quote:

Previous studies found that rates of pregnancy resulting from rape could be anything up to 30 per cent, compared to a two to four per cent chance of getting pregnant from a single act of consensual sex. This led some biologists, notably Randy Thornhill from the University of New Mexico at Albuquerque, to parade the figures as evidence that rape is a natural way for men to spread their genes (New Scientist, 19 February 2000, p 44).

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But in the ensuing controversy, the studies were all roundly criticised. Some rely on crime statistics, which may skew the figures: rape victims who become pregnant may be more likely to report the crime than those who do not. Others fail to measure the influence of contraception - either preventive or post-coital, such as the morning after pill. And some include acts of oral and anal rape, which cannot result in pregnancy.

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To associate rape primarily with sex, or even penile-vaginal sex is inaccurate, as is shown above. The sexual component may be only one of many criminal components, or personal violations in a rape. Many rapists freely concede that the power and terror they exercise over their victims is their major gratification.

Adding all the above together, to assert that rape is a reproductive strategy verges on the cretinous. To insist on that assertion in the face of the evidence is not only cretinous but deeply offensive. Please please stop it.

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ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Sorry, you have already been outted. You simply didnt wish to furnish the source because of the controversy and inaccuracy of the study itself.

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Previous studies found that rates of pregnancy resulting from rape could be anything up to 30 per cent, compared to a two to four per cent chance of getting pregnant from a single act of consensual sex. This led some biologists, notably Randy Thornhill from the University of New Mexico at Albuquerque, to parade the figures as evidence that rape is a natural way for men to spread their genes (New Scientist, 19 February 2000, p 44).

That would seem to make your case, but the data is flawed.

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But in the ensuing controversy, the studies were all roundly criticised. Some rely on crime statistics, which may skew the figures: rape victims who become pregnant may be more likely to report the crime than those who do not. Others fail to measure the influence of contraception - either preventive or post-coital, such as the morning after pill. And some include acts of oral and anal rape, which cannot result in pregnancy.

Proof of the flaws.

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rape victims who become pregnant may be more likely to report the crime than those who do not

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ORIGINAL: xssve

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To associate rape primarily with sex, or even penile-vaginal sex is inaccurate, as is shown above. The sexual component may be only one of many criminal components, or personal violations in a rape. Many rapists freely concede that the power and terror they exercise over their victims is their major gratification.

Adding all the above together, to assert that rape is a reproductive strategy verges on the cretinous. To insist on that assertion in the face of the evidence is not only cretinous but deeply offensive. Please please stop it.

"many rapists" not, "all rapists" - your insistence on cherry picking your examples, and attempting to refute the hypothesis I offered with ad hominem instead of argument is offensive to the spirit of empirical inquiry, please stop it.

You merely offer an alternative hypothesis, which I am not disputing, but it isn't a pre-emptive hypothesis, merely an alternative, and there is no reason that both cannot be correct.

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ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Well, whatever the fuckin thing is, it's obviously wholly fugazi, and that is prima facie.  

Look, if only 2-4 percent of sex acts with some portion of them folks trying result in a womans pregnancy, what would INCREASE that number to upwards to 30% let alone some goddamn 6% even?

NO TH IN GG..........it aint happenin.  There is no maybe, no theory, no magic of a woman's rape fantasy or violent sex fantasy that is gonna put that sort of number out there, PERIOD.

Junk from a punk. That's the most can be said for that 'study'. 

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ORIGINAL: xssve

Look, males, biologically, are much more expendable than females, by simple virtue of the fact that a single male can impregnate multiple females - I don't like that fact one little bit, doesn't make it any less true.

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ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

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ORIGINAL: xssve

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To associate rape primarily with sex, or even penile-vaginal sex is inaccurate, as is shown above. The sexual component may be only one of many criminal components, or personal violations in a rape. Many rapists freely concede that the power and terror they exercise over their victims is their major gratification.

Adding all the above together, to assert that rape is a reproductive strategy verges on the cretinous. To insist on that assertion in the face of the evidence is not only cretinous but deeply offensive. Please please stop it.

"many rapists" not, "all rapists" - your insistence on cherry picking your examples, and attempting to refute the hypothesis I offered with ad hominem instead of argument is offensive to the spirit of empirical inquiry, please stop it.

You merely offer an alternative hypothesis, which I am not disputing, but it isn't a pre-emptive hypothesis, merely an alternative, and there is no reason that both cannot be correct.

Your claim of rape being a good evolutionary reproductive strategy has several holes in it.

For species that don't invest paternal care in the offspring, it might be correct. Ancient humans, on the other hand, required significant paternal care if the ofspring was to reach sexual maturity.
Remember, just creating offspring is NOT reproductive success. Those offspring must reach sexual maturity and reproduce themselves for you to have been successful. This is probably the reason that humans tended to live in multigenerational family groups with parental assistance raising the young.
For humans, sex is a bonding activity. It is one way for the female to make sure the male stays around and helps defend and feed the family unit.

An archaic rapist, on the other hand might be able to impregnate multiple females but, as he would not be assisting for several years to ensure their survival, his actual reproductive success would be low. He would also put himself at personal risk at the hand of the female's real or prospective mate. (Nothing says "I love you" more than bringing home the head of that SOB that hurt you.)

In that environment, single mothers died along with their offspring. It doesn't matter what "Clan of the Cave Bear" says. They died.

Given that, Rape is a very poor reproductive strategy for humans.

Cuckoldry is a whole nother story.

My graduate work was primarily Evolutionary Biology.

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Given that, Rape is a very poor reproductive strategy for humans.

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ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Oh come on. Who do you think you are kidding? Every post you make on rape tells of your belief that its not the man's fault. And you expect me to believe you missed a so called piece of science, and a book, that states just what you believe?

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rape victims who become pregnant may be more likely to report the crime than those who do not

Now, explain why old ladies get raped.

Explain why men get raped.

Explain why there are rapes involving only oral.

Explain why there are rapes involving only anal.

None of these match your hypothesis.

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You merely offer an alternative hypothesis, which I am not disputing, but it isn't a pre-emptive hypothesis, merely an alternative, and there is no reason that both cannot be correct.

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ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Previous studies found that rates of pregnancy resulting from rape could be anything up to 30 per cent, compared to a two to four per cent chance of getting pregnant from a single act of consensual sex. This led some biologists, notably Randy Thornhill from the University of New Mexico at Albuquerque, to parade the figures as evidence that rape is a natural way for men to spread their genes (New Scientist, 19 February 2000, p 44).

Ja, raping 88 year old ladies is gonna lead to some barefoot pregnant girls alright.

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ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

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ORIGINAL: xssve

Look, males, biologically, are much more expendable than females, by simple virtue of the fact that a single male can impregnate multiple females - I don't like that fact one little bit, doesn't make it any less true.

He could impregnate several but, in an archaic environment, he could not enjoy reproductive success because he would be unable to feed and defend them.

2, maybe. 3 or more, ain't happenin.

They're leopard food.

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ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

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You merely offer an alternative hypothesis, which I am not disputing, but it isn't a pre-emptive hypothesis, merely an alternative, and there is no reason that both cannot be correct.

There is a very good reason your guesswork, which you have elevated falsely to the level of a 'hypothesis' cannot be correct. It doesn't describe reality.

I don't know what delusions you may have about your intellectual prowess - I could venture an opinion but it would probably get me moderated - but please apply such talents as you have to (a) a field where you have at least a rudimentary familiarity with current state of knowledge and (b) a field where the calamaties you continuously misrepresent to us as hypotheses are less offensive and outrageous.

It is very clear from your inane rants that you haven't the slightest familiarity with the field of rape or its consequences on those of us unfortunate enough to have been raped. Spare a thought for them if you can in fact see past your own nose.

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ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

I would also like to include that biology has its own way of ensuring the survival of the species. Its not just by chance that a child looks like it's biological father.

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ORIGINAL: mnottertail

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ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

I would also like to include that biology has its own way of ensuring the survival of the species. Its not just by chance that a child looks like it's biological father.

Well, if its born with no hair, I guess we know who's it is, hah?