RE: The myth of endless economic growth (Full Version)

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MrBukani -> RE: The myth of endless economic growth (3/24/2012 8:38:36 PM)

I can still buy futures on banks or any product as far as I know.
Its wrong to speculate on loss.
Its like gambling for destruction.

And by the way my bank was ruined because of the stockmarket, because the share holders thought they could make an extra dime on their shares selling one of the best banks we had. ABN AMRO.

The bank broke and its a state bank now again.
Just like in the old days.
A well thought out plan.
And we the people had to bail out the greedy shareholders.
As far as I know you can buy futures on anything.
Prove me wrong PLEASE!




Musicmystery -> RE: The myth of endless economic growth (3/24/2012 8:40:04 PM)

You are I are not talking about the same thing.

Show me where you buy banking futures.




MrBukani -> RE: The myth of endless economic growth (3/24/2012 8:52:41 PM)

http://books.google.nl/books?id=yUOpU4l6bPUC&pg=PA257&lpg=PA257&dq=future+options/bankshares&source=bl&ots=tlfilpwq07&sig=SSFL3MfCvCoighSEKgkOA0q_w8Q&hl=nl&sa=X&ei=3pRuT677OcrtOanQ4f4F&ved=0CHsQ6AEwCQ#v=onepage&q=future%20options%2Fbankshares&f=false

This is the best I could find for futres on bankshares maybe I read it wrong, but show me counter evidence you cannot buy futures on about anything and I will be happy too.
Im not the best googler.
Still its a fact the stock market does more damage to the economy then it helps.
Just look at all the bubbles.
If you want life to be a gamble.
I pity the fool who has to live with gambling with livelyhoods.
Yay for the capitalist nay for the ppor.




Musicmystery -> RE: The myth of endless economic growth (3/24/2012 9:03:03 PM)

Speculating and investing are not at all the same thing.

Investing is part ownership in the business. The capital has to come from somewhere.

By your definition, starting a business is gambling.





MrBukani -> RE: The myth of endless economic growth (3/24/2012 9:22:14 PM)

Everything in life is a bit of a gamble, but speculators are not investors.
They only trade for profit not for business.
So fuck those traders.
I would like to gamble with their families and see how they end up.
I would like to see how it feels for them to be on the wrong side of their dealings.
Do you have any idea how much damage they have done?
I think they are the root element of greed.
They dont give a fuck about makin products.




Musicmystery -> RE: The myth of endless economic growth (3/24/2012 9:22:58 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrBukani

speculators are not investors


I think I just pointed that out.

As for the rest of your rant -- in your world, making products would be an immoral act. You draw no distinction.




MrBukani -> RE: The myth of endless economic growth (3/24/2012 9:27:05 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

I think I just pointed that out.

Good. Thank you.




MrBukani -> RE: The myth of endless economic growth (3/24/2012 9:30:13 PM)

Just so you know in this trade there is no difference between investing and speculating, its in the eyes of the beholder.
So I say fuck the whole stockmarket industry.
It does nothing for economic stability, it just ruins it.
You wanna buy stock fine.
stock market? = corruption.




Musicmystery -> RE: The myth of endless economic growth (3/24/2012 9:33:09 PM)

You are talking about things you clearly don't understand.




Musicmystery -> RE: The myth of endless economic growth (3/24/2012 9:37:46 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: MrBukani

speculators are not investors.


quote:

ORIGINAL: MrBukani

there is no difference between investing and speculating






MrBukani -> RE: The myth of endless economic growth (3/24/2012 9:43:09 PM)

So you are sayin acting is the same as being.




Musicmystery -> RE: The myth of endless economic growth (3/24/2012 9:52:49 PM)

I'm saying you clearly don't understand what you're talking about.




MrBukani -> RE: The myth of endless economic growth (3/24/2012 9:58:32 PM)

Ok you stand your ground and prove me it is not so.
Give a link.
Cause you sayin me dont know what I am talkin about doesnt amount to much.
If you are right I am the first to say I was swrong.
Your move maestro.




Musicmystery -> RE: The myth of endless economic growth (3/24/2012 10:03:20 PM)

You keep jumping to futures. Of course futures are speculative.

You're trying to make speculation investment. It isn't.

Uncle Harold wants to open a corner store. He has half the money. You give him the other half and earn half the proceeds.

Congratulations. You're a stockholder.

One day, you decide to retire to Kenya, and you want your half of the business. Fortunately, your Great Aunt Petunia is looking for a good investment. You all sit down and work out just what the business is worth these days now that it's grown so. When you arrive at a figure, she writes you a check.

Congratulations. You both just participated in a stock market.





[yes, these are private sales, but that's the concept]




seekingOwnertoo -> RE: The myth of endless economic growth (3/24/2012 10:05:38 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

Can economic growth be sustained into the future indefinitely?


Economic growth is cyclical ... and depends entirely on the WORK ETHIC and INNOVATION of human beings.

Of course it will go up and down .... always has, always will.






MrBukani -> RE: The myth of endless economic growth (3/24/2012 10:09:16 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

You keep jumping to futures. Of course futures are speculative.

You're trying to make speculation investment. It isn't.

Uncle Harold wants to open a corner store. He has half the money. You give him the other half and earn half the proceeds.

Congratulations. You're a stockholder.



I am just waiting for a link that says I cant buy futures on any business not just commodities, and maybe currency is a commodity.
Do you want the rest of the world to gamble on your losses with the allmighty dollar?




Musicmystery -> RE: The myth of endless economic growth (3/24/2012 10:14:17 PM)

quote:

you sayin me dont know what I am talkin about doesnt amount to much.


http://www.collarchat.com/fb.asp?m=4072253

I've already quoted you directly contradicting yourself.





Musicmystery -> RE: The myth of endless economic growth (3/24/2012 10:16:46 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: MrBukani


quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

You keep jumping to futures. Of course futures are speculative.

You're trying to make speculation investment. It isn't.

Uncle Harold wants to open a corner store. He has half the money. You give him the other half and earn half the proceeds.

Congratulations. You're a stockholder.



I am just waiting for a link that says I cant buy futures on any business not just commodities, and maybe currency is a commodity.
Do you want the rest of the world to gamble on your losses with the allmighty dollar?

Fine. Don't buy futures.

What's the problem here?


quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

You keep jumping to futures. Of course futures are speculative.

You're trying to make speculation investment. It isn't.

Uncle Harold wants to open a corner store. He has half the money. You give him the other half and earn half the proceeds.

Congratulations. You're a stockholder.

One day, you decide to retire to Kenya, and you want your half of the business. Fortunately, your Great Aunt Petunia is looking for a good investment. You all sit down and work out just what the business is worth these days now that it's grown so. When you arrive at a figure, she writes you a check.

Congratulations. You both just participated in a stock market.





[yes, these are private sales, but that's the concept]

See? No futures contracts. Just business investment.

What you're insisting on is like saying all purchases are like buying a chance at the roulette wheel, ignoring that people also spend their money at the grocery store and not at the casino.





Hippiekinkster -> RE: The myth of endless economic growth (3/24/2012 10:20:53 PM)

Talk about losin' the plot... [:D]




MrBukani -> RE: The myth of endless economic growth (3/24/2012 10:21:46 PM)

Missing link.




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