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RE: Magical thinking - 10/25/2012 7:01:45 AM

TheHeretic

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

Thanks for admitting that Obama is going to win.....Care to change your prediction on Firms thread now?

I'm looking at possibilities, DYB, but the bet can ride right where it is.

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RE: Magical thinking - 10/25/2012 7:02:45 AM

mnottertail

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quote:

The same electorate that puts him there will also be sending a Republican controlled house to carry the purse, and their mandate will be just as strong as his, if not much stronger.

I don't see how they have a stronger mandate, or a mandate at all, since they have it pretty fucked up, and consider their mandate other than serious numerate reform.

Borrow and spend and lower taxes and shove money into military is not the mandate.

For them to have any sort of strong mandate, the Senate would be republican as well.

So, I think there is magical thinking in that.

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RE: Magical thinking - 10/25/2012 7:34:39 AM

SilverMark

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The Republicans will not win the Senate, so there will have to be some give and take aside from the Tea Party yahoos in the house. The only real impact of that is a failure for the Republicans to lead their own party, ready for another 8 years of a Democratic Whitehouse?....

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RE: Magical thinking - 10/25/2012 8:11:45 AM

Fellow

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quote:

Do you believe a second-term Obama will come up with any answer at all to the problem?

Predicting the future, I think, C. Eastwood's comment is about right: the second Obama term will be pretty much the same as the first. Romney would perhaps try some kind of austerity measures, but they are doomed because the places where cuts are necessary will not be cut (military operations, national security scam and such). Immigration reform (amnesty) can not be passed through the Congress; there is too much opposition. Such large scale reform is difficult to do with executive orders. Pandering to Spanish-speaking voter is not a bad idea though.

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RE: Magical thinking - 10/25/2012 8:23:04 AM

Fightdirecto

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic
Partisan gridlock is only going to get worse in those circumstances. Do you believe a second-term Obama will come up with any answer at all to the problem?

As long as there is one Republican/Tea Party Senator in the Senate, he or she will do everything they can to obstruct any and all of President Obama's policies and initiatives. They are willing to destroy the United States rather than do anything that would brand them as "bipartisan" - because their supporters perceive "bipartisan" to be the same as "treasonous".

As long as there is one Republican/Tea Party Representative in the House of Representatives, he or she will do everything they can to obstruct any and all of President Obama's policies and initiatives. They are willing to destroy the United States rather than do anything that would brand them as "bipartisan" - because their supporters perceive "bipartisan" to be the same as "treasonous".

Still, I would prefer a situation like that to four years of President Romney.

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RE: Magical thinking - 10/25/2012 8:23:14 AM

RacerJim

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Wont much of that have to depend on the elections to Congress?

Why should the make-up of Congress matter if Obama gets re-elected? Can't Obama work with Congress if it's a Republican majority like Gov. Romney worked with a Democratic majority Congress in MA? Or are you saying Obama is too much of an ideologistic narcissist to do that?

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RE: Magical thinking - 10/25/2012 8:24:46 AM

mnottertail

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NO, she is saying that the teabaggers are obstructionist, and won't work with Obama, he will have to really get the executive order pipeline flowing.

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RE: Magical thinking - 10/25/2012 8:27:33 AM

Hillwilliam

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quote:

ORIGINAL: RacerJim

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Wont much of that have to depend on the elections to Congress?

Why should the make-up of Congress matter if Obama gets re-elected? Can't Obama work with Congress if it's a Republican majority like Gov. Romney worked with a Democratic majority Congress in MA? Or are you saying Obama is too much of an ideologistic narcissist to do that?

For a president to work with a Congress of the opposite party, both have to be willing. An excellent example is Clinton's second term when he had a Republican controlled congress. They both made allowances and compromised and the result was prosperity for the entire country.
The TEAbaggers, on the other hand, have been noting but obstructionist.
They DID rename 60 post offices though.

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RE: Magical thinking - 10/25/2012 8:59:43 AM

RacerJim

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

If I`m not mistaken....Mitt claims he`ll be able to work better with congress.......

Perhaps.....in dismantling the social safety net or the wall of separation between church and state....

Folks don`t want the con-nutters and their mad social experimentations.

They just want competent government that does was it`s supposed to and stay out of our private lives.

This is why congress` numbers are single digit and the President are at over 50%

http://www.gallup.com/poll/113980/gallup-daily-obama-job-approval.aspx

And if I'm not mistaken....Mitt Romney's record as Governor of MA backs up his claim of being able to work better than Obama with Congress....

By forcing his pro-abortion and free contraception ideology on churchs Obama has already dismantled the wall of separation between church and state....

"We the poeple..." don't indeed want the lib-progressives and their mad GLBT social experimentations.

"We the poeple..." do indeed just want competent government that does what it's supposed to and not do what it's not supposed to...which leaves out Obama's government which has refused to enforce some laws and violated some other laws.

Last I knew Democrats controlled one-half of Congress, therefore they are part-n-parcel of Congress' single-digit number. Moreover, because the Democrat controlled Senate has not even discussed a Federal Budget for THREE YEARS I'd say they are more responsible for Congress' single-digit number than the Republican controlled House which has passed a Federal Budget proposal every year and sent it to the Democrat controlled Senate. That is why

Obama's approval number is less than 50%. Moreover, if the election were held today he would lose to Romney.
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/

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RE: Magical thinking - 10/25/2012 9:07:57 AM

DesideriScuri

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Fellow
Pandering to Spanish-speaking voter is not a bad idea though.

That all depends on how you define a "bad idea." I think pandering to any single group is wrong. I abhor it when it's announced that "Candidate X, from the Y Party is going after the Z Vote."

The Presidency is a National position. It's a position over all the genders, ethnicities, races, etc. Pushing or touting any reforms that give one group "special status" over another is wrong. In the eyes of the Government DYB and I should be seen as American Citizens only. We should not be seen as a white guy and a black guy, a Caucasian and an African-American (I only use him because his profile pic shows a black guy, so I assume he's black; I don't have any clue regarding you). We should be treated as equals. If I donate to the winning candidate's coffers, I should get the same treatment as someone who donated to the losing candidate(s)'s coffer(s).

**Disclaimer: This is a generality and might not necessarily accurately various situations that differ from the "norm."

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RE: Magical thinking - 10/25/2012 9:08:17 AM

mnottertail

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quote:

And if I'm not mistaken....Mitt Romney's record as Governor of MA backs up his claim of being able to work better than Obama with Congress....

You're mistaken. State politics are as much like Federal politics as apples to oranges.

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RE: Magical thinking - 10/25/2012 9:17:59 AM

thompsonx

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

So I'm reading a little coverage of the President's campaign efforts in Iowa, and I came across the most remarkable quote.

He was talking about the immigration reform he was supposed to get taken care of his first year in office,

Were you not aware that the existing law is a simple and effective way to stop illegal immigration? I have mentioned it to you on more than one occasion.
The federal law provides for a five year prison term and $250,000 fine ,for each illegal employed,for anyone who employes someone who has crossed the border illegally.
Why is any new legislation required?

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RE: Magical thinking - 10/25/2012 9:25:55 AM

DesideriScuri

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quote:

ORIGINAL: RacerJim
"We the poeple..." don't indeed want the lib-progressives and their mad GLBT social experimentations.

At one point, "We the people" didn't want negroes to have the same rights and authorities as us white folk. We have the rule of law, which supercedes the whims of the simple majority, or plurality (as opposed to super majorities, absolute majorities, etc.).

quote:

"We the poeple..." do indeed just want competent government that does what it's supposed to and not do what it's not supposed to...which leaves out Obama's government which has refused to enforce some laws and violated some other laws.

Everyone agrees on this point. Every single person here would agree. The disagreement creeps in when you start defining what government is or is not supposed to do.

Your point of Obama's not enforcing laws is accurate and something should be done about it. It may very well turn out that the laws he's decided to not enforce aren't Constitutional, but that needs to be worked out prior to non-enforcement, IMO.

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Personal Responsibility
Help for the truly needy
Limited Government
Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

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RE: Magical thinking - 10/25/2012 9:29:21 AM

thompsonx

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quote:

ORIGINAL: RacerJim

By forcing his pro-abortion and free contraception ideology on churchs Obama has already dismantled the wall of separation between church and state....

Why do yu feel that "forcing" churches to obey the laws of the u.s. is dismantling the wall of seperation obetweenchurch and state?

quote:

"We the poeple..." don't indeed want the lib-progressives and their mad GLBT social experimentations.

We the people include "the lib-progresssives and their mad glbt citizens of the u.s..

quote:

"We the poeple..." do indeed just want competent government that does what it's supposed to and not do what it's not supposed to...which leaves out Obama's government which has refused to enforce some laws and violated some other laws.

Such as?

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RE: Magical thinking - 10/25/2012 9:35:36 AM

Hillwilliam

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quote:

ORIGINAL: RacerJim

By forcing his pro-abortion and free contraception ideology on churchs Obama has already dismantled the wall of separation between church and state....

Actually, you have it completely backwards.

By treating a church like anyone else, not giving them special priveleges and telling them that they have to follow the law, he is keeping the wall between church and state in place.

Which one of the Kool-Aid delivery services on the radio gave you that stupid idea?

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RE: Magical thinking - 10/25/2012 9:37:08 AM

Owner59

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If that`s true,it`s also true that Mittens had one the worst jobs creations records ,47th out of all 50 states.....

So his claim of jobs creator is bogus.

And I couldn`t give na quarter-shit about "bi-partinsanship".

Working with cons to destroy our economy and country is NOT what most folks call "bi-partisanship".

.

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RE: Magical thinking - 10/25/2012 9:37:14 AM

mnottertail

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quote:

...which leaves out Obama's government which has refused to enforce some laws and violated some other laws.

I don't agree with this whatsoever.

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RE: Magical thinking - 10/25/2012 9:37:20 AM

thompsonx

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: Fellow
Pandering to Spanish-speaking voter is not a bad idea though.

That all depends on how you define a "bad idea." I think pandering to any single group is wrong. I abhor it when it's announced that "Candidate X, from the Y Party is going after the Z Vote."

You seem to be saying that candidates should tell all minorities to go fuck themselves. If tht is so how then does one build a consensus?

quote:

The Presidency is a National position. It's a position over all the genders, ethnicities, races, etc. Pushing or touting any reforms that give one group "special status" over another is wrong.

Why is it wrong to redress inequalities/

quote:

In the eyes of the Government DYB and I should be seen as American Citizens only. We should not be seen as a white guy and a black guy, a Caucasian and an African-American (I only use him because his profile pic shows a black guy, so I assume he's black; I don't have any clue regarding you). We should be treated as equals.

Any casual observer of u.s. history would be aware that that has not historically been the case. Were you unaware of this?

quote:

If I donate to the winning candidate's coffers, I should get the same treatment as someone who donated to the losing candidate(s)'s coffer(s).

When has this been the true?

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RE: Magical thinking - 10/25/2012 9:41:51 AM

DomKen

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
Your point of Obama's not enforcing laws is accurate and something should be done about it. It may very well turn out that the laws he's decided to not enforce aren't Constitutional, but that needs to be worked out prior to non-enforcement, IMO.

Which laws are you claiming the President is refusing to enforce?

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RE: Magical thinking - 10/25/2012 9:42:52 AM

DomKen

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

quote:

ORIGINAL: RacerJim

By forcing his pro-abortion and free contraception ideology on churchs Obama has already dismantled the wall of separation between church and state....

Actually, you have it completely backwards.

By treating a church like anyone else, not giving them special priveleges and telling them that they have to follow the law, he is keeping the wall between church and state in place.

Which one of the Kool-Aid delivery services on the radio gave you that stupid idea?