quote:

ORIGINAL: absolutchocolat

i'm sure folks find my laid-back style of writing awful. in my case, after writing stuffy business e-mails all day and leaving the world of academia behind, it's refreshing to write in a more relaxed manner. i use text speak and abbreviations, sometimes and i don't properly quote outside sources. shoot me.

i'm not annoyed by how other people communicate in this medium if i can get the gist of what they're saying. we're all different and i expect our writing styles to reflect that.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Darkfeather

Again you are missing the point. Capitalizations of pronouns are not, in fact, a form of roleplaying to those who use it. It is simply the way they were taught to do it. If you find the practice silly or annoying, just as real life, you can choose to ignore it. But to actively call someone for doing it silly, or thinking they will "influence" others... This is why people get defensive. You know the old saying, opinions are like ass holes, everyone has one and some even stink. But when you speak your opinions to the public, you are sure to annoy someone. And yes, this forum is exactly like a munch, except without an actual face to put to the words. A munch is a place where people can get together in a kink friendly enviornment and discuss anything. Would you say in a much, loud enough for all to hear, you think capitalization of pronouns to be silly? Not unless you want to insult. So why would written discussions be any different? Can anyone shout their opinions to the rafters, sure and many do it. But you also have to expect that some are going to take what you say personally, especially when it contradicts what they themselves believe in.

quote:

ORIGINAL: AAkasha

If you take me out of the equation though, and any of us (because as regular readers of collarchat, we all know what is going on), and instead focus on casual readers, or first time readers, or "outsiders", think about their perception. Think about the people that we may want to attract to stay in this group, to grow this group. Sure, you may say "well screw them if they have a stick up their ass and are judgmental over something as silly as protocol."

Just as you may say the same of a quiet couple who attends a public munch for the first time as an observer and does not say much but chooses not to attend again because they thought it was going to be free of ritual and roleplay but found some of the people talking "in role" to be a bit....odd. Like they couldn't quite feel comfortable enough to have a normal conversation. So it's their problem, right? Sure, it is. They can choose to walk out the door and never come back. No skin off our back.

At some point though you are just skewing the lines between saying, "This is a place for non roleplay, no bdsm, no protocol (oh, except for them, they just do it because they learned that way, they don't MEAN anything by it)" and outright roleplaying, because of *how it is perceived by others*.

Some people may come into a forum like this and the minute they see regular posters doing the Y/i thing in normal posts go "oh it's just a bunch of online roleplayers". Oh well, their loss, don't let the door hit them on the way out!

Akasha

quote:

ORIGINAL: Darkfeather

Again you are missing the point. Capitalizations of pronouns are not, in fact, a form of roleplaying to those who use it. It is simply the way they were taught to do it. If you find the practice silly or annoying, just as real life, you can choose to ignore it. But to actively call someone for doing it silly, or thinking they will "influence" others... This is why people get defensive. You know the old saying, opinions are like ass holes, everyone has one and some even stink. But when you speak your opinions to the public, you are sure to annoy someone. And yes, this forum is exactly like a munch, except without an actual face to put to the words. A munch is a place where people can get together in a kink friendly enviornment and discuss anything. Would you say in a much, loud enough for all to hear, you think capitalization of pronouns to be silly? Not unless you want to insult. So why would written discussions be any different? Can anyone shout their opinions to the rafters, sure and many do it. But you also have to expect that some are going to take what you say personally, especially when it contradicts what they themselves believe in.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Darkfeather


This may well be true, because you cannot know how another perceives a given situation unless they tell you. But it is way more appropriate to say, you can act however you feel here because we as kinky individuals don't want to suppress your free expression of your "personal" kink. Sure, there are those who go to a munch and say, this is too strange for me, just as there will be those who read certain posts and say, wow kink is way too extreme for me. But to those I say, how hard is it to ask questions. I would much rather force a shy person at a munch to actually participate and ask, then to say to everyone else curb your kink here.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

quote:

ORIGINAL: Darkfeather

Again you are missing the point. Capitalizations of pronouns are not, in fact, a form of roleplaying to those who use it. It is simply the way they were taught to do it. If you find the practice silly or annoying, just as real life, you can choose to ignore it. But to actively call someone for doing it silly, or thinking they will "influence" others... This is why people get defensive. You know the old saying, opinions are like ass holes, everyone has one and some even stink. But when you speak your opinions to the public, you are sure to annoy someone. And yes, this forum is exactly like a munch, except without an actual face to put to the words. A munch is a place where people can get together in a kink friendly enviornment and discuss anything. Would you say in a much, loud enough for all to hear, you think capitalization of pronouns to be silly? Not unless you want to insult. So why would written discussions be any different? Can anyone shout their opinions to the rafters, sure and many do it. But you also have to expect that some are going to take what you say personally, especially when it contradicts what they themselves believe in.

No fucker teaches you to capitalise a word that isn't a proper name in the middle of a sentence unless they're an imbecile.

quote:

ORIGINAL: AAkasha


I thought that munches (and to use the analogy here - a place like a discussion forum, like collar chat, here, vs. a 'roleplaying forum') is a place not for BDSM play, but for normal interaction? There should be no activity to 'curb.' The analogy I would use is that people would behave in this public space the same they would at their job and among their families and with people they do not know, as to not infringe their roles upon people in a way that would require them to explain.

Using that analogy, you could say that it's fine that people who use their Me/me and You/you protocol on "discussion" areas like here (a non roleplaying area open to the public where we are open to perception) could do so if that's the same way they communicate to their co-workers, bosses, friends, families, and strangers. I think not.

Again, it's not what the collective "we" think of it (we already all 'get it," we're kinksters, we know the meaning behind it) it's the skewed perception it gives others who come here for the first time and are deciding if they want to communicate in our group. If the collar chat forum is NOT a roleplay forum, just as a munch is not a play space, it seems to me that slashy speak, as a form of play protocol (since it's NOT used in every day communication to co workers, etc) is not appropriate and sends the message that this is also a "play space." I am not playing with any of you nor do I expect you to play with me when we're discussing BDSM topics.

Akasha

quote:

ORIGINAL: Darkfeather
Nope, actually munches are exactly like this forum.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Darkfeather

quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead



No fucker teaches you to capitalise a word that isn't a proper name in the middle of a sentence unless they're an imbecile.

Wow, thanks for that college level response. You must be new to kink

quote:

ORIGINAL: ToyOfRhamnusia
The point is: is this forum a playground for kinksters - or is it public forum where we want newbies to feel welcome?

quote:

ORIGINAL: absolutchocolat

how is lack of capitalization "disrespectful to others"? i think insistence on formality in a rather informal setting is absurd.

quote:

ORIGINAL: ToyOfRhamnusia

quote:

ORIGINAL: Darkfeather

quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead



No fucker teaches you to capitalise a word that isn't a proper name in the middle of a sentence unless they're an imbecile.

Wow, thanks for that college level response. You must be new to kink

So, you just got a taste of what newbies think of that practice...

The point is: is this forum a playground for kinksters - or is it public forum where we want newbies to feel welcome?

I am no new kinkster, but I am annoyed when I have to put a translator's cap on in order to read what other people write. Instead "we" and "ours", they write "W/we" and "Ours/ours", and some refer to themselves in plural (like some other royalty!), whereas others completely avoid the use of "I", "me", and "my". It is very annoying to read, and, for a newbie, it raises the question if this is the way they too are supposed to write posts...?

And if you are a Dom/Domme who thinks that it is important for me to constantly be reminded of your status in your personal relationship by capitalizing all words relating to yourself, then my knee-jerk reaction is "what an arrogant ass hole!" Sure, I might modify my opinion on the basis of other reasons, but really, I have no interest in such reminders. Mind you, in my vanilla life, I also have no respect for people's use of titles. I don't care. We are all humans, and all humans are equal. NO one has any rights to be treated with greater respect than others.

I can better accept absolutchocolat's lazy consistency about never using the shift key, but even that is still disrespectful of others, because it makes reading more difficult. And the fact that other people are not very good at writing English is no legitimate excuse for an intelligent person to make it worse. Throwing hizzy fits over this? No, of course not - but the consequences certainly are that it lowers my interest in such a post as it shows to me that the person writing is more concerned about his/her own convenience than about the message being read and well understood by other people. If that's the desired effect, then so be it.

I learned early on in life that communication must aim at being understood by the receiver. Just communicating out into the ether (or cyber space) without any concern for how the communication is going to be received and understood make no sense, but every deviation from what is generally seen as "good English" definitely adds something to the message, and it is not something positive.

quote:

ORIGINAL: ToyOfRhamnusia

You miss my point: I would ASSUME (but I could be wrong) that the purpose of posting something would be to have OTHER PEOPLE READ IT - and understand it.

This means that you would be concerned about how other people see and perceive what you post. What is the point in posting, if you don't care about anyone else's opinions, but your own? Maybe you just post for YOU - or for some in-sworn elite, or whatever. In such case, it is, of course, meaningless to be concerned with other people's take on your writing style and ways of expressing yourself, as you do it for a selected audience and don't care about anyone else. But that also turns it into an insult to everybody else that you do not simply communicate directly, in private, with your buddies.

Sure, you can choose to ignore my opinion - and the opinions of everybody else, just as you want - but your posting makes for a waste of time for everybody but yourself and your in-sworn buddies then.

In all other walks of life, such behavior is called selfish and inconsiderate of others. I hope I missed YOUR point being that THIS was/is your intent.

Besides, where do you see that I have insulted anyone? Maybe it is to be considered insulting for someone to point to observable facts and use some logic?

Disagreement about the issues we discuss is fine - it allows everybody to learn something. But we can all have a better experience from that if we all use a little fundamental courtesy and abstain from making our writing unnecessarily difficult for others to read.