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RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm com... - 6/10/2006 2:10:48 AM

meatcleaver

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quote:

ORIGINAL: NeedToUseYou

That's funny. Being a Nazi was PC in Germany at the time. Try saying Jews were equal see how they would accept such Politically incorrect statements in that time and place. Also, when the Klan was more than a joke it was PC to be racist here in the USA, the KKK has been a joke for decades now.

Actually this is a very good point and why politically correct language is insidious. Political correctness is used to brow beat descent.

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RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm com... - 6/10/2006 2:31:03 AM

darkinshadows

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quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

quote:

ORIGINAL: NeedToUseYou

That's funny. Being a Nazi was PC in Germany at the time. Try saying Jews were equal see how they would accept such Politically incorrect statements in that time and place. Also, when the Klan was more than a joke it was PC to be racist here in the USA, the KKK has been a joke for decades now.

Actually this is a very good point and why politically correct language is insidious. Political correctness is used to brow beat descent.

THANK YOU.

I said that before but people do not seem to understand that point.
What is just wierd that people trying to insist that language should be uniform is just as insidious and no different from being politically correct. It is almost an exact same controlling issue.

There is no one true way.

BDSM is an acronym. How one deferes to that acronym pretty much becomes subjective. If it didn't then there would be no need for people to say 'I am in a BDSM Lifestyle' There would be no such thing as 'vanillas' . You can't take a word and place it on an entire population because by merely saying that, someone who calls themselves a slave but doesn't fit your idea of slave - is not a slave - you are in fact trying to be politically correct! Different means to the same end. You are still trying to get people to conform - one is just insidious, the other is just more overt.

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RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm com... - 6/10/2006 3:06:22 AM

darkinshadows

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quote:

ORIGINAL: GoddessDustyGold

You are right, dark. Of course we know that I am drawing an analogy here. Yes, in a bra, I will generally wear a 34A. (Now everyone knows My bra size, but I never claimed to be well endowed!) I find certain brands and styles comfortable. They give Me the proper support, and make Me look good and feel good.
So if I am offered the option of a wrong size (and I can visually see that it is the wrong size), I am not going to try it just because maybe...
Same thing with a boy (or girl). When he tells Me he needs to be My cuck, and that this what makes him a slave, but I am not interested in a cuck, then he is not the one for Me. But he insists. Why is that? I have boys try to impress upon Me all the time what a slave is, and that they are the slave, but, but, but...Yet these are the same ones who truly believe that because they are willing to offer up their ass for a spanking, this makes them a slave. Not in My book.

Now I do agree with you about the masochistic Dominant, or the Sadistic submissive. We ( I certainly) have seen threads on these very topics. The problem is that the place to get this out is in a profile or in honest conversations. I have seen threads from disillusioned submissive gals who find another profile their Dom has put up as a submissive, or they are suddenly faced with the situation of a Dom they thought they knew, and now he admits he needs to bottom and expects her to do the topping. This can be downright scary and might spell the end of a relationship. Even if the submissive can handle the need, it might be okay for the Dominant to seek this elsewhere with her blessing. But it was never disclosed in the first place, so now what to do??? Then we begin to see the PC responses, such as "He is the Dom, so whatever he wants goes". What is not usually addressed is the deeper issue of why this was never discussed up front. Now we are being PC (as such a usage might apply to being polite on this board) by ignoring the actual problem.
Same thing on the submissive boy side of the coin. I read threads wherein boys complain that there are no real Dommes because every one they meet ends up wanting to submit to them. Of course I have yet to see and actual written example of this, so it could be all in the mind *WEG* but, maybe that boy just tends to be attracted toward weaker Ladies. Or that is his comfort level. Who really knows?
What we need is a standard or a basic of definitions, and then honesty in disclosure of the details. Of course, people have to know what it is they want in the first place to do this effectively.
And I think many don't. It is hard to figure out what you want when you don't have a standard set of definitions to begin.

I believe we are coming from the same place, because I agree with the annoyance just as you do. But I just fail to see why those words(highlighted) are being Politically Correct? It isn't a Political Correctness issue, it is a communication one. You are refering to the standard definition of being a dominant - is that standard definition a politically correct issue? I don't think it is. Political correctness is using language to not cause offense. It is used to generate a mindset within the populace that the political classes want to impose. So therefore - for example, it would be non PC to call a BDSMer a 'Freak'. It would be PC to say that those who follow BDSM are 'Lifestylers'. To a person who refers to themselves as a 'Lifestyler' in BDSM - that PC comment is not insidious. But to a moralist right that statement, that claim, would be insidious because it makes 'disgusting' practises acceptable. But a BDSMer claiming a dominant who is being whipped is obviously not dominant isnt a PC issue. It is a personal one and one of intollerance. If someone says "He is the Dom, so whatever he wants goes". Isn't a PC issue, it is a miscommunication and a sign trying to justify a mistake. That is over simplifying what a dominant is. Neither of these are political issues, they are personal ones.

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RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm com... - 6/10/2006 3:09:17 AM

darkinshadows

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BitaTruble

quote:

Are terms used by writers. teachers, and politicans really examples of PC taking over everyday life if one doesn't hear them in everyday life?

I thought the OP was claiming that PC is getting out of hand in everyday life and in BDSM....

I'll give you an example of every day PC. My grandparents were anti-Semitic. Every time they said anything about 'those fucking jews' someone in my family would excuse it by pointing out they were 'old'.. it's 'just their way' .. 'they don't understand culture' blah, blah, blah. My dad was the only one who ever stood up to my Grandfather and called him a racist. I took after my dad. I'm glad you weren't exposed to this sort of crap. It makes for a nice rose-colored view of the world and I'd like to see things that way myself. Life has taught me that being PC and burying your head in the sand isn't always an option. My grandparents had 5 sons. Three of them are/were anti-Semitic. None of my Uncles would come to my wedding because I married one of 'those fucking jews.' I'm a disgrace to the Catholic Church.. yadda, yadda, yadda. Maybe if someone had kicked my grandparents in the ass when they were younger, they wouldn't have brought 3 more anti-Semitic assholes into the world.

If you don't see that there's a problem at all, then you can't strive to fix it. The fact that you don't see it doesn't mean it doesn't exist or that it is not a problem. I could have chosen to go the route of my grandparents.. or the route of my Dad. My dad is my hero.. and a damn fine role model so I went with that and it's worked for me.

Celeste

I just do not understand what this, as important an issue and example as it is, has to do with PC within BDSM.

Yes, this statement is about PC... but how does this work within a BDSM example?

Just really trying to understand here.

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RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm com... - 6/10/2006 4:14:30 AM

bear372217355

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What part of my two cents can I throw in here with out offending, hmmmmm, I don't think I can.

I just read most of the replies to the OP and it struck me that many of the replies touting their use of PC type thinking, are in fact, some of the most self righteous un PC people I've read on here.

Now I know they're very knowledgable in the ways of BDSM, but they have opined and offended with all the tact, politeness and grace of a fundamentalist extremist as he/she (<-- inserted for shear comic relief) preaches to the infidels.

I am no proponent of the PC way of thought control, but the hypocracy that spews forth from those that have the tolerence of the afore mentioned fundamentalist zellots, is nothing less then breath taking.

There in lies the problem and the very reason that the PC police keep getting support from the dissinfranchised. Those that can will, regardless of whether they should or not, they lack the self control and ability to say "I could, but I shouldn't, so I won't". They will post, say, demand and coerce until their opinion is doctorine or their detractors give up and go away or fall in line.

Do I feel PC thought control has helped civilization? Umm, a resounding NO. Do I believe that it has created or attempted to foster an environment of tolerence and understanding? Yes. But now it's gone to far with some and nowhere near far enough with others.

If you truely wish to have the PC way of thought come to an end, police yourself accordingly. Just because one has the "right" to spit forth their opinion, does not give them the "right" to cram it down others collective throats, or beat away at someone until they swallow your shite with a forced smile. There is a time and a place for all commentary.

But when I see people I have seen chide someone into near invisiblity, use words like open, courteous (lmfao), tact, thoughtful or polite to describe themselves or their commentary, I just have to laugh.

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RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm com... - 6/10/2006 6:05:33 AM

ScooterTrash

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quote:

ORIGINAL: twicehappy
Is Political Correctness affecting the bdsm community?

Yes it has and is!

I don't think it has affected live, verbal, dialog as much as it has affected our ability to communicate accurately on-line. Many have mentioned it is quite noticeable in on-line dealings such as profiles and of course it's blatantly obvious on the forum boards here. In an effort to not offend anyone, it has created a difficult situation of identifying/expressing our placement in the lifestyle and it created a muzzle to the point of us not passing on any useful information. I have seen a few decent examples in this post and then I have seen a few totally unrelated examples, dealing more with the social climate, not the BDSM community. I won't concern myself with social nilla aspects, it's too big to tackle, but for lifestylers we have hope. The profiles are a good example of inaccurate information, but they are an example of a "result", not necessarily of someone being politically correct themselves. The inaccurate profiles are the direct result of poor communication and thus, misinformation. Is it their fault that they are inaccurate or ours? They are perhaps acquiring terminology by reading posts by those of us who dispense, or don't dispense what information we know. I also see where there are several people who just don't get it, haven't seen it and can't relate to the entire polically correct concept at all. Those I have to wonder about.

I dare say I am positive I know what the OP is getting at, so perhaps I can offer up some examples that hit closer to home.

If someone writes in a forum that they are exploring their BDSM curiosity, outside of their vanilla relationship, unbeknownst to their spouse, there are two reactions in most cases. The politically correct one; "Everyone needs to get some experience and since your spouse doesn't fulfill your need this may be the only outlet you have at this time. You do need to be discreet and careful however so no one gets hurt." OR, the truthful response; "You need to be upfront and speak with your spouse about your curiosity, perhaps offer to experiment with them? If you don't then you are simply cheating and using BDSM as a cover to make you feel better about it."

The one's I marvel at are what I call the identifier posts; Someone has been seeing a Dominant on the weekends for play sessions, about an hour away. After the sessions they go back home and carry on their normal routine. They are having trouble identifying their place in the lifestyle and are wondering if perhaps they are a slave since they look forward to the sessions so much. PC response; "Perhaps you are going past submission and are becoming a slave, I'm not sure and can't speak for everyone of course, but labels are just that, labels, and you can identify with whatever you feel describes you best." OR the honest response; "In all likelihood you are a bottom as it sounds like you enjoy play sessions but are not really involved in a D/s or M/s relationship at this point."

I saw a similar one earlier where a Dominant likes being whipped. From a PC standpoint, in the interest of not offending anyone, that can be accepted and just let pass. If I was giving an honest assessment of that situation, I would have to say this is a Top who likes to bottom occasionally, aka switch, having nothing to do with Dominance or submission.

Lastly, and this one really hits home, is when someone is cheating on their other(s) and wriggles out of it explaining that they are experimenting with poly. No they aren't and it's demeaning, or at least embarrassing to those who really are poly, in a loving and honest environment.

So what do these misnomers have to do with anyone else but themselves? It's simple; it's clouding the communication for those who are honestly attempting to portray themselves. When we tell someone that "it's whatever you want it to mean" or "you can do it however you want", it is not giving any information at all and is actually giving false information. One of my pet peeves is FILL in a conversation, verbal or written and that is what it has come to. The overwhelming majority of posts are simply fill and would have been better off if not said, if there was nothing to say in the first place. If someone asks a question, we should answer it to the best of out ability, based on our experiences and knowledge, if someone is offended or we burst their bubble, so be it. I'm not saying be rude, but at least be honest. To just throw out "it means whatever you want" is for the most part, bla, bla, bla, and tells them nothing. We are all adults with varying degrees of experience, in many different subjects...the only correct thing to do is share that information as some of it has likely come from trial and error, and in this lifestyle, errors can have very poor outcomes. Perhaps we got past our own error, let's not multiply the odds. If we don't share that info, if we don't pass on what we know, because we don't want to sound like we are telling them what to do or want to appear judgmental, then we are indirectly as much at fault as the person who makes a mistake that may lead to an injury, or worse. If someone is meeting for the first time, we should NOT make suggestions on how to negotiate a safe play session....we should be telling them to make their first meeting a social one, not a play session and just get to know the person. I have to wonder how many times we have sent someone into a dangerous situation only because we didn't have the balls to tell them they were wrong and speak our honest thoughts on the subject.

If anyone was offended by this post...tough, suck it up and go on.

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RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm com... - 6/10/2006 7:01:41 AM

thetammyjo

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chaingang

This thread is incoherent for the simple reason that people are failing to distinguish between outright lies, bigoted words and phrases, and euphemisms.

What are we going to talk about?

I get the idea that some people want to talk about lying and are under the misconception that lying falls under the umbrella of political correctness - which it doesn't. Wanting people not to use a word like "nigger" has nothing to do with the truth value for that particular term of disparagement - the word is simply offensive and has no truth value!

The inability of some to see these flaws in the discussion makes me really wonder about people's ability to think rationally and critically. Sorry, but there it is.

*applaud loudly*

Thus my repeated questions about how people are defining PC... the examples I'm seeing make no sense to me because they don't fit my definition of PC and I don't really "grok" how the examples could possibly be PC.

< Message edited by thetammyjo -- 6/10/2006 7:14:57 AM >

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RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm com... - 6/10/2006 7:37:16 AM

Level

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ScooterTrash

I saw a similar one earlier where a Dominant likes being whipped. From a PC standpoint, in the interest of not offending anyone, that can be accepted and just let pass. If I was giving an honest assessment of that situation, I would have to say this is a Top who likes to bottom occasionally, aka switch, having nothing to do with Dominance or submission.

See, Scooter and I differ on part of this. I'm a dominant and a switch. If I'm bottoming, I'm still in control, and there is no real submission there, it's simply using a kink to sexually fulfill myself (and hopefull my partner).

Beyond that, what I see as germane to the OP is the fact (not opinion) that Scooter disagreeing with me did not hurt me. He was not pc about his thoughts, and lo and behold, my head did not explode, I did not feel undermined, I did not feel invalidated, and I damn sure did not have the urge to call him names or go sulk LOL. I think we can agree to disagree and be no worse for wear.

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RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm com... - 6/10/2006 7:44:55 AM

twicehappy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: thetammyjo

quote:

ORIGINAL: Chaingang

This thread is incoherent for the simple reason that people are failing to distinguish between outright lies, bigoted words and phrases, and euphemisms.

What are we going to talk about?

I get the idea that some people want to talk about lying and are under the misconception that lying falls under the umbrella of political correctness - which it doesn't. Wanting people not to use a word like "nigger" has nothing to do with the truth value for that particular term of disparagement - the word is simply offensive and has no truth value!

The inability of some to see these flaws in the discussion makes me really wonder about people's ability to think rationally and critically. Sorry, but there it is.

Thus my repeated questions about how people are defining PC... the examples I'm seeing make no sense to me because they don't fit my definition of PC and I don't really "grok" how the examples could possibly be PC.

A better definition for Politically Correct;

politically correct
adj. Abbr. PC
1. term used to describe language that appears calculated to provide a minimum of offense,2. Being or perceived as being overconcerned with use of such language, often to the exclusion of other matters.

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RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm com... - 6/10/2006 8:00:53 AM

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I think those are very good definitions, twice.

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RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm com... - 6/10/2006 9:13:30 AM

HollyS

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ScooterTrash

If someone writes in a forum that they are exploring their BDSM curiosity, outside of their vanilla relationship, unbeknownst to their spouse, there are two reactions in most cases. The politically correct one; "Everyone needs to get some experience and since your spouse doesn't fulfill your need this may be the only outlet you have at this time. You do need to be discreet and careful however so no one gets hurt." OR, the truthful response; "You need to be upfront and speak with your spouse about your curiosity, perhaps offer to experiment with them? If you don't then you are simply cheating and using BDSM as a cover to make you feel better about it."

People in this thread keep confusing facts with opinions and wrapping it all up in a nice package called "truth." A married person may be seeing others without his or her spouse's knowledge. That's a fact. What one chooses to call that fact, be it "cheating" or "exploring" is subjective, irrlelvant and has noting to do with PCness. If you find yourself dealing with such a person, make your decision to continue based on the facts of what's happening, rather than the minutae of language. The end.

quote:

I saw a similar one earlier where a Dominant likes being whipped. From a PC standpoint, in the interest of not offending anyone, that can be accepted and just let pass. If I was giving an honest assessment of that situation, I would have to say this is a Top who likes to bottom occasionally, aka switch, having nothing to do with Dominance or submission.

Clearly we differ on the definitions of Dominance and submission. The truth is that the Dominant runs the show, directs the action and controls the submissive in any number of ways for his or her own pleasure. The submissive takes direction from the Dominant, does as he or she says and is focused on pleasing through serving their needs. So, if a Dominant also happens to be a bit of a masochist and takes great enjoyment from directing the sub how to throw a flogger at the Dom's back, it changes nothing about the power dynamic. It's no different than the Dom instructing the sub how to give a fabulous blow job. Honestly, this seems to be an uncomplicated concept to understand within the gay community, where slave tops and Dominant sadomasochists are both common and unapologetic, but I digress.

This is the main reason why I've long insisted "dominant" and "submissive" be used as adjectives rather than nouns. Another discussion for another time...

quote:

ORIGINAL: Chaingang

This thread is incoherent for the simple reason that people are failing to distinguish between outright lies, bigoted words and phrases, and euphemisms.

The inability of some to see these flaws in the discussion makes me really wonder about people's ability to think rationally and critically. Sorry, but there it is.

Preach on brother. At least the choir is listening.

~Holly

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RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm com... - 6/10/2006 9:22:21 AM

darkinshadows

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(Please remember this isnt a personal attack - I am just trying to show a different position that doesn't mean I follow, just another angle being presented)

That is what I meant by yourself being PC. You desire to call a spade a spade, but language isn't always that cut and dried - black and white. That dom being spanked is still a dom, a cheater is a cheater because its a fact that doesnt change, but that doesn't mean they will ever cheat again, a slave is a slave even if they don't fit your definition/perception - you are the one being overconcerned with the use of language with the exclusion of other matters...

Swings and roundabouts - one is overt, the other is not.

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RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm com... - 6/10/2006 10:22:56 AM

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quote:

darkinshadows wrote: a slave is a slave even if they don't fit your definition/perception

Hm. I saw a profile here, maybe a couple of days ago, the person announced themself as a "slave", then went on to dispense quite a long list of what they would and would not do. Is this a slave? Is this a submissive?.... so, I have to wonder how many believe that someone "is" whatever they say they are, no matter what?

If that's the case, I'm going to be a doctor. Starting now. Even though I dropped out of high school.

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RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm com... - 6/10/2006 10:35:09 AM

darkinshadows

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Yes, I see where you are coming from...

See, for me, slaves are owned property - thats my definition based on my fetish and addiction to word meanings. But I just don't want to impress that onto anyone else. But I do communicate what I feel it means to me.
If this slave, wants to list what they will and wont do - thats because they still aren't Owned - at least that would be my assumption.

It is a fine line. And I do understand the disappointment and frustration from issues like this. I mean I struggle with people saying they are 'a dominant'. They maybe - but doesn't mean they are to me. Now if thats deemed as being 'Politically Correct' sobeit. But to me, its just being honest. I won't say they aren't so someone a dominant, but to me - I couldn't care less if I am not submitting to them what they want to call themself.

People always ask - what are you within BDSM. I say me. If I am pushed - then I would have to say (and I have to thank Em here cause shes a star) that I submissivlely top. Does that make me a switch? Yes in a sense, but even then there are grey 'swtich' areas. At least there are to me.

I would much rather get to know the whole person - than the labels that are pinned to thier foreheads and communicate so I can find out and delve deeper. But then, I have alot of patience and I believe in taking alot of time - and I do have time for people.

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RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm com... - 6/10/2006 10:49:09 AM

thetammyjo

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quote:

ORIGINAL: twicehappy

A better definition for Politically Correct;

politically correct
adj. Abbr. PC
1. term used to describe language that appears calculated to provide a minimum of offense,2. Being or perceived as being overconcerned with use of such language, often to the exclusion of other matters.

Thank you for posting a definition. This pretty closely matches what I think of when I think of PC. I usually also include an idea of some authority trying to enforce things (usually changes in language) but that's just based on how I've heard people use it.

I see nothing in this definition about lying which seems to be a lot of what folks are harping on.

I also see the words "appears calculated" and "perceived" both of which are subjective to the one making the claim that someone or something is PC.

As to what is "calculated" it could be "to provide a minimum of offense" OR to to be inclusive OR to specifically represent meaning OR to persuade others OR to reaffirm one's position in a group OR etc....

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RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm com... - 6/10/2006 10:49:57 AM

RavenMuse

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Level
Hm. I saw a profile here, maybe a couple of days ago, the person announced themself as a "slave", then went on to dispense quite a long list of what they would and would not do. Is this a slave? Is this a submissive?.... so, I have to wonder how many believe that someone "is" whatever they say they are, no matter what?

A rarity, Level and I on opposite sides of an issue

Personaly when I see someone using the lable slave or sub, all I take from that is a rough idea of where they see their place on the dynamic, a start point for when the topic comes up between us (Assuming the discussion finds enough in common to get to that).

It certainly doesn't mean the girl has no hard limits....my girl does and she sought and found a Master who was compatable with those limits. A Master whos 'style' of ownership was compatable with the way she needs to be owned.

Does that make her any less a slave than some mindless, opinionless doormat drone? Not to me, I have absolutely no use for a doormat unless I need to wipe my feet, I certainly wouldn't collar one.

I don't believe ANYONE 'is' what they lable themself as.... I believe what I see in their actions and attitudes as I get to know them. The lable is simply a pointer, a start from which you look to learn more about what is ment and how they see the lable.

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RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm com... - 6/10/2006 11:40:21 AM

Chaingang

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politically correct. adjective
Abbr. PC, p.c.

1.Of, relating to, or supporting a program of broad social, political, and educational change, especially to redress historical injustices in matters such as race, class, gender, and sexual orientation.
2.Being or perceived as being overconcerned with this program, often to the exclusion of other matters.

— political correctness noun

Excerpted from The American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language, Third Edition Copyright © 1992 by Houghton Mifflin Company. Electronic version licensed from Lernout & Hauspie Speech Products N.V., further reproduction and distribution restricted in accordance with the Copyright Law of the United States. All rights reserved.

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Post #: 137

RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm com... - 6/10/2006 11:45:04 AM

Chaingang

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This part: "1. term used to describe language that appears calculated to provide a minimum of offense."
...is absurd. That is not the point of politcally correct language. In fact, it is a critique in and of itself.

This part: "2. Being or perceived as being overconcerned with use of such language, often to the exclusion of other matters."
...is fair to the extent that one is looking for an internal critique of the idea of PC going too far.

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Post #: 138

RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm com... - 6/10/2006 12:19:11 PM

Level

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quote:

ORIGINAL: RavenMuse

quote:

ORIGINAL: Level
Hm. I saw a profile here, maybe a couple of days ago, the person announced themself as a "slave", then went on to dispense quite a long list of what they would and would not do. Is this a slave? Is this a submissive?.... so, I have to wonder how many believe that someone "is" whatever they say they are, no matter what?

A rarity, Level and I on opposite sides of an issue

Personaly when I see someone using the lable slave or sub, all I take from that is a rough idea of where they see their place on the dynamic, a start point for when the topic comes up between us (Assuming the discussion finds enough in common to get to that).

It certainly doesn't mean the girl has no hard limits....my girl does and she sought and found a Master who was compatable with those limits. A Master whos 'style' of ownership was compatable with the way she needs to be owned.

Does that make her any less a slave than some mindless, opinionless doormat drone? Not to me, I have absolutely no use for a doormat unless I need to wipe my feet, I certainly wouldn't collar one.

I don't believe ANYONE 'is' what they lable themself as.... I believe what I see in their actions and attitudes as I get to know them. The lable is simply a pointer, a start from which you look to learn more about what is ment and how they see the lable.

Yes Raven, it does seem to be a rarity, my friend ..... could be a case of "great minds thinking alike" at least most of the time!

I just can't see one with a profile running along the lines of "i'm deeply submissive, with a slave's heart, but don't think i'm going to do housework, if you want a maid, look elsewhere, and it's best for all concerned if you don't put your dangly bits near my ass, cause that ain't happening, and as for expecting me to wear that oufit in public, don't make me laugh", as very submissive lol.

I don't want a doormat, either, but if one wishes for me to see them as submissive to me, then the number one thing on their mind should be to please and obey me. Now, if what I want them to do is anathema to them, by all means, it's expected for them to politely discuss it with me. I can be wrong, and I can also change my mind. But, if after discussion, if I don't change my mind, they have the choice of leaving.

What I'm trying to say is that having limits isn't a dealbreaker for me, but disobediance is. Thus finding that compatibility you spoke is so key to acquiring a good partner.

As for looking to their "actions and attitudes", yes, well stated, Raven. Actions do speak louder than words, as they say.

Well, shit. Have I dragged twiceowned's OP off track into the ditch?? PC......ah. Let me see if I can get it back on track with this potentially PC statement.

"To me........what I expect from a submissive is not unreasonable. Does that make the person that does not wish to meet my list "less submissive"? Possibly, to me. We all have our own definitions of kink, and I will go by mine. This does not mean I neccesarily find that person to be less attractive, intelligent, fun, or deserving of respect."

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Post #: 139

RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm com... - 6/10/2006 12:25:29 PM

darkinshadows

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quote:

"To me........what I expect from a submissive is not unreasonable. Does that make the person that does not wish to meet my list "less submissive"? Possibly, to me. We all have our own definitions of kink, and I will go by mine. This does not mean I neccesarily find that person to be less attractive, intelligent, fun, or deserving of respect."

I think I should start a thread of personal responsibilities Like -

"I am holding Level personally responsible for the coffee splurgh on my keyboard and wondering if I can get 100% of the compensation (like they say I can on the advert)" - touche.

Peace and Rapture

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