became submissive..there were days he'd be on a "high" and want to be submissive or the other way around. It just so happened that MOST of the time "high" days equaled dominant. Of course he could also be naturally Switch with bipolar or not but these were my observations in the relationship.

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RE: Specfic mental health questions in regards to BDSM? - 10/26/2011 1:13:23 PM   
RumpusParable


Posts: 1923
Joined: 7/7/2005
From: NYC now!
Status: offline 		I've bipolar 1. No, swings don't affect my dominance. Being depressed doesn't lessen it and being manic doesn't increase it.

For me, being depressed is a lot like, but worse, having the flu. It varies greatly how depressed I am and what sort of symptoms I have. Sometimes, like now, I'm doing pretty well with just fatigue and poor sleep the main problems. Other times I'm more or less influenced. A good listing of things that CAN happen when depressed, in differing mixes and amounts are: I'm terribly tired, ache all over, muscles are weak, I have a hard time focusing on things, I tend to be more sinusy and also have IBS like symptoms, can be nauseated, can be apathetic or intensely concerned about things, feel sad or just plain null, am prone to migraines, etc. I have "cogfog" where it's hard to think clearly, my thinking is slow or fuzzy, my memory is bad. It feels like I've been hit by a bus, my body is so sore and worn down and my mind is so sluggish with it.

It's not that I'm less dominant, it's that I'm sick. Same as with the flu or after surgery, for me... it's just being sick. I still like things my way and getting it, I still do with my Chael. But like having the flu, I just need to rest a lot and not have a bunch of stuff thrown at me; I need time to recover and have my mind clear.

Mania, in reverse, doesn't make me more dominant. It means I run a fever, have too much energy, have a hard time focusing except where I hyper-focus on something, am jittery and twitchy in my muscles, sleep and eat very little, have delusions, am unnaturally happy or irritable, dissociate more, am hyper-sensitive to certain sounds and movements, think and talk too fast, etc.

Again, I'm just sick, but in a different way. I'm still the same amount of dominant as when depressed. I just have less attention and focus and need to wait until my head clears... same as with depression I am just sick; I'm not a different person, I'm just on high speed... I still want what I want, like getting it and have Chael to make it happen.

Asking if different stages of bipolar makes one more or less dominant is like asking if recovering from surgery makes on more or less dominant. Just because you're not feeling well in some way or other doesn't mean a change in basic core personality traits.

< Message edited by RumpusParable -- 10/26/2011 1:15:45 PM >

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RE: Specfic mental health questions in regards to BDSM? - 10/26/2011 1:36:04 PM   
orchid77


Posts: 125
Joined: 5/20/2011
Status: offline 		Actually there are a couple types of BPD: BPD 1 is severe mania and depression, BPD 2 which is a milder form, Cyclothmic which is even more of milder form, and Mixed Polar Disorder mean going through symptoms at the same time. Finally there is Rapid Cycling BPD which there are two or more cycles within 12 months. Therefore it would depend which one the person falls into and if they are taking their medication.

So if you know someone with BPD it is best to ask them more about it, educate yourself, and make sure they taking care of themselves before you play.

I will address Wikipedia...do not use it as a form of reference most academic institutions (colleges and univerisities) do not allow it due to the fact that anyone can go in Wikpedia make an account and change information. So what you read may not be accurate.



< Message edited by orchid77 -- 10/26/2011 1:37:49 PM >

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RE: Specfic mental health questions in regards to BDSM? - 10/26/2011 2:56:02 PM   
ProlificNeeds


Posts: 1061
Joined: 5/19/2007
Status: offline 		Since I see D/s as sexual aspects of a person not moods, or personalities, I don't see how a mental disability or condition would alter one's sexual orientation. (Except maybe with severe Multi Personalities?)

I think it's just reaching to try to connect two topics you're interested in that really have little to do with one another.

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Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Specfic mental health questions in regards to BDSM? - 10/26/2011 3:20:57 PM   
AdorkableAiley


Posts: 920
Joined: 9/12/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Contentment

First, I love wikipedia. I get on a topic and just keep learning more and more, very interesting.

Recently I got onto the mental health stuff, in particular bi-polar, sadism and the new ones for DSM-V. Very interesting read.

First fun one, is that sadism isn't considered a mental illness anymore. They determined it was so common in males, that it wasn't viable as a mental illness. Very amusing. But then again, this is mental health, the minds that, at one point, thought PMS and homosexuality were just mental illnesses.

But for an illness like bi-polar, I imagine it would greatly impact the BDSM scene. Your mood switches from high confidence to a very low confidence, or at least a less confident persona - this would impact your ability to be dominant or submissive. A submissive with that much confidence, is probably not too submissive...Don't really know.

I suspect that listing them as a switch is probably not right either, but I wanted to know other people's thoughts on the subject.

PS: Not looking to make fun of the mentally ill. I enjoy my curiosity, and you can enjoy the conversation too, but try to keep it civil and non-discriminatory. Mental illness is super common and that needs to be kept in mind when posting on a public web site.



 
I don't think you grasp exactly what bi polar is. That's ok, not many do. Bi Polar isn’t switching from one personality to another and it USUALLY doesn’t happen in the blink of an eye, though for bi polar II you can cycle pretty quickly, that isn’t something that happens 24/7 365 or even without warning. It has absolutely nothing to do with BDSM or what side of the kneel you are on. 

And Bi polar does not a switch make…

Ailey

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Profile   Post #: 36
RE: Specfic mental health questions in regards to BDSM? - 10/26/2011 4:23:16 PM   
TraciTv


Posts: 21
Joined: 12/4/2009
Status: offline 		It's funny, most of the submissives I've known have been VERY confident people, including a few "C" level executives, and one woman who owned her own company.

There is a difference between being a submissive, and being self-destructive, as there is a difference between being dominant and being abusive.

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Profile   Post #: 37
RE: Specfic mental health questions in regards to BDSM? - 10/26/2011 4:27:36 PM   
avena


Posts: 80
Joined: 12/4/2010
Status: offline 		I'm going to answer the OP (and his subsequent posts) by echoing what Rumpus Parable said.

I'm not bipolar, but one of my very best friends (and roommate for a year) is bipolar. He also happens to be a dominant. Being bipolar does not affect how dominant he is. It does affect him in very similiar ways to what Rumpus described. His ups could not be described as increased confidence, nor could his downs be described as decreased confidence. The symptoms he exhibited were very similiar to being ill, and like any other sick man that I know, he was a big suck during those times! But that doesn't mean he was submissive at those times. He just needed someone to take care of him...note that I say needed, not wanted...

I also want to point out that, the majority of the time, especially once he was balanced on his medication, he was neither up nor down. He was just as level as the rest of the non-bipolar people that I know. So basically, if one looks at his bipolar swings as periods of 'illness' (as in, it presented as illness-like symptoms), his being bipolar had no more effect on his dominance than what anyone else might experience going through the occasional bout of flu or a bad cold.

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Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Specfic mental health questions in regards to BDSM? - 10/26/2011 4:45:03 PM   
SailingBum


Posts: 3225
Joined: 12/10/2007
From: Sailin the stormy sea
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

You really should not depend on Wikipedia for all your information.


I second that.... Perhaps most ppl don't realize that any moron can edit the content in wikki as a result many times the information on the site is wrong.

BadOne

_____________________________

The beatings will continue until morale improves.

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We are all so very lucky to have you with us to impart your great wisdom.

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Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Specfic mental health questions in regards to BDSM? - 10/26/2011 4:48:37 PM   
SailingBum


Posts: 3225
Joined: 12/10/2007
From: Sailin the stormy sea
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: AdorkableAiley

quote:

ORIGINAL: Contentment

First, I love wikipedia. I get on a topic and just keep learning more and more, very interesting.

Recently I got onto the mental health stuff, in particular bi-polar, sadism and the new ones for DSM-V. Very interesting read.

First fun one, is that sadism isn't considered a mental illness anymore. They determined it was so common in males, that it wasn't viable as a mental illness. Very amusing. But then again, this is mental health, the minds that, at one point, thought PMS and homosexuality were just mental illnesses.

But for an illness like bi-polar, I imagine it would greatly impact the BDSM scene. Your mood switches from high confidence to a very low confidence, or at least a less confident persona - this would impact your ability to be dominant or submissive. A submissive with that much confidence, is probably not too submissive...Don't really know.

I suspect that listing them as a switch is probably not right either, but I wanted to know other people's thoughts on the subject.

PS: Not looking to make fun of the mentally ill. I enjoy my curiosity, and you can enjoy the conversation too, but try to keep it civil and non-discriminatory. Mental illness is super common and that needs to be kept in mind when posting on a public web site.



 
I don't think you grasp exactly what bi polar is. That's ok, not many do. Bi Polar isn’t switching from one personality to another and it USUALLY doesn’t happen in the blink of an eye, though for bi polar II you can cycle pretty quickly, that isn’t something that happens 24/7 365 or even without warning. It has absolutely nothing to do with BDSM or what side of the kneel you are on. 

And Bi polar does not a switch make…

Ailey



Uhh I was just wondering if it is possible to lust a cartoon character type icon???

BadOne


_____________________________

The beatings will continue until morale improves.

According to SwithNSpanky
We are all so very lucky to have you with us to impart your great wisdom.

(in reply to AdorkableAiley)
Profile   Post #: 40
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