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RE: Not supporting UNBRIDLED illegal immigration does n... - 5/11/2012 2:22:56 PM   
MasterSlaveLA


Posts: 3991
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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

...chasing down those brown people you seem to hate so much



Ahhh... just like clockwork -- playing the RACE CARD.  tsk... tsk... tsk.



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(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 61
RE: Not supporting UNBRIDLED illegal immigration does n... - 5/11/2012 2:37:11 PM   
tj444


Posts: 7574
Joined: 3/7/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

quote:

ORIGINAL: tj444

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
Your facts are wrong. California deported more than one million american citizens of latino background in the thirties. Their private property was confiscated. When ww2 started the u.s. sent draft notices to all of those deportees who would have been draft elligible. Exactly 100% of those so notified returned to the u.s. and entered he military.


That is quite the history,.. I am guessing they never were compensated for the property stolen from them? And so after WW2, were they kicked right back out again??


If your interest is genuine then you can find all of the particulars you seek on line.

why would you think my interest isnt genuine?

Well,.. i dont have time to research further but I did find out so far is that they just this year, 2012, finally got an apology from California.. and a plaque.. WOW! That and $5 will get them a latte..

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(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 62
RE: Not supporting UNBRIDLED illegal immigration does n... - 5/11/2012 2:37:18 PM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Iamsemisweet

Since you obviously didn't read the link, why even pretend to discuss it?
quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


quote:

ORIGINAL: Iamsemisweet

Speaking of harm, there is this:
Q: Does the IRS pay billions in tax refunds to workers who are in the U.S. illegally? A: Yes. The Treasury Department’s Inspector General determined that $4.2 billion was paid in 2010, up from less than $1 billion in 2005. Leading Democrats are resisting a bill that would stop future payments.
Link to the full story:  http://factcheck.org/2012/05/tax-credits-for-illegal-immigrants/



Do I understand you correctly. A person earns money has their taxes deducted and the amount that they overpaid their taxes is returned to them. You seek to deny to a worker the money they earned by their labor. That is called slavery and is against the law in my country. That the person was illegally in the country has nothing to do with you seeking to steal the money they earned with their labor.




My response was to what you posted.
quote:

Q: Does the IRS pay billions in tax refunds to workers who are in the U.S. illegally? A: Yes. The Treasury Department’s Inspector General determined that $4.2 billion was paid in 2010, up from less than $1 billion in 2005.

Your link was not about tax refunds as you well know.

(in reply to Iamsemisweet)
Profile   Post #: 63
RE: Not supporting UNBRIDLED illegal immigration does n... - 5/11/2012 2:48:37 PM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

You havent counted in CEO bonuses and parachutes they wont be getting .............. actually going to the economy........pretty sloppy stuff huntie, I know you can add.


Toyotomi Hideyoshi 


Life at the top can be lonely.
My income is tax exempt.
Should miracles happen and the law be enforced I would probably visit some of those punkass motherfuckers in the joint just to gloat.

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 64
RE: Not supporting UNBRIDLED illegal immigration does n... - 5/11/2012 2:49:51 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		LOL at saburo.

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(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 65
RE: Not supporting UNBRIDLED illegal immigration does n... - 5/11/2012 2:54:54 PM   
Marini


Posts: 3629
Joined: 2/14/2010
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quote:

The mainland US has 12000+ miles of land and coastal borders. Alaska and Hawai'i adds another 8000 miles of coast and land border to that for a total in excess of 20,000 miles of border that would have to be sealed.

A simple wall would not work so you're talking about active and passive scanners and border agents monitoring the sensors and responding to every breach no matter how minor. Can you even begin to grasp the setup and ongoing costs of that? How exactly do we stay free with a tens of millions strong border patrol in our midst?



With the unemployment rate sky high for young people under 30 and the prisons bursting at the seams, we have PLENTY of able bodied workers available.
Some can be paid in $$$$ and the others can work off some of their debt to society, free room and board.

If we get at least half of our borders secure, we have enough advanced technology, high tech surveillance equipment and man power to man the other half.


I have a few other idea's but that is for my next OP.

_____________________________

As always, To EACH their Own.
"And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. "
Nelson Mandela
Life-long Democrat, not happy at all with Democratic Party.
NOT a Republican/Moderate and free agent

(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 66
RE: Not supporting UNBRIDLED illegal immigration does n... - 5/11/2012 2:54:55 PM   
fucktoyprincess


Posts: 2337
Status: offline 		At the most basic level I agree, but then there are a myriad of other factors that make this an extremely difficult issue.

Most of the people I know in the U.S. are descendants of immigrants or immigrants. I think I only know one person personally who is of Native American ancestry (but even they are of mixed descent, so they have immigrant heritage also). So I have a fundamental issue with the "us" vs "them" mentality.

Most of the illegal immigrants I know are from Ireland. Most of them now have legal status in the country. But they started as illegals. So it's fine to be anti illegal immigration if that's what one wants to be, but not all illegals are Hispanic. And not all Hispanic people in this country are illegals or the descendants of illegals. I just had dinner the other night with a couple from Mexico. Both graduate school educated, legal and employed. So when we start to equate illegal with just one group of people there is a problem. Let me repeat. MOST OF THE ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS I KNOW ARE FROM IRELAND.

All the illegal immigrants I know (whether they are now legal or are still illegal) are working at jobs that most American born do NOT want to do. So all the illegal immigrants I know are actually employed. If they left the country, the unemployment rate would not change, because no American born people would come forward to do these jobs. We have a fundamental issue in this country about the value of work. Most Americans would like to be a baseball star or a model. Failing that, they want to sit in an office cubicle from 9 to 5 only pushing paper around to no useful purpose and collect a paycheck at the end of the day for "work". Unfortunately, not all jobs resemble either of these things. How many of us would take the jobs that immigrant labor fills? Ask yourself how happy you would be as a migrant farm worker? Or housekeepers? Or dishwashers? Those of you who would be happy to have one of those jobs, and actually do so, have just earned the right to complain about illegal immigration all they want. Everyone else, no.

As for closing the border...haha...good luck with that.

The sooner that people accept that we have a global economy and that our fates are intertwined with the rest of the world, the easier it will be to determine what policies to have. We are one boat here. Those who think otherwise are facing a losing battle. Ultimately, there is no "us" vs "them". There are just humans on a planet with shrinking resources and poor family planning (in part due to conservative policies against birth control and abortion). The best way to control our population in the face of limited resources is for people to stop having so many children. And that, of course, is an issue that right-wingers don't want to touch. So we have ridiculous laws in place to protect a fetus, but no sensible laws when it comes to people who are here in our country working hard. None of it makes sense to me.





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(in reply to Marini)
Profile   Post #: 67
RE: Not supporting UNBRIDLED illegal immigration does n... - 5/11/2012 3:00:50 PM   
Marini


Posts: 3629
Joined: 2/14/2010
Status: offline 		One issue that is often NOT mentioned, is the fact that millions of people all over the world are also trying to gain entry and citizenship.

What about them? Do they not count? Where do they fit into the mix?

Why not give dual citizenship to everyone in North and South America?

It's okay to keep our borders open, we don't have any enemies in the world that mean us harm.


There are several important issues at stake, and the issue of citizenship is going to be numero uno eventually.

Question will be: who gets it?

If citizenship is not a goal, than maybe we should change the game, especially the end game.

< Message edited by Marini -- 5/11/2012 3:28:36 PM >

_____________________________

As always, To EACH their Own.
"And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. "
Nelson Mandela
Life-long Democrat, not happy at all with Democratic Party.
NOT a Republican/Moderate and free agent

(in reply to fucktoyprincess)
Profile   Post #: 68
RE: Not supporting UNBRIDLED illegal immigration does n... - 5/11/2012 3:03:13 PM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

...chasing down those brown people you seem to hate so much



Ahhh... just like clockwork -- playing the RACE CARD.  tsk... tsk... tsk.



Mexicans are caucasians just like you so how could anyone with a three digit iq and a pulse characterize my post as "race card"?
To those non-bigots with a three digit iq and a pulse
It works like this.
Crossing the boarder illegally is a misdomeanor.
Hiring someone who has crossed the boarder illegally is a federal felony punishable by 5 years in the federal slam(no parole from federal custody...a day showing is a day owing...no time off for good behavior) and $250,000 fine for each violaton. When several thousand ceo are doing 100+ years in the federal slam and the fed treasury is trillions of dollars richer (estimated 12 million who have crossed the boarder illegally X $250,000=3,000,000,000,000)who would hire someone who had crossed he boarder illegally?
The above can be accomplished with no cost to the taxpayer and positive cashflow to the treasury. The only reason anyone could have to waste taxpayers money chasing down those brown people you seem to hate so much would be bigotry.
Simply stated since there would be no work here they would go home as has been evidenced by recent developments(more mexicans crossing the boarder south than north.



(in reply to MasterSlaveLA)
Profile   Post #: 69
RE: Not supporting UNBRIDLED illegal immigration does n... - 5/11/2012 3:08:54 PM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Marini

quote:

The mainland US has 12000+ miles of land and coastal borders. Alaska and Hawai'i adds another 8000 miles of coast and land border to that for a total in excess of 20,000 miles of border that would have to be sealed.

A simple wall would not work so you're talking about active and passive scanners and border agents monitoring the sensors and responding to every breach no matter how minor. Can you even begin to grasp the setup and ongoing costs of that? How exactly do we stay free with a tens of millions strong border patrol in our midst?



With the unemployment rate sky high for young people under 30 and the prisons bursting at the seams, we have PLENTY of able bodied workers available.
Some can be paid in $$$$ and the others can work off some of their debt to society, free room and board.

If we get at least half of our borders secure, we have enough advanced technology, high tech surveillance equipment and man power to man the other half.


I have a few other idea's but that is for my next OP.



What is wrong with this idea? The laws are already on the books. It puts money in the treasury not take it out. It gets rid of all of those who have crossed the boarder illegally for free.
To those non-bigots with a three digit iq and a pulse
It works like this.
Crossing the boarder illegally is a misdomeanor.
Hiring someone who has crossed the boarder illegally is a federal felony punishable by 5 years in the federal slam(no parole from federal custody...a day showing is a day owing...no time off for good behavior) and $250,000 fine for each violaton. When several thousand ceo are doing 100+ years in the federal slam and the fed treasury is trillions of dollars richer (estimated 12 million who have crossed the boarder illegally X $250,000=3,000,000,000,000)who would hire someone who had crossed he boarder illegally?
The above can be accomplished with no cost to the taxpayer and positive cashflow to the treasury. The only reason anyone could have to waste taxpayers money chasing down those brown people you seem to hate so much would be bigotry.
Simply stated since there would be no work here they would go home as has been evidenced by recent developments(more mexicans crossing the boarder south than north.



(in reply to Marini)
Profile   Post #: 70
RE: Not supporting UNBRIDLED illegal immigration does n... - 5/11/2012 3:11:12 PM   
MasterSlaveLA


Posts: 3991
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Marini

...that the person is a racist, a bigot, or has some sort of hatred against the Hispanic population?




quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

...chasing down those brown people you seem to hate so much



Ahhh... just like clockwork, and as referenced in the OP -- playing the RACE CARD.  tsk... tsk... tsk.



_____________________________

It's only kinky the first time!!!

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 71
RE: Not supporting UNBRIDLED illegal immigration does n... - 5/11/2012 3:13:04 PM   
Marini


Posts: 3629
Joined: 2/14/2010
Status: offline 		x, why do you need to copy and paste the same thing over and over?

Relax and take a deep breath, and ease out of attack mode.

Sometimes it's easier to come together somewhere in the middle, instead of spending so much energy fighting.



< Message edited by Marini -- 5/11/2012 3:16:36 PM >

_____________________________

As always, To EACH their Own.
"And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. "
Nelson Mandela
Life-long Democrat, not happy at all with Democratic Party.
NOT a Republican/Moderate and free agent

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 72
RE: Not supporting UNBRIDLED illegal immigration does n... - 5/11/2012 3:19:08 PM   
Mupainurpleasure


Posts: 393
Joined: 4/12/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mupainurpleasure

You basically are for an manesty program with penalties....



No, I'm not.



quote:

(a) Calculated fine/back tax for each year they've been here illegally (paid in monthly installments).

(b) Apply for a Guest Worker Card/Work Visa/Student Visa and/or citizenship just like everyone else -- to the back of the line.
that's an amnesty program

(in reply to MasterSlaveLA)
Profile   Post #: 73
RE: Not supporting UNBRIDLED illegal immigration does n... - 5/11/2012 3:21:21 PM   
TrekkieLP


Posts: 48
Joined: 11/14/2010
Status: offline 		Wow. A Pony Play thread?

(in reply to Mupainurpleasure)
Profile   Post #: 74
RE: Not supporting UNBRIDLED illegal immigration does n... - 5/11/2012 3:24:30 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		Politically speaking we are trotting the pony around the barn here, yes.

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Profile   Post #: 75
RE: Not supporting UNBRIDLED illegal immigration does n... - 5/11/2012 3:25:59 PM   
MasterSlaveLA


Posts: 3991
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mupainurpleasure

that's an amnesty program



Uhh... no... it's not.  They go to the BACK OF THE LINE... in THEIR OWN COUNTRY.





< Message edited by MasterSlaveLA -- 5/11/2012 3:27:07 PM >

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Profile   Post #: 76
RE: Not supporting UNBRIDLED illegal immigration does n... - 5/11/2012 3:34:52 PM   
SternSkipper


Posts: 7546
Joined: 3/7/2004
Status: offline
quote:

When several thousand ceo are doing 100+ years in the federal slam and the fed treasury is trillions of dollars richer (estimated 12 million who have crossed the boarder illegally X $250,000=3,000,000,000,000)who would hire someone who had crossed he boarder illegally?


Obama should say fuck all with increasing taxes and send ICE out to bust all the one-percenter fucks profiting from employment of illegals.
There was a bait place here in town that employed a dozen Guatemalan laborers. They get busted. Do they pay their fines? Do they pay to send the workers back? Do they go straight and hire at minimum wage? No, no, no, and NO.
They tried to scam a local fisherman who'd lost his vessel to the bank to "contract" his employees to pick up the slack. Just one problem, the price the bait company pitched was $3.50 less than minimum wage spread across the 10 man crew.
The criminal.. I mean owner of the bait company, comes to the same little coffee shop on the edge of my neighborhood I go to a few times a week. He sits there and very often loudly talks back nastily to the radio playing the NPR morning news. He's so obnoxious I once put a $5 on my table and said to Karen, the waitress "Karen, give the Immigration Criminal a cup of shut the fuck up and keep the rest for yourself". He no longer looks at me like i could potentially be a commiserater and I am fine with that.
just another DEADBEAT tax and wage cheat to me.


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(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 77
RE: Not supporting UNBRIDLED illegal immigration does n... - 5/11/2012 3:40:01 PM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Marini

x, why do you need to copy and paste the same thing over and over?


Becuse it appears that there are some fucking morons who can't read.

quote:

Relax and take a deep breath, and ease out of attack mode.


The last time went on the attack mode I got two years in the penalty box before they realized their mistake and invited me back.
This is not attack. It is pointing out that the law exist to end the illegal crossing of the boarder for purposes of employment.
The clear solution is to follow the law.
The only reason I can see for anyone not following the law is that they are a bigot.
Can you see any other reason?

quote:

Sometimes it's easier to come together somewhere in the middle, instead of spending so much energy fighting.


I thought we were discussing the most cost effective way to remove from the u.s. those who have crossed the boarder illegally.
I have supplied it and yet we have people creating definitions for words out of whole cloth and then using those made up definitions to accuse me of playing the "race card". It is like trying to have an adult discussion with a five year old.






(in reply to Marini)
Profile   Post #: 78
RE: Not supporting UNBRIDLED illegal immigration does n... - 5/11/2012 4:02:18 PM   
Marini


Posts: 3629
Joined: 2/14/2010
Status: offline
quote:

Obama should say fuck all with increasing taxes and send ICE out to bust all the one-percenter fucks profiting from employment of illegals.
There was a bait place here in town that employed a dozen Guatemalan laborers. They get busted. Do they pay their fines? Do they pay to send the workers back? Do they go straight and hire at minimum wage? No, no, no, and NO.
They tried to scam a local fisherman who'd lost his vessel to the bank to "contract" his employees to pick up the slack. Just one problem, the price the bait company pitched was $3.50 less than minimum wage spread across the 10 man crew.
The criminal.. I mean owner of the bait company, comes to the same little coffee shop on the edge of my neighborhood I go to a few times a week. He sits there and very often loudly talks back nastily to the radio playing the NPR morning news. He's so obnoxious I once put a $5 on my table and said to Karen, the waitress "Karen, give the Immigration Criminal a cup of shut the fuck up and keep the rest for yourself". He no longer looks at me like i could potentially be a commiserater and I am fine with that.
just another DEADBEAT tax and wage cheat to me.






Taxes, the United States doesn't need any damn tax money, are you crazy?
As we teeter on the verge of becoming insolvent, going bankrupt, and sliding over into the abyss, we don't need to worry about money.

How much do we owe China? What is the national debt these days?

You must be some sort of racist commie pinko.
I don't even think you are a REAL American!

Paying slave wages, paying under the table, and tax evasion, things are only a few things, that make this country great.

Damn it to all hell, next you will start talking about fair wages and unions.
Don't you even think about paying fair wages and creating more unions, buster!

< Message edited by Marini -- 5/11/2012 4:25:58 PM >

_____________________________

As always, To EACH their Own.
"And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. "
Nelson Mandela
Life-long Democrat, not happy at all with Democratic Party.
NOT a Republican/Moderate and free agent

(in reply to SternSkipper)
Profile   Post #: 79
RE: Not supporting UNBRIDLED illegal immigration does n... - 5/11/2012 4:18:51 PM   
MrBukani


Posts: 1920
Joined: 4/18/2010
Status: offline 		I wouldnt be worried bout a couple of hispanics jumpin the border. I would worry about the midwest fams with 10 kids. If that continues within ten years, there are a billion legal americanbunnyfuckers

(in reply to Marini)
Profile   Post #: 80
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