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RE: Are we more self-aware? - 6/1/2006 8:24:44 AM

lisa1978

Posts: 224
Joined: 5/19/2006
From: Kansas City
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We are certainly not more self aware than anyone else. We have our share of self delusions. I do believe we in general are more comfortable in our own skin. That does not mean in every part of our life, but I do believe in far more things than "regular" people. It is not easy to live lives outside of the societal norms and to cast away the shame and doubt takes a certain something that I do not see in the average person. We are not special in that area as many people with beliefs and convictions go through this but I do believe it does make us a little different than the normal living people.

_____________________________

It hurts sometimes more than we can bear. If we could live without passion, maybe we'd know some kind of peace. But we would be hollow. Empty rooms, shuttered and dank. Without passion, we'd be truly dead.

(in reply to becca333)

Post #: 21

RE: Are we more self-aware? - 6/1/2006 8:26:12 AM

darkinshadows

Posts: 4145
Joined: 6/2/2004
From: UK
Status: offline

Answer to all - is no.

Peace and Rapture.

_____________________________

.dark.

...i surrender to gravity and the unknown...

(in reply to becca333)

Post #: 22

RE: Are we more self-aware? - 6/1/2006 8:32:16 AM

thetammyjo

Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline

I think we can be less angsty and more aware after we've been involved in BDSM for a while and taken the time to get to learn about it, ourselves, and others.

I've met a lot of folks starting out who just ooze angst though and self-confusion and fear as well as a lot of other emotions.

I've met folks who claim to be solid and experienced who seem more afraid and more unsure to me as they try to push their "one true way" onto others

I think BDSM like the rest of life is a process that can result in personal growth and awareness but it does not have to do so.

_____________________________

Love, Peace, Hugs, Kisses, Whips & Chains,

TammyJo

Check out my website at http://www.thetammyjo.com Or www.tammyjoeckhart.com

And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

(in reply to becca333)

Post #: 23

RE: Are we more self-aware? - 6/1/2006 8:41:22 AM

becca333

Posts: 1050
Joined: 4/11/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: lisa1978

We are certainly not more self aware than anyone else. We have our share of self delusions. I do believe we in general are more comfortable in our own skin. That does not mean in every part of our life, but I do believe in far more things than "regular" people. It is not easy to live lives outside of the societal norms and to cast away the shame and doubt takes a certain something that I do not see in the average person. We are not special in that area as many people with beliefs and convictions go through this but I do believe it does make us a little different than the normal living people.

Thank you - you've said what I meant to say, and far better than I managed.

I've noticed that there's a certain kind of assurance about people who are different from the accepted norm, and come to terms with it. It's not just the kink-aware but it applies to those who have physical differences, some kinds of handicaps, and other features that differ widely from the norm. There's a calmness about them, a still centre. I think of them as people who've 'been through the fires' - they've dealt with their challenges and they're at ease with themselves.

I've found that the Doms I've been involved with are more in tune with emotions - and the fact that emotions exist - than vanilla men.

They're way better at foreplay, too.

(in reply to lisa1978)

Post #: 24

RE: Are we more self-aware? - 6/1/2006 9:10:45 AM

Proprietrix

Posts: 756
Joined: 7/15/2005
From: Ohio/West Virginia
Status: offline

There are kinky people who are at peace with themselves.
But there are a hell of a lot more kinky people who seem to have a ton of inner strife going on all the time. I can't even begin to count the numerous times I've seen kinky people who are nothing more than an emotional mess, doubting who and what they are, constantly questioning their stance in this world, unable to sustain meaningful relationships, constantly living with victim mentality, blame-shifting, and sometimes seemingly vacant of any emotion whatsoever. These folks far outnumber the ones I've seen who are secure, happy, and content within.

There are also non-kinky people who are very at peace with themselves. Spiritual get-togethers come to mind. But when I really sit and think about it... it's in really vanilla situations. The good old boys at the fraternal lodge, the VFW's community picnic, the fire department's ice cream social, the volunteers at the hospital, the mailman who whistles while he walks his route, the total strangers who sit down together in the park to play chess. Those are the kind of people I see laughing, conversing, and enjoying the weather, and I say to myself.
Now there's folks who "get it".

Sometimes, when I look at the kink community, I see a whole lot of people who seem to be trying to somehow "prove" (to themselves? to other kinksters? to the world?) that they are happy with their choices. It occurs to me that if you have to prove you're happy, you're probably not.

Edited because I always digress too much.

< Message edited by Proprietrix -- 6/1/2006 9:12:58 AM >

_____________________________

IMO, IMHO, YMMV, AFAIK, to me, I see it as, from my perspective, it's been my experience, I only speak for myself, (and all other disclaimers here).

(in reply to becca333)

Post #: 25

RE: Are we more self-aware? - 6/1/2006 9:15:20 AM

Dustyn

Posts: 1044
Joined: 4/5/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dustyn
I just don't do some of the things that other people do, but it is personal preference that drives that choice, not prejudicial judgement.

That's true, and that's you.

But there are plenty of people IN the scene who make prejudicial judgements about people IN the scene. As a group, we are no less judgemental or "wrong calling" as any other group.

Curiosity first... Why the emphasis on the word 'in'?

Judgemental on the surface, perhaps, but most will at least consider the other person's point of view, even if it is just to discard it later down the road. I have yet to hear a muslim tell a christian that just because we have different names for what we believe, we both believe in God, and that is what matters...

We, or at least I would assume so, all consider each other kinky, and we accept that. We flame, decry and everything else, but there is very rarely the true rancor you would find on a non-kink forum board for singles. I've read through quite a few over the years, and hands down, kink forums are generally more accepting of the general populace that are members than not...

But, as always, that is just my take on the entire concept. A different viewpoint makes for a different perspective... *lil shrug*

_____________________________

Mother is the name for God on the lips and hearts of all children.

Murderer?! Murderer! Let me tell you something about murder. It's fun; it's easy; you gonna learn ALL about it. - Tin Tin

Can you be more amusing?

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

Post #: 26

RE: Are we more self-aware? - 6/1/2006 9:21:21 AM

MsIncognito

Posts: 742
Joined: 5/24/2005
Status: offline

Maybe it's just the community in my area but I've met more insecure, BPD-ish, uptight prudes in the kinky community than I've ever met anywhere else. So no, I don't think the kink community ism ore self-aware than the wider community. I find a lot more angst in this community (i.e. "Master wants me to do XYZ and I can't bring myself to do XYZ, I'm so disappointed in myself, I'm such a bad slave" or "I'm struggling with my submission, why can't I just be a good submissive? etc, ad nauseum).

I have found that people tend to spend a lot more time self-indulgently navel gazing, but rarely does that seem to spill over into heightened self-awareness. There have a been a handful of exceptions, but for the most part your theory doesn't hold true in my experience.

quote:

ORIGINAL: becca333

This came to mind while reading another thread: so many people with a kink seem to be at peace with themselves. Are the kink community more self-aware than the wider community?

Based on my limited observations, it seems to me that we're more accepting of ourselves, we're happier about our desires and we know how we want to live our lives.

Is there less angst in kink than in vanilla?

(in reply to becca333)

Post #: 27

RE: Are we more self-aware? - 6/1/2006 9:23:49 AM

jezabelKH

Posts: 663
Joined: 5/21/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: becca333

This came to mind while reading another thread: so many people with a kink seem to be at peace with themselves. Are the kink community more self-aware than the wider community?

Based on my limited observations, it seems to me that we're more accepting of ourselves, we're happier about our desires and we know how we want to live our lives.

Is there less angst in kink than in vanilla?

hello,

i feel that people are people, no matter what their lifestyle is. everyone can choose how to controll themself.............happines.....sadnesss.....anger.....contentment.

now because i am in the lifestyle and because of my nature as a 24/7 slave am i more aware of others "moods"? yes but that is my nature as a slave.

i wish you well
jezabelKH
just simply a slave
Property of Master Ken

(in reply to becca333)

Post #: 28

RE: Are we more self-aware? - 6/1/2006 9:51:50 AM

darkinshadows

Posts: 4145
Joined: 6/2/2004
From: UK
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dustyn

Curiosity first... Why the emphasis on the word 'in'?

Judgemental on the surface, perhaps, but most will at least consider the other person's point of view, even if it is just to discard it later down the road. I have yet to hear a muslim tell a christian that just because we have different names for what we believe, we both believe in God, and that is what matters...

Just wanted to say - I have heard a muslim say that, because it was said to me and I agreed.(And no, the muslim in question did not practise wiitwd)

quote:

We, or at least I would assume so, all consider each other kinky, and we accept that. We flame, decry and everything else, but there is very rarely the true rancor you would find on a non-kink forum board for singles. I've read through quite a few over the years, and hands down, kink forums are generally more accepting of the general populace that are members than not...

But, as always, that is just my take on the entire concept. A different viewpoint makes for a different perspective... *lil shrug*

I have to say, that I find alot less tollerance.

People in WIITWD are humans. And they are no different to those outside wiitwd. There is even the class distinction between submissive types and slaves.... switches who are accused of being 'unable to make up their minds what they are'... funny looks from people who hear of 'sadistic submissives and masochistic dominants'.... people who abhore ageplay or adult babies.... there is little understanding of 3rd person speech... People who practise wiitwd still have bigotry, there are chauvinists, there are class-based judgements and religious and spiritual hatred. You only have to view the off-topic discussion board to witness that.

Peace and Rapture

_____________________________

.dark.

...i surrender to gravity and the unknown...

(in reply to Dustyn)

Post #: 29

RE: Are we more self-aware? - 6/1/2006 11:37:24 AM

MasterMoody

Posts: 133
Joined: 4/19/2006
Status: offline

right is weknow who we are and what we wamt and we all was know what is going on in are heads and don't try to hide od dien what we want and we do all we can to get it and for us to be happy

(in reply to darkinshadows)

Post #: 30

RE: Are we more self-aware? - 6/1/2006 1:33:27 PM

Dustyn

Posts: 1044
Joined: 4/5/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: darkinshadows

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dustyn

Curiosity first... Why the emphasis on the word 'in'?

Judgemental on the surface, perhaps, but most will at least consider the other person's point of view, even if it is just to discard it later down the road. I have yet to hear a muslim tell a christian that just because we have different names for what we believe, we both believe in God, and that is what matters...

Just wanted to say - I have heard a muslim say that, because it was said to me and I agreed.(And no, the muslim in question did not practise wiitwd)

quote:

We, or at least I would assume so, all consider each other kinky, and we accept that. We flame, decry and everything else, but there is very rarely the true rancor you would find on a non-kink forum board for singles. I've read through quite a few over the years, and hands down, kink forums are generally more accepting of the general populace that are members than not...

But, as always, that is just my take on the entire concept. A different viewpoint makes for a different perspective... *lil shrug*

I have to say, that I find alot less tollerance.
People in WIITWD are humans. And they are no different to those outside wiitwd. There is even the class distinction between submissive types and slaves.... switches who are accused of being 'unable to make up their minds what they are'... funny looks from people who hear of 'sadistic submissives and masochistic dominants'.... people who abhore ageplay or adult babies.... there is little understanding of 3rd person speech... People who practise wiitwd still have bigotry, there are chauvinists, there are class-based judgements and religious and spiritual hatred. You only have to view the off-topic discussion board to witness that.

Peace and Rapture

Don't spend much time in the off topic forums for the most part. Too many hot button topics there for me to really spend much time there without wanting to smack people around from time to time. Oh, wait... I'm a sadist, so that might have something to do with it. LOL

Guess I am just saying that while everyone in bdsm might not agree what is what in terms of 'real' or 'true' or any of that other label nonsense, those that have been involved with it for a few years are at least willing to give other people their space to do their own thing.

Agree to disagree, I guess you could say. But, like I said, I could be wrong on that.

_____________________________

Mother is the name for God on the lips and hearts of all children.

Murderer?! Murderer! Let me tell you something about murder. It's fun; it's easy; you gonna learn ALL about it. - Tin Tin

Can you be more amusing?

(in reply to darkinshadows)

Post #: 31

RE: Are we more self-aware? - 6/1/2006 1:40:22 PM

puella

Posts: 2457
Joined: 12/2/2004
Status: offline

I'm sure it's a quirk of an already quirky personality... but I am very leery of declaring either myself or a subset of people whom I identify with as better, or more than anyone else.

Usually there is no universal standard, either in my posse or the other used in comparison... and in the end.. it comes down to the power of one... the better question might be... Has BDSM or the practice of any of the myriad of kinks/lifestyles/ethos/ or activities done anything to help you become more self-aware? At least I think the answers to that question might be a bit more definitive.

I just personally don't think anyone can truly know how self-aware anyone is but themselves.. its rather implicit in the word itself.

(in reply to becca333)

Post #: 32

RE: Are we more self-aware? - 6/1/2006 1:47:07 PM

MasterMoody

Posts: 133
Joined: 4/19/2006
Status: offline

i think it is whowe are and what we want that makes us who we are and what makes us happy

(in reply to puella)

Post #: 33

RE: Are we more self-aware? - 6/1/2006 3:12:56 PM

Sunshine119

Posts: 611
Joined: 8/8/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dustyn

Judgemental on the surface, perhaps, but most will at least consider the other person's point of view, even if it is just to discard it later down the road. I have yet to hear a muslim tell a christian that just because we have different names for what we believe, we both believe in God, and that is what matters...

Hmmmm.....now I understand that statement to be very culturally insensitive. I know a number of Muslims who believe in the exact same God as I, because we both understand and can recognize the history and Judeo-Christian roots of Islam. Sooooooo.......sounds to me like you may be as judgemental (and not just on the surface) as others.

quote:

We, or at least I would assume so, all consider each other kinky, and we accept that. We flame, decry and everything else, but there is very rarely the true rancor you would find on a non-kink forum board for singles. I've read through quite a few over the years, and hands down, kink forums are generally more accepting of the general populace that are members than not...

Geez, again, these massive generalizations are daunting. Stick around awhile and you will surely get a taste of how much true rancor people in this lifestyle can hold for each other....even regarding each other's kink. There have even been a few threads where the mods have had to step in since you have been here.

We are no better, nor worse or different than anyone else.

_____________________________

Life is not measured by the number of breaths we take, but by the moments that take our breath away.

(in reply to Dustyn)

Post #: 34

RE: Are we more self-aware? - 6/1/2006 3:33:45 PM

MistressOfGa

Posts: 2929
Status: offline

quote:

BDSMers are just as hung up about our skin and the wicked things we do as anyone else.

Speak for yourself, I have no problem with the wicked things I do. I also disagree with the intenseness of a D/s relationship, especially when there is extreme pain involved. It is not every day that I would see bruises on the ass and a smile on the face of any of my vanilla friends. IMO, BDSMers are more intense with their time together. I do agree we are no better or more self aware than V's.

_____________________________

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Post #: 35

RE: Are we more self-aware? - 6/1/2006 3:43:03 PM

eruditegirl1

Posts: 175
Joined: 5/9/2006
From: Nevada
Status: offline

From reading both on the boards and literature.... in my experience haven't found anymore or any less... self aware people in BDSM than in Vanilla....seems to be about equal on both sides....like all things...it comes down to balance....kink balanced by prude.....open by close....cold by hot...aware by unconscious
I started a few years back on my own personal growth....and since have seemed to gravitate towards people who are growing too...or those who have helped me to undestand myself more....maybe you are on the same path ...and are coming across more of the self aware people too....

(in reply to Sunshine119)

Post #: 36

RE: Are we more self-aware? - 6/1/2006 3:49:47 PM

BitaTruble

Posts: 9779
Joined: 1/12/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline

As a whole, I think BDSM folks tend to be a bit more open in the subjects they'll discuss than 'nilla folks. My 'nilla girlfriends will discuss sex up to a certain point before they get all red and embarrased and change the subject to something a bit less risque. My kink-minded friends don't seem to have a problem discussing sex, kink and D/s till the sun comes up. If travel broadens the mind, then it would make sense that diversity would also broaden the mind and if one is open to discussion, then self-awareness .. even in small measure .. would be easier to come by for the kink-minded than the non-kink minded simply because of additional exposure to areas in which 'nilla's won't dwell. All things being equal, exploring kink would be a + not a - towards becoming more self-aware.

YMMV

Celeste

_____________________________

"Oh, so it's just like
Rock, paper, scissors."

He laughed. "You are the wisest woman I know."

(in reply to MistressOfGa)

Post #: 37

RE: Are we more self-aware? - 6/1/2006 4:02:41 PM

doll

Posts: 296
Joined: 7/10/2005
From: Middle Georgia
Status: offline

We are more in-tune with what we want and what we desire to make ourselves happy... nillas normally go with the flow to make others happy.

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Official Member Of MoGa's IN-crowd!
*sexylicious doll* as proclaimed by DRH
*dollface* as proclaimed by Lady Hib
*parkay* as proclaimed by buttah

(in reply to BitaTruble)

Post #: 38

RE: Are we more self-aware? - 6/1/2006 4:04:45 PM

juliaoceania

Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline

The easy answer is NO!

I do not think this is the most self aware group of people I have ever encountered. The most self aware subculture I have ever been a part of was in college. But that is just me and I could be wrong... etc

< Message edited by juliaoceania -- 6/1/2006 4:05:24 PM >

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to becca333)

Post #: 39

RE: Are we more self-aware? - 6/1/2006 4:34:35 PM

Dustyn

Posts: 1044
Joined: 4/5/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sunshine119

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dustyn

Judgemental on the surface, perhaps, but most will at least consider the other person's point of view, even if it is just to discard it later down the road. I have yet to hear a muslim tell a christian that just because we have different names for what we believe, we both believe in God, and that is what matters...

Hmmmm.....now I understand that statement to be very culturally insensitive. I know a number of Muslims who believe in the exact same God as I, because we both understand and can recognize the history and Judeo-Christian roots of Islam. Sooooooo.......sounds to me like you may be as judgemental (and not just on the surface) as others.

Not really. I just call things the way I see them. A surface acknowledgement of the roots does not mean that the Christian will go to a mosque for services and vice versa. At least I've never seen it happen for on a holy day for either religion, but anything's possible.

quote:

quote:

We, or at least I would assume so, all consider each other kinky, and we accept that. We flame, decry and everything else, but there is very rarely the true rancor you would find on a non-kink forum board for singles. I've read through quite a few over the years, and hands down, kink forums are generally more accepting of the general populace that are members than not...

Geez, again, these massive generalizations are daunting. Stick around awhile and you will surely get a taste of how much true rancor people in this lifestyle can hold for each other....even regarding each other's kink. There have even been a few threads where the mods have had to step in since you have been here.

We are no better, nor worse or different than anyone else.

Guess I am just more willing to accept things than most people. Then again, I could care less about how I am judged by others, so that might be part of why I tend to overlook the amusing angst that shows up on forum boards.

Tell you one thing, though. It's more common for a homosexual to find acceptance in a bdsm forum than in the average forum. There will always be a bit fo flaming from the insecure ones, but by and large, the lifestylers that I talk with on a regular basis are at least willing to accept the fact that we might do things differently, but we are still part of the same sub-culture. Nothing says we have to accept every single facet of every kink that comes across these boards, but I don't notice a grand deal of racism, orientation bashing, or other things along those lines around here.

Maybe I just tend to overlook the muck and look at the knowledge.

_____________________________

Mother is the name for God on the lips and hearts of all children.

Murderer?! Murderer! Let me tell you something about murder. It's fun; it's easy; you gonna learn ALL about it. - Tin Tin

Can you be more amusing?

(in reply to Sunshine119)

Post #: 40

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