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RE: Is this objectification? - 1/12/2012 12:04:58 PM   
GreedyTop


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once again I say...

if the OP FEELS objectified, there is the answer. If she does not, there ALSO in an answer.

REGARDLESS of all this analytical posturing.

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RE: Is this objectification? - 1/12/2012 12:08:20 PM   
mnottertail


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Hey, IT!!!! You're just a roof-sweeping object.  

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RE: Is this objectification? - 1/12/2012 1:11:15 PM   
GreedyTop


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no blow job for you tonight :P

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RE: Is this objectification? - 1/12/2012 1:34:18 PM   
mummyman321


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Greedy you can sweep me any day LOL!

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RE: Is this objectification? - 1/12/2012 1:37:00 PM   
mnottertail


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quote:

ORIGINAL: GreedyTop

no blow job for you tonight :P


Noted, with objection, then ignored.

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RE: Is this objectification? - 1/12/2012 3:43:34 PM   
DaddySatyr


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Personally, I think it's a no-brainer.

It is absolutely objectification. It is of a type that you are okay with but it is objectification, all the same.

It's no different than the go-go dancer/stripper that uses her body to make a metric shit-ton of cash because she likes nice clothes and fast cars and has the means (her body) to go out and make it happen. Neither she nor her customers see it as a bad thing. There are womens' groups that would disagree but no one who has looked up the word could honestly conclude that it isn't objectification.

I'll give a somewhat more timid example: fashion models are objectified. When they walk the runway, their only reason for exsistence is to show the clothes they're wearing and make them look as desirable as possible. They're animated clothes hangers! Not many complain about their objectification but that is exactly what it is.

I believe a lot of what we do is objectification to one degree or another. I believe it is an under-current to what it is we do and how we choose to live. How many people consistantly use "submissive", "slave", "dominant", and "master" as opposed to "lady", "wife", "boyfriend" or "husband"? While the "lifestyle labels" are not offensive terms by any stretch, they are labels th ey at remove a bit of the "human element" of the person to whom we've assigned the label.

If the question is: "Should this make me feel used or degraded?" Well, I think there is some element of that and that is part of the turn-on. and if it turns on all parties involved, what's the beef?

If the question is: "Is this a measure of objectification?", you bet your sweet ass it is!



Peace and comfort,



Michael


< Message edited by DaddySatyr -- 1/12/2012 4:13:36 PM >


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RE: Is this objectification? - 1/12/2012 4:21:38 PM   
shylilbear


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This isn't about labels at all. It's about definition. It came up last night in a conversation with my Daddy after he'd asked me about the likes/limits list I'd written over a year ago. A lot of things have changed since I wrote it, and he wanted to know what was different.

One thing on my limits list has always been objectification. I had added a side note that I am a person, NOT an it. I have fought hard to discover who I am, what makes me, "me" and to me, the idea of objectification negates that. Then Daddy pointed out that being used as a sex toy like that is a form of objectification. As I mentioned before, I enjoy the idea of Daddy sharing me with his friends, but because I've always associated that word with something negative, I've had a hard time wrapping my brain around the idea that it isn't always a bad thing. He had me post the question here to get a broader idea of what objectification is to other people.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Fornica

Why is a label needed?


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RE: Is this objectification? - 1/12/2012 7:04:34 PM   
xssve


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Well there you go, I think it's one of those things that you know it when you see it, I think it takes a tougher person to handle it, in previous discussions, I've heard women in here describe how unrelenting objectification became ultimately, over a period of time, kind of a drag - if I'm not understating that.

re: RS, the definition of objectivity is seeing things as they are, not as you wish them to be: objectification as play is in some sense the opposite: "you are a slut, act like one, etc.", i.e, for the duration of the scene, and that can be liberating, given that if you want to experience true objectification, join a church, and when they ask you to testify, tell them about your last gang bang, how good it felt to have all those cocks pounding you, the warm feeling of lying on the bed exhausted, cum leaking from your swollen, throbbing holes, and how you can't wait to do it again - I guarantee you'll get a taste of true objectification.

In any case, putting a woman on a pedestal is objectification, being mother is objectification, etc., pretty much any role is objectification, objectification in BDSM is usually about getting over your hangups about enjoying yourself sexually without distancing yourself from the experience, but really being your self and exploring your feelings as a purely sexual being without all the second guessing.

It's not the only thing, there are myriad different forms, Dollification, fuckmeat, rag doll, slave, etc., even daddy dom, whatever works for you, but the huge onus on expressing anything but the approved sexuality in some circles really does a number on some peoples heads - seriously, there is almost no positive model of female sexual expression other than wife and mother, it's not really fair, but neither is it easy to change, you have to roll with it to some extent.

If you're lying there wondering what "people will think" instead of getting into the act, it's called spectatoring, and presumably, it's a different thing than subspace, which is immersing oneself in the act.

Bottom line is, you're doing the same thing - whether you're being objectified negatively or positively, is largely a matter of preference, you're going to be the same person regardless.

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RE: Is this objectification? - 1/12/2012 7:31:42 PM   
Miserlou


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i would say that its up to you. if it makes you feel like an object, then its objectification. if it doesn't, then it isn't.


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RE: Is this objectification? - 1/12/2012 8:02:55 PM   
ScatteredRose


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As everyone said, do you feel objectified? Is it a good or bad thing?

In my personal experience, I don't view that as objectification. To me, I guess I'm a bit more literal and down to the freaking T when it comes to definitions.

I see objectification as becoming an object. Not necessarily a blow up doll or fuck toy, but things like: a table, a pillow, a footstool, etc.
I enjoy very mild forms of it, but not like, super extreme being a table all the time. Haha!

Everyone is different. If you feel like you are being used (in a good way of course) then that can be it to you.
The beauty of this lifestyle, is there is a lot of things open to interpretation. :)


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RE: Is this objectification? - 1/12/2012 8:04:37 PM   
RaspberryLemon


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It depends on how you feel about it, OP. Objectification is very subjective. Different things constitute objectification to different people. Does getting passed around to his friends make you feel objectified? There's your answer.

Personally, getting "shared" would DEFINITELY constitute as objectification, to me. I would not want to participate in that, nor do I want to participate in anything I consider to be objectification. Thankfully my Master keeps me to himself; I prefer it that way and he does too--I don't want to belong to anyone but him, not even short-term.

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RE: Is this objectification? - 1/12/2012 8:12:58 PM   
Duskypearls


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quote:

ORIGINAL: xssve

Well there you go, I think it's one of those things that you know it when you see it, I think it takes a tougher person to handle it, in previous discussions, I've heard women in here describe how unrelenting objectification became ultimately, over a period of time, kind of a drag - if I'm not understating that.

re: RS, the definition of objectivity is seeing things as they are, not as you wish them to be: objectification as play is in some sense the opposite: "you are a slut, act like one, etc.", i.e, for the duration of the scene, and that can be liberating, given that if you want to experience true objectification, join a church, and when they ask you to testify, tell them about your last gang bang, how good it felt to have all those cocks pounding you, the warm feeling of lying on the bed exhausted, cum leaking from your swollen, throbbing holes, and how you can't wait to do it again - I guarantee you'll get a taste of true objectification.

In any case, putting a woman on a pedestal is objectification, being mother is objectification, etc., pretty much any role is objectification, objectification in BDSM is usually about getting over your hangups about enjoying yourself sexually without distancing yourself from the experience, but really being your self and exploring your feelings as a purely sexual being without all the second guessing.

It's not the only thing, there are myriad different forms, Dollification, fuckmeat, rag doll, slave, etc., even daddy dom, whatever works for you, but the huge onus on expressing anything but the approved sexuality in some circles really does a number on some peoples heads - seriously, there is almost no positive model of female sexual expression other than wife and mother, it's not really fair, but neither is it easy to change, you have to roll with it to some extent.

If you're lying there wondering what "people will think" instead of getting into the act, it's called spectatoring, and presumably, it's a different thing than subspace, which is immersing oneself in the act.

Bottom line is, you're doing the same thing - whether you're being objectified negatively or positively, is largely a matter of preference, you're going to be the same person regardless.



Brilliant post, xs.

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RE: Is this objectification? - 1/12/2012 11:08:09 PM   
slaverachel2Him


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quote:

ORIGINAL: shylilbear

Good morning to everyone reading this.

Part of my Daddy's plans for me include sharing me with his friends, to be used by them in any way he sees fit, to basically be a sex toy at times. I love the idea, as I think it sounds really hot and I get all sorts of tingly when I think about it.

Does this qualify as objectification? Why or why not?



Thank you for taking the time to read this, and I look forward to seeing all of your responses.

shylilbear


If it feels like it.

Objectification is when a subject is considered as a sex object, their sexuality is separate from a personhood. Objectified are often seen (at least temporarily) a subhuman, used a s furniture, a fuck toy, entertainment object. usually referred to as "it" and is used for sexual pleasure for others or as an object aka furniture. It is a hot kink for many. (me too) This can include toilet slave, footstools, party favors etc.

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RE: Is this objectification? - 1/12/2012 11:56:29 PM   
ResidentSadist


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quote:

ORIGINAL: xssve

Well there you go, I think it's one of those things that you know it when you see it, I think it takes a tougher person to handle it, in previous discussions, I've heard women in here describe how unrelenting objectification became ultimately, over a period of time, kind of a drag - if I'm not understating that.

re: RS, the definition of objectivity is seeing things as they are, not as you wish them to be: objectification as play is in some sense the opposite: "you are a slut, act like one, etc.", i.e, for the duration of the scene, and that can be liberating, given that if you want to experience true objectification, join a church, and when they ask you to testify, tell them about your last gang bang, how good it felt to have all those cocks pounding you, the warm feeling of lying on the bed exhausted, cum leaking from your swollen, throbbing holes, and how you can't wait to do it again - I guarantee you'll get a taste of true objectification.

In any case, putting a woman on a pedestal is objectification, being mother is objectification, etc., pretty much any role is objectification, objectification in BDSM is usually about getting over your hangups about enjoying yourself sexually without distancing yourself from the experience, but really being your self and exploring your feelings as a purely sexual being without all the second guessing.

It's not the only thing, there are myriad different forms, Dollification, fuckmeat, rag doll, slave, etc., even daddy dom, whatever works for you, but the huge onus on expressing anything but the approved sexuality in some circles really does a number on some peoples heads - seriously, there is almost no positive model of female sexual expression other than wife and mother, it's not really fair, but neither is it easy to change, you have to roll with it to some extent.

If you're lying there wondering what "people will think" instead of getting into the act, it's called spectatoring, and presumably, it's a different thing than subspace, which is immersing oneself in the act.

Bottom line is, you're doing the same thing - whether you're being objectified negatively or positively, is largely a matter of preference, you're going to be the same person regardless.

The points you make are quite valid but I just don't see how they apply to this thread.  It's like you imagined the OP asked something they didn't. 
"I've heard women in here describe how unrelenting objectification became ultimately, over a period of time, kind of a drag"
I don't think the OP's gang bang fuck party is gonna' last a lifetime.  I thought the OP was clear.  We aren't talking about her living in a cage, or acting as an ashtray, urinal or table over the "long term".  The poor chick just wanted to know if the proposed scene was objectification or not.  Again you are imposing things on the OP that aren't true.  

Objectivity has nothing to with objectification.  WTF are you talking about? I reply to your posts because I think you miss the point (and definition) of objectification.  Some people don't want to "feel", they don't want lust and passion... they want to disconnect.  Whether it is that they can only function sexually when disconnected or it is a retreat from emotions, they don't want all those things you describe.  You describe many things like humiliation, deification, adoration and worship, not objectification. 


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RE: Is this objectification? - 1/13/2012 4:56:27 AM   
xssve


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Well there is the dictionary, and then there is the experience - when one experiences a thing, one does not typically run to the dictionary to find out what they are feeling, they just feel it.

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RE: Is this objectification? - 1/13/2012 7:10:33 AM   
kalikshama


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I don't feel objectified during group sex - I feel like the center of attention.

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RE: Is this objectification? - 1/13/2012 7:31:19 AM   
Kana


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kalikshama

I don't feel objectified during group sex - I feel like the center of attention.


All those hard cocks standing at attention, one can imagine why :-)


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RE: Is this objectification? - 1/13/2012 7:45:30 AM   
DesFIP


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I would suggest op that you think out why exactly being objectified is so unpleasant for you? Have you been in a relationship where your input was ignored, and you were devalued? Because then it would be that to have a relationship like that is what you should hard limit. But if you're lying on the floor and he puts his feet on you to rest them, that's not the same as being devalued and belittled. Although it is being treated like an object, in this case a foot stool.

Unless for you, there isn't any way not to feel devalued in such a situation. More than the label is required here, you need to talk about the emotions behind them.

Some women feel like toys during gang bangs, others feel the center of attention and very powerful for being able to arouse all those men and have all of them wanting her.


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RE: Is this objectification? - 1/15/2012 7:38:33 AM   
xssve


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I should add there is also a distinction between objectification and humiliation, RS is correct in that the former is the act of ignoring your emotions, the latter is using them against you - they do overlap slightly, and are often mentioned together, but they're not quite the same thing, objects of worship and objects of derision are both objects, it's a much more complicated subject than it first appears.

In any case, in a gangbang you are basically an object everybody wants to fuck, which can be quite pleasant - it's a very common, if not the most common female fantasy - most women's reservations have to do with how they're supposed to act and how they'll be treated afterwards, i.e., "will you still respect me in the morning?" Of course I tell them, "I don't respect you now".

In this case, if he's talking you into it, then I'd go for the ride as long as it sounds fun, and you're not exactly dead set against it. If it turns out he can't handle it then it's really on him for biting off more than he can swallow, but most guys who are into the hotwife thing are pretty much into that, anything bothers you after, talk about it with him.

Don't worry about how to act, be yourself, trust your own emotions.


< Message edited by xssve -- 1/15/2012 7:53:30 AM >

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RE: Is this objectification? - 1/15/2012 5:11:22 PM   
lemmony2


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Sexual objectification refers to the practice of regarding or treating another person merely as an instrument (object) towards one's sexual pleasure, and a sex object is a person who is regarded simply as an object of sexual gratification or who is sexually attractive. Objectification is an attitude that regards a person as a commodity or as an object for use, with little or no regard for a person's personality or sentience.~ (Wikipedia) Not the most reliable place but reliable enough for this purpose.

So with that as a set definition my answer to your question would be NO.
The key reason for my logic in this matter is in this :"as an object for use, with little or no regard for a person's personality or sentience."..
Since you have already stated it is acceptable and actual pleasurable to you as well to take part in this behavior then it could be considered that you have been considered which means obviously their has been regard for your sentience.

Mr Levi

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