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RE: Prez debate (schedule enclosed) - 10/7/2012 2:52:28 PM   
DomYngBlk


Posts: 3316
Joined: 3/27/2006
Status: offline 		Only problem is man, nobody is doing their part.

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 61
RE: Prez debate (schedule enclosed) - 10/7/2012 3:52:45 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline 		So now you are contradicting yourself, DYB. First you say you believe in the goodness in people, now you are chucking all of that, and going on about how charity doesn't work, and that it must be a function of government to shovel out the goodies/technology (Obamaphones?).

Which is it?


(in reply to DomYngBlk)
Profile   Post #: 62
RE: Prez debate (schedule enclosed) - 10/7/2012 4:08:53 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk
At the end, you see Gov't as something bad that is there to deny you something.





I'm not seeing that you know what you think, DYB. Please don't try to tell me what I think.

I see government as something we need, as a structure which is the only way certain things beneficial to all of us can be accomplished. I also understand that government is inherently inefficient, and normally the worst way of doing something that can be accomplished without it. I understand that power is both addictive, and corrupting, and that for the American Experiment to succeed, government is best held to a tight leash.

(in reply to DomYngBlk)
Profile   Post #: 63
RE: Prez debate (schedule enclosed) - 10/7/2012 4:58:30 PM   
DomYngBlk


Posts: 3316
Joined: 3/27/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

So now you are contradicting yourself, DYB. First you say you believe in the goodness in people, now you are chucking all of that, and going on about how charity doesn't work, and that it must be a function of government to shovel out the goodies/technology (Obamaphones?).

Which is it?




Not contradictory at all. How is it. Yes, I believe in people. But it doesn't mean that people are doing the right things. Two different ideas totally.

I deal in the real world. Charity isn't working. Or do you have some sort of magic that says it is.

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 64
RE: Prez debate (schedule enclosed) - 10/7/2012 5:12:17 PM   
DomYngBlk


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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk
At the end, you see Gov't as something bad that is there to deny you something.





I'm not seeing that you know what you think, DYB. Please don't try to tell me what I think.

I see government as something we need, as a structure which is the only way certain things beneficial to all of us can be accomplished. I also understand that government is inherently inefficient, and normally the worst way of doing something that can be accomplished without it. I understand that power is both addictive, and corrupting, and that for the American Experiment to succeed, government is best held to a tight leash.



I dunno. I keep giving you facts to discuss but you don't seem to want to talk to those points. Rather dance around them.

And I believe the reverse of you. Corporations in general bring out the worst in people giving them the ability to wreak havoc on other humans without second thoughts.

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 65
RE: Prez debate (schedule enclosed) - 10/7/2012 5:13:39 PM   
DomYngBlk


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Joined: 3/27/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

So now you are contradicting yourself, DYB. First you say you believe in the goodness in people, now you are chucking all of that, and going on about how charity doesn't work, and that it must be a function of government to shovel out the goodies/technology (Obamaphones?).

Which is it?




Of course it would be someone like you to laugh at the technology gap that exists.....hey fine. You gotta live with yourself not me.

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 66
RE: Prez debate (schedule enclosed) - 10/7/2012 5:15:09 PM   
Yachtie


Posts: 3593
Joined: 1/18/2012
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

I believe in people. But it doesn't mean that people are doing the right things. Two different ideas totally.



Correct. I believe in people too. They exist. (ok, that was snark)

And how do you know the difference? Might you mistakenly believe in one who is, in fact, doing the wrong thing?




_____________________________

“We all know it’s going to end badly, but in the meantime we can make some money.” - Jim Cramer, CNBC

“Those who ‘abjure’ violence can only do so because others are committing violence on their behalf.” - George Orwell

(in reply to DomYngBlk)
Profile   Post #: 67
RE: Prez debate (schedule enclosed) - 10/7/2012 6:03:32 PM   
LookieNoNookie


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

By the way, why are there hybrid cars? Did the car companies come to the market with the idea or was it a reaction to.....wait for it....regulations.


Toyota came out with the Prius in 1999....at double the mandate for hybrids (10 years prior to the current mandates). Honda followed shortly.

They sold like dead possums until $4.00 a gallon.

Now, regardless of CAFE's standards, everyone's chasing their tails.

< Message edited by LookieNoNookie -- 10/7/2012 6:15:15 PM >

(in reply to DomYngBlk)
Profile   Post #: 68
RE: Prez debate (schedule enclosed) - 10/7/2012 7:23:19 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic
So now you are contradicting yourself, DYB. First you say you believe in the goodness in people, now you are chucking all of that, and going on about how charity doesn't work, and that it must be a function of government to shovel out the goodies/technology (Obamaphones?).
Which is it?

Not contradictory at all. How is it. Yes, I believe in people. But it doesn't mean that people are doing the right things. Two different ideas totally.
I deal in the real world. Charity isn't working. Or do you have some sort of magic that says it is.


So, you deal in the real world. And, you say that charities have shown that they aren't up to the task, and you have said that "nobody is doing their part."

Yet, you claim to believe in the goodness of the people. How can you believe in that when you are also stating that nobody is doing their part and that charities aren't capable? How is it that government force is considered "charity" or the "goodness" of people?

There are your contradictory statements.

You claim there is a technology gap. Where? What is it? What are people missing out by not having that technology?

http://www.technologyreview.com/news/427787/are-smart-phones-spreading-faster-than-any/

Very interesting graphs there.

http://pewinternet.org/Commentary/2012/February/Pew-Internet-Mobile.aspx

Lots of info there.

http://people.hofstra.edu/geotrans/eng/ch1en/conc1en/telecomdiffusionUS.html

This one only goes to 2010, but the line graph is interesting.



_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to DomYngBlk)
Profile   Post #: 69
RE: Prez debate (schedule enclosed) - 10/7/2012 7:33:28 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline 		The attempted Ron-fu is weak and without substance, DYB. Why not just admit that you believe people must be forced to be good, rather than claiming a belief in inherent goodness in the first place? It's a pretty standard liberal template, anyway. Remember Clinton refusing to return the (dot-com bubble) surplus to the taxpayers, "because they wouldn't spend it right?"

Why try to shore up the stupid facade with foolish assertions and self-contradicting rationalizations, such as have been offered?


(in reply to DomYngBlk)
Profile   Post #: 70
RE: Prez debate (schedule enclosed) - 10/8/2012 8:09:19 AM   
DomYngBlk


Posts: 3316
Joined: 3/27/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LookieNoNookie

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

By the way, why are there hybrid cars? Did the car companies come to the market with the idea or was it a reaction to.....wait for it....regulations.


Toyota came out with the Prius in 1999....at double the mandate for hybrids (10 years prior to the current mandates). Honda followed shortly.

They sold like dead possums until $4.00 a gallon.

Now, regardless of CAFE's standards, everyone's chasing their tails.


Yes, you are correct. I was wrong in my assertion on that issue.

(in reply to LookieNoNookie)
Profile   Post #: 71
RE: Prez debate (schedule enclosed) - 10/8/2012 8:11:34 AM   
DomYngBlk


Posts: 3316
Joined: 3/27/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic
So now you are contradicting yourself, DYB. First you say you believe in the goodness in people, now you are chucking all of that, and going on about how charity doesn't work, and that it must be a function of government to shovel out the goodies/technology (Obamaphones?).
Which is it?

Not contradictory at all. How is it. Yes, I believe in people. But it doesn't mean that people are doing the right things. Two different ideas totally.
I deal in the real world. Charity isn't working. Or do you have some sort of magic that says it is.


So, you deal in the real world. And, you say that charities have shown that they aren't up to the task, and you have said that "nobody is doing their part."

Yet, you claim to believe in the goodness of the people. How can you believe in that when you are also stating that nobody is doing their part and that charities aren't capable? How is it that government force is considered "charity" or the "goodness" of people?

There are your contradictory statements.

You claim there is a technology gap. Where? What is it? What are people missing out by not having that technology?

http://www.technologyreview.com/news/427787/are-smart-phones-spreading-faster-than-any/

Very interesting graphs there.

http://pewinternet.org/Commentary/2012/February/Pew-Internet-Mobile.aspx

Lots of info there.

http://people.hofstra.edu/geotrans/eng/ch1en/conc1en/telecomdiffusionUS.html

This one only goes to 2010, but the line graph is interesting.




Come on you are smarter than that. You give me phones? How about graphing high speed connections in homes in poor vs more affluent areas.

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 72
RE: Prez debate (schedule enclosed) - 10/8/2012 4:18:30 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk
Come on you are smarter than that. You give me phones? How about graphing high speed connections in homes in poor vs more affluent areas.


You, too, are smarter than that. Two of those links actually had something to say about that. The hofstra.edu link included broadband (which, surprisingly enough, is in a higher % of homes than cable ever was; see graph below), and the Tech Review link included the internet (which looks as if it took about 25 years to reach 75% penetration into US homes).

Did you even follow the links, or just read their addresses? And, smartphones are falling behind the current tech rage, reaching 40% penetration in 2011 (looks to have taken about 10 or 11 years to get to that point). Tablets seem to have taken less than 3 years to reach 10% penetration. I don't doubt that tablets will cross the 40% threshold quicker than smart phones.

Now, to create a discussion, why is current technology necessary for getting ahead? Sure, it's faster than older tech, but is it impossible? Not at all. What did business do before broadband? I recall the amazing speeds a 56k modem would get you compared to that crazy 14.4 or 28.8 baud modem. Crazy fast. My local cable company touts their 20Meg speeds now, about 15 years after I first got online at 56k. And that's just for their basic VIP bundles. You can get 50Meg speeds and they have higher speeds for businesses. $120/month gets you basic cable (100+ channels), phone (all calls in the 419 area code are "local"), and 20Meg internet. You do have to live in the Sandusky or Toledo areas to get Buckeye Cable, though. It's actually quite a fucking value. And, the call center is either in Toledo, or Sandusky, and every tech I ever had to deal with was there within 30 minutes of the beginning of the 2 hour window. One called and offered to get there 2 hours early because his other calls didn't take as long as he was allotted. No doubt he would have called the appt. after me with the same offer if I hadn't taken him up on it.

Local libraries have 10+ internet-connected computers at each branch (and there are a lot of branches in Lucas County). Research can be done without broadband. Homework can be done without broadband.



Again, I ask you, "Where? What is it? What are people missing out by not having that technology?"

_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to DomYngBlk)
Profile   Post #: 73
RE: Prez debate (schedule enclosed) - 10/9/2012 5:24:48 AM   
DomYngBlk


Posts: 3316
Joined: 3/27/2006
Status: offline 		Access to infomation. Nice lines but if you look at your bb and cable they stop basically same spot.

how much money do you figure poor people have? buck twenty to spend every month on cable? ya kiddin. Kid lives miles from a library...he is going to access that how on a daily basis. Besides libraries have time limits on using the computers. If you are researching how mlk and malcolm differed in economic policy then that is gonna take a bit more than 30 minutes.

Need to give your head a shake and go see how real people live man...

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 74
RE: Prez debate (schedule enclosed) - 10/9/2012 1:56:46 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk
Access to infomation. Nice lines but if you look at your bb and cable they stop basically same spot.
how much money do you figure poor people have? buck twenty to spend every month on cable? ya kiddin. Kid lives miles from a library...he is going to access that how on a daily basis. Besides libraries have time limits on using the computers. If you are researching how mlk and malcolm differed in economic policy then that is gonna take a bit more than 30 minutes.
Need to give your head a shake and go see how real people live man...


Yes, BB and cable end near the same place, but bb is still going up, isn't it? Yeah, thought so.

Lucas County essentially has a branch in every 'burb, and several in the city. It would be a rare thing for someone to not be within a few minute's drive to one.

Are you going to go to the lowest common denominator, next? How much are cell phones? 90% penetration. Does that mean we only have 10% poor people? Actually, that doesn't. My parents don't have cell phones. That's their choice. And, it really hampers getting hold of them some times. But, that is made out of choice, not out of necessity. If someone is too poor to have internet access, but has a phone, that's a choice that was made by them. I'm not happy they had to choose one and not both, but it was still a choice they made.

Get real, man. This stuff is ridiculous you're spouting now.

_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to DomYngBlk)
Profile   Post #: 75
RE: Prez debate (schedule enclosed) - 10/9/2012 2:01:48 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		It aint going up, past performance is no indicator of future results.  its at 63%.   Now in innumeracy math as practiced by the republicans, that would be Romneys 47% that are missing out, right? 

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 76
RE: Prez debate (schedule enclosed) - 10/9/2012 6:05:31 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail
It aint going up, past performance is no indicator of future results.  its at 63%.   Now in innumeracy math as practiced by the republicans, that would be Romneys 47% that are missing out, right? 


And, yet, the trend still points to increased penetration.

Your response has all the depth and power of "Unh Unh."

_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 77
RE: Prez debate (schedule enclosed) - 10/9/2012 7:56:13 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail
It aint going up, past performance is no indicator of future results.  its at 63%.   Now in innumeracy math as practiced by the republicans, that would be Romneys 47% that are missing out, right? 


And, yet, the trend still points to increased penetration.

Your response has all the depth and power of "Unh Unh."


And yours is less than useful.  Look at VCRs.

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 78
RE: Prez debate (schedule enclosed) - 10/9/2012 9:29:03 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

The attempted Ron-fu is weak and without substance, DYB. Why not just admit that you believe people must be forced to be good, rather than claiming a belief in inherent goodness in the first place? It's a pretty standard liberal template, anyway. Remember Clinton refusing to return the (dot-com bubble) surplus to the taxpayers, "because they wouldn't spend it right?"

Why try to shore up the stupid facade with foolish assertions and self-contradicting rationalizations, such as have been offered?




I believe that some people are inherently good.

I believe that some people just dont give a fuck.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 79
RE: Prez debate (schedule enclosed) - 10/9/2012 9:35:07 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

Lucas County essentially has a branch in every 'burb, and several in the city. It would be a rare thing for someone to not be within a few minute's drive to one.


Drive? You believe everyone has an automobile?

Pittsburgh is losing bus routes every three months due to cut backs.

There are many communities with children that have no access to public libraries.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 80
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