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RE: guys who pretend to be girls - 10/24/2004 9:48:57 PM

perverseangelic

Posts: 2625
Joined: 2/2/2004
From: Davis, Ca
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: yellovv

i'm a man and i know many other men in all races, we tend to agree that we assume and rush to judgement quite often...vanillia or not...if you know anyone who's not like this and he's a male, then he is an anomoly

I find this an incredibly sexist view. Any outlook which claims to know something about someone based on something as arbitrary and subjective as gender is flawed in my opinion.

Where does "male" stope? Someone who is a biological male but identifies female, a bio female who identifies male? Or someone with XXY or YO?

Perhaps the men you've met are like this. It's certainly not my experience. No matter -how- you define male, you still don't know anything about the person you're defining except what gender they see themself as. You certainly have no way into their worldview.

About the actual question though-- my computer hates me. It sometimes spontaneously shuts programs. I use Firefox to get to the net. Some pages hate that and randomly disconnect me. I drop out of chat without notice. It sucks, but I can't always explain why I've vanished.

Occationally, when someone is harassing me, or simply talking in a way I'd prefer not to be addressed, I will simply drop the chat. I'll admit, this is -not- polite of me, however sometimes you're not left a polite out in a conversation.

I AM NOT SAYING THIS IS WHAT HAPPENED IN YOUR SITUATION. I'm simply offering two other possibilities.

_____________________________

~in the begining it is always dark~

(in reply to yellovv)

Post #: 41

RE: guys who pretend to be girls - 10/24/2004 9:53:42 PM

yellovv

Posts: 57
Joined: 10/17/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: topcat

M. Yellovv-

First off, my sincere complements- you have started from a poor premise (IMO), but you are hanging in there and responding respectfully- Thank you.

Now, I am sure you can come up with a dozen reasons that person might have gone 'poof' other then their being false about hir gender, can't you? I wonder if your jumping to that conclusion reveals a preoccupation on your part more than anything else?

I don't want to give you a had time- I really did want to salute your ability to stick with it after a less thatn great start, and your calm responces to the sort of ribbing that others have taken as attacks in the past..

welcome aboard

stay warm,
Lawrence

i nood to you topcat as i still stand firm on view and my reasoning. people may not agree with me, but this is how i see it. i just reread the thread and yes, i do come off as a complete dick...what can i say, i typed quickly and some of my responses were not completely described. i respect all the women who have responded, but it seems as though i have become an enemy

btw, thank you for the welcome...been apart of this community for less than a day now

_____________________________

"It may seem frivolous to suggest everybody just needs a good night out... but really we are living in such troubled times that losing yourself on the dancefloor is a nice way to escape and remind yourself that life is for living"

Nick Warren

(in reply to topcat)

Post #: 42

RE: guys who pretend to be girls - 10/24/2004 9:56:11 PM

IservBlkKingPaPa

Posts: 84
Joined: 8/17/2004
From: Long Island NY
Status: offline

Yes, it is a wonderful thing that you have manners and are considerate. In an ideal world everyone would be. Unfortunately that is not the case and there are alot of people who do not care about what the person on the other end of the monitor thinks. That allows them to hit the power button with no thought of anybody else.

@}PaPa's}slave}--

Ai! laurië lantar lassi...

(in reply to yellovv)

Post #: 43

RE: guys who pretend to be girls - 10/24/2004 9:59:35 PM

LadyBeckett

Posts: 865
Joined: 2/4/2004
From: Scotland/Tennessee
Status: offline

quote:

but it seems as though i have become an enemy

Not at all. Stay with us.

_____________________________

Lady Beckett

_______________________________________________

"Submissive boys yearn to fall into their proper place, so the rest of their life will." ~ Lady Beckett

(in reply to yellovv)

Post #: 44

RE: guys who pretend to be girls - 10/24/2004 9:59:40 PM

yellovv

Posts: 57
Joined: 10/17/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: perverseangelic

I find this an incredibly sexist view. Any outlook which claims to know something about someone based on something as arbitrary and subjective as gender is flawed in my opinion.

Where does "male" stope? Someone who is a biological male but identifies female, a bio female who identifies male? Or someone with XXY or YO?

Perhaps the men you've met are like this. It's certainly not my experience. No matter -how- you define male, you still don't know anything about the person you're defining except what gender they see themself as. You certainly have no way into their worldview.

About the actual question though-- my computer hates me. It sometimes spontaneously shuts programs. I use Firefox to get to the net. Some pages hate that and randomly disconnect me. I drop out of chat without notice. It sucks, but I can't always explain why I've vanished.

Occationally, when someone is harassing me, or simply talking in a way I'd prefer not to be addressed, I will simply drop the chat. I'll admit, this is -not- polite of me, however sometimes you're not left a polite out in a conversation.

I AM NOT SAYING THIS IS WHAT HAPPENED IN YOUR SITUATION. I'm simply offering two other possibilities.

no, i literally mean i know men from almost all religions and race and they will rush to judgement at times and they assume things even more so. i never said that all men are like this, just the majority of the men (not just those in my age group) who are like this from first hand experience through radio, television, the hotel industry, club owners, friends, bosses, i see it from time to time in the bay area and we're known as the clam, understanding type.

the kneejerk reactions are just that - in a heat of the moment...maybe my responses of all us men seemed incorrect and possibly sexist, but we actually do that at times, and i'm sure women do that...i know some do from first hand...it's the human physcey working with the id.

_____________________________

"It may seem frivolous to suggest everybody just needs a good night out... but really we are living in such troubled times that losing yourself on the dancefloor is a nice way to escape and remind yourself that life is for living"

Nick Warren

(in reply to perverseangelic)

Post #: 45

RE: guys who pretend to be girls - 10/24/2004 10:02:04 PM

LadyAngelika

Posts: 8070
Joined: 7/4/2004
Status: offline

quote:

but it seems as though i have become an enemy

You haven't become an enemy yellovv. Far from it.

You just have to stop, think then post. You are addressing a very wide variety of people here and sometimes a little temperance isn't a bad thing.

Rule of thumb. If you stick your ass out at us, we will swat it. Dom/mes & subs alike ;)

Welcome to the boards.

- LA

_____________________________

Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

(in reply to yellovv)

Post #: 46

RE: guys who pretend to be girls - 10/24/2004 10:03:00 PM

stef

Posts: 10215
Joined: 1/26/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: yellovv

i can understand how you say it's depressing, we all do rush to judgement at times, good or bad, and we all assume as well, i and many others tend to do it once to many and i'm sorry to say that it happens because my assumptions do come true at times and it reinforces the notion that assumption can be rashinal sometimes.

If you go through life with the expectation that you're going to experience the worst in every situation, you shouldn't be surprised if that's exactly you get. Your new signature may very well be a self-fulfilling prophecy.

quote:

btw, i checked your profile and you are a transgender...

No, I'm not a "transgender". A person can no more be a "transgender" than they can be a "dominate". I'm a pre-operative transsexual. The term "transgendered" has become commonly used as an umbrella term to cover anything from transsexuals to crossdressers. It's not a term I hold in particularly high regard.

quote:

i live in san francisc, born and raised...i have no ill will towards anyone and none of my remarks were towards any gender of people...just towards the one person i talked to through yim.

If you were born and raised in SF, then I don't think your earlier supposition of your attitudes being a regional difference in idealogy is the case. I spent the last 8 years living in SF.

quote:

but your profile says that you are a transgender, if the person i talked to was a man who felt like he was a women, shouldn't he have taken the same position as you and tell me that he was a man?

That's not the position I'm taking. I am most certainly not a man.

I'm not going to speculate on the other person since we know nothing about him other than the fact that he stopped chatting with you.

~stef

< Message edited by sfgrrl -- 10/24/2004 10:06:19 PM >

_____________________________

Welcome to PoliticSpace! If you came here expecting meaningful BDSM discussions, boy are you in the wrong place.

"Hypocrisy has consequences"

(in reply to yellovv)

Post #: 47

RE: guys who pretend to be girls - 10/24/2004 10:05:43 PM

EStrict

Posts: 729
Joined: 1/11/2004
Status: offline

hi Angelica,

Yes, I did catch that, but considered it more 2 different questions and decided to respond to the one that I felt like talking about :)

As far as the origanal post...

Well, I live close to the west coast, and have known people there all my life. I don't see it as regional thing, more as a ::ducking:: age thing. Having a children that are within 4 years of your age, (and being 20 years older than you), I have *sadly* watched how jaded many young people are. *Luckily*, I have seen many learn that everything isn't as negative as their generation wishes to believe.

On a side note,, I am curious to where the logic of the picture comes from at all (unless it was an nude, which if you ever read the boards you will see aren't as *appreciated* as males want them to be)? You have one in your profile, she already knows what you look like.

_____________________________

Sandy

Don't take life too seriously, no one gets out alive anyway...

(in reply to IservBlkKingPaPa)

Post #: 48

RE: guys who pretend to be girls - 10/24/2004 10:07:02 PM

yellovv

Posts: 57
Joined: 10/17/2004
Status: offline

quote:

You haven't become an enemy yellovv. Far from it.

You just have to stop, think then post. You are addressing a very wide variety of people here and sometimes a little temperance isn't a bad thing.

Rule of thumb. If you stick your ass out at us, we will swat it. Dom/mes & subs alike ;)

Welcome to the boards.

- LA

hello and thank you for the warm, but much different type of welcome

p.s. i'll try to remember the ruleofthumb...but i'm not promising anything...lol

_____________________________

"It may seem frivolous to suggest everybody just needs a good night out... but really we are living in such troubled times that losing yourself on the dancefloor is a nice way to escape and remind yourself that life is for living"

Nick Warren

(in reply to LadyAngelika)

Post #: 49

RE: guys who pretend to be girls - 10/24/2004 10:14:11 PM

yellovv

Posts: 57
Joined: 10/17/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: sfgrrl

If you go through life with the expectation that you're going to experience the worst in every situation, you shouldn't be surprised if that's exactly you get. Your new signature may very well be a self-fulfilling prophecy.

no, it's just that i'm cynical.

quote:

No, I'm not a "transgender". A person can no more be a "transgender" than they can be a "dominate". I'm a pre-operative transsexual. The term "transgendered" has become commonly used as an umbrella term to cover anything from transsexuals to crossdressers. It's not a term I hold in particularly high regard.

sorry, i don't really know the difference between them

quote:

If you were born and raised in SF, then I don't think your earlier supposition of your attitudes being a regional difference in idealogy is the case. I spent the last 8 years living in SF

true, maybe we just live in two differenet worlds, even though we live in the same city

quote:

I'm not going to speculate on the other person since we know nothing about him other than the fact that he stopped chatting with you.

yea, honestly i need to stop too

_____________________________

"It may seem frivolous to suggest everybody just needs a good night out... but really we are living in such troubled times that losing yourself on the dancefloor is a nice way to escape and remind yourself that life is for living"

Nick Warren

(in reply to stef)

Post #: 50

RE: guys who pretend to be girls - 10/24/2004 10:42:21 PM

perverseangelic

Posts: 2625
Joined: 2/2/2004
From: Davis, Ca
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: yellovv

quote:

no, i literally mean i know men from almost all religions and race and they will rush to judgement at times and they assume things even more so. i never said that all men are like this, just the majority of the men (not just those in my age group) who are like this from first hand experience through radio, television, the hotel industry, club owners, friends, bosses, i see it from time to time in the bay area and we're known as the clam, understanding type.

the kneejerk reactions are just that - in a heat of the moment...maybe my responses of all us men seemed incorrect and possibly sexist, but we actually do that at times, and i'm sure women do that...i know some do from first hand...it's the human physcey working with the id.

But you did though "if you know anyone who's not like this and he's a male, then he is an anomoly " Implying most to all of men behave the opposite way.

I'm seriously not trying to demonize you. I like the way you'er saying what you have to say. This is mostly just a big issue for me, especially with the current emphasis on the definition of marriage. I adamantly dislike generalizations based on gender and wanted to stress that gender is pretty much as arbitrary as anything else.

_____________________________

~in the begining it is always dark~

(in reply to yellovv)

Post #: 51

RE: guys who pretend to be girls - 10/24/2004 10:51:53 PM

yellovv

Posts: 57
Joined: 10/17/2004
Status: offline

quote:

But you did though "if you know anyone who's not like this and he's a male, then he is an anomoly " Implying most to all of men behave the opposite way.

I'm seriously not trying to demonize you. I like the way you'er saying what you have to say. This is mostly just a big issue for me, especially with the current emphasis on the definition of marriage. I adamantly dislike generalizations based on gender and wanted to stress that gender is pretty much as arbitrary as anything else.

yes, again i'll sound like a hypercrite as i do know some who does this less. not to say some men i know never assume, nor react blindly from some experiences, but they are the few exceptions - and yes, they do seem like anomolys to me because there are few men that don't act that way from the experiences i have encountered.

when i say experinces, these are from men who i personally know or have known for at least a year. i'm no in the business of judging others (really i'm not)...but my retared ass reads like it. i guess if i just really sit back and think, it's probably just an ego/male hornmone that just pushes me and most of the men i know to act like this.

deeply sorry for all the contridictions

M

_____________________________

"It may seem frivolous to suggest everybody just needs a good night out... but really we are living in such troubled times that losing yourself on the dancefloor is a nice way to escape and remind yourself that life is for living"

Nick Warren

(in reply to perverseangelic)

Post #: 52

RE: guys who pretend to be girls - 10/24/2004 11:15:47 PM

EStrict

Posts: 729
Joined: 1/11/2004
Status: offline

::laughing:: does the fact that you skipped my suggestion about it possibly being age mean it's possibly close?

_____________________________

Sandy

Don't take life too seriously, no one gets out alive anyway...

(in reply to yellovv)

Post #: 53

RE: guys who pretend to be girls - 10/24/2004 11:34:57 PM

yellovv

Posts: 57
Joined: 10/17/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: EStrict

::laughing:: does the fact that you skipped my suggestion about it possibly being age mean it's possibly close?

O, sorry Sandy, i didn't see it...i'm a bit shock to see how fast this topic has been responded to. i honestly doubt that it's an age issue as maturity doesn't corralate with age.

Maybe I’m wrong but I always use this analogy to explain it….when I was 15 and I wanted to ask a girl on a date, she said I was too immature and she went with an 18 yr old guy. When I was 18, it happened again and the girl went with a 25 yr old guy. Now I’m 22 and when I ask a girl my age, she says I’m not mature enough and she heads towards a guy in his late 30’s. I understand that every woman aren’t like this, but you get the idea that age and maturity, or a more “clam demeanor” has any correlation because everytime i get to that age or now other guys who are that age, usually or still is quite immature. it's just a perception issue that's the problem

_____________________________

"It may seem frivolous to suggest everybody just needs a good night out... but really we are living in such troubled times that losing yourself on the dancefloor is a nice way to escape and remind yourself that life is for living"

Nick Warren

(in reply to EStrict)

Post #: 54

RE: guys who pretend to be girls - 10/24/2004 11:42:04 PM

EStrict

Posts: 729
Joined: 1/11/2004
Status: offline

Ahh but see, again that is a different issue. I never spoke about maturity. My 17 year old son is one of the most mature people I have evern known. I am speaking generations and expectations. I know 50 year olds (male and female) who behave worse than my 2 year old in actions. That is a lack of maturity, not a lack of age.

I am speaking more the way peers in high school *decide* what is *cool* or not,,, or determine what is *just stupid*....

You say every man you know. My point is, you are *only* 22,,, and were you may be more mature than the other 22 year olds you know, in this matter you may be just jaded because of how those who are you age react. The men I know in their 60's have things that they react to differently than the men I know in their 40's, and the 20 year olds I know... that doesn't mean they all have the same level of maturity as everyone else who is their age.

_____________________________

Sandy

Don't take life too seriously, no one gets out alive anyway...

(in reply to yellovv)

Post #: 55

RE: guys who pretend to be girls - 10/25/2004 12:04:22 AM

GoddessDustyGold

Posts: 2822
Joined: 4/11/2004
From: Arizona
Status: offline

Well, Well! I had things to do today and came home so tired I took a nap! And look at what I missed!
Welcome to the boards yellowvv. I can't really add much to what has already been discussed except this. I am sorry you had someone leave you in chat, for whatever reason. It happens all the time. I seem to have the opposite problem, in that I am polite and have a difficult time ending the chat with a sub/slave! LOL
Now, I do hear from male subs all the time who are nervous as they find they have been chatting with males who represent themselves as a FemDom. Haven't heard of the other way 'round, but I guess anything is possible. And yes, if that was the case, you should have been told, but it isn't good to jump to conclusions.
I did notice you use the word "assume" a few times, so, oh this is so trite...(ahem!)
"when you assume you make and ass out of 'u' and me."
Also, take another look at your favorite saying attached to your posts. I really hope you don't feel that way!
Welcome, again! Sorry I missed this while it was happening!

_____________________________

Dusty
They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety
B Franklin
Don't blame Me ~ I didn't vote for either of them
The Hidden Kingdom

(in reply to yellovv)

Post #: 56

RE: guys who pretend to be girls - 10/25/2004 12:44:48 AM

BeachMystress

Posts: 2156
Joined: 4/3/2004
From: Naples Island- Long Beach CA - Southern California
Status: offline

*smiles* I have had a lot of fun reading this thread. Thank you folks.

ok, yellovv, the avatar LadyAngelika uses is a drawing by Namio Harukawa. There are two people in it.. one is a man suspended up side down. Does that make it easier for you to figure it out?

And IMHO, if it would have been a man posing as a woman, he probably would have had a fake photo all ready to send. You probably hit a woman who for whatever reason, bailed. It happens to all of us. Do not take it personally or be upset by it. Shrug, sigh and move on. Welcome to the boards.

_____________________________

Beach Mystress
*Do not threaten the weak. Intimidate the strong. ~ Stevenson*
http://beachmystress.jigsy.com
http://www.flickr.com/photos/beachmystress/

(in reply to yellovv)

Post #: 57

RE: guys who pretend to be girls - 10/25/2004 8:38:03 AM

yellovv

Posts: 57
Joined: 10/17/2004
Status: offline

quote:

You say every man you know. My point is, you are *only* 22,,, and were you may be more mature than the other 22 year olds you know, in this matter you may be just jaded because of how those who are you age react. The men I know in their 60's have things that they react to differently than the men I know in their 40's, and the 20 year olds I know... that doesn't mean they all have the same level of maturity as everyone else who is their age.

i may be jaded and i'll be the first to say that i am along that i'm cynical, and sarcastic because of the culture i live in. i'll take it for face value that my generation has been bombarded with images and sound bites to a level where my view and perception has been molded and mutated to this point, but it's certainly not just me.

it's possible that this is an extreme case or that my presentation has been over exaggerated, but it doesn’t negate the fact that most men do act this way (not always, but in certain case like mine, we do).

_____________________________

"It may seem frivolous to suggest everybody just needs a good night out... but really we are living in such troubled times that losing yourself on the dancefloor is a nice way to escape and remind yourself that life is for living"

Nick Warren

(in reply to EStrict)

Post #: 58

RE: guys who pretend to be girls - 10/25/2004 8:48:05 AM

yellovv

Posts: 57
Joined: 10/17/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: GoddessDustyGold

Well, Well! I had things to do today and came home so tired I took a nap! And look at what I missed!
Welcome to the boards yellowvv. I can't really add much to what has already been discussed except this. I am sorry you had someone leave you in chat, for whatever reason. It happens all the time. I seem to have the opposite problem, in that I am polite and have a difficult time ending the chat with a sub/slave! LOL
Now, I do hear from male subs all the time who are nervous as they find they have been chatting with males who represent themselves as a FemDom. Haven't heard of the other way 'round, but I guess anything is possible. And yes, if that was the case, you should have been told, but it isn't good to jump to conclusions.
I did notice you use the word "assume" a few times, so, oh this is so trite...(ahem!)
"when you assume you make and ass out of 'u' and me."
Also, take another look at your favorite saying attached to your posts. I really hope you don't feel that way!
Welcome, again! Sorry I missed this while it was happening!

yes i do assume because it's a natural reaction...i did say it many times because i am not trying to hide this fact, but from some of the replies i've gotten, i get the feeling that i may be the only one in this board that does this? i know that this can't be possible as people assume many things, it just may be that they don't do it in a negative outlook.

O, and for my sig...i thought it was funny so i used it, i don't believe in that honestly because i do understand and see that my life would be sh!t if i lived that way and i cherish my youth and my life.

_____________________________

"It may seem frivolous to suggest everybody just needs a good night out... but really we are living in such troubled times that losing yourself on the dancefloor is a nice way to escape and remind yourself that life is for living"

Nick Warren

(in reply to GoddessDustyGold)

Post #: 59

RE: guys who pretend to be girls - 10/25/2004 11:24:58 AM

RiotGirl

Posts: 3149
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: yellovv

what is wrong with these people? i was just talking to what i believe to be a female sub, and once i sent her (him) a pic, she (he) signs off right away. i know that doesn't say it is a male, but it's as close to a fact as you can get.

i'm just asking because even though i am a top and i live in this culture, i'm normal.

please, discuss

I dont get it either... Whats the purpos/point of it? What in the world are they getting from it?

(in reply to yellovv)

Post #: 60

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