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RE: Is There Imagination in BDSM? - 6/10/2012 1:13:23 PM

Moonhead

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I'm not arguing with that. I just find the OP's apparent conviction that us pervs are all far more creative and imaginative than the vanilla mundanes who couldn't conceive of the stuff we've (if we're honest with ourselves) taken from people who did have a bit of creativity and copied parrot fashion completely wrongheaded even without the Ray Bradbury thing. You might as well say that the ability to GM a game of Dungeons and Dragons well enough that everybody playing has a good time (which is definitely not an undemanding task) is equivalent to writing The Lord Of The Rings, or even one of the many sub Tolkein pastiche trilogies that have become popular since the late '70s.

As you say, creativity and imagination are subjective, but they're also analogue scales rather than digital. Saying that you either are or aren't is nonsense, and there's plenty of people leading vanilla lives who have their dials cranked up much higher than some zeeb who thinks that they're special and better than the next person because they have a slightly unorthodox sex life. I don't have any time for that sort of consolatory power fantasy: it's deeply witless and utterly pathetic, and I find it depressing how many people are just into BDSM to get bragging rights about that.

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RE: Is There Imagination in BDSM? - 6/10/2012 1:15:26 PM

Endivius

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I'm into bdsm because it gives me wood. I'm talking louisville slugger wood.

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RE: Is There Imagination in BDSM? - 6/10/2012 1:17:54 PM

Moonhead

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You're kidding!

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I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

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Post #: 63

RE: Is There Imagination in BDSM? - 6/10/2012 1:22:51 PM

PeonForHer

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

That's individual tailoring and fine tuning rather than imagination or creativity, though.

I have to say that I think you're being a bit of a curmudgeon on this, Moonie. Of course BDSM is packed to the gills with tired old cliches in its porn manifestation, and the same might be said of a lot of the fantasies of those who've thought about it but never done it (and may never do it). I also think that the fundamental 'energies' at the root of BDSM activities might not vary much. But when it comes to BDSM lifestyles - I have a feeling that there will be as large a variety of these as there are varieties of people. Necessity (of making a BDSM lifestyle between partners work and continue to work) would be the mother of invention, surely?

Personally, one thing I'd love to see, but never have done - even anything approaching it - is a dramatic representation of a BDSM lifestyle. The ordinary day-to-day dynamics, that is.

< Message edited by PeonForHer -- 6/10/2012 1:23:38 PM >

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RE: Is There Imagination in BDSM? - 6/10/2012 1:43:09 PM

MadameM4U

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Joined: 4/23/2012
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quote:

I also think that the fundamental 'energies' at the root of BDSM activities might not vary much. But when it comes to BDSM lifestyles - I have a feeling that there will be as large a variety of these as there are varieties of people. Necessity (of making a BDSM lifestyle between partners work and continue to work) would be the mother of invention, surely?

Personally, one thing I'd love to see, but never have done - even anything approaching it - is a dramatic representation of a BDSM lifestyle. The ordinary day-to-day dynamics, that is.

Agreed! There will be a large variety because it will vary from person to person, even if all those involved are "in the lifestyle".

I too would very much enjoy a dramatic representation of folks in the BDSM lifestyle although it might turn out to be a sit-com at times . . .

< Message edited by MadameM4U -- 6/10/2012 1:44:29 PM >

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RE: Is There Imagination in BDSM? - 6/10/2012 1:44:28 PM

Moonhead

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The Amusing Adventures Of Wealliam And Twudy, you mean?

Peon, my point is just that anything that's stuffed with (and as you say, actively based on) cliches is unlikely to be all that creative, as cliches and creativity are at odds. I get the impression that a few people in this thread are in denial about this fact.

< Message edited by Moonhead -- 6/10/2012 1:47:33 PM >

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to MadameM4U)

Post #: 66

RE: Is There Imagination in BDSM? - 6/10/2012 2:15:03 PM

MissImmortalPain

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If you had only said it like that to begin with....I would have agreed with you. Of course then there is the issue of trying to find any field, genre, group, etc. of anything where this isn't true. Do you believe that all creativity is dead?

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RE: Is There Imagination in BDSM? - 6/10/2012 2:18:46 PM

poise

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kana
Had lots of fun last night with her and nothing but a cigarette.

Did she inhale?

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Post #: 68

RE: Is There Imagination in BDSM? - 6/10/2012 2:39:20 PM

LadyPact

Posts: 32566
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I don't think it's so much that people are trying to say that kinky people are more or less creative than other groups. It's more that the creativity that they have is easily transferred to BDSM.

Anybody who likes to paint, draw, or make designs can easily put that kind of creativity into doing it on people. Playing with wax can be all about art. So can needles if you want to make a particular pattern or create a picture. All a scene has to be is some kind of situation that you came up with as a vision in your head of something that you find to be hot. The very same can be said of mind fucks. People who are into rope come up with the most beautiful ways to decorate people. Predicament bondage is all about coming up with odd scenarios. Ingenuity is the mother of invention and that's absolutely a creative skill as well. What kind of material will make the mark that you want it to make?

It's not necessarily the kink that makes you creative. It's the creativity that allows you to have more fun with the kinks.

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Post #: 69

RE: Is There Imagination in BDSM? - 6/10/2012 2:42:21 PM

mummyman321

Posts: 2102
Joined: 10/31/2005
From: Dusseldorf
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

I'm not arguing with that. I just find the OP's apparent conviction that us pervs are all far more creative and imaginative than the vanilla mundanes who couldn't conceive of the stuff we've (if we're honest with ourselves) taken from people who did have a bit of creativity and copied parrot fashion completely wrongheaded even without the Ray Bradbury thing.

That is not my conviction nor did not say that. I just love how people try to twist words and take things out of context when they are on the loosing end of an arguement. I never said vanilla people were not creative, those are your words, not mine. There are many creative people in all walks of life. Sir Isaac Asimov, Albert Einstein, JRR Tolkien, Steve Jobs, Shigeru Miyamoto, are just few of the many.

What I did say is that it was imagination that makes BDSM great. And I stand by what I said. If the only thing you can see in BDSM is tired old cliches I feel sorry for you. I see an entire other world full of creative imaginative people. Demask in one example. The owners of Demask started out in 1990 in a small shop in Amsterdam making basic rubber and leather items. Since then Demask had greatly expanded their production and has stores in New York, Dortmund, Munich and the Czech Republic with plan to expand to many more stores in the UK. Demask has created some very unique designs not made by anyone else. Their 3000+ items range from the very kinky to the very elegant. A very creative imaginative mind had a vision of unique styles of clothing in rubber and leather and brought those visions to life and at the same time creating a very successful business out of it.

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Post #: 70

RE: Is There Imagination in BDSM? - 6/10/2012 2:50:06 PM

Blankpain

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True imagination in play is what orgasm is all about!

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Post #: 71

RE: Is There Imagination in BDSM? - 6/10/2012 4:01:33 PM

littlewonder

Posts: 15659
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: poise

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kana
Had lots of fun last night with her and nothing but a cigarette.

Did she inhale?

I'd say "but I didn't inhale" but it would be a lie.

<cough cough blech ooowwwww from sitting too close to him while he's smoking.>

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Everything has changed

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Post #: 72

RE: Is There Imagination in BDSM? - 6/10/2012 4:16:34 PM

KnightofMists

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Joined: 7/29/2005
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quote:

So what say you……Is there imagination in BDSM?

no more or less than anywhere else. But it sure makes peoples ego inflate if they believe that those in BDSM are more imaginative that those boring vanillas!

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Knight of Mists

An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

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Post #: 73

RE: Is There Imagination in BDSM? - 6/10/2012 6:15:39 PM

KnightofMists

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Joined: 7/29/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: poise

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kana
Had lots of fun last night with her and nothing but a cigarette.

Did she inhale?

I just had my cock... not sure if they had fun.... but I did....

but they didn't inhale! unfortunately...

_____________________________

Knight of Mists

An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

(in reply to poise)

Post #: 74

RE: Is There Imagination in BDSM? - 6/10/2012 7:46:35 PM

fucktoyprincess

Posts: 2337
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

It's not necessarily the kink that makes you creative. It's the creativity that allows you to have more fun with the kinks.

Yes, I would have to agree.

Again, I don't dispute that there is creativity in the BDSM world, but many who I've been with have not really had their game on, so to speak. And I know many vanilla people who are very creative. Even when it comes to their sex lives.

So the world is divided into some different spectrums - the highly creative to the less creative; the extreme BDSM to the extreme vanilla. But I think we can't attach imagination or creativity to an interest in BDSM. I certainly don't see any greater correlation amongst the people I know. Some of the most creative people I know are completely vanilla; and sadly, I've been with some kinksters who just weren't all that imaginative or creative. It has to be said....

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Post #: 75

RE: Is There Imagination in BDSM? - 6/10/2012 10:17:33 PM

Marini

Posts: 3629
Joined: 2/14/2010
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

I'm not arguing with that. I just find the OP's apparent conviction that us pervs are all far more creative and imaginative than the vanilla mundanes who couldn't conceive of the stuff we've (if we're honest with ourselves) taken from people who did have a bit of creativity and copied parrot fashion completely wrongheaded even without the Ray Bradbury thing. You might as well say that the ability to GM a game of Dungeons and Dragons well enough that everybody playing has a good time (which is definitely not an undemanding task) is equivalent to writing The Lord Of The Rings, or even one of the many sub Tolkein pastiche trilogies that have become popular since the late '70s.

As you say, creativity and imagination are subjective, but they're also analogue scales rather than digital. Saying that you either are or aren't is nonsense, and there's plenty of people leading vanilla lives who have their dials cranked up much higher than some zeeb who thinks that they're special and better than the next person because they have a slightly unorthodox sex life. I don't have any time for that sort of consolatory power fantasy: it's deeply witless and utterly pathetic, and I find it depressing how many people are just into BDSM to get bragging rights about that.

OMG, I am going to save this!

Moonhead thank you, for often taking the "other side" on many topics, I don't like to read posts in which everyone seems to be lining up like ducks in a row, with similar mindsets.
If I can't see divergent points of views, I can't get a big enough picture.
First, I would like to say that I KNOW there are many people that are "into BDSM" in a myriad of ways that are very imaginative, there is no doubt.

BUT, I agree with Moonhead about 90% on this one.
I have ALWAYS been put off with people that think they are "better" than vanilla folks because they are into BDSM.
That is one of the reasons I have little interest in participating in many BDSM community events.

Being into BDSM just doesn't make you a member of the "cool kids" in my world.
To me, most people are creative and imaginative, or they are not.
I just can't get into the "I am soooo special because I participate in BDSM activities" mindset.
I see far too many people who seem to get their sense of worth and identity based on this lifestyle.
I will never feel "better" or superior to vanilla folks, based on kink related activities.

Peace

< Message edited by Marini -- 6/10/2012 10:28:05 PM >

_____________________________

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"And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. "
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NOT a Republican/Moderate and free agent

(in reply to Moonhead)

Post #: 76

RE: Is There Imagination in BDSM? - 6/10/2012 10:23:10 PM

Marini

Posts: 3629
Joined: 2/14/2010
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: KnightofMists

quote:

So what say you……Is there imagination in BDSM?

no more or less than anywhere else. But it sure makes peoples ego inflate if they believe that those in BDSM are more imaginative that those boring vanillas!

I fucking A adore you Knight!

< Message edited by Marini -- 6/10/2012 10:24:14 PM >

_____________________________

As always, To EACH their Own.
"And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. "
Nelson Mandela
Life-long Democrat, not happy at all with Democratic Party.
NOT a Republican/Moderate and free agent

(in reply to KnightofMists)

Post #: 77

RE: Is There Imagination in BDSM? - 6/10/2012 10:35:06 PM

Marini

Posts: 3629
Joined: 2/14/2010
Status: offline

quote:

Again, I don't dispute that there is creativity in the BDSM world, but many who I've been with have not really had their game on, so to speak. And I know many vanilla people who are very creative. Even when it comes to their sex lives.

So the world is divided into some different spectrums - the highly creative to the less creative; the extreme BDSM to the extreme vanilla. But I think we can't attach imagination or creativity to an interest in BDSM. I certainly don't see any greater correlation amongst the people I know. Some of the most creative people I know are completely vanilla; and sadly, I've been with some kinksters who just weren't all that imaginative or creative. It has to be said....

This is how I see things also.
There is imagination in every aspect of life, and imagination is normally an innate quality.

In my world, there is IMAGINATION involved, in almost everything that I do.

_____________________________

As always, To EACH their Own.
"And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. "
Nelson Mandela
Life-long Democrat, not happy at all with Democratic Party.
NOT a Republican/Moderate and free agent

(in reply to fucktoyprincess)

Post #: 78

RE: Is There Imagination in BDSM? - 6/10/2012 11:04:52 PM

sexyred1

Posts: 8998
Joined: 8/9/2007
Status: offline

I don't think people into BDSM have more imagination than anyone else.

The difference is having the desire and courage to engage in what you imagine, that's it.

< Message edited by sexyred1 -- 6/10/2012 11:11:14 PM >

(in reply to Marini)

Post #: 79

RE: Is There Imagination in BDSM? - 6/11/2012 3:14:42 AM

mummyman321

Posts: 2102
Joined: 10/31/2005
From: Dusseldorf
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Marini

quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

I'm not arguing with that. I just find the OP's apparent conviction that us pervs are all far more creative and imaginative than the vanilla mundanes who couldn't conceive of the stuff we've (if we're honest with ourselves) taken from people who did have a bit of creativity and copied parrot fashion completely wrongheaded even without the Ray Bradbury thing. You might as well say that the ability to GM a game of Dungeons and Dragons well enough that everybody playing has a good time (which is definitely not an undemanding task) is equivalent to writing The Lord Of The Rings, or even one of the many sub Tolkein pastiche trilogies that have become popular since the late '70s.

As you say, creativity and imagination are subjective, but they're also analogue scales rather than digital. Saying that you either are or aren't is nonsense, and there's plenty of people leading vanilla lives who have their dials cranked up much higher than some zeeb who thinks that they're special and better than the next person because they have a slightly unorthodox sex life. I don't have any time for that sort of consolatory power fantasy: it's deeply witless and utterly pathetic, and I find it depressing how many people are just into BDSM to get bragging rights about that.

OMG, I am going to save this!

Moonhead thank you, for often taking the "other side" on many topics, I don't like to read posts in which everyone seems to be lining up like ducks in a row, with similar mindsets.
If I can't see divergent points of views, I can't get a big enough picture.
First, I would like to say that I KNOW there are many people that are "into BDSM" in a myriad of ways that are very imaginative, there is no doubt.

BUT, I agree with Moonhead about 90% on this one.
I have ALWAYS been put off with people that think they are "better" than vanilla folks because they are into BDSM.
That is one of the reasons I have little interest in participating in many BDSM community events.

Being into BDSM just doesn't make you a member of the "cool kids" in my world.
To me, most people are creative and imaginative, or they are not.
I just can't get into the "I am soooo special because I participate in BDSM activities" mindset.
I see far too many people who seem to get their sense of worth and identity based on this lifestyle.
I will never feel "better" or superior to vanilla folks, based on kink related activities.

Peace

Marini,
The reason I disagree with Moonheads point that no one, including me, said the BDSM folks were more creative than the vanilla folks. Moonhead and Knights of Mist said that. No one else. The rest of us have been saying BDSM allows for a creativity. Not that we are better than vanilla people.

_____________________________

Life - Its not about where you are but about the journey to get there - I prefer to choose the road less traveled

(in reply to Marini)

Post #: 80

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