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FOX News: Ryan "blatant lies" - 8/30/2012 2:50:59 PM   
Musicmystery


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Joined: 3/14/2005
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From FOX News:

To anyone paying the slightest bit of attention to facts, Ryan’s speech was an apparent attempt to set the world record for the greatest number of blatant lies and misrepresentations slipped into a single political speech. On this measure, while it was Romney who ran the Olympics, Ryan earned the gold.

The good news is that the Romney-Ryan campaign has likely created dozens of new jobs among the legions of additional fact checkers that media outlets are rushing to hire to sift through the mountain of cow dung that flowed from Ryan’s mouth. Said fact checkers have already condemned certain arguments that Ryan still irresponsibly repeated.

Fact: While Ryan tried to pin the downgrade of the United States’ credit rating on spending under President Obama, the credit rating was actually downgraded because Republicans threatened not to raise the debt ceiling.

Fact: While Ryan blamed President Obama for the shut down of a GM plant in Janesville, Wisconsin, the plant was actually closed under President George W. Bush. Ryan actually asked for federal spending to save the plant, while Romney has criticized the auto industry bailout that President Obama ultimately enacted to prevent other plants from closing.

Fact: Though Ryan insisted that President Obama wants to give all the credit for private sector success to government, that isn't what the president said. Period.

Fact: Though Paul Ryan accused President Obama of taking $716 billion out of Medicare, the fact is that that amount was savings in Medicare reimbursement rates (which, incidentally, save Medicare recipients out-of-pocket costs, too) and Ryan himself embraced these savings in his budget plan.

Elections should be about competing based on your record in the past and your vision for the future, not competing to see who can get away with the most lies and distortions without voters noticing or bother to care. Both parties should hold themselves to that standard. Republicans should be ashamed that there was even one misrepresentation in Ryan’s speech but sadly, there were many.

And then there’s what Ryan didn’t talk about.

Ryan didn’t mention his extremist stance on banning all abortions with no exception for rape or incest, a stance that is out of touch with 75% of American voters.

Ryan didn’t mention his previous plan to hand over Social Security to Wall Street.

Ryan didn’t mention his numerous votes to raise spending and balloon the deficit when George W. Bush was president.

Ryan didn’t mention how his budget would eviscerate programs that help the poor and raise taxes on 95% of Americans in order to cut taxes for millionaires and billionaires even further and increase — yes, increase —the deficit.

These aspects of Ryan’s resume and ideology are sticky to say the least. He would have been wise to tackle them head on and try and explain them away in his first real introduction to voters. But instead of Ryan airing his own dirty laundry, Democrats will get the chance.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/08/30/paul-ryans-speech-in-three-words/#ixzz254JV95nG

Then there are these:

Let’s start with the chronologically impossible. Ryan spoke about the GM plant in his hometown of Janesville:

A lot of guys I went to high school with worked at that GM plant. Right there at that plant, candidate Obama said: “I believe that if our government is there to support you … this plant will be here for another hundred years.” That’s what he said in 2008.

Well, as it turned out, that plant didn’t last another year. It is locked up and empty to this day. And that’s how it is in so many towns today, where the recovery that was promised is nowhere in sight.

Set aside the fact that Paul Ryan, in a fit of anti-Randianism, asked for government funds to save the plant. Set aside that he voted for the big-government auto bailout. Ryan also conveniently forgot to mention that GM announced the closure of the plant in early June 2008. In fact, Ryan and then-Wisconsin Sens. Russ Feingold (D) and Herb Kohl (D) sent a letter that month to GM CEO Rick Wagoner asking him to reconsider. This was not just before Barack Obama was inaugurated or even elected; it was the same day he won his own party’s nomination. There was no way Obama could have saved that auto plant without also discovering time travel.

Despite his problems with calendars, how did Ryan fare when it came to his own record? Well, he also inveighed against Obama on the national debt:

[Obama] created a bipartisan debt commission [, the Simpson-Bowles commission]. They came back with an urgent report. He thanked them, sent them on their way, and then did exactly nothing.

But Ryan was on that commission, and he voted against that “urgent report.” Also, the president did not do “exactly nothing”: The White House released a debt plan last September, despite Republicans’ best attempts to pretend it doesn’t exist. Finally, if the crisis is so urgent, why does Ryan’s own budget proposal not balance the budget until the 2030s?

One more example — a line from his attack on Obama’s stimulus:

The stimulus was a case of political patronage, corporate welfare, and cronyism at their worst.

As Time’s Michael Grunwald, who has just published a new book about the stimulus, points out, “Experts had warned that 5 percent of the stimulus could be lost to fraud, but investigators have documented less than $10 million in losses — about 0.001 percent.” Solyndra has been the exception, not the rule.

These are just three examples, and there are many others: attacking the president for “raiding” Medicare when his own budget calls for cutting the same amount of money from the program; claiming fiscal rectitude after voting for the two wars, Medicare expansion and tax cuts that remain key drivers of our federal deficit; and so on.

With tonight’s speech, Mitt Romney and Paul Ryan have doubled down on their twin bets of 2012 — that journalists will sit back and name winners and losers without regard to who is telling the truth, and that voters are too ignorant to care about the truth. Do not let them be right.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-partisan/post/paul-ryans-dishonest-speech/2012/08/30/16bb62d8-f24f-11e1-adc6-87dfa8eff430_blog.html?wpisrc=nl_opinions

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/08/30/paul-ryans-speech-in-three-words/
Profile   Post #: 1
RE: FOX News: Ryan "blatant lies" - 8/30/2012 3:38:05 PM   
subrob1967


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1, The OPINION PIECE you posted was written by a liberal activist, so there's no point in disputing her "facts". It's a hatchet opinion piece, nothing more.
2, Ryan never said that Obama caused the GM plant to close, he quoted Obama when Obama said government would be there for them. Since the government wasn't there for them, and the plant closed... How exactly is what Ryan said a lie?
3, How exactly is what Ryan said about the stimulus a lie? Didn't the banks, and UAW er GM & Chrysler get the majority of the stimulus funds?

Continue to post attacks on Ryan & Romney, it's the only hope your side has left.

The fear is delicious...

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(in reply to Musicmystery)
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RE: FOX News: Ryan "blatant lies" - 8/30/2012 3:39:06 PM   
Yachtie


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The Democraps are desperate. The wailing and gnashing of teeth.

Ain't it fun?

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(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 3
RE: FOX News: Ryan "blatant lies" - 8/30/2012 4:32:07 PM   
LookieNoNookie


Posts: 12216
Joined: 8/9/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

From FOX News:

To anyone paying the slightest bit of attention to facts, Ryan’s speech was an apparent attempt to set the world record for the greatest number of blatant lies and misrepresentations slipped into a single political speech. On this measure, while it was Romney who ran the Olympics, Ryan earned the gold.

The good news is that the Romney-Ryan campaign has likely created dozens of new jobs among the legions of additional fact checkers that media outlets are rushing to hire to sift through the mountain of cow dung that flowed from Ryan’s mouth. Said fact checkers have already condemned certain arguments that Ryan still irresponsibly repeated.

Fact: While Ryan tried to pin the downgrade of the United States’ credit rating on spending under President Obama, the credit rating was actually downgraded because Republicans threatened not to raise the debt ceiling.

Fact: While Ryan blamed President Obama for the shut down of a GM plant in Janesville, Wisconsin, the plant was actually closed under President George W. Bush. Ryan actually asked for federal spending to save the plant, while Romney has criticized the auto industry bailout that President Obama ultimately enacted to prevent other plants from closing.

Fact: Though Ryan insisted that President Obama wants to give all the credit for private sector success to government, that isn't what the president said. Period.

Fact: Though Paul Ryan accused President Obama of taking $716 billion out of Medicare, the fact is that that amount was savings in Medicare reimbursement rates (which, incidentally, save Medicare recipients out-of-pocket costs, too) and Ryan himself embraced these savings in his budget plan.

Elections should be about competing based on your record in the past and your vision for the future, not competing to see who can get away with the most lies and distortions without voters noticing or bother to care. Both parties should hold themselves to that standard. Republicans should be ashamed that there was even one misrepresentation in Ryan’s speech but sadly, there were many.

And then there’s what Ryan didn’t talk about.

Ryan didn’t mention his extremist stance on banning all abortions with no exception for rape or incest, a stance that is out of touch with 75% of American voters.

Ryan didn’t mention his previous plan to hand over Social Security to Wall Street.

Ryan didn’t mention his numerous votes to raise spending and balloon the deficit when George W. Bush was president.

Ryan didn’t mention how his budget would eviscerate programs that help the poor and raise taxes on 95% of Americans in order to cut taxes for millionaires and billionaires even further and increase — yes, increase —the deficit.

These aspects of Ryan’s resume and ideology are sticky to say the least. He would have been wise to tackle them head on and try and explain them away in his first real introduction to voters. But instead of Ryan airing his own dirty laundry, Democrats will get the chance.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/08/30/paul-ryans-speech-in-three-words/#ixzz254JV95nG

Then there are these:

Let’s start with the chronologically impossible. Ryan spoke about the GM plant in his hometown of Janesville:

A lot of guys I went to high school with worked at that GM plant. Right there at that plant, candidate Obama said: “I believe that if our government is there to support you … this plant will be here for another hundred years.” That’s what he said in 2008.

Well, as it turned out, that plant didn’t last another year. It is locked up and empty to this day. And that’s how it is in so many towns today, where the recovery that was promised is nowhere in sight.

Set aside the fact that Paul Ryan, in a fit of anti-Randianism, asked for government funds to save the plant. Set aside that he voted for the big-government auto bailout. Ryan also conveniently forgot to mention that GM announced the closure of the plant in early June 2008. In fact, Ryan and then-Wisconsin Sens. Russ Feingold (D) and Herb Kohl (D) sent a letter that month to GM CEO Rick Wagoner asking him to reconsider. This was not just before Barack Obama was inaugurated or even elected; it was the same day he won his own party’s nomination. There was no way Obama could have saved that auto plant without also discovering time travel.

Despite his problems with calendars, how did Ryan fare when it came to his own record? Well, he also inveighed against Obama on the national debt:

[Obama] created a bipartisan debt commission [, the Simpson-Bowles commission]. They came back with an urgent report. He thanked them, sent them on their way, and then did exactly nothing.

But Ryan was on that commission, and he voted against that “urgent report.” Also, the president did not do “exactly nothing”: The White House released a debt plan last September, despite Republicans’ best attempts to pretend it doesn’t exist. Finally, if the crisis is so urgent, why does Ryan’s own budget proposal not balance the budget until the 2030s?

One more example — a line from his attack on Obama’s stimulus:

The stimulus was a case of political patronage, corporate welfare, and cronyism at their worst.

As Time’s Michael Grunwald, who has just published a new book about the stimulus, points out, “Experts had warned that 5 percent of the stimulus could be lost to fraud, but investigators have documented less than $10 million in losses — about 0.001 percent.” Solyndra has been the exception, not the rule.

These are just three examples, and there are many others: attacking the president for “raiding” Medicare when his own budget calls for cutting the same amount of money from the program; claiming fiscal rectitude after voting for the two wars, Medicare expansion and tax cuts that remain key drivers of our federal deficit; and so on.

With tonight’s speech, Mitt Romney and Paul Ryan have doubled down on their twin bets of 2012 — that journalists will sit back and name winners and losers without regard to who is telling the truth, and that voters are too ignorant to care about the truth. Do not let them be right.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-partisan/post/paul-ryans-dishonest-speech/2012/08/30/16bb62d8-f24f-11e1-adc6-87dfa8eff430_blog.html?wpisrc=nl_opinions

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/08/30/paul-ryans-speech-in-three-words/


Fact: We owe too much.
Fact: They're (whoever the fuck they are....Congress) spending too much.
Fact: Those who make more aren't taxed enough (I'm one of them).
Fact: The assholes that run the show are spending your money faster than you can send it off to them.
Fact: When SSI was first created, it was created KNOWING that (on the assumption that everyone would die before they got benefits) that....no one would ever get a check...and then....as the years went by...NO ONE had the balls to say...."FUCK!!!! People are living/working longer....let's move the dates up".
Fact: Game is different today.....
Fact: Assholes run the game.



(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 4
RE: FOX News: Ryan "blatant lies" - 8/30/2012 4:35:41 PM   
LookieNoNookie


Posts: 12216
Joined: 8/9/2008
Status: offline
FACT: Let's change the game. Let's tell these pricks....no more dipping in....move the dates up to 68 AND.....WTF is all this paying SSI up to 110K?

You make money...you pay SSI.

You make money on investments (as I do)...you pay...up to a katrillion.

Done.

AND....there's no fucking touching the kitty.

Period.

(in reply to LookieNoNookie)
Profile   Post #: 5
RE: FOX News: Ryan "blatant lies" - 8/30/2012 4:46:10 PM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
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quote:

The OPINION PIECE you posted was written by a liberal activist


One of the many who work for FOX, no doubt.


(in reply to subrob1967)
Profile   Post #: 6
RE: FOX News: Ryan "blatant lies" - 8/30/2012 5:07:41 PM   
FatDomDaddy


Posts: 3183
Joined: 1/31/2004
Status: offline
Wait.... aren't you one of those "Faux News Lies" bunch?

I thought we were suppose to believe anything we hear on Fox???

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 7
RE: FOX News: Ryan "blatant lies" - 8/30/2012 5:14:22 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

I thought we were suppose to believe anything we hear on Fox???


And you do... trust me... you do believe anything.

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RE: FOX News: Ryan "blatant lies" - 8/30/2012 7:13:23 PM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: FatDomDaddy

Wait.... aren't you one of those "Faux News Lies" bunch?

I thought we were suppose to believe anything we hear on Fox???

Well look who's catching on.

Exactly the point, ya think? From your own trusted source.

And the point raised in the article is an excellent one--leading with lies instead of tackling the issues leaves the door open for your opponents.

But it also shows what we can expect from Romney/Ryan. Not looking promising.

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Profile   Post #: 9
RE: FOX News: Ryan "blatant lies" - 8/30/2012 7:43:52 PM   
LookieNoNookie


Posts: 12216
Joined: 8/9/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery


quote:

ORIGINAL: FatDomDaddy

Wait.... aren't you one of those "Faux News Lies" bunch?

I thought we were suppose to believe anything we hear on Fox???

Well look who's catching on.

Exactly the point, ya think? From your own trusted source.

And the point raised in the article is an excellent one--leading with lies instead of tackling the issues leaves the door open for your opponents.

But it also shows what we can expect from Romney/Ryan. Not looking promising.


Fox News is a travesty.

So is Obama.

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 10
RE: FOX News: Ryan "blatant lies" - 8/30/2012 7:53:30 PM   
stellauk


Posts: 1360
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie


Ain't it fun?


I'll certainly agree with you there. But then again I'm a socialist.

The Republican campaign could have been scripted for Laurel and Hardy.

Do you want my 'I told you so' now or would you rather I wait until November?

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Usually when you have all the answers for something nobody is interested in listening.

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Profile   Post #: 11
RE: FOX News: Ryan "blatant lies" - 8/30/2012 8:04:11 PM   
Arturas


Posts: 3245
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quote:

Fact: While Ryan tried to pin the downgrade of the United States’ credit rating on spending under President Obama, the credit rating was actually downgraded because Republicans threatened not to raise the debt ceiling.


Not tue.

Fact: The credit rating was downgraded because we were required to reduce our debt, not increase it. How does anyone get a better credit rating by increasing their debt even more than they can afford now?

Of course they cannot. The debt ceiling could only be raised if we produced a plan to reduce spending also and Obama and the Senate had no will to do that and refused to do so. This was the other side of the equation and simply encreasing the debt celling would not save our credit rating. Again, how would raising our already ginormous debt save our credt rating? It would not.

I don't plan on spending anymore time on the rest of the "facts" since it is clearly not needed. They, like this statement, are all half true which means they are not true.

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Profile   Post #: 12
RE: FOX News: Ryan "blatant lies" - 8/30/2012 8:15:24 PM   
Musicmystery


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Well this one is pretty easy to establish, Artie---the rating agency specifically said it was because Congress was willing to threaten default.

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Profile   Post #: 13
RE: FOX News: Ryan "blatant lies" - 8/30/2012 8:27:50 PM   
erieangel


Posts: 2237
Joined: 6/19/2011
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Arturas

quote:

Fact: While Ryan tried to pin the downgrade of the United States’ credit rating on spending under President Obama, the credit rating was actually downgraded because Republicans threatened not to raise the debt ceiling.


Not tue.

Fact: The credit rating was downgraded because we were required to reduce our debt, not increase it. How does anyone get a better credit rating by increasing their debt even more than they can afford now?

Of course they cannot. The debt ceiling could only be raised if we produced a plan to reduce spending also and Obama and the Senate had no will to do that and refused to do so. This was the other side of the equation and simply encreasing the debt celling would not save our credit rating. Again, how would raising our already ginormous debt save our credt rating? It would not.

I don't plan on spending anymore time on the rest of the "facts" since it is clearly not needed. They, like this statement, are all half true which means they are not true.



Then explain all the other times the debt ceiling had been raised without reducing the debt or plans to reduce it and this is the first time in our history that our credit has taken a hit.


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Profile   Post #: 14
RE: FOX News: Ryan "blatant lies" - 8/31/2012 3:23:31 AM   
DaNewAgeViking


Posts: 1009
Joined: 4/29/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: subrob1967

1, The OPINION PIECE you posted was written by a liberal activist, so there's no point in disputing her "facts". It's a hatchet opinion piece, nothing more.

This stuff is straight off Fox - and it's all a liberal lie? Interesting that you'll throw even God's Anointed under the bus if they don't spin the way the fanatics tell them to.

I have to admit, though, that stuff like this coming from Fox is creepy weird...


< Message edited by DaNewAgeViking -- 8/31/2012 3:25:17 AM >

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Profile   Post #: 15
RE: FOX News: Ryan "blatant lies" - 8/31/2012 3:31:35 AM   
Lucylastic


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Just like Michael Moore saying that Romney is gonna win....
yeah he said it, but the context is what counts

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Profile   Post #: 16
RE: FOX News: Ryan "blatant lies" - 8/31/2012 3:35:49 AM   
GotSteel


Posts: 5871
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Fact: putting Fact: before something does not in any way make it a fact.

Fact: The issue isn't the debt in and of itself but of the dysfunctional state of our government and how that will prevent us from getting a handle on the debt.

quote:

ORIGINAL: http://www.standardandpoors.com/servlet/BlobServer?blobheadername3=MDT-Type&blobcol=urldata&blobtable=MungoBlobs&blobheadervalue2=inline%3B+filename%3DUS_Downgraded_AA%2B.pdf&blobheadername2=Content-Disposition&blobheadervalue1=application%2Fpdf&blobkey=id&blobheadername1=content-type&blobwhere=1243942957443&blobheadervalue3=UTF-8

Overview
· We have lowered our long-term sovereign credit rating on the United
States of America to 'AA+' from 'AAA' and affirmed the 'A-1+' short-term
rating.
· We have also removed both the short- and long-term ratings from
CreditWatch negative.
· The downgrade reflects our opinion that the fiscal consolidation plan
that Congress and the Administration recently agreed to falls short of
what, in our view, would be necessary to stabilize the government's
medium-term debt dynamics.
· More broadly, the downgrade reflects our view that the effectiveness,
stability, and predictability of American policymaking and political
institutions have weakened at a time of ongoing fiscal and economic
challenges to a degree more than we envisioned when we assigned a
negative outlook to the rating on April 18, 2011.
· Since then, we have changed our view of the difficulties in bridging the
gulf between the political parties over fiscal policy, which makes us
pessimistic about the capacity of Congress and the Administration to be
able to leverage their agreement this week into a broader fiscal
consolidation plan that stabilizes the government's debt dynamics any
time soon.
· The outlook on the long-term rating is negative. We could lower the
long-term rating to 'AA' within the next two years if we see that less
reduction in spending than agreed to, higher interest rates, or new
fiscal pressures during the period result in a higher general government
debt trajectory than we currently assume in our base case.

(in reply to Arturas)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: FOX News: Ryan "blatant lies" - 8/31/2012 6:23:56 AM   
FatDomDaddy


Posts: 3183
Joined: 1/31/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery


quote:

ORIGINAL: FatDomDaddy

Wait.... aren't you one of those "Faux News Lies" bunch?

I thought we were suppose to believe anything we hear on Fox???

Well look who's catching on.

Exactly the point, ya think? From your own trusted source.

And the point raised in the article is an excellent one--leading with lies instead of tackling the issues leaves the door open for your opponents.

But it also shows what we can expect from Romney/Ryan. Not looking promising.



So you now believe Fox to be a trusted news source....good

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: FOX News: Ryan "blatant lies" - 8/31/2012 7:11:54 AM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline
You'll note I included the Washington Post as well.

Y'all are so funny. You invent the "rules" and shift "positions" hourly as you squirm to convince yourself, like kids faking a game at recess.

In this case, the point is, that even the Right recognizes Ryan delivered a load of crap, and this journalist recognizes that's a problem for the candidates, not an effective approach, for the reasons outlined.

(in reply to FatDomDaddy)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: FOX News: Ryan "blatant lies" - 8/31/2012 9:28:43 AM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline
LOL!

http://www.colbertnation.com/full-episodes/thu-august-30-2012-jon-huntsman?xrs=synd_facebook

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Profile   Post #: 20
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