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masochism - 6/15/2006 8:59:48 AM

sabswife

Posts: 188
Joined: 5/2/2006
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i hope this comes across correctly because i am geniuinely interested, but yet completely useless when it comes to using the search feature. maybe some of you who have a talent for that would be willing to help me out with a search link? or even direct me to the proper forum, i'm not entirely sure if this is the right one...

anyway my question is this...

i personally don't quite get the whole pain thing, like being flogged in order to achieve orgasm (not subspace-- that i get thats different). i guess i just think, why subject yourself to the pain for something that can be achieved without pain, which leads to me the question, is the orgasm more intense? like with mental orgasm.. i feel that from head to toe as opposed to say a localized clitoral orgasm. is that what happens with being flogged or whatever you choose as your outlet, the whole body is involved so the climax involves the whole body?

im just a curious person by nature and i truly hope that nobody is offended by this question, i really would just like some insight.

if some of you would prefer to go to mail i would also be willing to go into more detail on my curiosity. thanks in advance for your replies :)

_____________________________

"If you look inside your heart, You don't have to be afraid--Of what you are. There's an answer, If you reach into your soul--And the sorrow that you know Will melt away."

Post #: 1

RE: masochism - 6/15/2006 9:15:46 AM

LuckyAlbatross

Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: sabswife
i guess i just think, why subject yourself to the pain for something that can be achieved without pain, which leads to me the question, is the orgasm more intense? like with mental orgasm.. i feel that from head to toe as opposed to say a localized clitoral orgasm. is that what happens with being flogged or whatever you choose as your outlet, the whole body is involved so the climax involves the whole body?

For some masochists, yes. For some masochists, it has nothing to do with orgasm at all.

For me masochism = gaining direct pleasure from what is generally considered to be physically painful

The physical experiences that most people consider "painful" is directly converted into a pleasureable experience. How or why I have no idea- I wish I did.

Then you have people like me- I love everything about pain play EXCEPT the pain part. The pain part sucks. I'm not a masochist- I get no DIRECT pleasure from physically painful experiences.

But I love the marks, the attention, the being passive, the endurance, the submission for THEIR pleasure, the fear, the being used....I love all of those INDIRECTLY. So for me, it's the gaining of all of those indirect things that make the pain experience worthwhile for me.

Masochists can have those indirect reactions as well, which further confuses things.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to sabswife)

Post #: 2

RE: masochism - 6/15/2006 9:24:55 AM

SenseofBelonging

Posts: 69
Joined: 10/20/2005
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when i first submitted to Mistress (knowing She was a bit sadistic)...i was in no way a masochist. pain hurt, though i had a high pain threshold, i did not enjoy it. i only enjoyed the pleasure it brought to Mistress. as time goes on, however, i find myself looking forward to Her crop. i think it is a learned thing, the body/mind's response of a sub to his Mistress's attention and i expect that in time, i will become a true masochist, unconsciously desiring the pain that brings pleasure.

(in reply to sabswife)

Post #: 3

RE: masochism - 6/15/2006 9:27:49 AM

SweetSarijane

Posts: 3788
Joined: 10/7/2005
From: KC area Missouri
Status: offline

I don't (haven't yet) orgasmed from pain play, but I thoroughly love being flogged, paddled, whipped, spanked, caned, etc. It's pleasure to me. It feels so good. I love the marks I get from it, the rush I feel, all the sensations that hit me during it. It's hard to put it into words really. It just translates to pleasure rather than pain for me. Some hits cause pain initially, but then quickly become pleasure and I lose myself in the feelings and joy it gives me.

_____________________________

Sarah2
Deviant Mind
Wild Side Readers KCSass

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

Post #: 4

RE: masochism - 6/15/2006 9:50:23 AM

KatyLied

Posts: 13029
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Pennsylvania
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I do not enjoy pain play. But I enjoy submitting to it. Why do I subject myself to something that: 1) I don't enjoy & 2) doesn't give me an orgasm.....mainly because he enjoys it. He enjoys the fact that I submit to it, knowing that it's not enjoyable. It's another way that he can exercise control over me.

_____________________________

“If you want to live a happy life, tie it to a goal, not to people or things.”
- Albert Einstein

(in reply to sabswife)

Post #: 5

RE: masochism - 6/15/2006 9:57:49 AM

Notsweet

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Joined: 6/11/2006
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Katy, those are my thoughts exactly. I don't enjoy pain at all, but I seek out sadists

(in reply to KatyLied)

Post #: 6

RE: masochism - 6/15/2006 10:00:16 AM

KatyLied

Posts: 13029
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Pennsylvania
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Without going all psychological about it, there is probably a part of you that seeks it out. Perhaps the "torture" parts of the relationship are the things you replay and think about the most.

_____________________________

“If you want to live a happy life, tie it to a goal, not to people or things.”
- Albert Einstein

(in reply to Notsweet)

Post #: 7

RE: masochism - 6/15/2006 10:02:15 AM

Tikkiee

Posts: 1099
Joined: 4/6/2006
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I can only answer for myself and why I choose to seek out pain. It''s not to reach subspace, and it's not to reach orgasm. For me, when I feel the pain, I feel more alive. I like the feeling that it brings. The more pain, the more I feel.
Some have even gone so far as to say that I push for more as a sort of competition within myself; they may be correct. I have never tried to analyze the WHY.

_____________________________

~~@ cass @~~

(in reply to sabswife)

Post #: 8

RE: masochism - 6/15/2006 10:20:24 AM

Submotive

Posts: 440
Joined: 9/9/2005
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i enjoy pain to a degree - - - - However, Master may desire to administer more than i find enjoyable - this is just part of my submission to His desires. For me, submission doesn't always involve my comfort, my desires but His. And yet the dichotomy is that pleasing Him is so pleasing to me that even when i'm uncomfortable or downright yelling from the pain, i still receive pleasure just knowing i am pleasing Him.

_____________________________

Owned by Scotch Master

i would rather continue alone than be permitted to show only parts of myself to my Beloved.

If you're not living as you would like to today, when are you going to start?

(in reply to sabswife)

Post #: 9

RE: masochism - 6/15/2006 10:23:37 AM

littleone35

Posts: 2828
Joined: 2/17/2005
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Pain play does nothing for me pain hurts. My Master is a sensual Dom not a sadist. Pain has never done anything for me but make me cry. I do like a spanking though.

Matt's littleone

(in reply to Submotive)

Post #: 10

RE: masochism - 6/15/2006 10:57:46 AM

trippingdaisy

Posts: 113
Joined: 6/3/2006
From: Georgia
Status: offline

i'm simply going to reiterate that it's not just the pleaure that's derived from pain, but also the indirect pleasure from the scene/play. The marks left behind, the pleasure from knowing that He is happy, and just...all of that.

Subspace was also mentioned...but you also say you get that, so i obviously won't go into that. i can say that i have studied myself a little, and wondered about this. The 'why' of why i like pain. Most pain does translate into pleasure for me, yes...but i've also come to realize that i greatly enjoy all the natural chemicals the body produces in reaction to painful stimuli. The farther He goes, the higher i get, and after the scene, i can sit there and giggle my happy ass off. He thinks it's hilarious.

i rarely climax from receiving pain, to answer another question of yours, but i can also say that for me, pain and pleasure combined instigates a whole new level of orgasm for me.

(in reply to sabswife)

Post #: 11

RE: masochism - 6/15/2006 11:24:47 AM

APerfectParadox

Posts: 95
Joined: 11/1/2005
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When I first got involved in pain play I did not enjoy it , my only pleasure came from submitting. Now the line between pain and pleasure easily becomes blurred but for me. That was part of a process, it did not happen overnight. I would be happy to share my experience and what ever insight I can into that in an email on the other side if you want.

< Message edited by APerfectParadox -- 6/15/2006 11:27:55 AM >

_____________________________

“Your task is not to seek for love, but merely to seek and find all the barriers within yourself that you have built against it.”

If there were dreams to sell, what would you buy?

(in reply to SweetSarijane)

Post #: 12

RE: masochism - 6/15/2006 11:28:16 AM

lisa1978

Posts: 224
Joined: 5/19/2006
From: Kansas City
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: KatyLied

I do not enjoy pain play. But I enjoy submitting to it. Why do I subject myself to something that: 1) I don't enjoy & 2) doesn't give me an orgasm.....mainly because he enjoys it. He enjoys the fact that I submit to it, knowing that it's not enjoyable. It's another way that he can exercise control over me.

This describes me as well. Much better than I can do. I do not get physical pleasure but seeing my owner get pleasure and the pure power exchange of getting pain inflicted on me even though my owner knows I will not enjoy it makes me look for an owner who has sadist leanings. About the power exchange for me and that will get me hot and bothered every single time.

_____________________________

It hurts sometimes more than we can bear. If we could live without passion, maybe we'd know some kind of peace. But we would be hollow. Empty rooms, shuttered and dank. Without passion, we'd be truly dead.

(in reply to KatyLied)

Post #: 13

RE: masochism - 6/15/2006 11:29:16 AM

APerfectParadox

Posts: 95
Joined: 11/1/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: trippingdaisy

i rarely climax from receiving pain, to answer another question of yours, but i can also say that for me, pain and pleasure combined instigates a whole new level of orgasm for me.

This is true for me as well

_____________________________

“Your task is not to seek for love, but merely to seek and find all the barriers within yourself that you have built against it.”

If there were dreams to sell, what would you buy?

(in reply to trippingdaisy)

Post #: 14

RE: masochism - 6/15/2006 12:16:31 PM

darkinshadows

Posts: 4145
Joined: 6/2/2004
From: UK
Status: offline

I cannot answer your specific question - as I am not a masochist. But I did want to run past you the question of -

if you are specifically wanting answers from submissive masochists?

I am sadistic. I am submissive. There are an awful lot of masochistic dominants out there - I just wondered if you had considered this.

(Just a thought - just you might miss some really interesting input by posting here in the submissives forum)

Peace and Rapture

_____________________________

.dark.

...i surrender to gravity and the unknown...

(in reply to sabswife)

Post #: 15

RE: masochism - 6/15/2006 12:41:10 PM

Bearlee

Posts: 2311
Joined: 10/25/2004
From: South Central CO
Status: offline

Hmmmmmmmmm…I’m curious. Can we define pain; pain like the ‘pain’ of a spanking; pain like the ‘pain’ of a flogging? Marks? Like a reddened backside? Or…pain that marks the body with bloody welts?

I realize ‘pain’ is a relative thing, so I’m curious…is it the ‘normal’ submissive/bottom who likes the simple spanking and the masochistic submissive/bottom who enjoys marks from canes and single tails; needles and knives?

I am curious about this because, LA…you said it as I’ve been saying it for years; I don’t really like the pain…I like what it brings. But…IS that what IS a masochist?

Edited to add: *I like what it brings* = pleasure to the Dominant, perhaps subspace, wonderful marks, the strong feelings of submissiveness and the giving up of me.

< Message edited by Bearlee -- 6/15/2006 12:45:42 PM >

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

Post #: 16

RE: masochism - 6/15/2006 12:59:57 PM

BitaTruble

Posts: 9779
Joined: 1/12/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline

There's good pain (like flogging) and bad pain (like smashing your thumb with a hammer). I'm one who colors both inside and outside the lines. I enjoy pain just for the sake of the pain and I enjoy submitting to Himself's sadism just because he enjoys me submitting to it. Sometimes both are happening at once and that's just yummy. That's when the body/mind connection really flows for us. Also, there are some folks who can't orgasm without pain. I count myself lucky that I can get there both with or without pain. Highly intense pain tends to put me into orbit rather than orgasm, but medium to heavy pain is a surefire way to get my juices going towards orgasms if that's where Himself wants me to go. Methodology also has a lot to do with things for me. A figging takes me to a different place than being cropped on my breasts and an enema takes me to a different place than a figging and so on and so forth. On any given day, the same weapon will produce a different result depending on what's gone on before, where Himself has put my head space, where 'his' head space is and any number of other factors.

I love buffets.

Celeste

_____________________________

"Oh, so it's just like
Rock, paper, scissors."

He laughed. "You are the wisest woman I know."

(in reply to Bearlee)

Post #: 17

RE: masochism - 6/15/2006 1:01:01 PM

HisTicia

Posts: 203
Joined: 5/31/2006
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I am not so much into pain..but I do get a high from the challenge.. maybe just to see how much I can take..and I push myself on that a bit.. not using safe words ever. So I guess.. maybe I am into pain..hmm... that is something for me to think about.. I suppose there is pleasure in watching Him enjoy it.. but there is pleasure for me in pushing my boundries also.

Not sure if that made sense.. I was thinking while I was writing it..

Wait..that didn't sound good either.. nevermind.

_____________________________

All my soul follows you, love encircles you and I live in being yours. ~Browning

Believe nothing just because someone else believes it. Believe only what you yourself test and judge to be true. ~Buddha

(in reply to Bearlee)

Post #: 18

RE: masochism - 6/15/2006 1:16:00 PM

LuckyAlbatross

Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bearlee
is it the ‘normal’ submissive/bottom who likes the simple spanking and the masochistic submissive/bottom who enjoys marks from canes and single tails; needles and knives?

Nope- and remember that masochist is completely independent from "bottom/top/dom/sub/switch."

quote:

I am curious about this because, LA…you said it as I’ve been saying it for years; I don’t really like the pain…I like what it brings. But…IS that what IS a masochist?

According to my definition (in my first reply), no, you are like me. You get off on everything BUT the pain. That's not a masochist- that's bottoming/submission.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to Bearlee)

Post #: 19

RE: masochism - 6/15/2006 1:17:21 PM

trippingdaisy

Posts: 113
Joined: 6/3/2006
From: Georgia
Status: offline

'Pain' can't really be defined. i mean, it can be...but it's going to be different for everyone. i love being flogged and spanked, but i also like the pain from other less mainstream sources.

i can also assure you that even if i WAS a pain slut, and it did get me off more than anything...i still don't think i'd like stubbing my toe. That sh*t hurts.

On a more serious note, though...a friend of mine in Oregon was one of those really intense masochists. Almost any sort of pain would translate into pleasure for her...even pain that produced scars. She was honestly the first person (and possibly the ONLY person) that i've met face to face that didn't only enjoy the aftermath of a pain session, but craved the sensation of pain. That was her main thing, always has been.

However...she has multiple sclerosis that caused a completely different type of pain. The lesions in her brain caused that horrible 'pins and needles' feeling, very very intensely, throughout the entire left side of her body. The MS, and the pain, came on very quickly, and it was something even she couldn't handle. Different kind of pain, y'see. Level 8, it was, constantly, so she's now on a lot of pain killers (morphine patches, morphine lollypops for severe exascerbations, et cetera).

(in reply to Bearlee)

Post #: 20

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