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RE: Conservatives Are Losing The Culture War - 7/30/2012 2:44:07 PM   
crazyml


Posts: 5568
Joined: 7/3/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: papassion
They have already told the English police to stay out of their community. Said they will handle the law in their community and the English courts have agreed!


Where the fuck did you hear this utter, utter nonsense.

Please post a link, so that I can explain your error to you.

TYVM

_____________________________

Remember.... There's always somewhere on the planet where it's jackass o'clock.

(in reply to papassion)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: Conservatives Are Losing The Culture War - 7/30/2012 2:55:03 PM   
KYsissy


Posts: 781
Joined: 5/12/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Nah, the national pork producers council will not allow that to happen.


The other white meat.


Eat salmon, The other pink meat.

_____________________________

"If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went."
Will Rogers, 1897-1935

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: Conservatives Are Losing The Culture War - 7/30/2012 3:05:49 PM   
Aswad


Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie

Both are running the grave risk of the destruction of western civilization. Both are succeeding.


Just out of curiosity... which western civilization?

Are we talking its origins (preantiquity), its unification (christendom), the middle ages, the renaissance, early industrial, late industrial, prewar, postwar, 70s, 80s, 90s, new millenium, what?

There isn't, and hasn't been, a single unit we could call western civilization at any point in time. The closest you will come is Christendom, which was neither homogenous, nor static. Over time, there have been any number of evolutions and revolutions in this nebulous entity, and like anything not dead it is still moving. The nature of the beast is that cultures are organic entities which neither spring from nothing, nor disappear suddenly, but rather change in a constant interplay with other cultures and forces inside the culture itself. No culture has ever been destroyed without killing every member of that culture. Decimated, perhaps, in cases like with the native American cultures. But even those were not destroyed outright. They changed, like the cultures before them.

As such, you're really going to have to specify which particular version of western civilization you want to conserve.

Surely it's not its present form, which contains those seeds of destruction you seem worried about. Which raises the question of just how far back you are looking for your roots, and how much of that you want to hold on to. If the answer is "the Christian cultural tradition", you're still going to have to specify more clearly, as the longest tradition in Christianity is that of social change and internal strife between factions that have significant disagreements. The answer can't be "the humanist cultural tradition", as that's the origin of the changes you oppose. So what, exactly, is it that you wish to hold on to?

If you can define that, I suspect you'll be more likely to get somewhere, and far more likely to get respect for your views.

IWYW,
— Aswad.



_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


(in reply to Yachtie)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: Conservatives Are Losing The Culture War - 7/30/2012 3:38:57 PM   
crazyml


Posts: 5568
Joined: 7/3/2007
Status: offline 		And yet... when one uses the term "western civilisation" everyone seems to know what you mean, pretty much.

Odd that.

_____________________________

Remember.... There's always somewhere on the planet where it's jackass o'clock.

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Profile   Post #: 44
RE: Conservatives Are Losing The Culture War - 7/30/2012 3:48:51 PM   
Montana32DDD


Posts: 9
Joined: 1/29/2011
Status: offline 		The culture war is not over. I do not believe that the defense of the nuclear family is a hateful thing. I do believe the Democrats have engaged in a hate program over gay marriage. One only has to Google Chic-a-fil to see how the supposedly tolerant Progressives who supposedly believe in Liberty virulently attack any one who dares to disagree with them. In My Humble Opinion things will continue to get worse until this country has a long, honest, and open debate about the downsides and the negatives of Left Wing - Democrat - Progressive Political Policy. We have been discussing the GOP's faults for decades. I believe that soon, it will be the left's turn.

Cheers

(in reply to Yachtie)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: Conservatives Are Losing The Culture War - 7/30/2012 3:56:08 PM   
Aswad


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Joined: 4/4/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: crazyml

And yet... when one uses the term "western civilisation" everyone seems to know what you mean, pretty much.


Precisely. Either the moving target, or a snapshot of some point in their life.
When those two go out of sync, people get alienated and freak out.
If he thinks the world is changing too fast, he should say so.

The imminent collapse of western culture is a common trope in western extremist ideologies.

IWYW,
— Aswad.



_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


(in reply to crazyml)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Conservatives Are Losing The Culture War - 7/30/2012 4:12:47 PM   
Musicmystery


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Joined: 3/14/2005
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quote:

Look at the Muslim religion. That will be the future.


You know not the first thing about the Muslim religion. Nor the future.

(in reply to papassion)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: Conservatives Are Losing The Culture War - 7/30/2012 4:44:57 PM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: subrob1967


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

Gay bashings are way way down. The police respond very seriously when it does happen.
We still don't have marriage equality but the Governor has made some noise in support.
The last of the abortion opponents have stopped protesting the clinics here. It's been years since anyone even got an anti abortion bill a vote in either house of the state legislature.
The state science standars were redone a few years back to include more discussion of evolution. The creationists seem to have moved out of state seeking more gullible suckers.
We still have a fair number of unions and union members. The unions held off Wal-Mart's entry into the city for years until they got substantial concessions (there is even a quiet move underway to unionize a city Wal-Mart).

So all in all the progressive social agenda is doing quite well in Chicago.



Quite well... I can see that.

Put several million people in close quarters and things will happen. And of course the media lives to sensationalize them when they do happen.

That you live in fear of the best place to live in the world is kind of sad.

(in reply to subrob1967)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: Conservatives Are Losing The Culture War - 7/30/2012 4:47:31 PM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Montana32DDD

The culture war is not over. I do not believe that the defense of the nuclear family is a hateful thing. I do believe the Democrats have engaged in a hate program over gay marriage. One only has to Google Chic-a-fil to see how the supposedly tolerant Progressives who supposedly believe in Liberty virulently attack any one who dares to disagree with them. In My Humble Opinion things will continue to get worse until this country has a long, honest, and open debate about the downsides and the negatives of Left Wing - Democrat - Progressive Political Policy. We have been discussing the GOP's faults for decades. I believe that soon, it will be the left's turn.

Cheers

So its a bad thing to publicize and oppose the expansion of a business that funds hate groups? What if Chik-Fil-A funded the Klan? Would it be bad to boycott them and publicize wher they spend their money?

(in reply to Montana32DDD)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: Conservatives Are Losing The Culture War - 7/30/2012 5:44:59 PM   
Yachtie


Posts: 3593
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

So its a bad thing to publicize and oppose the expansion of a business that funds hate groups? What if Chik-Fil-A funded the Klan? Would it be bad to boycott them and publicize wher they spend their money?


Why does adhering to the Christian tenant concerning marriage constitute hate?




_____________________________

“We all know it’s going to end badly, but in the meantime we can make some money.” - Jim Cramer, CNBC

“Those who ‘abjure’ violence can only do so because others are committing violence on their behalf.” - George Orwell

(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 50
RE: Conservatives Are Losing The Culture War - 7/30/2012 6:04:24 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

You know not the first thing about the Muslim religion.



They don't like dogs.  Who needs to know more than that?

(There is also the whole "submit" to God, rather than come freely, and "kill the infidel" shit, but a ban on pet pooches is enough)

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 51
RE: Conservatives Are Losing The Culture War - 7/30/2012 6:13:05 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead


quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

One of these day you are going to figure out that there are homophobes and religious nuts on the left too. Then who are you going to hate?

Care to name a few of them?
(Helpful hint: neither Stalin, Hitler nor Pol Pot were lefties, whatever Rush says...)



Perhaps you've heard of Westboro Baptist Church?  You did know they are liberal Democrats, right?

(in reply to Moonhead)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: Conservatives Are Losing The Culture War - 7/30/2012 6:27:01 PM   
dcnovice


Posts: 37282
Joined: 8/2/2006
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quote:

Just out of curiosity... which western civilization?


Which, of course, brings to mind of one journalism's greatest Q&A moments:

Reporter: What do you think of Western Civilization?

Gandhi: I think it would be a good idea.

_____________________________

No matter how cynical you become,
it's never enough to keep up.

JANE WAGNER, THE SEARCH FOR SIGNS OF
INTELLIGENT LIFE IN THE UNIVERSE

(in reply to Aswad)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Conservatives Are Losing The Culture War - 7/30/2012 6:40:21 PM   
dcnovice


Posts: 37282
Joined: 8/2/2006
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quote:

Perhaps you've heard of Westboro Baptist Church?  You did know they are liberal Democrats, right?

Well, that's certainly an unexpected plot twist.

How did you learn this? I couldn't access the church's website, which may be God's way of shielding my blood pressure, but I did find the following in Wikipedia's WBC entry:

The Westboro Baptist Church believes that Barack Obama is the Antichrist, and that he forms an Unholy Trinity with Satan and Pope Benedict XVI, who they believe is the False Prophet.[85]

Margie Phelps, daughter of pastor Fred Phelps and attorney for WBC, said in an interview with Fox News that Obama is "absolutely" going to hell, and that he is "most likely the Beast spoken of in the Revelation". She also said Obama's presidency is a sign of the Apocalypse.[86]

That doesn't sound like any liberal Democrat I know.

_____________________________

No matter how cynical you become,
it's never enough to keep up.

JANE WAGNER, THE SEARCH FOR SIGNS OF
INTELLIGENT LIFE IN THE UNIVERSE

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: Conservatives Are Losing The Culture War - 7/30/2012 6:51:50 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

quote:

Perhaps you've heard of Westboro Baptist Church?  You did know they are liberal Democrats, right?

Well, that's certainly an unexpected plot twist.



Hardly unexpected, DC.  If they had run for office as Republicans, you know the whole party would have been smeared with it a very long time ago.  It's not all that much different than learning the affiliation of a corrupt official from a mainstream news report.  If it is a Repub, that will be mentioned in the first couple graphs, and if it isn't mentioned at all, he's a Democrat.  Check out the City of Bell scandal in the LA area. 

Beyond simple logic, though, someone posted a link to a well written story about the church a little while back.  The law firm takes on all sorts of social justice cases...  Well, probably not discrimination based on sexual orientation.  They do have a big stick up their ass about that.

(in reply to dcnovice)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: Conservatives Are Losing The Culture War - 7/30/2012 7:02:18 PM   
Hillwilliam


Posts: 19394
Joined: 8/27/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

You know not the first thing about the Muslim religion.





(There is also the whole "submit" to God, rather than come freely,)

That sounds like Southern Baptists.

_____________________________

Kinkier than a cheap garden hose.

Whoever said "Religion is the opiate of the masses" never heard Right Wing talk radio.

Don't blame me, I voted for Gary Johnson.

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 56
RE: Conservatives Are Losing The Culture War - 7/30/2012 7:17:52 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

quote:

Perhaps you've heard of Westboro Baptist Church?  You did know they are liberal Democrats, right?

Well, that's certainly an unexpected plot twist.





Hardly unexpected, DC.  If they had run for office as Republicans, you know the whole party would have been smeared with it a very long time ago.  It's not all that much different than learning the affiliation of a corrupt official from a mainstream news report.  If it is a Repub, that will be mentioned in the first couple graphs, and if it isn't mentioned at all, he's a Democrat.  Check out the City of Bell scandal in the LA area. 

Beyond simple logic, though, someone posted a link to a well written story about the church a little while back.  The law firm takes on all sorts of social justice cases...  Well, probably not discrimination based on sexual orientation.  They do have a big stick up their ass about that.


The WBC are republicans.


They are supporting one of the main planks of the GOP platform.


We`ll put you and mr. triple-d in the make-pretend/denial slot.
http://www.rhrealitycheck.org/article/2012/07/30/federal-judge-upholds-arizona-law-criminalizing-all-abortions-after-20-weeks

_____________________________

"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

President Obama

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 57
RE: Conservatives Are Losing The Culture War - 7/30/2012 7:48:34 PM   
Aswad


Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

Reporter: What do you think of Western Civilization?

Gandhi: I think it would be a good idea.


Good times.

IWYW,
— Aswad.


_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


(in reply to dcnovice)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: Conservatives Are Losing The Culture War - 7/30/2012 8:07:17 PM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
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quote:

Democratic PartyPhelps has run in various Kansas Democratic Party primaries five times, but has never won.


He doesn't appear to be very good at it.

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: Conservatives Are Losing The Culture War - 7/30/2012 8:14:16 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

He doesn't appear to be very good at it.


Translation.  "Yes, Rich is absolutely right in his description of Phelps.  Thank God only 15-30% of Democrat Primary voters will vote for him."

(And I don't need a translator app - Quite fluent, thank you)


(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 60
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