RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case

RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (Full Version)

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tazzygirl -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (9/30/2012 6:23:11 PM)
I never said he didnt. I merely asked how Martin's body came to rest on the ground, face down. There is too much that, for me, doesnt fit the story.

vincentML -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (9/30/2012 6:25:53 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl I never said he didnt. I merely asked how Martin's body came to rest on the ground, face down. There is too much that, for me, doesnt fit the story. Real events are messy and often don't fit neatly into any script, is the best i can say, tazzie.

tazzygirl -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (9/30/2012 6:46:45 PM)
Some things should fit.... this is but one that doesnt.

vincentML -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (9/30/2012 6:50:01 PM)
One detail of the event doesn't fit or. . . the whole thing smells?

tazzygirl -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (9/30/2012 6:53:51 PM)
Too much smells.

vincentML -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (9/30/2012 7:19:53 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl Too much smells. Okay. A jury will have to sort it then. My beef is that Zimmerman was prejudged by the media before we ever saw him. As i stated above the photos of Martin as a 12 year old and Zimmerman in jail drag were propaganda, which along with marches in the street and TV appearances by the Martin family stirred up an outrage against Z. Some here make the most impassioned accusations with flimsy evidence. Sorta like we'll hang him and then have a trial to prove him guilty.

tazzygirl -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (9/30/2012 7:24:52 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: vincentML quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl Too much smells. Okay. A jury will have to sort it then. My beef is that Zimmerman was prejudged by the media before we ever saw him. As i stated above the photos of Martin as a 12 year old and Zimmerman in jail drag were propaganda, which along with marches in the street and TV appearances by the Martin family stirred up an outrage against Z. Some here make the most impassioned accusations with flimsy evidence. Sorta like we'll hang him and then have a trial to prove him guilty. Nothing was being done without the TV appearances and the marches. We went though that here in Pittsburgh. It shouldnt have to come to that.

vincentML -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (9/30/2012 8:13:04 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: ORIGINAL: vincentML quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl Too much smells. Okay. A jury will have to sort it then. My beef is that Zimmerman was prejudged by the media before we ever saw him. As i stated above the photos of Martin as a 12 year old and Zimmerman in jail drag were propaganda, which along with marches in the street and TV appearances by the Martin family stirred up an outrage against Z. Some here make the most impassioned accusations with flimsy evidence. Sorta like we'll hang him and then have a trial to prove him guilty. Nothing was being done without the TV appearances and the marches. We went though that here in Pittsburgh. It shouldnt have to come to that. Oh yes, I agree. The unfortunate consequence was that Zimmerman was lynched before the indictment.

tazzygirl -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (9/30/2012 8:17:41 PM)
Zimmerman should have been arrested that night, turned in his gun, been processed and then allowed bail. Thats typically what happens with most people who kill someone and the actions are questionable.

BamaD -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (9/30/2012 10:14:41 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl Zimmerman should have been arrested that night, turned in his gun, been processed and then allowed bail. Thats typically what happens with most people who kill someone and the actions are questionable. The problem is that the police, except for the detective who had a grudge against Zimmerman for defending homeless people against the police didn't see enough evidence for an aresst let alone a conviction. The evidence hasn't changed. There is still nothing to reject self defense, question perhaps but refute no.

farglebargle -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/1/2012 1:02:44 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: vincentML Some here make the most impassioned accusations with flimsy evidence. Sorta like we'll hang him and then have a trial to prove him guilty. Can you please provide a detailed list of EVERYONE who suggested we hang Zimmerman and then have a trial, because as I've witnessed, EVERYONE HAS DEMANDED A TRIAL TO SORT OUT ZIMMERMAN'S CONFLICTING CLAIMS. The only person I see suggesting otherwise is you, and I wonder what your motivation is.

farglebargle -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/1/2012 1:03:49 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl Zimmerman should have been arrested that night, turned in his gun, been processed and then allowed bail. Thats typically what happens with most people who kill someone and the actions are questionable. The problem is that the police, except for the detective who had a grudge against Zimmerman for defending homeless people against the police didn't see enough evidence for an aresst let alone a conviction. The evidence hasn't changed. There is still nothing to reject self defense, question perhaps but refute no. When the Chief of Police is best friends with Zimmerman's meth hook-up .. I mean "mentor" Osterman, there's an obvious conflict of interest....

mons -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/1/2012 3:29:49 AM)
Raiikun Your sir are so, what is the word? You do not and will not see that Zimmerman murder a child, someone child!!!!!! If this were a black man and and a white child I would feel the same (he is wrong so wrong that I do see anything else but a murder be he white or black or anything else)!!!!!!! Is it possible you hate so much and just do not see what has happen?????????? It makes me frighten for my sons, thank god they have wonderful jobs and do not live in Florida and yes we do live in a city where you can count how many black people are here! But unlike the place you live in your mind there are none of that people of thinking going on here in the wonderful city we live in! How, no I know you do not have children!! You could not possibility have children and think the way you do! Have you not kindness of humanity in you! Your most likely thinking "why does she care what I think? Because if everyone thought as you do it is too frightening to think of, to rap my mind around such hate makes it so ' ill!!! The first time someone called me the "n" word I look around and wonder who they could possibly be calling that word I laugh this made them so mad I had to ran into a store to be safe! Such hate is something that eats away at you, you have no ability to grow, you stay in that hole of hate you may have dug up! It takes so little time to become ill with yourself, I feel sorry for you! It is right there for you to see, right in front of you a boy is dead and a nut put him in his grave but you still see that he was right! For once look and live not hide with hate! This may be pulled but I hope you do get it and soon Mons

Raiikun -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/1/2012 5:57:38 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: ORIGINAL: vincentML quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl Too much smells. Okay. A jury will have to sort it then. My beef is that Zimmerman was prejudged by the media before we ever saw him. As i stated above the photos of Martin as a 12 year old and Zimmerman in jail drag were propaganda, which along with marches in the street and TV appearances by the Martin family stirred up an outrage against Z. Some here make the most impassioned accusations with flimsy evidence. Sorta like we'll hang him and then have a trial to prove him guilty. Nothing was being done without the TV appearances and the marches. We went though that here in Pittsburgh. It shouldnt have to come to that. Except things were being done. Zimmerman was taken to the station and kept there for nearly 5 hours to be questioned (and they kept Zimmerman's gun). They then took him to the scene and had him walk them through it. They then had him retell the events again under a lie detector test, had him lie on his back and scream for help to get exemplars to do a voice comparison, they interviewed everyone there, they did DNA tests, forensic workups etc. And the lead investigator's thoughts were that the evidence did not exist to disprove the self defense claim, which is why they did not arrest.

Raiikun -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/1/2012 6:06:40 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mons How, no I know you do not have children!! You could not possibility have children and think the way you do! Have you not kindness of humanity in you! Untrue. I have no criticisms for Trayvon's parents for their grief over what is a very tragic situation, so please kindly stop with the personal attacks. How one feels for their loss of their child is an entirely seperate issue from the court proceedings; which is still simply this: Did George have a reasonable belief that deadly force was needed to prevent severe bodily injury at the hands of Trayvon? If so, he was justified. O'Mara said this really well in an interview done this week. quote: ORIGINAL: Mark O'Mara I have my own thoughts as to what happened that night. My thoughts matter less than anybody else's because I'm not even allowed to give my personal opinion. More importantly, I know the evidence presented that night. Regardless of how these two men, call them young men, how their lives intersected, one ended up passed away and one ended up in hiding. He will never have the life he had before that fateful night he was going to Target. And Trayvon will never grow up to be an 18-year-old because of that night. "And that's tragic for both of them. I think I know how it happened. I think I know what the evidence is going to support as to how it happened. It doesn't mean because there's a tragedy there was a criminal act. There was just a tragedy maybe. My belief as to what the evidence shows on this case has nothing to do with my personal feelings toward either of the victims, and it's a very prejudiced viewpoint that would lead someone to claim otherwise.

Raiikun -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/1/2012 6:10:31 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl To make it like you stated it, he would have had to lift Martin's body completely and set him down on the ground. Not true, and to suggest such would mean you're not grasping what I'm saying possibly happened. Yes, there's more than one way it could have happened that George got out from under Martin. Some of those might have flipped Martin over onto his back. Others would not have. Hence there's nothing odd about him ending up on the ground face down.

tazzygirl -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/1/2012 6:12:32 AM)
quote: Except things were being done. Zimmerman was taken to the station and kept there for nearly 5 hours to be questioned (and they kept Zimmerman's gun). They then took him to the scene and had him walk them through it. They then had him retell the events again under a lie detector test, had him lie on his back and scream for help to get exemplars to do a voice comparison, they interviewed everyone there, they did DNA tests, forensic workups etc. And the lead investigator's thoughts were that the evidence did not exist to disprove the self defense claim, which is why they did not arrest. So the police were doing the job of a judge and jury in deciding the innocence or guilt of this man... and you wonder why people were marching and complaining?

tazzygirl -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/1/2012 6:16:59 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Raiikun quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl To make it like you stated it, he would have had to lift Martin's body completely and set him down on the ground. Not true, and to suggest such would mean you're not grasping what I'm saying possibly happened. Yes, there's more than one way it could have happened that George got out from under Martin. Some of those might have flipped Martin over onto his back. Others would not have. Hence there's nothing odd about him ending up on the ground face down. Dead body weight tumbles when pushed. Again,., try it with your buddies. See how easy it is to wiggle out from under them.. and have them remain face down with their hands under them.

Raiikun -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/1/2012 6:49:22 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: ORIGINAL: Raiikun quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl To make it like you stated it, he would have had to lift Martin's body completely and set him down on the ground. Not true, and to suggest such would mean you're not grasping what I'm saying possibly happened. Yes, there's more than one way it could have happened that George got out from under Martin. Some of those might have flipped Martin over onto his back. Others would not have. Hence there's nothing odd about him ending up on the ground face down. Dead body weight tumbles when pushed. Again,., try it with your buddies. See how easy it is to wiggle out from under them.. and have them remain face down with their hands under them. Earliest witness reports before Police showed up had Trayvon's arms out to the sides, not under him. And since the evidence/forensics/etc indicate Trayvon would have lived and been conscious and able to speak for a bit after the gunshot, we don't know if he fell down instantly, or if it was slow enough that George didn't have to do much to be out from under him before he was on the ground.

Raiikun -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/1/2012 6:51:44 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: Except things were being done. Zimmerman was taken to the station and kept there for nearly 5 hours to be questioned (and they kept Zimmerman's gun). They then took him to the scene and had him walk them through it. They then had him retell the events again under a lie detector test, had him lie on his back and scream for help to get exemplars to do a voice comparison, they interviewed everyone there, they did DNA tests, forensic workups etc. And the lead investigator's thoughts were that the evidence did not exist to disprove the self defense claim, which is why they did not arrest. So the police were doing the job of a judge and jury in deciding the innocence or guilt of this man... and you wonder why people were marching and complaining? No, they weren't doing the job of the judge and jury. The Police's job was not to decide the innocence or guilt; only to decide if there was probable cause for a crime. And looking at the evidence now, it really isn't hard to see why they didn't feel there was probable cause.

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