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RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/26/2012 3:34:10 AM   
LookieNoNookie


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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


quote:

ORIGINAL: LookieNoNookie

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

quote:

And of course, there are some sins that are without debate...murder


Opinions vary.


(Something tells me that was the entire point of my above post).


Then you have clearly misunderstood my post.


I'm patently confident I'm not the first.

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 201
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/26/2012 5:10:43 AM   
Politesub53


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

Being raised in a Hindu family doesn't make you the expert on Hinduism that you imagine yourself to be.

And just for the record, I am not your effing "buddy".

K.[/font][/size]


Your irony is stunning but sadly unsurprising. No doubt you will show FTP all she needs to know.

(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 202
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/26/2012 5:13:50 AM   
Politesub53


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

I know what Mourdock said. I know the context he was using. I know what his prepositional impersonal jackwagon pronouns referred to. I didn't have to refer to Strunk and White to figure it out, either. You are the one not getting it. First, I don't agree with Mourdock. It's fine with me if he feels that way. I disagree with him. And, it's not his call anyway. He can not determine for anyone if something is a blessing or not.

Can you tell me if a blade of grass on my property is good or bad? Obviously, not. That depends on where it is and where I want it to be. If it's in a garden or flower bed, hell no, it's not good. That's bad. If it's in the middle of my lawn, it's good. It's my yard. I get to decide.

You're getting all tied up in knots for whatever reason. I have no idea why the fuck it matters to you. If a woman gets raped, gets pregnant as a consequence of that rape, should she be forced to abort since a rape pregnancy is, according to what you are arguing, a heinous thing? Should she be forced to abort, even if it's against her will? Are you going to take the stand that there is no possible way that Life could be a blessing if it was a consequence of being raped? Is that what you are stating?

So long as all rules of abortion are followed, I have no problem with a woman aborting a rape fetus.


Well brains, you have been arguing about what he said all the way through the thread.

I am glad you finally get what he said and not what you parsed it to be.

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 203
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/26/2012 5:15:52 AM   
Politesub53


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quote:

ORIGINAL: OpenMindOpenHand

He didn't say that God intended for rape to happen. He said that God intended for life to happen, and that the intention is not negated by the sins of a rapist. There is a vast difference between the two ideas.

One says that people should be allowed to commit gross violent acts that take a beautiful thing meant to engender love and turn it into a horror festival.

The other says that people, even those who commit gross violent acts or who are the victims of gross violent acts, that take a beautiful thing meant to engender love and turn it into a horror festival, should not then be allowed to dehumanize and victimize, and murder, their own progeny; but, they should accept that life is precious and each new creation of it is a miracle, even if not begun in love, and that the end can still be love.


You need to read his actual words, or better yet watch the video. Mourdocks comments are clear enough.

(in reply to OpenMindOpenHand)
Profile   Post #: 204
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/26/2012 5:26:08 AM   
DesideriScuri


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53
Well brains, you have been arguing about what he said all the way through the thread.
I am glad you finally get what he said and not what you parsed it to be.


Yes, I have been arguing about what he said this entire time. I'm glad you finally get what I've been saying this whole time.

_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to Politesub53)
Profile   Post #: 205
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/26/2012 5:30:22 AM   
Politesub53


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53
Well brains, you have been arguing about what he said all the way through the thread.
I am glad you finally get what he said and not what you parsed it to be.


Yes, I have been arguing about what he said this entire time. I'm glad you finally get what I've been saying this whole time.


Yet you keep insisting he didnt mean what he actually said

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 206
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/26/2012 5:37:41 AM   
DesideriScuri


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl
quote:

95% of reported rapes do not, according to your stats, result in viable pregnancies.

Nope, that is not what my stats say. 5% end up in reported pregnancy. Thats a huge difference. How many are pregnant from date rape? How many are too embarrassed to report it? How many take the morning after pill received as part of a rape kit?
You see a narrow number and decide it supports your argument... when most women know the numbers are far higher.


How do you go from:
quote:

5% of reported rapes result in pregnancy.

to
quote:

5% end up in reported pregnancy.
?

quote:

quote:

Obviously, you can't have rape pregnancies without rape, but that wasn't the point at all.

That is the point of this discussion.


This whole thread has been about Mourdock saying that God intended a rape to happen. If you don't agree with my assessment of the topic, read the fucking Subject Line again.

My first response to this thread was Post#3:
    quote:

    You do understand that the Bible states that God already knows what we are going to do before we do it, right? If you believe in predestination, then getting pregnant from rape can be seen as intentional. It could be seen as a "test" of one's faith for that same reason.

    Don't take that as a defense of Mourdock, just presenting a possible rationale for his belief. I have my personal beliefs about abortion, and I take the stand that Government should keep out of the decision-making.


Since then, I've pretty much been defending incorrect accusations leveled against me. I simply don't understand that. I gave a perfectly rational explanation for Mourdock's belief, and then stated that I wasn't defending him, and that my abortion beliefs didn't agree with his.

_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 207
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/26/2012 5:39:08 AM   
DomYngBlk


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl
quote:

That is not up to you to decide. The pregnancy and the rape, while linked, are still separate. A resulting pregnancy can still be considered a gift, regardless of how horrible a rape is.

How can something linked that closely be separate?

You can have one without the other. Getting raped isn't required to get pregnant, and not all rapes result in a pregnancy.

You just dont get it do you. Have you seen an actual video of Mourdocks remarks, he is clearly linking both events ?
To suggest otherwise, is plain stupid.


I know what Mourdock said. I know the context he was using. I know what his prepositional impersonal jackwagon pronouns referred to. I didn't have to refer to Strunk and White to figure it out, either. You are the one not getting it. First, I don't agree with Mourdock. It's fine with me if he feels that way. I disagree with him. And, it's not his call anyway. He can not determine for anyone if something is a blessing or not.

Can you tell me if a blade of grass on my property is good or bad? Obviously, not. That depends on where it is and where I want it to be. If it's in a garden or flower bed, hell no, it's not good. That's bad. If it's in the middle of my lawn, it's good. It's my yard. I get to decide.

You're getting all tied up in knots for whatever reason. I have no idea why the fuck it matters to you. If a woman gets raped, gets pregnant as a consequence of that rape, should she be forced to abort since a rape pregnancy is, according to what you are arguing, a heinous thing? Should she be forced to abort, even if it's against her will? Are you going to take the stand that there is no possible way that Life could be a blessing if it was a consequence of being raped? Is that what you are stating?

So long as all rules of abortion are followed, I have no problem with a woman aborting a rape fetus.


So you are saying that Hitler having killed millions was just acting on what he believed. Consequently, though you might disagree with his views you'd not have raised a hand to stop him?

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 208
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/26/2012 5:40:39 AM   
DesideriScuri


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53
Well brains, you have been arguing about what he said all the way through the thread.
I am glad you finally get what he said and not what you parsed it to be.

Yes, I have been arguing about what he said this entire time. I'm glad you finally get what I've been saying this whole time.

Yet you keep insisting he didnt mean what he actually said


He was being accused of stating that God intended the rape to happen. That is not the case. He stated that the result of the rape being a pregnancy, was the intention of God. The pregnancy is the gift, not the rape.

Are you going to get around addressing any of the questions I asked?

_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to Politesub53)
Profile   Post #: 209
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/26/2012 5:46:16 AM   
DesideriScuri


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk
So you are saying that Hitler having killed millions was just acting on what he believed. Consequently, though you might disagree with his views you'd not have raised a hand to stop him?


Um, huh? I have no vote in Indiana. Kinda tough to stop him.

I have said, from my very first post on this thread, that I didn't agree with him.

What have you done to stop him?

_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to DomYngBlk)
Profile   Post #: 210
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/26/2012 5:46:34 AM   
Hillwilliam


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

He was being accused of stating that God intended the rape to happen. That is not the case. He stated that the result of the rape being a pregnancy, was the intention of God. The pregnancy is the gift, not the rape.

Are you going to get around addressing any of the questions I asked?

Seeing as you couldn't have had that pregnancy without the rape, isn't it a package deal?

If God ordained one, he HAD to also ordain the other. It's His will.

_____________________________

Kinkier than a cheap garden hose.

Whoever said "Religion is the opiate of the masses" never heard Right Wing talk radio.

Don't blame me, I voted for Gary Johnson.

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 211
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/26/2012 6:03:19 AM   
GotSteel


Posts: 5871
Joined: 2/19/2008
Status: offline 		It's not like Yahweh got Mary's consent before knocking her up.


(in reply to Politesub53)
Profile   Post #: 212
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/26/2012 6:05:36 AM   
subspaceseven


Posts: 467
Joined: 3/2/2012
Status: offline 		That is what I was thinking, perhaps that is why conservatives are ok with rape babies as a "gift from god" cause their savior was a rape baby

(in reply to GotSteel)
Profile   Post #: 213
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/26/2012 6:07:10 AM   
subspaceseven


Posts: 467
Joined: 3/2/2012
Status: offline 		Hmmm this things keeps posting, maybe its god getting his point across

< Message edited by subspaceseven -- 10/26/2012 6:08:32 AM >

(in reply to GotSteel)
Profile   Post #: 214
demos vote november 10th! - 10/26/2012 6:09:58 AM   
ElChupa


Posts: 117
Joined: 11/14/2009
Status: offline 		you would think you compassionate, loving leftists would reach out and be real human beings toward conservatives. Where is all this love and compassion I keep hearing about from the left? Remember, all demos! Voting starts November 10th! Pick up your obamaphone at the same time! Obama will pay for your cigarettes, booze, and make car payments at the same time. NOVEMBER 10TH!

(in reply to subspaceseven)
Profile   Post #: 215
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/26/2012 6:16:53 AM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

Murder is the unlawful killing, with malice aforethought, of another human, and generally this state of mind distinguishes murder from other forms of unlawful homicide (such as manslaughter).


Murder is killing.... killing isnt always murder.

Killing someone in self defense is killing... its not murder.


If one has the ability to end a life in "self defense" then it follows that one has the ability to disable their asailant...thus the laws concerning appropriate levels of force. Pink lipstick on a pig is still pink lipstick on a pig.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 216
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/26/2012 6:19:27 AM   
DomYngBlk


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Joined: 3/27/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk
So you are saying that Hitler having killed millions was just acting on what he believed. Consequently, though you might disagree with his views you'd not have raised a hand to stop him?


Um, huh? I have no vote in Indiana. Kinda tough to stop him.

I have said, from my very first post on this thread, that I didn't agree with him.

What have you done to stop him?


You disagree but at the same time think it is ok? Having it both ways is romnesian of you but it doesn't work

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 217
RE: demos vote november 10th! - 10/26/2012 6:23:26 AM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: ElChupa

you would think you compassionate, loving leftists would reach out and be real human beings toward conservatives. Where is all this love and compassion I keep hearing about from the left? Remember, all demos! Voting starts November 10th! Pick up your obamaphone at the same time! Obama will pay for your cigarettes, booze, and make car payments at the same time. NOVEMBER 10TH!



It is pretty clear from your posts that you have never heard anything from a leftist. Your post contain only the moronic rantings of ruxh and beck.
Perhaps if you were to avail yourself of the writings of someone who is a valid source for the left you mght eschew from your post their mind numbing ignorance.

(in reply to ElChupa)
Profile   Post #: 218
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/26/2012 6:29:30 AM   
DesideriScuri


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
He was being accused of stating that God intended the rape to happen. That is not the case. He stated that the result of the rape being a pregnancy, was the intention of God. The pregnancy is the gift, not the rape.
Are you going to get around addressing any of the questions I asked?

Seeing as you couldn't have had that pregnancy without the rape, isn't it a package deal?
If God ordained one, he HAD to also ordain the other. It's His will.


Um, no. You don't have to be raped to get pregnant.

Good God. More of this BS.

Mourdock didn't say that God intended for a rape pregnancy. He was saying that God intended for a Life to be conceived. He was saying that something good could have come out of the horrible act of rape.

That would be, in a very, very loose simile, akin to making lemonade out of lemons.

In all this, though, it is up to the victim of the rape, the pregnant woman, to determine if the pregnancy is a blessing or a curse. She may decide it is a blessing, regardless of what anyone here believes. She may be the only woman in the world to consider it a blessing. And, none of those things matter, if she views it as a blessing. If she views it as a curse, she should have the opportunity to rid herself of the curse.

_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to Hillwilliam)
Profile   Post #: 219
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/26/2012 6:31:22 AM   
fucktoyprincess


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Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: fucktoyprincess

I am of Hindu ancestry. This is all fine philosophically, but if you actually look at Hindu scripture and the role of women in it, it has nothing to do with all this wonderful stuff you've quoted above. The fact that Catholics worship the Virgin Mary does not make the religion as a whole any more open minded about women's issues. It is you who do not understand Hinduism if you are going to quote the above to ME who was raised a Hindu. Give me a break buddy.

Being raised in a Hindu family doesn't make you the expert on Hinduism that you imagine yourself to be.

And just for the record, I am not your effing "buddy".

K.


If you would like to believe that all the mainstream religions have historically been structured in a way to be favorable to women then you are entitled to your opinion, but having been raised in a Hindu family, I can tell you, you are wrong. I am quite sure I have spent more time speaking to actual Hindu priests in countries like India than you have.

And there are others on this thread who also seem to be under the same delusion as you. The mere worshipping of female gods and idols does NOT make a religion any more favorable towards women. If Catholics worship the Virgin Mary, and Hindus worship various female deities then why is scripture entirely written and interpreted by men (only men can be priests in both the Catholic and Hindu religions). Why are there many practices in both of those religions that actually work against the freedoms of women?

Have fun with your arcane philosophy and debate it all you want. I am talking about the REALITY of what happens in these religions and how religion is used to put half of the population in a secondary status. Why even respond to this thread which is about politics and the real world if what you are interested in is some esoteric debate.

Are you REALLY going to sit there and tell me that these religions treat men and women EXACTLY the same? Because THAT is what I am addressing.

Again, Mourdock is accurate in his description of his faith. This is what the religion says. The Bible is not written in a way that denounces rape and the Bible actually treats women as responsible should rape happen (a woman who is raped can be punishable by death). Many other mainstream religions also have this in their scripture. If you think this is justice, fine. I beg to differ.

And explain to me again how worshipping female deities or idols protects actual women from secondary status, mistreatment, abuse, and exploitation under the guise of religion??

_____________________________

~ ftp

(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 220
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