Collarspace Discussion Forums


Home  Login  Search 

The winds of change have a funny smell


View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
 
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion >> The winds of change have a funny smell Page: [1] 2 3 4   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
The winds of change have a funny smell - 12/8/2012 8:45:09 AM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline 		http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505266_162-57557466/marijuana-legalized-in-wash.-seattle-celebrates/


Thoughts on the legalization of marijuana in Washington State, and what it will mean across the rest of the country?

What response do you think should be expected from the federal level?

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

Profile   Post #: 1
RE: The winds of change have a funny smell - 12/8/2012 8:54:15 AM   
kdsub


Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline 		I’m sure this thread will deteriorate to the usual when speaking of drugs…we can only hope not.

I just wonder when and if the Federal government will snap the whip so to speak and off to the courts it will go. It will be interesting to see what happens.

As a personal opinion I am sorry to see the law passed. I know I will be shouted down but I guess I am just old fashioned and worry about just another way for people to loose control of their senses.

I drink socially and am responsible and I’m sure most pot users are the same but there will always be the abusers. Do we really need another way to escape reality?

Butch

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 2
RE: The winds of change have a funny smell - 12/8/2012 9:07:52 AM   
vincentML


Posts: 9980
Joined: 10/31/2009
Status: offline
quote:

Do we really need another way to escape reality?

For many people reality is painful. So, why not? Watching television or going to a football game is an escape from reality. Escape mechanisms have long been a part of human history. Applause from me.

As to the results and implications. We will see a diminishment of incarceration of people of color in those states. I doubt the Obama admnistration has an interest in prosecuting federal law in those states. And isn't this just ducky for the 10th Amendment adherents? In the long run it remains a question if SCOTUS would apply the Commerce clause or the supremacy of Fed statutes to bash the state laws.

(in reply to kdsub)
Profile   Post #: 3
RE: The winds of change have a funny smell - 12/8/2012 9:23:57 AM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub
Do we really need another way to escape reality?




We have it now, Butch. Contempt for the law has become such under the failed policies we have in place that anybody who wants to smoke pot, already does.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


(in reply to kdsub)
Profile   Post #: 4
RE: The winds of change have a funny smell - 12/8/2012 9:24:55 AM   
erieangel


Posts: 2237
Joined: 6/19/2011
Status: offline 		Read about the end of prohibition.

States began breaking federal law and legalizing the use the alcohol. Eventually, the federal government had to do the same. Prohibition didn't work.

Prohibition of pot and other street drugs hasn't worked either.

The 'war on drugs' has been our longest and costliest war. We've thrown good money after bad on that war since I was a child and I'm now 50.

Regulating the growth, production and sale of pot will ultimately make it safer as it won't be cut with stronger drugs.

I believe WA is planning a "state store" type for the sale of pot--the state will own the stores and only in those state owned stores will it be legally purchased. That is a money maker, even if they don't tax the substance extraordinarily high. PA has a state store system for liquor with profits in the millions of dollars a year.

Speaking of taxes...

What are the possibilities of drug lords NOT becoming entrepreneurs in this. After all, they know their product and their customers more than anybody. They will then pay income taxes.



< Message edited by erieangel -- 12/8/2012 9:26:45 AM >

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 5
RE: The winds of change have a funny smell - 12/8/2012 9:27:29 AM   
kdsub


Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline 		Yes this is true...but we have kids and they will have kids...and as they move through the culture of free access to drugs...is not alcohol not enough to worry about?

Butch

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 6
RE: The winds of change have a funny smell - 12/8/2012 9:28:59 AM   
kdsub


Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline
quote:

Prohibition of pot and other street drugs hasn't worked either


But there is no good alternative but to try and limit the use of some of those street drugs don't you agree?

Butch

< Message edited by kdsub -- 12/8/2012 9:29:30 AM >

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

(in reply to erieangel)
Profile   Post #: 7
RE: The winds of change have a funny smell - 12/8/2012 9:30:31 AM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline 		Supremacy seems a lot more likely to me, Vincent. It's a direct challenge of federal authority.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


(in reply to vincentML)
Profile   Post #: 8
RE: The winds of change have a funny smell - 12/8/2012 9:32:32 AM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub


But there is no good alternative but to try and limit the use of some of those street drugs don't you agree?



I don't agree at all. There are lots of better alternatives to what we have been doing for 40 years, Butch.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


(in reply to kdsub)
Profile   Post #: 9
RE: The winds of change have a funny smell - 12/8/2012 9:34:57 AM   
erieangel


Posts: 2237
Joined: 6/19/2011
Status: offline 		Why?

People have free will.

Those who want to use, will use, no matter the possible consequences. The number of people sitting in our prisons on drug related charges proves that point.

Also, for some, the idea that something is forbidden that is the draw. De-criminalization or legalization with education is the only sane way to go.

Besides pot is not addictive (unlike alcohol or even cigarettes). It won't be any good for many waistlines, though, in a country already facing a near epidemic of obesity.

(in reply to kdsub)
Profile   Post #: 10
RE: The winds of change have a funny smell - 12/8/2012 9:35:17 AM   
kdsub


Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline
quote:

I don't agree at all. There are lots of better alternatives to what we have been doing for 40 years, Butch


Oh I agree new approaches are needed...but there are some drugs that should never be freely accessible and legal... Of course just my opinion.

Butch

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 11
RE: The winds of change have a funny smell - 12/8/2012 9:37:12 AM   
kdsub


Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline
quote:

People have free will.


Do you really think a 15 year old has the good sense to intelligently figure the risk of meth? Hell for that matter all 21 year olds either?

Butch

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

(in reply to erieangel)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: The winds of change have a funny smell - 12/8/2012 9:38:16 AM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: erieangel


What are the possibilities of drug lords NOT becoming entrepreneurs in this. After all, they know their product and their customers more than anybody. They will then pay income taxes.





I'd say the criminal distribution networks are going to be pretty much shit-outta-luck, Erie. The growers will shift to legal operations.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


(in reply to erieangel)
Profile   Post #: 13
RE: The winds of change have a funny smell - 12/8/2012 9:41:29 AM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

Do you really think a 15 year old has the good sense to intelligently figure the risk of meth? Hell for that matter all 21 year olds either?

Butch



If pot is coming from a legal source, even if illegally resold to minors, those teens aren't going to be getting to know dealers who will offer them meth later. That's a great big gateway to use of more dangerous drugs, and this will close it.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


(in reply to kdsub)
Profile   Post #: 14
RE: The winds of change have a funny smell - 12/8/2012 9:43:16 AM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: erieangel
It won't be any good for many waistlines, though, in a country already facing a near epidemic of obesity.




It's just a shame it didn't happen in time to save the Twinkie and Ding-Dong.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


(in reply to erieangel)
Profile   Post #: 15
RE: The winds of change have a funny smell - 12/8/2012 10:29:59 AM   
Kana


Posts: 6676
Joined: 10/24/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

quote:

Prohibition of pot and other street drugs hasn't worked either


But there is no good alternative but to try and limit the use of some of those street drugs don't you agree?

Butch

Why?
1-We are a free nation predicated on the idea that people should be free to make decisions in their lives and are capable of making rational decisions about said lives.
2-Limiting has epically failed. Instead we have inner cities that are war zones, a permanent underclass held down due to drug laws, massive racial disparities, eroding or nonexistent civil liberties, a tremendous outgrowth in the reach of Federal and law enforcement powers, a prison industrial complex that saps our finances, neighbor states who have been greatly damaged by our draconian policies, the rise of drug gangs and the creation of entire generations of americans who view the govt as an enemy to be opposed at any and all turns and are financed by the sale of drugs.
The drug war is over, and we, all of us, lost. And we lost big time.
And just to counter your point about children (And have you ever noticed that when people have to resort to the infamous "What about the children" argument it's because every other logical argument has failed?Debate tactics that are fear based are failures designed to appeal to the basest emotions), most teens have far readier access to drugs than alcohol. Why?
Because every kid knows a dealer at school who will sell them what they need whereas alcohol is actually much harder to get because it is controlled.

_____________________________

"One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die. "
HST

(in reply to kdsub)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: The winds of change have a funny smell - 12/8/2012 10:41:34 AM   
ChatteParfaitt


Posts: 6562
Joined: 3/22/2011
From: The t'aint of the Midwest -- Indiana
Status: offline 		FR:

It is no secret that I think all drugs should be legal, full stop.

Prohibition failed. The supposed war on drugs is a failure.

There are so many social and psychological reasons why people chose to be drug abusers -- and are current culture just about breeds alcohol and drug use and abuse. But even if it didn't, even if we lived in as close to a perfect society as we could make, some people would chose to abuse drugs and alcohol. It's who they are.

Now if we (as a society) could only get to an understanding that abusing drugs and alcohol was a medical issue, not a criminal issue or a character flaw.



< Message edited by ChatteParfaitt -- 12/8/2012 10:42:29 AM >

_____________________________



(in reply to Kana)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: The winds of change have a funny smell - 12/8/2012 10:48:20 AM   
jlf1961


Posts: 14840
Joined: 6/10/2008
From: Somewhere Texas
Status: offline 		Well at a tax of $.50 per joint, the tax revenue would be 3.2 to 6.4 billion dollars, and that was the estimate in 1991. I have heard the new estimates for tax revenue at the Federal level for legalized pot could be as high as 12 to 16 billion dollars.

Now for the offside of legalization, it would increase health costs due to damage to lungs (sorry people, if you believe the myth that pot smoke is less harmful than tobacco smoke, I have some beach front property in Colorado I want to sell you,) which would raise medicaid and medicare costs.

Currently there is no state in the United States that has a sin tax on tobacco or alcohol sales, which I am glad since I smoke and drink.

Now considering the physical affects of pot, I would say that DWI laws would apply equally.

_____________________________

Boy, it sure would be nice if we had some grenades, don't you think?

You cannot control who comes into your life, but you can control which airlock you throw them out of.

Paranoid Paramilitary Gun Loving Conspiracy Theorist AND EQUAL OPPORTUNI

(in reply to Kana)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: The winds of change have a funny smell - 12/8/2012 10:54:19 AM   
ChatteParfaitt


Posts: 6562
Joined: 3/22/2011
From: The t'aint of the Midwest -- Indiana
Status: offline 		50 cents?

WTF?

If you sold a joint for $5 each and the govt took half -- that's $2.50 each. If all that money was spent for social service programs instead of war mongering, think what a plus it would be.

_____________________________



(in reply to jlf1961)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: The winds of change have a funny smell - 12/8/2012 11:04:29 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

Currently there is no state in the United States that has a sin tax on tobacco or alcohol sales, which I am glad since I smoke and drink.


http://taxfoundation.org/article/state-sales-gasoline-cigarette-and-alcohol-tax-rates-state-2000-2010

States do have sin taxes.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to jlf1961)
Profile   Post #: 20
Page:   [1] 2 3 4   next >   >>
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion >> The winds of change have a funny smell Page: [1] 2 3 4   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts




Collarchat.com © 2025
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy

0.094