Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm community? (Full Version)

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twicehappy -> Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm community? (6/9/2006 6:15:49 AM)

Is Political Correctness affecting the bdsm community? The world at large?

As I read the threads here on Collarme I notice more and more those politically correct answers that have become the standard everywhere.

You know the ones I am talking about," I’m ok you’re ok; just play nice and everybody wins nobody loses; Johnny is not a pervert who eats his Master’s shit to get his rocks off he is a socially traumatized consumer of an unmentionable  human digestive by product  from his same gendered partner thereby gaining gratification in a degenerative fashion; you may call yourself a dom and just because your girlfriend whips your ass nightly does not mean you are a sub if you define yourself as a dom and that’s what that means to you then you are a dom and it’s  ok.”

So I went looking for commentary from various sources on the subject. I posted no credits to any individual, the sources were too numerous. I will state for the record the following statements are not mine.

“Political correctness is what is killing our personalities and brain cells every second of every day. It's killing our rights to free speech, opinion, and thought. Political correctness causes a dramatic increase in every human being's sensitivity to name calling and in the long run will cause great psychological damage and communications break downs when said human finds out what the world is really like.”

“Political correctness used to be something that most people considered an annoyance, well-adjusted people anyway. Championed by a group of malcontent busybodies who were probably “traumatized” as children and who have developed a passion for sticking their noses into other people’s business, political correctness, in its infancy, was about gender pronouns, hyphenated nationalities and stereotypes that only the thin-skinned could possibly consider offensive. Alarmingly, this is not the case anymore”

“Political correctness equals the threat of censure or worse if one is not "tolerant" and "sensitive" to everything. PC makes reality, fiction, right, wrong, good and evil impossible to define or differentiate without being persecuted as intolerant.”

“Political correctness is literally a form of cultural Marxism. Where Marxism is an economic-political doctrine, political correctness is a cultural-political doctrine. They are both totalitarian. They are both dangerous.”

“PC and its mate "diversity" are attacks on our way of life under the guise of keeping people from being offended. They need to be offended and get over it; no one gets through life without a little offense handed to them”

“In conclusion, political correctness is the devil.”

What I am getting at is this; have we here in the bdsm community become so politically correct you cannot get a straight answer any more? Is PC  now affecting our day to day vanilla lives as well? In my book it sure looks that way.

Come on, if your name is Johnny and you are eating shit from your Master’s ass to get off in reality you are a homosexual with a scat fetish.

If your girlfriend whips your ass you are a sub, a slave, a switch or a bottom. What you are not is a Dom. I really do not care how you feel about, how you define it does not mean a damn thing; if some one is whipping your ass you are not a Dom, period!

Winning does count, if you do not think so next time they hold the Superbowl go tell them not to keep score, everybody gets a trophy and we can all have fat free vanilla yogurt in our mini van on the way home.

You can call yourself a slave or subbie until the cows come home; if you only submit in the bedroom when and how you want, you are bottom or you simply enjoy kinky sex. What you are not is a slave or subbie, period.

So my question; Am I the only one who sees this? Does anybody agree with the quotes I found? Is political correctness making it damn near impossible to search for a lifestyle partner because everybody defines things the way they are comfortable with and everybody else is telling them it is ok to do so? Is it even affecting something so mundane as how we write a post it note for fear of offending someone?




LuckyAlbatross -> RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm community? (6/9/2006 6:23:54 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: twicehappy
So my question; Am I the only one who sees this? Does anybody agree with the quotes I found? Is political correctness making it damn near impossible to search for a lifestyle partner because everybody defines things the way they are comfortable with and everybody else is telling them it is ok to do so? Is it even affecting something so mundane as how we write a post it note for fear of offending someone?

I think like any way of interacting with others, going to extremes isn't helpful.

I agree in the ideas of listening to others, of being considerate of others, of shaping my language to be inclusive, of using words that are likely to foster communication and understanding rather than alienating and shutting out.  If those are PC ideals- I'm ok with that.

I can be a polite and nice person and do all those "typically PC things" and still be true to myself.  I don't consider myself being compromised by being socially aware and comfortable.

"Acting PC" can go to as unhealthy an extreme as "Being brutally honest."  People who rail against being PC are just as bad as the ones who pander to it. 

I see nothing wrong with trying to be open and courteous, trying to be inclusive and aware.




LadyJulieAnn -> RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm community? (6/9/2006 6:27:13 AM)

I feel it necessary to validate you as a person and fully accept your statements as worthy.  Well done!  [;)]

Political correctness drives me crazy too.  Thanks for the quotes.  [:)]

Be well,
Julie




peterK50 -> RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm community? (6/9/2006 6:27:47 AM)

I remember a quote from my youth "Nothing Is Wrong Until Man Makes It So" It's not PC it's just being open to differences. If you wonder where the term "brutally honest" came from it's when you tell your Mistress she does look fat in those jeans.




Sab -> RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm community? (6/9/2006 6:29:23 AM)

Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm community?

Yes.





twicehappy -> RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm community? (6/9/2006 6:42:57 AM)

I accept your validation and offer you my own, we both win.

Truthfully there is a difference bewtween being polite or gracious and being politcally correct so instead how about i simply say Thank you very much.

quote:

ORIGINAL: peterK50

It's not PC it's just being open to differences. If you wonder where the term "brutally honest" came from it's when you tell your Mistress she does look fat in those jeans.


Open to differences i am ok with; i do not care if Johnny is a homosexual, i have lots of gay friends. What drives me buggy is when Johnny asks am i homosexual and is answered "No you are just heterosexually challenged" or is answered with"Do you feel like you are gay? If you feel you are gay then you might be gay, explore those feelings. But if you feel you are straight even though you just admitted to blowing three men last night then you are straight, nobody can define your sexuality but you and that's ok if that's how you feel".

To those kinds of statements i say BULL SHIT! If you are a guy sucking off another guy you are bi or gay, not straight.

As to being brutally honest, we are talking about PC not everyday discretion, there is a world of difference.




GddssBella -> RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm community? (6/9/2006 6:47:16 AM)

G'morning all:


Political correctness has completely ripped the nuts out of this lifestyle. It's possible to express one's self without being rude. It's called tact. Unfortunately, people take it so far that they fear to upset someone. I think folks need a good shake up from time to time, to rock them out of their complacent little niches in life and wake up.

If being honest, even to the point of brutality, makes me politically incorrect, I can live with that. There's worse sins in this world.


Stay safe, play nice, & share your toys w/ others...


[:D]


Bella




mistoferin -> RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm community? (6/9/2006 7:00:06 AM)

Seeing as I've struggled with being one of those "brutally honest" people, I find the concept of Political Correctness a frustrating goal....and one that I'm not sure that I really want to achieve. It seems when I try to be politically correct, I end up with either my foot in my mouth,  biting off the end of my tongue or just plain feeling stifled and censored. Not to mention that when I am communicating with someone who relies heavily on political correctness, I am never really sure if what I am getting from them is an accurate depiction of their thought.

I like the concepts of tact, courtesy, respect and politeness better. I believe that although in some circumstances I struggle with them also, they are much more attainable for me. The world seemed to make it just fine for an awfully long time incorporating those principles.




marieToo -> RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm community? (6/9/2006 7:00:59 AM)

I think human beings are basically very changeable (even hypocritical)  in accordance to the particular point we are trying to make at the time.  We may judge something in particular as right or wrong in one conversation, and then whine when someone isnt open minded to the same exact thing in another conversation. 

As far as the PC stuff., Yeah.  Ive found in the bdsm community an overbearing sense of bending over backwards so as not to be interpreted as judgemental about something, or racial, or prejudicial, or biased etc.  Its to a point where people do not have the balls to speak out on their own convictions because it may not be acceptable in the mainstream.  It seems to me, that no matter what you say or how you feel, someone is just waiting to tear into your reasons for it.  So we all do a tip toe dance in our wording of everything.   




redpetals -> RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm community? (6/9/2006 7:05:05 AM)

i think politicaly correct is silly
and i especially think its silly when i see people who are otherwise rather smart cookies,sucumbing to it..




LuckyAlbatross -> RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm community? (6/9/2006 7:06:37 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin
The world seemed to make it just fine for an awfully long time incorporating those principles.


Did it? 

The reason PC began was to grow tolerance, awareness and understanding for people, mostly in the workplace- people with disabilities, women, other races, etc. It was to make it clear that grabbing a womans ass or telling her to wear certain clothes was wrong, or that making degrading jokes about people with disabilities is wrong.

The GOALS of PC aren't bad, and they certainly are rooted in very real issues that DID need to see some change in the world.

But, like everything, it gets taken to an extreme and we are left with nothing to hold onto.  That doesn't mean we should go to the OTHER extreme and bash PC-ness altogether or suggest it's completely worthless.

I agree with you- politeness courtesy and tact are exactly what is needed.  But in a world that lacked it to such a degree that it was hurting people's opportunity's, I'm ok that we actively tried to change it.




CreativeDominant -> RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm community? (6/9/2006 7:08:55 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: twicehappy

Is Political Correctness affecting the bdsm community? The world at large?

As I read the threads here on Collarme I notice more and more those politically correct answers that have become the standard everywhere.

You know the ones I am talking about," I’m ok you’re ok; just play nice and everybody wins nobody loses; Johnny is not a pervert who eats his Master’s shit to get his rocks off he is a socially traumatized consumer of an unmentionable  human digestive by product  from his same gendered partner thereby gaining gratification in a degenerative fashion; you may call yourself a dom and just because your girlfriend whips your ass nightly does not mean you are a sub if you define yourself as a dom and that’s what that means to you then you are a dom and it’s  ok.”

So I went looking for commentary from various sources on the subject. I posted no credits to any individual, the sources were too numerous. I will state for the record the following statements are not mine.

“Political correctness is what is killing our personalities and brain cells every second of every day. It's killing our rights to free speech, opinion, and thought. Political correctness causes a dramatic increase in every human being's sensitivity to name calling and in the long run will cause great psychological damage and communications break downs when said human finds out what the world is really like.”

“Political correctness used to be something that most people considered an annoyance, well-adjusted people anyway. Championed by a group of malcontent busybodies who were probably “traumatized” as children and who have developed a passion for sticking their noses into other people’s business, political correctness, in its infancy, was about gender pronouns, hyphenated nationalities and stereotypes that only the thin-skinned could possibly consider offensive. Alarmingly, this is not the case anymore”

“Political correctness equals the threat of censure or worse if one is not "tolerant" and "sensitive" to everything. PC makes reality, fiction, right, wrong, good and evil impossible to define or differentiate without being persecuted as intolerant.”

“Political correctness is literally a form of cultural Marxism. Where Marxism is an economic-political doctrine, political correctness is a cultural-political doctrine. They are both totalitarian. They are both dangerous.”

“PC and its mate "diversity" are attacks on our way of life under the guise of keeping people from being offended. They need to be offended and get over it; no one gets through life without a little offense handed to them”

“In conclusion, political correctness is the devil.”

What I am getting at is this; have we here in the bdsm community become so politically correct you cannot get a straight answer any more? Is PC  now affecting our day to day vanilla lives as well? In my book it sure looks that way.

Come on, if your name is Johnny and you are eating shit from your Master’s ass to get off in reality you are a homosexual with a scat fetish.

If your girlfriend whips your ass you are a sub, a slave, a switch or a bottom. What you are not is a Dom. I really do not care how you feel about, how you define it does not mean a damn thing; if some one is whipping your ass you are not a Dom, period!

Winning does count, if you do not think so next time they hold the Superbowl go tell them not to keep score, everybody gets a trophy and we can all have fat free vanilla yogurt in our mini van on the way home.

You can call yourself a slave or subbie until the cows come home; if you only submit in the bedroom when and how you want, you are bottom or you simply enjoy kinky sex. What you are not is a slave or subbie, period.

So my question; Am I the only one who sees this? Does anybody agree with the quotes I found? Is political correctness making it damn near impossible to search for a lifestyle partner because everybody defines things the way they are comfortable with and everybody else is telling them it is ok to do so? Is it even affecting something so mundane as how we write a post it note for fear of offending someone?


Of course, it is.  You tell someone that their views are racist and, though a whole bunch of people agree with you in their responses, you (and they) are wrong and just "don't get it".

Someone plays around on their partner without their knowledge and finds offense at a thread wherein other posters note that they would not meet and play with someone who is married but not telling their partner.  These people are labeled "judgemental" as if that is always wrong.  It isn't.  People make judgements as to what is right and wrong every day and the fact that we enjoy WIITWD does not mean that we have to accept every thing that is a variant within it or, if we do accept it, does not mean that we can't still call it what it is...whether it is cheating, being a sissy, or anything else.

As has been said before, one man's poison is another man's pleasure.  That doesn't mean that I can't call it poison and be wrong for doing so.  If I think that you (generic) are an abusive, domineering asshole because you fit every conceivable definition, not just my own, of being an abusive, domineering asshole and not "just a strict dominant", then I am going to call it that way.  I may do so in a tactful manner but not to the point of conceding that just because there is some lost, confused person (not submissive) who for whatever godly reason decides you are just what she needs that your point is proven.

But then, I've reached the point in my life where I'm tired of most bullshit.




DDLYCHINADOLL06 -> RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm community? (6/9/2006 7:20:13 AM)

Hell yes it's getting way to pc!Its out of control! if you say or do or even refer to anything even remotely provocative thats it! Your branded as a trouble maker, and as a Collarme.com subscriberi've noticed these usualy powerless losers find holy ground! i'm sure some of these politicly overcorrect individuals is sure to point out any transgressions all to quickly,even to the point of banning people they dont like...... now i submit to you... is that p.c.? Is typeing in caps a hanging offence?.... sure why not.... if you say anything thats not in there little agenda.... your out!

Please people loosen up! This is supposed to be fun.... I think the opperators should take a look at there room monitors. And screw the p.c.!




HollyS -> RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm community? (6/9/2006 7:28:09 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: twicehappy

Come on, if your name is Johnny and you are eating shit from your Master’s ass to get off in reality you are a homosexual with a scat fetish.

If your girlfriend whips your ass you are a sub, a slave, a switch or a bottom. What you are not is a Dom. I really do not care how you feel about, how you define it does not mean a damn thing; if some one is whipping your ass you are not a Dom, period!

You can call yourself a slave or subbie until the cows come home; if you only submit in the bedroom when and how you want, you are bottom or you simply enjoy kinky sex. What you are not is a slave or subbie, period.


twicehappy-

I'm confused why these things are important to you.  In all three examples you give, the person is defining themselves, not anyone else, and hasn't done anything that would affect you. 

I'm speaking directly to these three examples, since these are what you chose to put up here.  How are you hurt by others self-defining their own reality?

~Holly




Arpig -> RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm community? (6/9/2006 7:28:18 AM)

quote:

Did it? 


Yes it did. As to how and why PC-ness began, you aren't old enough to really remember (or should I say you are chronologically challenged?) It began in various intstitutional environments to avoid idiotic and frivolous lawsuits. It is ridiculous and I for one have rejected it from the very start. All being PC does is to hamper communication and understanding.




pinkee -> RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm community? (6/9/2006 7:28:25 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: twicehappy

Is Political Correctness affecting the bdsm community? The world at large?

As I read the threads here on Collarme I notice more and more those politically correct answers that have become the standard everywhere.

You know the ones I am talking about," I’m ok you’re ok; just play nice and everybody wins nobody loses; Johnny is not a pervert who eats his Master’s shit to get his rocks off he is a socially traumatized consumer of an unmentionable  human digestive by product  from his same gendered partner thereby gaining gratification in a degenerative fashion; you may call yourself a dom and just because your girlfriend whips your ass nightly does not mean you are a sub if you define yourself as a dom and that’s what that means to you then you are a dom and it’s  ok.”

So I went looking for commentary from various sources on the subject. I posted no credits to any individual, the sources were too numerous. I will state for the record the following statements are not mine.

“Political correctness is what is killing our personalities and brain cells every second of every day. It's killing our rights to free speech, opinion, and thought. Political correctness causes a dramatic increase in every human being's sensitivity to name calling and in the long run will cause great psychological damage and communications break downs when said human finds out what the world is really like.”

“Political correctness used to be something that most people considered an annoyance, well-adjusted people anyway. Championed by a group of malcontent busybodies who were probably “traumatized” as children and who have developed a passion for sticking their noses into other people’s business, political correctness, in its infancy, was about gender pronouns, hyphenated nationalities and stereotypes that only the thin-skinned could possibly consider offensive. Alarmingly, this is not the case anymore”

“Political correctness equals the threat of censure or worse if one is not "tolerant" and "sensitive" to everything. PC makes reality, fiction, right, wrong, good and evil impossible to define or differentiate without being persecuted as intolerant.”

“Political correctness is literally a form of cultural Marxism. Where Marxism is an economic-political doctrine, political correctness is a cultural-political doctrine. They are both totalitarian. They are both dangerous.”

“PC and its mate "diversity" are attacks on our way of life under the guise of keeping people from being offended. They need to be offended and get over it; no one gets through life without a little offense handed to them”

“In conclusion, political correctness is the devil.”

What I am getting at is this; have we here in the bdsm community become so politically correct you cannot get a straight answer any more? Is PC  now affecting our day to day vanilla lives as well? In my book it sure looks that way.

Come on, if your name is Johnny and you are eating shit from your Master’s ass to get off in reality you are a homosexual with a scat fetish.

If your girlfriend whips your ass you are a sub, a slave, a switch or a bottom. What you are not is a Dom. I really do not care how you feel about, how you define it does not mean a damn thing; if some one is whipping your ass you are not a Dom, period!

Winning does count, if you do not think so next time they hold the Superbowl go tell them not to keep score, everybody gets a trophy and we can all have fat free vanilla yogurt in our mini van on the way home.

You can call yourself a slave or subbie until the cows come home; if you only submit in the bedroom when and how you want, you are bottom or you simply enjoy kinky sex. What you are not is a slave or subbie, period.

So my question; Am I the only one who sees this? Does anybody agree with the quotes I found? Is political correctness making it damn near impossible to search for a lifestyle partner because everybody defines things the way they are comfortable with and everybody else is telling them it is ok to do so? Is it even affecting something so mundane as how we write a post it note for fear of offending someone?


"Political correctness" is such an elastic term...and i cannot answer whether it affects the world at large or just thr BDSM "community".  i've only been here two years -- on the boards much less -- and IMHO there is a consensus amoungst most P/posters that W/we will not write "hate speech" and W/we will try to be as inclusive as W/we can.  Obviously, not E/everyone agrees, but that's what the "block" button is for.
 
pinkee




RavenMuse -> RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm community? (6/9/2006 7:37:05 AM)

If someone else wants to be PC themselves, fine.... it only becomes a problem if they try to put it on me and try to tell me how to post/speak then they can stuff their PC bullshit where the sun don't shine.

Over all I haven't seen enough of it to be a problem in the community (Here, another site I post to and/or the local scene) as there are quite a number of cantankerous old farts like myself who aren't and never will be PC, so honest answers are always to be found [:)]




meatcleaver -> RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm community? (6/9/2006 7:38:35 AM)

Political correctness is a sickness, a virus that permeates bdsm along with society as a whole. It was born out of a lie and a willfull misintepretation of Witgenstein from what I understand and it will remain a lie, it is something best left to social workers and other misguided dictatorial professions. It really has no place in the world of free speach. If one has a cause one should win people's hearts and minds through debate, not shut them up by claiming they are intrinsically bad for holding a particular view.

Language doesn't define human experience and perception and to curtail language through the social pressure of political correctness is denying rights so many people have fought for over hundreds of years. I'd rather be sent to the proverbial gulags that give a pat opinion that I don't believe in, just not to offend anyone. Free speach is meaningless if you have to curtail it rather than offend someone.




mistoferin -> RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm community? (6/9/2006 7:41:50 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross
The reason PC began was to grow tolerance, awareness and understanding for people, mostly in the workplace- people with disabilities, women, other races, etc. It was to make it clear that grabbing a womans ass or telling her to wear certain clothes was wrong, or that making degrading jokes about people with disabilities is wrong.


Social changes don't happen because the ones rallying the cause are being politically correct. I don't think that majority of people saw Rosa Parks taking that seat on the bus as the politically correct thing to do at the time she did it. Women didn't bring about changes in the way we view sexual harrasment by being politically correct, they did it by getting pissed off and banding together and putting their collective feet down and saying "This is bullshit and we are not going to stand for it any longer". Social changes take place when people are fed up and stand up and get in the face of "the majority". At the time they do it, the "majority" doesn't generally see anything politically correct about their words or actions. It is only after the "majority" is overcome and the change has taken place that we attach the "politically correct" label.




LuckyAlbatross -> RE: Is Political Correctness now affecting the bdsm community? (6/9/2006 7:45:19 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin
Social changes don't happen because the ones rallying the cause are being politically correct.

I'm saying the PC at one point was a cause in and of itself- it was people standing up and saying "This is wrong, we need things to change."

A lot of people say the feminist movement was ultimately harmful to women's rights and their feelings about themselves.  Like most political movements, the ideals are good, but the execution goes to unhealthy extremes.

(tic to Arpic)
And I realize I was only born in 1980 and thus can not have any relevant or formative understanding of anything that occurred in the world before the Reagan years, I make do with what pathetic scraps I can get.




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