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RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/25/2012 5:30:01 PM   
fucktoyprincess


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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

quote:

And of course, there are some sins that are without debate...murder


Opinions vary.


I think "murder" is without debate. It is "killing" that is open to debate. They are not the same thing. The term "murder" implies a wrongful killing. But not all "killing" equals "murder".

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RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/25/2012 5:42:46 PM   
LookieNoNookie


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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

quote:

And of course, there are some sins that are without debate...murder


Opinions vary.


(Something tells me that was the entire point of my above post).

< Message edited by LookieNoNookie -- 10/25/2012 5:54:16 PM >

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 182
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/25/2012 5:45:00 PM   
absolutchocolat


Posts: 1392
Status: offline 		once again, i think you're painting all religions with broad strokes. there are religions and cultures that worship women. if you're talking about western religions, fine. but you don't make that distinction.

my personal experience with religion is irrelevant. however, having studied different religions throughout history, there are more nuances than most people realize. women weren't these static, irrelevant beings that were ignored, which is what your statements suggest. different bibles and religious texts (since there is more than one, not just the king james version) DO have books written by women. many of the books omitted by the modern king james version of the bible were written by women. also, since the authorship of many books of the KJV is questionable, it's possible that some of them actually were written by women.

it's more complex than "men dominate religion" or "women don't have a say", but if that is the worldview you've chosen for yourself, have at it. i happen to think it's simplistic and somewhat false.



< Message edited by absolutchocolat -- 10/25/2012 5:50:36 PM >

(in reply to fucktoyprincess)
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RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/25/2012 5:54:36 PM   
GotSteel


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quote:

ORIGINAL: BoundSlave4Life
That being said (Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong) If "God" already knows what we are going to do before we do it doesn't that negate that little value of "Free Will" and all that I've heard mentioned quite a few times as being in these religious books which people worship so blindly?


If you expect this stuff to make sense you'll be perpetually disappointed.

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Profile   Post #: 184
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/25/2012 6:33:15 PM   
thompsonx


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quote:

ORIGINAL: fucktoyprincess


quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

quote:

And of course, there are some sins that are without debate...murder


Opinions vary.


I think "murder" is without debate. It is "killing" that is open to debate. They are not the same thing. The term "murder" implies a wrongful killing. But not all "killing" equals "murder".


I fail to see a a distinction. When is killing another human being not murder?

< Message edited by thompsonx -- 10/25/2012 6:44:55 PM >

(in reply to fucktoyprincess)
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RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/25/2012 6:47:02 PM   
thompsonx


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LookieNoNookie

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

quote:

And of course, there are some sins that are without debate...murder


Opinions vary.


(Something tells me that was the entire point of my above post).


Then you have clearly misunderstood my post.

(in reply to LookieNoNookie)
Profile   Post #: 186
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/25/2012 6:59:21 PM   
Kirata


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quote:

ORIGINAL: fucktoyprincess

I am of Hindu ancestry. This is all fine philosophically, but if you actually look at Hindu scripture and the role of women in it, it has nothing to do with all this wonderful stuff you've quoted above. The fact that Catholics worship the Virgin Mary does not make the religion as a whole any more open minded about women's issues. It is you who do not understand Hinduism if you are going to quote the above to ME who was raised a Hindu. Give me a break buddy.

Being raised in a Hindu family doesn't make you the expert on Hinduism that you imagine yourself to be.

And just for the record, I am not your effing "buddy".

K.

(in reply to fucktoyprincess)
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RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/25/2012 7:00:18 PM   
tazzygirl


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quote:

I fail to see a a distinction. When is killing another human being not murder?


Murder is a legal definition, not a moral one.

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Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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Profile   Post #: 188
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/25/2012 7:15:24 PM   
thompsonx


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

I fail to see a a distinction. When is killing another human being not murder?


Murder is a legal definition, not a moral one.


Murder is when you snuff out another human life...no matter what color lipstick you put on that pig it is still a pig.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 189
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/25/2012 7:28:50 PM   
tazzygirl


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quote:

Murder is the unlawful killing, with malice aforethought, of another human, and generally this state of mind distinguishes murder from other forms of unlawful homicide (such as manslaughter).


Murder is killing.... killing isnt always murder.

Killing someone in self defense is killing... its not murder.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 190
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/25/2012 8:04:06 PM   
DesideriScuri


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl
quote:

That is not up to you to decide. The pregnancy and the rape, while linked, are still separate. A resulting pregnancy can still be considered a gift, regardless of how horrible a rape is.

How can something linked that closely be separate?

You can have one without the other. Getting raped isn't required to get pregnant, and not all rapes result in a pregnancy.

You just dont get it do you. Have you seen an actual video of Mourdocks remarks, he is clearly linking both events ?
To suggest otherwise, is plain stupid.


I know what Mourdock said. I know the context he was using. I know what his prepositional impersonal jackwagon pronouns referred to. I didn't have to refer to Strunk and White to figure it out, either. You are the one not getting it. First, I don't agree with Mourdock. It's fine with me if he feels that way. I disagree with him. And, it's not his call anyway. He can not determine for anyone if something is a blessing or not.

Can you tell me if a blade of grass on my property is good or bad? Obviously, not. That depends on where it is and where I want it to be. If it's in a garden or flower bed, hell no, it's not good. That's bad. If it's in the middle of my lawn, it's good. It's my yard. I get to decide.

You're getting all tied up in knots for whatever reason. I have no idea why the fuck it matters to you. If a woman gets raped, gets pregnant as a consequence of that rape, should she be forced to abort since a rape pregnancy is, according to what you are arguing, a heinous thing? Should she be forced to abort, even if it's against her will? Are you going to take the stand that there is no possible way that Life could be a blessing if it was a consequence of being raped? Is that what you are stating?

So long as all rules of abortion are followed, I have no problem with a woman aborting a rape fetus.

_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to Politesub53)
Profile   Post #: 191
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/25/2012 8:15:38 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
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quote:

You can have one without the other. Getting raped isn't required to get pregnant, and not all rapes result in a pregnancy.


5% of reported rapes result in pregnancy. Thats only of those reported.

Thats also those that progress to the point of actually resulting in implantation and growing. Over half of all pregnancies end in miscarriage and often women never know.

You are trying to separate the two acts, when one is required for the other to occur.

Since we are speaking about only those pregnancies resulting from rape, and you cannot have a pregnancy from a rape without a rape... the two are very closely related.

quote:

Regardless of how many women believe the way you do (and, for the record, I can't imagine being able to see a gift from God in a rape pregnancy if it occurred to any of the women in my life), it doesn't matter. Neither you, nor I, get to decide for a woman who got pregnant from being raped. There could be zero women who think a pregnancy that resulted from a rape was a gift from God. It is still up the woman who got raped to determine how she feels about it.


Back it up. No where did I say I would make that decision for anyone but myself.

quote:

And, while I would admire any woman who would view a pregnancy that resulted from rape as a gift, I could not. I think you would find, if you asked about, that I am not in the minority on that belief.


Please make sure your arguments fit the person you are replying too.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 192
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/25/2012 8:29:00 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl
quote:

You can have one without the other. Getting raped isn't required to get pregnant, and not all rapes result in a pregnancy.

5% of reported rapes result in pregnancy. Thats only of those reported.
Thats also those that progress to the point of actually resulting in implantation and growing. Over half of all pregnancies end in miscarriage and often women never know.
You are trying to separate the two acts, when one is required for the other to occur.
Since we are speaking about only those pregnancies resulting from rape, and you cannot have a pregnancy from a rape without a rape... the two are very closely related.


95% of reported rapes do not, according to your stats, result in viable pregnancies. Ergo, you can have rape without pregnancy. And, I think you'd agree with me, that you can have pregnancies without rape. Obviously, you can't have rape pregnancies without rape, but that wasn't the point at all. Mourdock stated that a pregnancy is a gift from God, even when it occurs from something as heinous as a rape. That was Mourdock's belief. It is not yours. It is not mine.

quote:

quote:

Regardless of how many women believe the way you do (and, for the record, I can't imagine being able to see a gift from God in a rape pregnancy if it occurred to any of the women in my life), it doesn't matter. Neither you, nor I, get to decide for a woman who got pregnant from being raped. There could be zero women who think a pregnancy that resulted from a rape was a gift from God. It is still up the woman who got raped to determine how she feels about it.

Back it up. No where did I say I would make that decision for anyone but myself.


I never said you did.

quote:

quote:

And, while I would admire any woman who would view a pregnancy that resulted from rape as a gift, I could not. I think you would find, if you asked about, that I am not in the minority on that belief.

Please make sure your arguments fit the person you are replying too.


You stated that you believed you were not in the minority in your belief about a rape pregnancy not being a gift. I stated that it didn't matter how many women believe the same way you do. The only one that it matters to is the one who is pregnant from a rape. SHE gets to decide. She might not ask you or anyone else what they think. She gets to decide. No one else. That's all I'm saying. And, you even agree with me.

_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 193
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/25/2012 8:39:48 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
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quote:

95% of reported rapes do not, according to your stats, result in viable pregnancies.


Nope, that is not what my stats say. 5% end up in reported pregnancy. Thats a huge difference. How many are pregnant from date rape? How many are too embarrassed to report it? How many take the morning after pill received as part of a rape kit?

You see a narrow number and decide it supports your argument... when most women know the numbers are far higher.

quote:

Obviously, you can't have rape pregnancies without rape, but that wasn't the point at all.


That is the point of this discussion.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 194
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/25/2012 9:11:58 PM   
Kirata


Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Murder is a legal definition, not a moral one.


Murder is when you snuff out another human life...no matter what color lipstick you put on that pig it is still a pig.

You're both wrong, it's a flock of crows.

K.

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 195
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/25/2012 9:14:07 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		As the crow flies!

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 196
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/25/2012 9:15:17 PM   
Kirata


Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: GotSteel
quote:

ORIGINAL: BoundSlave4Life
If "God" already knows what we are going to do before we do it doesn't that negate that little value of "Free Will" ...?

If you expect this stuff to make sense you'll be perpetually disappointed.

Why don't you explain to us how omniscience negates free will.

K.

(in reply to GotSteel)
Profile   Post #: 197
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/25/2012 9:24:46 PM   
OpenMindOpenHand


Posts: 12
Joined: 10/16/2012
Status: offline 		He didn't say that God intended for rape to happen. He said that God intended for life to happen, and that the intention is not negated by the sins of a rapist. There is a vast difference between the two ideas.

One says that people should be allowed to commit gross violent acts that take a beautiful thing meant to engender love and turn it into a horror festival.

The other says that people, even those who commit gross violent acts or who are the victims of gross violent acts, that take a beautiful thing meant to engender love and turn it into a horror festival, should not then be allowed to dehumanize and victimize, and murder, their own progeny; but, they should accept that life is precious and each new creation of it is a miracle, even if not begun in love, and that the end can still be love.

(in reply to Politesub53)
Profile   Post #: 198
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/25/2012 9:26:45 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: fucktoyprincess

I am of Hindu ancestry. This is all fine philosophically, but if you actually look at Hindu scripture and the role of women in it, it has nothing to do with all this wonderful stuff you've quoted above. The fact that Catholics worship the Virgin Mary does not make the religion as a whole any more open minded about women's issues. It is you who do not understand Hinduism if you are going to quote the above to ME who was raised a Hindu. Give me a break buddy.

Being raised in a Hindu family doesn't make you the expert on Hinduism that you imagine yourself to be.

And just for the record, I am not your effing "buddy".

K.



Whatever you`re doing FTP....keep do`n it.......

< Message edited by Owner59 -- 10/25/2012 9:27:15 PM >

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President Obama

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Profile   Post #: 199
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/25/2012 9:27:57 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
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quote:

The other says that people, even those who commit gross violent acts or who are the victims of gross violent acts, that take a beautiful thing meant to engender love and turn it into a horror festival, should not then be allowed to dehumanize and victimize, and murder, their own progeny; but, they should accept that life is precious and each new creation of it is a miracle, even if not begun in love, and that the end can still be love.


And it is only the victim of this crime that is told to suck it up and live with the consequences.

It really pisses me off when others insist their morality can determine how I live MY life irregardless of the laws.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to OpenMindOpenHand)
Profile   Post #: 200
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