tj444
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Joined: 3/7/2010
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ORIGINAL: Aswad
quote:
ORIGINAL: tj444
Yes, you did condon using people to clear minefields, it was an example you were fine with as were comfort women.
My original statement about minefields was:
"I'm not naïve as to war as a brutal thing that features a lot of savagery. We used live Germans to clear our mine fields after WW2."
There is nothing there to say I condone what we did.
It states that I am aware that war is brutal and savage, using an example from before I was born to illustrate precisely that war is a dehumanizing affair that has a great cost in lives and suffering. However much you may disagree with my views, you cannot claim that the above is an endorsement of using prisoners of war to trigger mines by forcing them to run in a line through the minefield, especially since I also note that it is contrary to treaties we were party to, and that adherence to such treaties is a requirement in my morality.
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You can attempt to then justify it for paragraphs which again, shows you were fine with it and condoned it.
No, I stated that when you have a minefield threatening your civilian population, it needs to be cleared. Clearing mines is an activity that carries a substantial risk. To do it properly takes training and gear, but does not eliminate the risk entirely. Yet one always tries to preserve the lives of those doing the job.
Thus I said that a case could be made that it would be acceptable, laws and treaties permitting, to train the people who placed the mines in how to remove them as safely as possible, equip them with gear to do the job as safely as possible, and have them clean up after themselves while keeping the usual medical personell close on hand. In other words, placing the risk where it belongs, while still making every effort to minimize the risk.
I did not even say that was a clear cut case, just that an argument could be made to that effect.
And, you might ask yourself, if you've mined someone's home, is it not the decent thing of you to be the one to remove it afterwards? Would it be acceptable of you to leave your mines where they can harm or kill innocent civilians? Or would you feel compelled to clean up after yourself?
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Forcing someone after the war is over into doing life threatening work is no different than what Hitler did.
I do not hold him as a point of reference for what to do or not to do.
I don't feel compelled to hate dogs because Hitler loved his dog.
I don't object to vegans because Hitler preferred vegan food.
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A lot of the comfort women were children... you said you were fine with it..
A poor choice of words on my part; mea culpa.
I'm not fine with the historical event referenced by the term, i.e. the Japanese practices of WW2. I am fine with war rape, targetted at adults, though I think it's poor taste, especially againt noncombattants. I used the term 'confort women' as a euphemism for that, without considering the historical implications of the term.
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You can blather away all you want, paragraph after paragraph justifying it.. it doesnt fly with me..
It doesn't seem like you're reading what I'm saying, either.
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While you say " it's not the situation of the victims that concerns me".. yeah, we see that and just how much you "feel for them"  , its the situation of the victims that does concern me.. 
It is possible to feel for someone's plight and not care enough to do something about it.
Millions of people around the world are starving, and the cost of my lifestyle could feed some 500 famine stricken people in Africa. Even so, I am going to live in the apartment I've got, keep the high speed fiber Internet access, eat nice food, wear comfy clothes and so forth. And come bedtime, I'm going to sleep soundly, without feeling guilty about what I have, and without feeling compelled to give it all up for them.
The fact that you're replying to me on the Internet tells me you could feed some starving Africans too, if you so chose. I don't imply that you don't feel for them. I simply recognize that you don't care enough to do something about it. Which is fine by me, and evidently fine by you. Presumably, you also haven't dedicated your life to eradicating other suffering, yet I again don't imply that you're so callous as to not feel for the plight of suffering humans.
You are content to imply I don't actually feel for people because my stance is that their suffering is unfortunate but also acceptable, while yours is the morality that centers on their suffering and thus carries the imperative to act in a manner you're demonstrably not acting. Only one of us is acting in line with our professed values. That, to me, is a demerit, and it is utterly unimpressive that you pass judgment on my morals when you're not acting in line with your own.
I'm quite capable of feeling with people without reaching out to end their pain and/or suffering.
For that matter, that's by definition also the case for all the sadists on the board.
Health,
al-Aswad.
again, wow... you dont know a dam thing about me and yet you make these assumptions? You claim you feel for victims yet you feel war rape is acceptable? imo you are in the very same category as Sam.. and definately not worth any further discussion, that would be pointless in any event, I wont change your mind and you definately arent going to change mine..
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RE: The actions of a few disgrace all allied troops. - 
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